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Midi DJ Controller Choice

Hello everyone,

As you might know, few years ago I owned a Xone92 and 2x CDJ800MK2 along with an EFX-1000. Kinda professional DJ equipment, but I had to sell it due to money and lack of space in the new appartment. It was a difficult decision, and I miss my equipment.

In fact, I think I miss much more mixing than the equipment itself. I always loved the Xone, the CDJs and the EFX-1000, but I don't think I would use all of the features. Anyway, I'm looking to get back into the mixing but I can't afford to get a "full" solution. In fact, because of the lack of space, I'm looking to get a Midi DJ Controller to plug with my computer, where my M-Audio Fast Track Ultra and Events TR6 are plugged in.

Because I already have a pretty good external sound card, I'm planning on using it. So I'm not looking into audio quality of the Midi controller.

Here are some controllers I'm looking into:

M-Audio Torq Xponent
Numark Stealth Control
Vestax VCI-100

I heard really nice things about the VCI-100, but I have to say it's not the best looking controller. However, I did not try any of these and I shouldn't base the equipment on look, but either quality. I don't have the money for the VCI-300, so forget it.

Having used Numark stuff in the past, I think it's the lowest in quality between these 3 controllers. It looks really good though. I've heard many issues about it, such as freezing after 30min of use. However, the Numark is the cheapest also, because it lacks of audio card. Because I own a Fast Track Ultra, I don't plan on using the onboard card of a midi controller, if there is any.

As with the M-Audio, it seems to be a great controller. It has many controls, which is a good thing I think. However, I'm not aware of the quality of M-Audio controllers. I only own a the Fast Track Ultra from them and it's great.

If you have other controllers suggestions, feel free to comment.

Another thing I might add, is that I like to mix trance and progressive. I don't scratch, but I like big jogwheels (this is why I bought the CDJ800MK2 instead of the CDJ200) to beatmatch. I never use "auto beatmatch" and I'm not really into effects. I think the EFX-1000 I bought few years ago turned out to be quite useless. I used more the filters on my Xone92 than the EFX-1000.

Thanks for any suggestions and comments. As I said, I didn't try any of these controllers, but I'm looking to get inputs from you guys.

Thank you,

Neo.

What DVS software do you plan on using? That could affect things.

quote:

Originally posted by miamitranceman What DVS software do you plan on using? That could affect things.

I honestly couldn't tell. I never used a software more than 5 minutes.

So I'm totally new to this. But I know how it works. Being new to softwares, I can adapt to most of them pretty fast.

edit: Shouldn't MIDI be compatible with all softwares, as they only require MIDI controllers? My understanding of MIDI is that I could use my Oxygen49 keyboard to control a DJ software.

quote:

Originally posted by Neo Hacker I honestly couldn't tell. I never used a software more than 5 minutes. So I'm totally new to this. But I know how it works. Being new to softwares, I can adapt to most of them pretty fast.

Well before the DVS wars begin in this thread, I'll just say that any of the mainstream DVS will be absolutely fine for you and is really a matter of personal preference because they all have their ups and downs. I've used Torq and Traktor, for example.
It's just that some of the midi controllers, like the Xponent, for example, are really built for use with the Torq software. The controller is modelled after the onscreen interface. That said you CAN still use it as a controller for other stuff. Other controllers are a bit more universal.

Just something to consider.

woscar and I both use VCI-100's. It's a good MIDI controller, you just have to spend a little bit of time interfacing it with Traktor, making sure all the buttons and knobs do what you want. It's nice and cheap too.

quote:

Originally posted by ziptnf woscar and I both use VCI-100's. It's a good MIDI controller, you just have to spend a little bit of time interfacing it with Traktor, making sure all the buttons and knobs do what you want. It's nice and cheap too.

VCI 100 cheap?

I was under the impression that it's one of the more expensive controllers out there but it's built like a tank and therefor is worth the money. I've never heard anyone say the 100 was cheap though..

Since some people around have the VCI-100...can anybody tell me what's up with the SE,LE version ? I heard about firmwares bugs below 1.3 ...

quote:

Originally posted by n3lly VCI 100 cheap? I was under the impression that it's one of the more expensive controllers out there but it's built like a tank and therefor is worth the money. I've never heard anyone say the 100 was cheap though..

