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turntables vs. cd players
if you want to start mixing these days, would you choose cds or vynils or both? wich one is cheaper and wich one is better and easier?
I'd choose CDJs (Actually I have 
) Reason: I'm only going to be playing at my house, as a hobby, and burning cd's is a lot cheaper than building a vinyl collection. If your aim is to become a 'pro'/club DJ I would suggest vinyl though.
As for which is easier... IMHO it doesn't really matter, whatever you learn first will seem easier afterwards, personal preference, really
check this thread....
http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...light=vinyl+cdj
If you can do both do both, otherwise, knowing what I know now I would have chosen CDs.
The worse thing about spinning with vinyl and turntables is the vinyl. Vinyls are often limited and hard to get, upkeep and maintenance is very high, large, and expensive. Semi-professional DJs easily can spend $100/week on vinyls.
I like the feel of vinyl and it looks cooler but with the way technology is going, vinyl age is ending. Music is made and burned onto CDs. There is equipment to manipulate CDs like vinyl.
A lot of clubs use only CDs now. It's cheaper to keep up with fast paced music. I would go CD.
As a footnote, I own both turntables and cd turntables. If dance music was released on CD singles, I would buy those instead of vinyl. Right now, releases comes out on vinyl first so I'm forced to get vinyl.
and i heard there is this new thing its like a double cd player except its a mp3 player and i think you can hook it up to your computer. anyway i'll guess i'll go cd then.
i'd go for vinyl, and i'm glad i've chosen vinyl... cd technology will not be around in 5 years... already new cds have been developed, so these cds will become obsolete soon... its true though, vinyl is really expensive, but it will never go under, NEVER... so yea, if you think you can afford it, go with vinyl
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| Originally posted by TranceGeek cd technology will not be around in 5 years |
Well it may be true, think about it. Very few knew what DVD was about 5 years ago. Now it is practically the standard, with big chains choosing to no longer hold so much vhs, and mainly stocking dvd and devoting bigger and bigger sections of the store to them. Even Blockbuster is mostly DVD nowadays.
So who's to say CD won't be replaced? It really isn't such an impressive format... 700MB of storage space isn't much, nor is 80 minutes of recording time. Some type of DVD disc would be much more practical but more costly. Perhaps something in between that could store 2-3 hours of audio on it? Maybe a type of media that is strictly designed for audio? Who knows.
Vinyl should be around for a very long time though, considering many of the top name DJ's will not stop spinning vinyl and switch to cd's anytime soon and think about the record label's. You think they want to start releasing trance singles on cd first considering piracy of cd's is common knowledge? Not to mention that I think Vinyl has more sound quality.
And we most never forget it is much cooler to carry a bunch of vinyl than a binder of CD's! 
74 min cds have been around for 20 years... they are bound to be replaced by some new technology in about 5 years tops... already toshiba made a cd big enough to fit into a cell phone with a storage capacity of a couple gigs if i'm not mistaken, 5 i think, with some new laser that they came up with... so yea, cd's will be replaced by something else, and that something else will take another 5 years to be introduced successfully in the industry, like cds are now... and unless they come up with some new way of converting analogue into digital, there really is no point in going that way... i dunno, just my thoughts on it...
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| Originally posted by sym And we most never forget it is much cooler to carry a bunch of vinyl than a binder of CD's! |
Turntables have been around for what, 100 years? Although the storage has changed from wax to vinyl, the technology is exactly the same. To say that CDs will be phased out in 5 years is pure conjecture. And as for the DVD example... ever notice how DVD players are reverse compatible with regular audio cds and VCD/SVCD? There are so many audio cds out there currently, and making a digital reader reverse compatible is easier than making an analogue one, that I think we'll see CDDA support for a while.
I use cds. They're cheaper. I'm poor. But I still love using turntables... it's like driving a car or riding a bike - both will get you where you need to go, but the car will be faster and carry more stuff, while the bike will let you see the scenery and enjoy the fresh air.
it's like comparing apples to oranges though...
take a look at what you want to do, and how you want to get there
i was going to go with cdjs at first as well, but then i went out and bought my first vinyl... i was hooked after that
i don't see vinyl going anywhere soon, it's been around for a long time, not in the mainstream but still there
cd's will be replaced, just like cd's replaced cassette tapes, which replaced 8-track
people need a convient way to store and transport their music, and the technology keeps coming up with new stuff everyday
but one thing's for sure, vinyl isn't going anywhere soon, it'll just have cooler and cooler companions in the future
correct me if i'm wrong but vinyl mixing is easier cuz u get more control right?
