Am I the only one thinking that Vanguard sounds horrible?

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-- Am I the only one thinking that Vanguard sounds horrible?
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Posted by AuxiliaryInput on Feb-23-2007 12:49:

Am I the only one thinking that Vanguard sounds horrible?

I'm starting to think that I am the only person here in the world who hates the sound Vanguard (VST) squeals.

It sounds horrible! Its user interface is great and all, easy to use and so on, but the sound is horrific! I think it sounds metallic and.. very software ish. Why does everyone use it? Am I using it the wrong way? There are so many VST's out there that I think sounds better than Vanguard!

Also, What the **** were Vengeance on when they made presets for Vanguard. Give me whatever they were on, now. Seriously, they've made such good presets for other synthesizers and VST's. They've said that certain VST's sounded metallic. But what the hell, Vanguard is the worst piece of crap I've ever heard. (Fine, I've heard worse user made vst's)

So please, tell me. Am I using it the wrong way? Am I the only one who hates it?

Also, I'd like to say that I don't care if you use Vanguard, use it all you want. If you enjoy it, that's great. So I'm not saying you should stop using it. And I'm happy that reFx made a VST who became this popular. But I'm confused. [/rant]

Posted by flutlicht junky on Feb-23-2007 12:56:

I dont think it sounds horrible. It does have its own unique sound i.e bit hollow / metallic but it works well layered with other vstis and can do some good hard dance / freeform mid basses juno style!

Posted by AuxiliaryInput on Feb-23-2007 13:04:

That's what I hate the most about it. Its bass. It sounds like there's no bass at all. All I can hear is a clear saw at a very low octave unless you use rounder waveforms.

Posted by B_man on Feb-23-2007 14:02:

Are you kidding? I've used the Vanguard time and time again for bass patches (even with the saw waveform -- it's called a cutoff)... even layering such patches with the V-Station to make a nice phat bass. Even the pads and stuff in Vanguard have a noticeable shake in both my headphones and my monitors (which I don't have at the moment).

However, Vanguard does have a digital bite to it. However, that's desireable for certain patches, and even EDM friendly for specific types of sound. If it's too digital sounding for certain timbres that you are constructing then you simply don't use it. The Vanguard wasn't designed to be the cure-all to dance music. If you're looking for a very warm sounding analog pad -- chances are you are not going to find the Vangaurd as satisfying as, say, Linplug's Octopus. BUT, if you're looking for a sizzling, cool pad that's dim enough to fill in the 400-800hrtz stuff, then the Vanguard could have the sound you need.

Posted by djms on Feb-23-2007 14:12:

u can get some good sounds out of vanguard.

Grab yourself some more sound banks and learn more about synthesis then you will get it sounding better but tbh I rarely use it. z3ta, FM7 and minimoog are my weapons of choice

Mark Sherry swears by Vanguard so it must do something right

Posted by AuxiliaryInput on Feb-23-2007 14:21:

Maybe I've been thinking it sounds worse ever since I got that Virus Classic synth. And yes, its filter is horrible. That's what I meant about the saw thing. And I'm not talking about layering and if you use vanguard with the "ultimate hardware sounding effect plugin 3000" blah blah blah. I'm talking about vanguard itself.

Posted by Vizay on Feb-23-2007 14:28:

vanguard shure has it's own distinct sound, reminds me very much of ferry corsten stuff, his kind of sound.

I was fond of it in the beginning but I realized quite quickly that most of the times it ends up with one kind of sound from it so I've more or less stopped using it.

I prefer Albino 2 over vanguard any day of the week.
V-station and pro-53 also rocks vanguards world totally.

Posted by AuxiliaryInput on Feb-23-2007 14:59:

quote:
Originally posted by Vizay
vanguard shure has it's own distinct sound, reminds me very much of ferry corsten stuff, his kind of sound.

I was fond of it in the beginning but I realized quite quickly that most of the times it ends up with one kind of sound from it so I've more or less stopped using it.

I prefer Albino 2 over vanguard any day of the week.
V-station and pro-53 also rocks vanguards world totally.

I totally agree. I used to use Vanguard a lot when I was using Fruity Loops. But I stopped and I realized it was horrible.

Posted by ronk on Feb-23-2007 15:30:

with the right effetcs (eq, compression, reverb/delay etc) it can sound pretty damn good. but in general, it does sound horrible.

I actually used Vanguard as my lead in my latest track...here's a short sample: [[ LINK REMOVED ]]

I think it sounds good

Posted by cybernetica on Feb-23-2007 15:36:

It's not horrible. Not at all. But it definately has that very characteristic metallic and artificial sound that lets it kind of stand out among other synths.

