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Crazy news for Australian Djs!

ahh

"One minute you're mixing CDs in your bedroom, the next, the federal police are knocking on your door. And if you're a DJ, you can expect a visit, too. Richard Guilliatt reports on the music industry's all-out war on piracy. "

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http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003...6220597879.html

Why are the Authorities such fuckheads?
Wake up and smell the fucking roses, if you really wanted to stop file sharing you would ban the sale of modems, network cards, new mob phones, mp3 players, md's and CD-RW!!

But instead they jail people who are trying to make a living and a career for themselves!

I liked this bit.

"I've been DJ-ing for 14 years; it's what I'm passionate about," he says. "I love this job, being here in the shop surrounded by the music. DJs are going to put out mixes regardless of what the record companies do. Nightclub promoters ask you for your demo, and any mix or demo you make is a bootleg. So they're going to have to sue every single DJ in the country. Get jukeboxes in every club - take it back to the '60s and '70s."


Werd dude Werd, lets sue every DJ.

Can I just ask . . . how did the Record Companies find out about their artists in the first place? Maybe . . . Demo CDs?

It looks like the federal world is getting dumber by the day, answer me this question, Is the whole reason behind these raids just because they're aren't getting any tax or do they really care about the companies. I doubt it's the latter one.

Yes the continuation of mixes are going to happen of plainly the fact that to get heard you have to create "demos" but you can't hide the fact that selling your own mixes is still not right, personal use is alright even to share around the world cause no profit is being made...i go back to my first point, because companies and the government don't get the profit and tax, then they take legal action.


I might be wrong about the following point but i think i'm on the right track. Why are drugs illegal?, is it because the cops really want us not to get harmed by the bad substance, or are the government offended that drug dealers evade tax by selling drugs??

Do they really care or is the money that will put everyone behind bars for doing something they love or something they find easy?

quote:

Originally posted by Dj_Psygnosis I might be wrong about the following point but i think i'm on the right track. Why are drugs illegal?, is it because the cops really want us not to get harmed by the bad substance, or are the government offended that drug dealers evade tax by selling drugs??

Some drugs lead to physical addiction, some people who take drugs can get mentally addicted, when they are, and no money is left to buy drugs, what do they do? steal shit. Drugs lead to deaths from people taking bad stuff or overdosing. Drugs lead to a lot of social problems not only limited to stealing and death. Poverty from addiction, Congestion of the court system with petty offences due to drugs, Violence, Murder, a tonne of social problems. Drug dealers somewhere down line will have to pay tax proportionate to their declared income by laundering the money to make their earnings look legitimate or they can end up having their possessions seized and sold by the government (at least in W.A.). However that isnt to stop drug dealers declaring less than they actually earned and risking getting caught out. If the government was interested in tax money from drugs they would legalise them to an extent where registered retailers could sell them at a certain price (which im sure 80% of it would be tax) like smokes or alcahol.

Anyway on to the point of the article. This guy was getting busted for taking songs and taking a bassline or sample from them, and then using that in a mix cd he put together. Im pretty sure if he was just making a mix cd with original tracks he would be fine. Note how it said he used a computer to mix them, more than likely the tunes were mp3s.

Im not defending the situation and saying it was right to arrest him, it wasnt, and it is a pretty fucked up state of affairs when record companies arrest some one for something like this. I didnt see any mention of him selling the mix cds, just distributing, if he was selling them then they were right to arrest him in my opinion.

quote:

"I've been DJ-ing for 14 years; it's what I'm passionate about," he says. "I love this job, being here in the shop surrounded by the music. DJs are going to put out mixes regardless of what the record companies do. Nightclub promoters ask you for your demo, and any mix or demo you make is a bootleg. So they're going to have to sue every single DJ in the country. Get jukeboxes in every club - take it back to the '60s and '70s."

Another point is that he was distributing these over the net to a lot of people in whatever "community" he was in. At least thats what i got from the article. When you make a mix cd to send to people you usually send it to a few friends and the appropriate places right? You dont avertise it THAT much and encourage everyone to download it, unless your an attention whore which is possibly why he got busted? The Record Industry like going after high profile targets.

quote:

Speck was able to establish that some of the DJs were using songs by major artists like Mary J. Blige and Ja Rule without permission.

Notice how the article is mostly on hip hop. However does this mean i cant play my Size DDD - Techno white label? Most probably, since it is a bootleg of an eminem track. Sure we may not like it, but it is the law. Therefore when some one decides to prosecute we dont really have a leg to stand on. I think ultimatley some record labels are more likely to go and find these people and make examples of them rather than others. Hopefully labels (and their distributors) which release trance are not going to follow the same line. Something interesting is when a record is released with an acapella on it (like quite a few hip hop records) does that mean i am not able to play the acapella over another track if i wanted? would that constitute sampling?