I'd recommend you start off by buying a CDDJing set. I've got the pioneer cdj-100s and it works a dream. That way you can learn the basics, and you won't need to outlay much into a cd collection, since you can burn your mp3s onto cd. It also means that if you happen to DJ at friends' parties you'll be able to play crappy pop when they request it :-P
Then you could make a recording and distribute it round to some small scale clubs that might be looking for someone to fill in the earlier slots. That might get you a job, which will hopefully supply you with enough income to start buying vinyls. And you'll certainly need a lot of money! :-( While vinyls are a little more difficult to cue then cds (you can't just press the cue button to return somewhere), they're a lot easier and more accurate to mix, cause you have so much more control (for instance, cd players are limited to 0.1% tempo increments). Also, it's easier to mix vinyls, cause you can just apply pressure to the rim to get a perfect beat match.
Now, a comparism of the medium. CDs are good cause they have nice midrange (vocals etc) and vinyls are good cause they have phatt (that's got to be spelt with a "P") bass.
Personally, I'm a CD/vinyl DJ cause it means that I can burn average songs onto CD and only buy vinyl songs which I really like.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by dj_qub correct me if i'm wrong but vinyl mixing is easier cuz u get more control right? |
i`m 15 years old and i recently bought ttz 
so why can`t u?
[stupid post]
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Trypsin Turntables have been around for what, 100 years? Although the storage has changed from wax to vinyl, the technology is exactly the same. To say that CDs will be phased out in 5 years is pure conjecture. And as for the DVD example... ever notice how DVD players are reverse compatible with regular audio cds and VCD/SVCD? There are so many audio cds out there currently, and making a digital reader reverse compatible is easier than making an analogue one, that I think we'll see CDDA support for a while. |
I think that both will be around in the future.
Why do you need gigs and gigs of storage on a dvd when you're just gonna put one song on a cd right? So either route will offer no disadvatages.
For DJing purposes ya, Just one song per cd is good... but what about for other purposes? Burning a compilation cd with a ton of tracks? Or even recording a 4 hour liveset? Wouldn't it be more practical to be able to fit more on one cd? Eventually every media will be replaced, but if your looking at the here and now, CD's are cheaper. Vinyl is more expensive, but to me a much better medium. Different people have different tastes.
It also depends on what type of music to plan to play. If your gunna play pop and top 40, than your better off going cd. But if you plan to play Trance or House or basically anything in a genre similiar, your going to have go vinyl if you want to spin the latest stuff, since cd releases of songs happen much later. You could argue that you can get the mp3's and burn them, but the problem here is in different bitrates and levels I believe. I mean i've never dj'd with CD's, but just from cd's i've burnt with mp3's I could see this as an obstacle since occasionaly songs will seem to have completely different levels.
My biggest gripe with vinyl: When I spendd $10 on a vinyl, I want that vinyl to last forever or provide me means to make it last forever. I've started buying 2 or 3 of the same vinyl just so I can delay that. On top of which, if you keep your vinyls in perfect condition, sound quality starts to degrade after 100 uses. I'm not sure on that number because I read it else where but the point is, it's a limited number.
Scientifically ang logically, there is no reason why a vinyl would sound better than it would on a CD. People claim vinyls have a rounder sound because it's analog, but they forget to mention that a track is producted digitally (in the dance world at least), placed onto a cdr (the same ones you and I use), and then given to the vinyl pressers to work their magic. CDs win in the category of longevity, portability, and scalablity.
I don't know anyone who spins 1 track 1 cd. I cram as much as I can into 1.
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| Originally posted by Scottaculous Scientifically ang logically, there is no reason why a vinyl would sound better than it would on a CD. People claim vinyls have a rounder sound because it's analog, but they forget to mention that a track is producted digitally (in the dance world at least), placed onto a cdr (the same ones you and I use), and then given to the vinyl pressers to work their magic. CDs win in the category of longevity, portability, and scalablity. |
simply because of sample rates and because of analogue sound... lots of loss occurs when analogue is converted to digital... lots and lots and lots 
Remember that you're starting out from digital format and going to vinyl (analog). Are you implying that the vinyl presser adds additional sounds to the original recording?
you are reffering to music made on the computer and then pressed on vinyl... what i'm reffering to is analogue sound recorded directly onto vinyl... and as far as i know electronica too is made in sample rates higher than 44hz which is what cds are recorded at where as vinyl is at 92khz if im not mistaken... so yea, in both instances vinyl wins
Since we are discussing the vinyl and CD medium in respect to dance music, I confined my reasons to only that.
