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-- Michael Moore scolds Canadians who would vote for Harper
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Michael Moore scolds Canadians who would vote for Harper

I love this guy...

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Co...ol=968793972154

"Firebrand filmmaker Michael Moore hopes his controversial new work Fahrenheit 9/11 will help stop Conservative Leader Stephen Harper from becoming Prime Minister, along with throwing U.S. President George W. Bush out of office"

"And he brought with him a warning that if Canadians swing to the right by electing Harper on June 28, as polls suggest might happen, then dire consequences will follow.
...
"I can't believe that you guys would think about going in that direction, when we're trying to get out of that direction," Moore told the Star, shortly before heading to the Varsity Cinemas to make a red-carpet arrival at the screening.

"I hope this doesn't happen. Bush is going to throw a party (after the Canadian election). He's going to be a happy man. (Harper) has a big pair of scissors in his hand. He wants to snip away at your social safety net. He'd like this to be the 51st State."

Moore doesn't let the Liberals off the hook, blaming them for creating the mood in Canada where a Conservative government seems plausible."
...
"He praised former Prime Minister Jean Chr�tien for refusing last year to join Bush's "Coalition of the Willing" in the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq. He regrets not giving Chr�tien credit for his bravery in Fahrenheit 9/11, much of which takes a critical look at the Iraq invasion and the Bush family's ties to terrorist leader Osama bin Laden."
...
"This movie should say to Canadians, you want to join the Coalition of the Willing? Get ready to send your kids over to die for nothing, so that Bush's buddies can line their pockets."

Thats nice for him. He doesnt have to pay our taxes and it wasnt his money that was stolen. Id love to see americans' reactions if one of our celebrities commented on their election. Oh wait, they probably wouldnt even care!

so you'll criticize the man instead of what he had to say...that's productive.

Regardless of what you think of him, he's politically saavy, to say the least. He's not just some ignoramus who knows nothing about Canadian and American politics.

you're right...Americans wouldn't care...egocentricity runs rampant there.

we've already discussed what he has to say a million times over in other threads. So yes, im critisizing him. The outcome doesnt affect him either way which gives him the licence to be as ideological as he wishes without having to pay for it.

I personally hope they get rid of Bush in the US but that election is none of my business.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 personally hope they get rid of Bush in the US but that election is none of my business.

Of course it's your business - our neighboring country has a big impact on us as Canadians.

Go Michael Moore.

This election is not about whos a better gov't.
Its a lesser of evils.

I'll say it again, i like some stuff that harper is proposing but the guy freaks me out. You gotta consider track records.

yah exactly, you have to consider track records. what has paul martin done? get the liberals the hell out of there as far as I'm concerned

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 we've already discussed what he has to say a million times over in other threads. So yes, im critisizing him. The outcome doesnt affect him either way which gives him the licence to be as ideological as he wishes without having to pay for it. I personally hope they get rid of Bush in the US but that election is none of my business.

The outcome of any election in the United States or Canada directly effects the other country in A LOT of ways. To think "everyone" in the other country doesn't care is pretty ignorant. If you were powerful enough to have a voice that could be heard it would be part of your business, if you cared.

Michael Moore is accomplishing something that a lot of "independent" news sources try to do, but don't have the outlet to do it, and what major media sources won't do.

The guy is a doomsdayer anyways.
Canada is not going to fall apart because people vote Conservative
The arguement/scare tactic about Canada becoming the 51 State is as old as the hills and doesn't care any weight at all.
We KNOW who we are as a country and where we stand; hell every Canadian converstation that involves the U.S. and Canada is how about how different we are from them.
We may share the same economic/social circles but make no bones about it, we have no interest in becoming what they are as a society.

In regards to Iraq, while the attack may have not been joined by Canada, we did support it in other ways.
I believe Saddam had to go and it was time.
Oh sure you can argue all the other collateral reasons like oil??
If the United States were to intervene abroad every time the interests of an American corporation were threatened, their military would be very, very busy.
But if in the process they succeed in overthrowing a vicious despot armed with biological, chemical, and perhaps nuclear weapons, what's the problem??