This problem stems from outdated business models, trying to recoup "losses" through outdated laws. I put "losses" in quotation marks because it is impossible to say the music industry has lost much. Personally through my mp3 use ive bought decks and spent more money on records in this past 6 months than probably ever would have on music in 10 years. It also needs to be pointed out that these "losses" are gains waiting to occur. If the music industry realised that then i doubt their would be as big of deal created by them.

Comparing these losses to what drug runners, and terrorists make and lumping standard users like DJs into this figure is total bullshit. Sure music piracy may fund organised crime. Easy money for an organisation who has the means of doing it on a large scale. Again, the means of doing it on large scale. This does not refer to people with CD burners, this refers to the people who sell duplicated cds with scanned covers at swapmeets and the like week after week. Which isnt a HUGE problem in australia, sure its there, but perhaps the record companies should check out asia? However, people who distribute the MP3 versions of these tracks over the internet are asking for trouble, they are easier to track, and their operating costs can be signifcantly lower than the pirates who duplicate cds. There user base is also a lot larger than that of piracy organisation. Making them prime targets for the record industry (unless like kazzaa they are all over the place) as they can send more music, to more people, for lesser cost. Even though they arnt making much/any profit out of it.

Does your average user want to spend 1 hour poking around the net and finding the hidden places to download from and spend even longer downloading it? No, im sure they would rather go to sonymusic.com and pay 10-15 dollars to be able to download that cd. I think the way amazon does business with ebooks will be the future of downloading music. You download a player which has a unique identification, pay money, download the book, and load it in the player. The player then contacts the server and checks if your able to play the book (i dont know the transactions exactly however), if you can you read the book all you want, if not you get an error.

I can understand - maybe - arresting those who were selling pirated material for profit, or perhaps even those running mp3 sites (sorry Swamper ) but some of the stuff in that article is bloody ridiculous. Arresting someone for making mixes, a demo tape, or remixes of copyrighted songs? It's pretty insane. So far as I'm concerned, the record companies can spend millions of dollars investigating DJs who - god forbid - are using a burnt copy of music they already own, but who is it, really who's going to suffer? The all pervasive mp3 culture or the record companies themselves?

I especially liked this line:

quote:

The industry's anti-piracy lawyer, Michael Williams, even drew a comparison between Mp3WmaLand and Osama bin Laden's terrorist cells.

Yep, these people are mad-men. Keep making the world a safer place, Mike, sleep tight knowing that by throwing a few kids in jail for swapping R'n'B mp3s you've prevented the further spread of chemical and nuclear weapons almost certain to be used in future terrorist attacks - you know, because everyone who's ever downloaded an mp3 is an evil terrorist murderer like Osama bin Laden and such.

Fucking idiots.

Renegade, im pretty sure swamper gets permission to post the mp3s here.

quote:

Now any kid in Bankstown or Dandenong can remix Jennifer Lopez's new single and give it away over the internet, or compile a mix-CD for friends. Is that piracy? The Australian record companies say it is. "No DJ has the right to copy any commercial recording for their own use," says Michael Williams

record companies really do need to buy themselves a f'kin clue. the levels they're reaching to to try n diminish piracy are rather pathetic. fine isnt it how we have a bunch of corporate morons, who havent the slightest comprehension of what music is about, or certain roles it has/plays. i mean, "no dj has the right to copy any commercial recording for their own use". do they have a slightest clue of what a role of a dj entails? pfft. anything to increase the dollar value. why not crush the musical passions of many while you're at it.

yup. as the article says, bring on the jukeboxes.
lets gooooo baaaaack in time.

im not sure i've ever read a stupider article than that

trance music is pretty well only accessed thru sharing networks, i dont think i have seen any cd aside from MOS etc in a jb hi-fi with trance music on it... this blows, if they keep up with this, not only are they gonna ruin so much business for clubs, but artists and great djs will be out of business! i say that someone should dump a semi trailer load of horse manure right in front of the court that instigated this and put a nice sign in the middle which clearly states how intellectually challenged they are

... if anyone takes my collection of music i'll fkn sue them for the amount of hours i had to pay to my isp so i could download it

fuck them!!!

quote:

Originally posted by escee Some drugs lead to physical addiction, some people who take drugs can get mentally addicted, when they are, and no money is left to buy drugs, what do they do? steal shit. Drugs lead to deaths from people taking bad stuff or overdosing. Drugs lead to a lot of social problems not only limited to stealing and death. Poverty from addiction, Congestion of the court system with petty offences due to drugs, Violence, Murder, a tonne of social problems. Drug dealers somewhere down line will have to pay tax proportionate to their declared income by laundering the money to make their earnings look legitimate or they can end up having their possessions seized and sold by the government (at least in W.A.). However that isnt to stop drug dealers declaring less than they actually earned and risking getting caught out. If the government was interested in tax money from drugs they would legalise them to an extent where registered retailers could sell them at a certain price (which im sure 80% of it would be tax) like smokes or alcahol.

i think you just contradicted your own arguement dude, alchohol causes all these same problems but is still legal, its a money making thing and thats all there is too it. They dont give 2 shits about our physical health and the other wank they go on about.

they know that the drug trade would always be able to evade the tax system due to its underground nature, so they might as well make illegal to try and stop it.

quote:

This problem stems from outdated business models, trying to recoup "losses" through outdated laws. I put "losses" in quotation marks because it is impossible to say the music industry has lost much.