The first reason everyone uses is because it is so easy to set up a nice sound. The second reason is because its a little cheaper than the most professional synths. ReFX intended to make an easy-to-use, low cost synth that has everything the average amateur trance producer needs, and that is just what Vanguard does.

Even with a little more professional ambition, you can get great sounds out of it.
You just have to know what it's good at and what it can't do.
Like we all agree on, the character is quite artificial. It might even be that you are going for an artificial digital sound (like I do, I usually prefer "anorganic" music).
Examples?
I've created some nice digital short stabs with it. I've also created some warping bubbling low acid lines using the glide function and the bandpass filter. I've created low background percussion by tweaking the "FX Percussion 64" preset. I've created sonic mayhem with the r2d2 waves and some sick effects afterwards.

The possibilities are huge. A lot of the typical vanguard sound comes from the "drive" controller, the high timbre frequencies, and sometimes the ugly rough basses. Using the bandpass filter, filtering out the more ugly sounding frequencies, and avoiding the vanguard overdrive (remember, you can use other better sounding overdrive modules as Post FX) makes Vanguard usually sound better to my ears. Also make sure to use Post FX to distinguish the sound and an equalizer to shape it even more.

I've seen a few professional releases where the producer used vanguard in a more subtle way, and it sounds very good. Four Carry Nuts - Mechanical Age is made a lot with Vanguard. Check it out yourself: http://www.saikosounds.com/english/...ase.asp?id=4065

Posted by thecYrus on Feb-23-2007 15:41:

here some vanguard samples from me (every synth sound is vanguard)

http://www.solarproject.ch/linked/guessthis.mp3

http://www.solarproject.ch/linked/S...uard%20Demo.mp3

Posted by KilldaDJ on Feb-23-2007 16:43:

its a good synth but i wouldnt dare use it for lead.

Posted by DJ Shibby on Feb-23-2007 17:06:

This thread is a waste of time and space.

All you've let us know is that you're an uncreative git.

Posted by Subtle on Feb-23-2007 17:23:

I love vanguard.. for acid and sweeping sequence sounds.

Like in this sample:

CLICKY

Posted by AuxiliaryInput on Feb-23-2007 17:49:

quote:
Originally posted by DJ Shibby
This thread is a waste of time and space.

All you've let us know is that you're an uncreative git.

How is a different taste in sound uncreative?

Ok, so I have learned that it's good for acids. It sounds quite good. Sometimes. But it's still erm.. Metallic. There are other VST's out there that sounds better than this I think.

Posted by flutlicht junky on Feb-23-2007 17:59:

quote:
Originally posted by DJ Shibby
This thread is a waste of time and space.

All you've let us know is that you're an uncreative git.

Whats not liking the sound got to do with not being creative?

Posted by Subtle on Feb-23-2007 18:10:

I also used Vanguard only for my lead in my insomnia remix.

It sounds good for about anything except basses, and supersaw leads in my opinion.

Posted by Enigmatic XTC on Feb-23-2007 21:30:

i'm not that big a fan of vanguard either. all the sounds seem like they have too much noise to me, or they seem distorted in some way.

Posted by gk_nz on Feb-23-2007 22:12:

I have to agree I think vanguard is highly overrated.

Posted by Seppa on Feb-24-2007 11:56:

quote:
here some vanguard samples from me (every synth sound is vanguard)

I'm not a straight trance fan, but i can say this: You've achieved a good sound with the vanguard so i don't know what people are moaning about.(eg i'd rework on the reverb don't like it much, but that's just me)

Posted by Steve Allen on Feb-24-2007 12:00:

v-station for me personally

however if it works for you and sounds good then use it, if not then dont

any piece of kit within reason sounds good in the right hands

Posted by DJ Shibby on Feb-24-2007 17:17:

quote:
Originally posted by flutlicht junky
Whats not liking the sound got to do with not being creative?

You're missing the point.

There is no "Sound". It's an engine that can create trillions of potential sounds.

Got it? Good.

Posted by DJ Shibby on Feb-24-2007 17:19:

One more thing...

The new version of Vanguard has features to reduce the digital edge, should you choose to apply it.

Also, I would strongly suggest NOT using the built in delay and reverb, as they are largely the cause of that "metallic" sound you're complaining about.

Posted by cybernetica on Feb-24-2007 17:48:

Here is a pad/lead I made with Vanguard. I think I really like the sound.

[[ LINK REMOVED ]]

Posted by bluebird on Feb-24-2007 18:38:

Im surprised to learn that so many people dislike vanguard; i would have placed it on top of my list anytime. but with regards to its presets and low end...
and there's the fine example of how it should be done ^^^ buried away where no one will ever know it 's there

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