He's a little too left of center, has gaping holes in his arguements and even other Bush-bashing conspiracy theorists don't agree with him.
This article states:

quote:

"In his rush to ensure that no credit goes un-annexed, Clarke [another left-wing anti-Bush basher] exposes Moore's rant as based on paranoia and the presumptions common among fever-swamp liberals that never survive the slightest encounter with facts," he said.

Instead of being spoon fed the heavy handed propoganda of Mr.Moore, maybe look into the guy who's doing the feeding....then make an informed decision.

MooreWatch
- http://www.moorewatch.com (contains OVER 300 articles)

Moore Exposed
- http://www.mooreexposed.com

Moore LIES
- http://www.moorelies.com

Michael Moore Hates America
- http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com

Do you think Michael Moore just dislikes Bush in general and it's his mission in life to bring him down??? Or do you think he's just a prick in general and likes to pick up on anyone in power?

Just for the record I'm not for or against him...I just personally know a few guys who just enjoy being pricks towards specific other people...so I'm wondering if it's just between him and Bush or between hin and just anyone really?!

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 we've already discussed what he has to say a million times over in other threads. So yes, im critisizing him. The outcome doesnt affect him either way which gives him the licence to be as ideological as he wishes without having to pay for it. I personally hope they get rid of Bush in the US but that election is none of my business.

\

That doesn't make some of his words true, also to add to the fact his first movie (maybe book..not sure) was aided/produced by canadian companies who took a chance on him where most American companies wouldnt touch, he spends alot of time in Canada, as he frequently known to visit alot and spend time here as he likes it here alot. As for other people saying his too paranoid and way too crazy, I think its good to realize which part of Moore is worth listening to, and the parts that are just too much for myself to believe. Michael Moore doesn't have to say a word, but choose to in order to try and open the eyes of the world, so that we can hope to question our leaders more and not just let certain things happen without care. Flame him all you want, he has said and done alot more than what most people could even dream of accomplishing in the political/media spectrum, and I respect him for that much (but thats just my opinion).

quote:

Originally posted by starsearcher Do you think Michael Moore just dislikes Bush in general and it's his mission in life to bring him down??? Or do you think he's just a prick in general and likes to pick up on anyone in power? Just for the record I'm not for or against him...I just personally know a few guys who just enjoy being pricks towards specific other people...so I'm wondering if it's just between him and Bush or between hin and just anyone really?!

I think he's really pissed at GWB for making the invasion of Iraq the #1 priority (to make his corporate buddies even richer) instead of concentrating more on social programs that take care of the less fortunate Americans.

quote:

Originally posted by EvilDust I think he's really pissed at GWB for making the invasion of Iraq the #1 priority (to make his corporate buddies even richer) instead of concentrating more on social programs that take care of the less fortunate Americans.

exactly...but being a fiscally responsible President who merely improves the lives of his country's citizens doesn't make one go down in the history books as a "great" president. It also doesn't make him and his buddies rich.

I'm so glad Harper would seek to strengthen ties to a jackass like him...and we'd be reading about regular deaths of Canadian soldiers for what? oh yeah, "to liberate the people of Iraq". yeah, right. I'm sure Bush lays awake at night, wondering about what he can do to improve the lives of Iraqi citizens. What a crock of shit.

Half of those lame anti-Moore sites just attack him as a person, which is an Ad Hominem fallacy in argumentation and logic theory (you can go look that up). You can call Moore a hypocrite if you want (by being rich but fighting for the little guy)...you can call him a propagandist, but that DOES NOT detract from the points he makes and the illumination he brings to issues that the Bush administation and the U.S. media would like to sweep under the rug (like Bush's family connection to the Bin Ladens.)

Thats what people on Ontario were saying about McGuinty and his meery band of Liberal thieves....

Look at us now!

quote:

. You gotta consider track records.

Billions lost by the Lieberals.