There is no doubt that record companies (or at least the music divisions of the big media companies)are in serious trouble. They most definitely lose money from internet file-swapping.

I doubt however that prosecuting punters in Australia that host MPs is really effective given the MP3's can be hosted on sites located in countries like Russia which do not respect intellectual property laws.

quote:

Originally posted by Solstice i think you just contradicted your own arguement dude, alchohol causes all these same problems but is still legal, its a money making thing and thats all there is too it. They dont give 2 shits about our physical health and the other wank they go on about. they know that the drug trade would always be able to evade the tax system due to its underground nature, so they might as well make illegal to try and stop it.

Im sure the day alcoholics commit the same level of crime as heroin addicts then alcohol will be criminalised. Except that wont happen. Sure there is more alcohol and smoke related deaths per year than illegal drugs, but only because alcohol and smokes are a lot more widespread. If harder drugs were made legal then im sure the numbers on that would change too.

If they made it legal then they could reap all the benefits of taxation? Once the government sells it for less than the dealers then the dealers will stop selling. Having the government being the distributor to registered dealers/shops they could get all the tax they like. This plan would never ever be put into action however, but in my opinion the government does not make drugs illegal because they arnt able to make any money out of it. If they wanted to, they could.

quote:

Originally posted by rupert There is no doubt that record companies (or at least the music divisions of the big media companies)are in serious trouble. They most definitely lose money from internet file-swapping.

They dont taken into account the money they gain though. All you ever hear about from the record companies is losses, losses and losses. Sure my record buying isnt going to make up for all their losses, but how many people like me are there? Im sure there would be quite a few on TA. However im sure that they do lose money from the mainstream market from people who would have bought pop music, except now download it. As I said they need to change the way they do business, and realise that as times change so must they.

quote:

Originally posted by Renegade Fucking idiots.

Yep, that just about sums it up.

quote:

Originally posted by escee Some drugs lead to physical addiction, some people who take drugs can get mentally addicted, when they are, and no money is left to buy drugs, what do they do? steal shit. Drugs lead to deaths from people taking bad stuff or overdosing. Drugs lead to a lot of social problems not only limited to stealing and death.

Ehh what about tobacco?? Are you telling me Tobacco isn't addictive and lead to long term damage like cancer? Tobacco is much more addictive that some drugs like Marijuana and Ecstasy? So tell me why Tobacco is legal...i can tell you in 2 words Govermental Corruption . It's a easy process, tobacco companies pay the government millions, even up to billions of dollars just to have tobacco legalized.

Think about it.

lol gotta love the government conspiracy theories

so this guy is saying that making a demo cd is illegal cause u arent getting the artists permission to play the track? then he is saying all djing is illegal unless u ring up every artist before your set or play only your own tracks...

"yo ferry how u goin mate? who am i? john smith from australia! you dont know me? sure you do, i was towards the middle and a little to the left of the crowd at your melbourne set. listen the reason im calling is im a dj and i wanted to know if you mind me playing solstice at my next gig. yeah i bought the record, i thought that meant i could play it too, but you know how these cops are these days. how did i get this number? aah.. hey look i left the stove on, gotta run..!"

quote:

Originally posted by Philby i was towards the middle and a little to the left of the crowd at your melbourne set

rofl so true

quote:

Originally posted by Philby lol gotta love the government conspiracy theories so this guy is saying that making a demo cd is illegal cause u arent getting the artists permission to play the track? then he is saying all djing is illegal unless u ring up every artist before your set or play only your own tracks... "yo ferry how u goin mate? who am i? john smith from australia! you dont know me? sure you do, i was towards the middle and a little to the left of the crowd at your melbourne set. listen the reason im calling is im a dj and i wanted to know if you mind me playing solstice at my next gig. yeah i bought the record, i thought that meant i could play it too, but you know how these cops are these days. how did i get this number? aah.. hey look i left the stove on, gotta run..!"

ROFLMAO @ Philby!

Hey I wouldnt mind that :P

But yes fuckin idiots should have their balls reattatched.

