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The music industry and the poor state it is in now - what about the future?

Read the full post below this quote.

In short I want to know your view on the following:

quote:

By Storyteller further down this topic Maybe I should formulate my question more exact: If you where a record label, or just an independent artist and have to live of the revenue generated by your music (and music-related) product(s), what would you do to make it a viable business? How would you stand out? How would you differentiate yourself from all the others in terms of marketing/communication and perhaps the use of the online possibilities? Would you intentionally move to offline media? What business model do you think will be the potential savour of the music industry

Laurent (Lolo) said this in another topic. The music industry is changing it's strategy, finally. Something big seems to be around the corner.

I just read this quote in another topic:

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN I'll never use spotify as it's criminal how little they pay to artists (and my problem is not with the fact they give exposure to artists (blah blah blah), but that they make a lot of money as a commercial entity and pass fuck all of it along to said artists). In that respect i prefer piracy, at least there's not a corporate entity making money off it, but that's a different discussion.

That raises a big question; What would be viable new business oppurtunities for music? How could an artist/label create revenue in these times where earning an income with releases is no longer a fact? Is Spotify genuis or a bunch of criminals?

In this case I wholeheartedly welcome Spotify. I personally think it's a brilliant development. Sure, it might not pay well for the artists but people (especially majors in the music industry) need to realise that times are changing. Spotify fits in the state of mind of our generation (get a lot, anywhere, for little in exchange). From what I've read in the past Spotify is not yet profitable. But they're one of the few that actually created a new source of revenue for artists in a time where the revenue is declining, thus I can only say this is a very good initiative.

The state this music industry is in is appalling. Majors holding on to their old ways trying to impose copyrights on users by sueing, or by sueing new platforms that try and bring something new to the table. If you can't beat em, join em! Why not turn it around and see how you can beat illegal mp3-sites by offering a more interesting product yourself?

My main question would be this one as written earlier:
How could an artist/label create revenue in these times where earning an income with releases is no longer a fact? Keep in mind that a lot of people expect to pay very little or nothing at all for great products and that this attitude is really hard to change. I am just curious to see if anyone has any idea on how te create an interesting revenue stream with music. What could revolutionize the music industry as we know it know, what could be the next best thing now that streaming from 'the cloud' is a hot item like it is now?

Flame on guys! .

PS: I don't want to focus too much on what actually might be the cause of the problem. I'd rather hear how you think this could be solved.

Re: The music industry and the poor state it is in now - what about the future?

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller I just read this quote in another topic: DJ RANN's remark about Spotify.

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Originally posted by Storyteller In this case I wholeheartedly welcome Spotify.

http://www.informationisbeautiful.n...ts-earn-online/

Scroll down.



It's ugly.

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Originally posted by clay release on vinyl.

Exactly what I was thinking.

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Originally posted by EddieZilker http://www.informationisbeautiful.n...ts-earn-online/ Scroll down. It's ugly.

Oh I bet it is; But my question remains, how could this be turned around for the better? Could this negative climate be feeding grounds for new initiatives or approaches to generating income with music?

I don't want to focus too much on what actually might be the cause of the problem. I'd rather hear how you think this could be solved.

quote:

Originally posted by clay release on vinyl.

Please elaborate/motivate your comments. I'd love this to be a constructive topic as much as possible as I think this could be a really interesting discussion overall.

every artist out there has to get their hands in everything for the future. as an artist you can't be ignorant about the business side anymore.

promote nights,dj,live pa,produce,start a label, if you get your hands dirty in all those people will hear you out.

here's an interesting vid on the music industry for today that i think is relevant to this thread:

Thanks for your contribution. Watching the video while typing this. Starts off interesting!

This one has A-trak and he talks about the club scene. The last vid had more of a focus on indie rock it seems.

Panel: Artists As Businesses

quote:

Originally posted by clay release on vinyl.

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Originally posted by Beatflux Exactly what I was thinking.

Just a shame though that after selling maybe 1 copy it will still be ripped and put online.

Back to square 1.