Nuff said.

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT exactly...but being a fiscally responsible President who merely improves the lives of his country's citizens doesn't make one go down in the history books as a "great" president. It also doesn't make him and his buddies rich.

the son wants to make his daddy proud by finishing off where he left off rather than where america left off after clinton.

quote:

Billions lost by the Lieberals.

people only remember these type of things. In that case, remember the billions wasted by the tories and running the country into deficit where the liberals with fnce minister martin had to cut spending in order to reduce the deficit.

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT ...but that DOES NOT detract from the points he makes and the illumination he brings to issues that the Bush administation and the U.S. media would like to sweep under the rug (like Bush's family connection to the Bin Ladens.)

That would be great if anything Moore said were actually factual...
How could anybody ever believe a hypocrite?
Just because he thinks he's right doesn't make it so.
That movie is not a documentary. A real documentary has arguements for both sides and then weighs them.
It's clearly an attack and a personal bias by someone with a big enough mouth to actually pull off a movie.
It's no wonder Disney dropped him.

I'm getting sick of Michael Moore.

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r It's no wonder Disney dropped him.

Disney dropped him because they didn't want controversial publicity... It had nothing to do with Moore's character.

After all, they were a very large contributor to GWB's election campaign.

-Your Mother

quote:

Originally posted by Dmatrox the son wants to make his daddy proud by finishing off where he left off rather than where america left off after clinton.

The Iraq war was first thought up in 1998 by Cheney, Rumsfled, Perle, and Wolfowitz (and some others) while Clinton was at the healm. They even presented the idea to Clinton but he rejected the idea as a hard sell to the American public and not a necessary undertaking.

Alot more information can be found in the PNAC website (project for a new american century). Its a website that outlines the long term goals of a consortium of people (with the above people at the front of everything). www.newamericancentury.org

Anyways, Once Bush came into power, the aforementioned hawks could put the wheels into motion. They decided to use WMD as the excuse to invade so they pressed the CIA to find hard evidence that Iraq still had the WMD that were sold to them by the US many years ago. Wolfowitz has even been quoted as saying the WMD was the excuse everyone agreed to use, but they had many other reasons they wanted to get in there. After all, the WMD excuse was the easiest sell to the American public.

Its the opinion of many (including myself) that the US invaded Iraq for 3 reasons:

1) Gain indirect control over the Iraqi oil fields so they can apply pressue with regards to dictating global oil prices.
2) Provide a relief point for US forces stationed in Saudi Arabia without reducing the overall security of the region.
3) Install a US friendly government so they can use Iraq as a launching point for future military actions in the region. This directly provides a security blanket for Israel.

-Your Mother

quote:

Originally posted by Your Mother Disney dropped him because they didn't want controversial publicity... It had nothing to do with Moore's character.

I totally agree with Disney not wanting to be tied to someone like him and has everything to do with the character of Moore.
Why would a family oriented business want to be??

You Moore haters seem to forget one thing.

If Moore said anything that was a blatant lie...if his pointing to the relationship between the Bush and bin Laben families was a fabrication...there would be lawsuits. While generally saying things about political figures is fine, that would cross the line and there would be all kinds of publicity.

It makes no sense to blindly accept what Moore says as fact...but isn't it just naive to immediately dismiss it all as propaganda?

Shit if it were about the money, he could make a pro-Bush film that was full of "yay America" crap...the misguided patriotism of Americans would have resulted in 100 million at the box office in the first weekend, I'm sure

Uh oh! Somebody better call a waaaaaaaaaaaaaambulance...

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r I totally agree with Disney not wanting to be tied to someone like him and has everything to do with the character of Moore. Why would a family oriented business want to be??

Because the emphasis is on BUSINESS and not on FAMILY. Disney, even though its one of the big five media corps, can't afford to piss off the US government because they got a "you suck my dick, I suck yours" relationship going on.

Only 1 theatre (as far as I can tell) is showing this on Friday - Canada Square @ Yonge/Eglinton

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