I bought it on ebay for like 250 bucks, and it IS built like a tank, even used. Maybe not cheap retail, but I didn't mind 250 bucks

I have had experience with different controllers. I still have my Xponent and i never had problems with it. It never locked up or cut out in the bedroom or live gig. From reading your description, I believe i spin the same as you. Music and how. I like to beatmatch and the pitch fader is the best length compared to other pitch faders on midi controllers. Of course you can adjust the range. It has room for effects but i only use a few for transitioning. The jog wheels can go in vinyl mode like you 800s.

I would like to go CDJs but like you money and space are an issue. If there are anymore questions on the xponent i likely have the answers. good luck in your choice!

-Archie

quote:

Originally posted by Neo Hacker Since some people around have the VCI-100...can anybody tell me what's up with the SE,LE version ? I heard about firmwares bugs below 1.3 ...

The SE is the Special Edition the guys at DJTechTools.com developed. LE refers to the version of Traktor that's included with the controller.

http://techtools.myshopify.com/products/vci-100se

http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0017/2972/files/VCi-100_ComparrisonSheet.jpg?1252782163

I have the normal VCI-100 and I have had no problems with the firmware whatsoever.

As ziptnf mentioned, it's built like a tank. Unlike other controllers that are plasticky and actually look like something from Toys R'Us the VCI-100 is solid metal.

Worth every penny.

I agree that looking at software first is a good idea, because you can then base how you want to work around that.

If you decide you want to use Ableton for example, then you'll probably want a fairly different controller from Traktor.

If you want the experience to be similar to DJing with CDJs, however, Traktor could well be your best bet so something like the VCI would suit it very well.

Thank you guys, I'll have a look at some softwares before deciding what is best for me.

I've used Ableton in the past for recording (and kind of producing) and didn't like it very much. I had a lite version included in my Oxygen49 and after few days, I couldn't figure out how it really worked. I installed Reason instead and could record/produce right away.

Few years ago, nearly 8 years ago, before I had my CDJs I used the classic Virtual DJ software for beginner. I was quite pleased with it for beginner use. Although, I've just looked at the Virtual DJ web ite this morning and it seems way more "techy" than it used to be.

I've looked at the pictures of Traktor and it seems pretty solid too, but my first impression is "messy".

Looking at Torq on screenshots, the first thing I notice is the waveform display. It seems to be a really good feature in Torq. Although I was mixing with CDJ800, there were no waveforms on it so I'm used to not using them.

But looking at screenshots from Torq and Traktor, Torq seems to be more "intuitive". I've read horror stories about the database in Torq...anyone can confirm ?

Thanks for the explanations about the VCI-100SE. I had a look yesterday on DJTechTools and I really do like the fact that there is so much third party support for the device. I doubt Torq is versatile like the VCI-100.

The only problem I have with the torq database is that you can't work on it while your device isn't plugged in. You can't turn on torq software without the hardware.

I used VDJ way back in the day and i agree. I have had it crash on me though.

As for the layout. You can change the appearance with theme colors and the overall layout. I usually have it displaying with just my browser and current track time information. This is because everything else i really need is on the controller. Only touch or look at the computer to change up a effect type or to change a track.

I can't find a demo of Torq anywhere to be downloaded so I can't validate this information. Sorry for asking !

Can I still use my Windows soundcard in Torq instead of the Xponents outputs ? My Event TR6s are connected to my Fast Track Ultra and I would like to keep it that way. I wouldn't use the Xponents Audio Card except for the headphones monitoring I guess.

quote:

Originally posted by Neo Hacker Can I still use my Windows soundcard in Torq instead of the Xponents outputs ?

I always thought that you needed the Torq hardware in order to run the software (like with Serato), but I might well be wrong so don't take my word.

quote:

Originally posted by Neo Hacker I can't find a demo of Torq anywhere to be downloaded so I can't validate this information. Sorry for asking ! Can I still use my Windows soundcard in Torq instead of the Xponents outputs ? My Event TR6s are connected to my Fast Track Ultra and I would like to keep it that way. I wouldn't use the Xponents Audio Card except for the headphones monitoring I guess.

The software is free for download but the catch is you need the torq hardware to run it. Sorta sucks if you want to try it out. I am not sure if you can get around it. I have run protools before with my xponent so i don't know if any other m-audio hardware would work.

If you had the xponent you can still run the other sound cards in the configuration you stated, yes.

quote:

Originally posted by Rebel Brown I always thought that you needed the Torq hardware in order to run the software (like with Serato), but I might well be wrong so don't take my word.