Electronica is produced digitally. Which means, the original signal is digital. Whatever limitation of that digital recording is then sent to a mechanical device that cuts the vinyl and represents that digital signal into an analog signal. If that digital signal is a 44.1kHz (standard, although there are much higher sampling rates can be created) then the analog representation is recreated from a 44.1 signal.
A record playing system (recording from an analog source) has the potential to reproduce frequencies well above the CD's upper limit. However, in actual practice LP reproduction is limited by many other factors, including the quality of vinyl, stylus compliance, and the condition of the record. Even on the outer grooves, a dust partticle or groove deformation only 0.025 millimeter in diameter will cause the same loss of high-frequently resolution as that designed into the CD standard. On the inner grooves, the dust particle need be only 0.011 mm in diameter to produce the same loss.
No one can argue with the statement that the original recording is the best recording. In the recording industry, the original recordings are the master tapes. From the master tapes, all the vinyls and CDs are created. Now in the electronica world, if the original recording (digital) was produced at 24bit 96kHz and copies onto CD and vinyl, theoratically CD and vinyl would sound the same. Now let's look back at paragraph #2, the upkeep of vinyl is expensive and those dust particles will more than likely get into your vinyl degrading your sound quality. Vinyl has more distortions than CDs because of that. Those cracks and pops found in vinyl are non-existent in CDs. See my point?
Vinyl may sound better recorded from an analog source, but when it's being recorded from a digital source it loses.
| quote: |
| Originally posted by Scottaculous Since we are discussing the vinyl and CD medium in respect to dance music, I confined my reasons to only that. Electronica is produced digitally. Which means, the original signal is digital. Whatever limitation of that digital recording is then sent to a mechanical device that cuts the vinyl and represents that digital signal into an analog signal. If that digital signal is a 44.1kHz (standard, although there are much higher sampling rates can be created) then the analog representation is recreated from a 44.1 signal. A record playing system (recording from an analog source) has the potential to reproduce frequencies well above the CD's upper limit. However, in actual practice LP reproduction is limited by many other factors, including the quality of vinyl, stylus compliance, and the condition of the record. Even on the outer grooves, a dust partticle or groove deformation only 0.025 millimeter in diameter will cause the same loss of high-frequently resolution as that designed into the CD standard. On the inner grooves, the dust particle need be only 0.011 mm in diameter to produce the same loss. No one can argue with the statement that the original recording is the best recording. In the recording industry, the original recordings are the master tapes. From the master tapes, all the vinyls and CDs are created. Now in the electronica world, if the original recording (digital) was produced at 24bit 96kHz and copies onto CD and vinyl, theoratically CD and vinyl would sound the same. Now let's look back at paragraph #2, the upkeep of vinyl is expensive and those dust particles will more than likely get into your vinyl degrading your sound quality. Vinyl has more distortions than CDs because of that. Those cracks and pops found in vinyl are non-existent in CDs. See my point? Vinyl may sound better recorded from an analog source, but when it's being recorded from a digital source it loses. |
| quote: |
| Since we are discussing the vinyl and CD medium in respect to dance music, I confined my reasons to only that. Electronica is produced digitally. Which means, the original signal is digital. Whatever limitation of that digital recording is then sent to a mechanical device that cuts the vinyl and represents that digital signal into an analog signal. If that digital signal is a 44.1kHz (standard, although there are much higher sampling rates can be created) then the analog representation is recreated from a 44.1 signal. A record playing system (recording from an analog source) has the potential to reproduce frequencies well above the CD's upper limit. However, in actual practice LP reproduction is limited by many other factors, including the quality of vinyl, stylus compliance, and the condition of the record. Even on the outer grooves, a dust partticle or groove deformation only 0.025 millimeter in diameter will cause the same loss of high-frequently resolution as that designed into the CD standard. On the inner grooves, the dust particle need be only 0.011 mm in diameter to produce the same loss. No one can argue with the statement that the original recording is the best recording. In the recording industry, the original recordings are the master tapes. From the master tapes, all the vinyls and CDs are created. Now in the electronica world, if the original recording (digital) was produced at 24bit 96kHz and copies onto CD and vinyl, theoratically CD and vinyl would sound the same. Now let's look back at paragraph #2, the upkeep of vinyl is expensive and those dust particles will more than likely get into your vinyl degrading your sound quality. Vinyl has more distortions than CDs because of that. Those cracks and pops found in vinyl are non-existent in CDs. See my point? Vinyl may sound better recorded from an analog source, but when it's being recorded from a digital source it loses. |
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