NB . . You do realise on most records it says "Do not play this record unless for home use without permission of the artist first" or something like that.

Just a thought.

Now for some maths . . . .

Australia = 20,000,000 people.
Lets say at least half have downloaded an mp3 in their time.
=10,000,000
Then at least half of the rest have either taped something from TV or on casette from the radio . .
=15,000,000
and the other 5,000,000 are either too young, too old or just too stupid to know anything about technology.

So that makes 15,000,000 Australian's that should get arrested. Looks like the Fed's have got a big job ahead of em. Good luck boys (Better hide your old mix tapes too)

Fucking Idiots


Tunage atm . . . . . NOFX - Murder the Government

quote:

Originally posted by matt_a Now for some maths . . . . Australia = 20,000,000 people. Lets say at least half have downloaded an mp3 in their time. =10,000,000 Then at least half of the rest have either taped something from TV or on casette from the radio . . =15,000,000 and the other 5,000,000 are either too young, too old or just too stupid to know anything about technology. So that makes 15,000,000 Australian's that should get arrested. Looks like the Fed's have got a big job ahead of em. Good luck boys (Better hide your old mix tapes too)

Dude .. get some statistics

There's only 7 million households in Australia, and only about 65% of them have computers. About 50% of them have internet access. And even then, you'd be surprised at how few people actually download music.

Sure, it seems like a lot, but we all spend a shitload of time in a forum dedicated to music. What of the old people who log on once a week to check their emails? What of people who just want news, weather, FootyTAB and Lotto results?

I read some stats the other day that said about 90% of Kazaa's traffic is created by about 5% of its users -- there's a bunch of hardcore leechers who grab everything in sight, while the vast majority get what they're looking for, and get out

I think the recording industry as we know it will be completely gone within five years .. all this sort of thing looks like shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic

quote:

Originally posted by webmeister Dude .. get some statistics There's only 7 million households in Australia, and only about 65% of them have computers. About 50% of them have internet access. And even then, you'd be surprised at how few people actually download music. Sure, it seems like a lot, but we all spend a shitload of time in a forum dedicated to music. What of the old people who log on once a week to check their emails? What of people who just want news, weather, FootyTAB and Lotto results? I read some stats the other day that said about 90% of Kazaa's traffic is created by about 5% of its users -- there's a bunch of hardcore leechers who grab everything in sight, while the vast majority get what they're looking for, and get out I think the recording industry as we know it will be completely gone within five years .. all this sort of thing looks like shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic

boo hoo joel. (I know you work for APRA :P)

quote:

Originally posted by matt_a boo hoo joel. (I know you work for APRA :P)

You know something I don't?!?!?

I work in market research, it's my job to know dumb statistics like that

The logic of these record companies astounds me. Surely they must know that they can't rid the world of internet piracy and that it is irrational to sue everyone and anyone for remixing tunes, playing mp3s etc! I know that they're trying to make an example out of this case, to show to the world the consequences of distributing mp3s...but don�t they realise it's not working.

quote:

The industry's anti-piracy lawyer, Michael Williams, even drew a comparison between Mp3WmaLand and Osama bin Laden's terrorist cells.

That is ridiculous. I know lawyers are supposed to be persuasive and emotive; but making absurd comparisons between mp3s and terrorism does absolutely nothing to assist their cause. If anything, they've now lost their credibility (that is, if they had any in the first place).

Hmm, here's a rather avant garde thought for ya- how about adapting to today's society and using technology to your advantage.
(ohhh! that might be a bit too progressive and out there for us...we should just continue to waste time by taking people to court for piracy. Did you know it's as bad as terrorism?)

...

and lets not forget those radio stations, jolz!

think of all them poor guys who will now have to make a phone call before every song they play!!!

WOOT NO MORE NOVA!!!

Well if u take into fact the Recording of TV shows onto cassettes and the teh recording of music rom radio, your bound to find people who are against piracy have done this, Hypocritical Bastards

quote:

Originally posted by -=M=- WOOT NO MORE NOVA!!!

Hmm...

quote:

Hmm, here's a rather avant garde thought for ya- how about adapting to today's society and using technology to your advantage. (ohhh! that might be a bit too progressive and out there for us...we should just continue to waste time by taking people to court for piracy. Did you know it's as bad as terrorism?)

I noticed that, but i still don't understand why they really give a flying fcuk. I mean terrorist are planning attacks while cops are planning attacks on poor risers of the next breed of Producers who are struggling enough with the worlds current economy.

Another thought just popped into my head, don't people think that the death of electonica will be caused by the federals?

yes psygnosis smokes are addictive, but does one smoke or even one pack cost the same amount as one hit of heroin? no. Believe it or not the government, police and courts are there to protect and serve.

Except they are there for everyone, including record labels.

whats an Mp3?

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