You can still open, organize and play one deck with serato. You can't do anything with torq if it is not setup.

quote:

Originally posted by archaudio The software is free for download but the catch is you need the torq hardware to run it. Sorta sucks if you want to try it out. I am not sure if you can get around it. I have run protools before with my xponent so i don't know if any other m-audio hardware would work. If you had the xponent you can still run the other sound cards in the configuration you stated, yes.

I'll try Traktor at home then and I'll look at some videos on Torq. I guess that's the best I can do.

Thanks for the answer. I'm glad to know that I can still use my Fast Track Ultra. I guess I'll still have to plug the headphones in the Xponent directly instead of the Fast Track, but that's not really a problem.

quote:

Originally posted by archaudio You can still open, organize and play one deck with serato. You can't do anything with torq if it is not setup.

This really is a downside of Torq. I guess they wanted to add extra-protection to the software. I can download the 1.5.2 software from M-Audio, but I'll still have to enter a cdkey so I can't use the software really. Would be nice for M-Audio to give us a demo version. I'm sure I'm not the first one to ask.

Archie, from reading your posts you seem to really enjoy the Xponent and seem to recommend it aswell. Have you tried the VCI-100 ? It would be interesting to know your comments between these 2 controllers.

Just thought about it...but I might get into radio show or whatever. I got an XLR microphone at home and eventually, I might want to incorporate the microphone into the software while mixing. Is that possible in Torq or Traktor ? I would connect the microphone through the XLR connectors on my Fast Track Ultra.

Thanks !

Newb question: A MIDI controler connects speakers and laptop? So one can software (traktor/ableton)and control through MIDI the volumes etc?

no (thats a soundcard). yes.
and finaly, u need both.

quote:

Originally posted by Chimney Newb question: A MIDI controler connects speakers and laptop? So one can software (traktor/ableton)and control through MIDI the volumes etc?

A midi controller is a device that sends midi signals. You press a button move a slider, turn a knob and a specific signal is sent.

You then map that specific signal in your programs software to do something.

EG. i press the play button on my midi controller and a specific sequence of 'code' is interpreted by the program you're using which in turn has (hopefully) the desired effect you're looking for. (on/off, increase decrease etcetc)

A midi cable (Or usb) is needed to carry the signal to usually a sound card or midi-usb device. Look up midi cable, midi card. midi usb converter etc etc.

Faderfox are nice simple midi controllers. They use midi cables. In my instance i use the Audio8DJ (Native Instruments) sound card which has midi input and output ports that you can hook your controller up to.

There's also the Native Instruments X1 which is a usb Midi Controller.

Vestax VCI 100 is also a midi controller.

Look them all up to get a better grasp on what's on offer and wikipedia is also your friend to understand the ins and outs of midi.

That's a very very rough (probably slightly incorrect) round up for you mate. Just thought i'd give a little more info apart from yes and no answers.

Just to add a little bit to what my Irish friend said above - as he explained, a MIDI controller is for controlling your software, essentially so you don't sit their in the DJ booth clicking a mouse like an utter plank.

You don't actually NEED anything else, because the audio output on your PC can go straight to your speakers. But most people prefer to buy an external sound card for several reasons:

1. Most DJs use laptops and the audio outputs on them are designed for headphones, not for driving reasonable speakers
2. A good external sound card will give you much better sound quality than a laptop soundcard
3. You almost certainly want at least 2 outputs (one for your speakers and one for your headphones), possibly more... external sound cards usually have several outputs, while your laptop/PC probably only has one.


You can get MIDI controllers with built-in sound cards, so act as an "all-in-one" solution, but it's best to think of these as a separate MIDI controller and sound card which happen to be in the same box.

Here are some of the setup and how-to Torq videos right from Avid's (formerly M-Audio's) site btw.

http://torq-dj.com/videos.php

quote:

Originally posted by miamitranceman Here are some of the setup and how-to Torq videos right from Avid's (formerly M-Audio's) site btw. http://torq-dj.com/videos.php

I've looked at all the videos on Torq and I'm quite impressed with it. I love the how the software works and it has really good functions that I might use. The Xponent itself ses to be quite good also with a good respobse time. Unfortunatly, in my case, the audio card would not be used as I would use my Fast Track Ultra. I noticed that I can't really use a microphone for radio shows but only for Samplers. i haven't figure out what I would do on this one.

I have installed Traktor demo on my pc, however I haven't tried it out yet. But at first sight, Torq seems more attractive visually.

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