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Originally posted by Storyteller Oh I bet it is; But my question remains, how could this be turned around for the better? Could this negative climate be feeding grounds for new initiatives or approaches to generating income with music? I don't want to focus too much on what actually might be the cause of the problem. I'd rather hear how you think this could be solved.

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...48&pagenumber=4



In the third post down, I cited Terre Thaemlitz, who discusses the weakened market for music and how he's marketing his stuff. I'm not sure if a giant box set sold for a lump sum of 220.00 Euros is the way to go, but it's an interesting idea. It seems like, if producers are going to make the money they'd like to be making, they're going to have to divorce themselves from the market place in its current incarnation.


Great idea for a thread, and, hopefully, I'll be able to add more, as things progress.

(If it wasn't for piracy, again a major flaw) What about selling your actual project files? Surely there would be money in that?
Wouldn't you not be the slightest bit curious to see how your favourite tracks were put together?

I've seen that some guys sell their vinyls with their merch when their giging somewhere

Just neocapitalism rotting all facets of humanity from the inside out, as usual.

Please: I don't want to focus too much on what actually might be the cause of the problem. I'd rather hear how you think this could be solved.

quote:

Originally posted by -FSP- This one has A-trak and he talks about the club scene. The last vid had more of a focus on indie rock it seems. Panel: Artists As Businesses

They're saying some interesting things (watched all clips). What I mostly notice is their professionalism is way beyond what I consider to be regular. Working with managers, lawyers, agents etc. Too bad they're not really covering ground on the hard climate for the musicians that much, they're mostly talking about business in general. It does make me realise that I need to sort some stuff out for the elaborate label plans I've got over 18 months now (LAWYERS, LEGAL PAPERWORK, sigh).

quote:

Originally posted by Andy28 Just a shame though that after selling maybe 1 copy it will still be ripped and put online. Back to square 1.

Whenever you sell music on a physical medium it has more worth than just a WAV or mp3 download. People enjoy cover and vinyl art.

People who buy vinyl could have some pride in that they own a copy of a song that can't be reproduced infinitely.

The remaining question about vinyl would be: Would that be enough to put yourself out there as an artist and to realise a sustainable income?

Maybe I should formulate my question more exact: If you where a record label, or just an independent artist and have to live of the revenue generated by your music (and music-related) product(s), what would you do to make it a viable business? How would you stand out? How would you differentiate yourself from all the others in terms of marketing/communication and perhaps the use of the online possibilities? Would you intentionally move to offline media? What business model do you think will be the potential savour of the music industry

Try and think outside of the box

Re: Re: The music industry and the poor state it is in now - what about the future?

quote:

Originally posted by EddieZilker http://www.informationisbeautiful.n...ts-earn-online/ Scroll down. It's ugly.

I think this really demonstrates that in terms of business models, companies involved in the music industry just don't have a clue and the changing of the guard from the old model (i.e. majors selling to music distributors who in turn sell to music shops) has not even got close to it's viable future. I'm not talking about what the problem is (we all know that), I'm talking about reluctance to accept the new status quo.



IMO, if it's true that companies like spotify are not making money, and yet they pay artists and labels so little, then I hope they go out of business, fast. I also think it will happen as more and more artists are removing their content due to the sheer lack of revenue generated for so many plays.


EDITED OUT REST OF RESPONSE: because (even though it sounds lame) I just had a fucking great idea.......

In a sense the model is just returning to its roots, with performance being the distinguishing factor in terms of financial gain. There is hope for producers on the licensing side of things, but it can't sustain everyone en masse.

Here's my thinking, outside the box:

Kind of sketchy but...

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller The remaining question about vinyl would be: Would that be enough to put yourself out there as an artist and to realise a sustainable income? Maybe I should formulate my question more exact: If you where a record label, or just an independent artist and have to live of the revenue generated by your music (and music-related) product(s), what would be the correct way to stand out from the crowd and generate that revenue you are looking for?

I think there has to be a market for it but audio quality is the way I'd like to go.



I saw this and remembered how events used to sound verses how events and other venues began sounding by the time I informally stopped going to clubs. If you listen to what this guy says about the sound-chain (And I suppose DJ RANN might have more of an idea if this guy is smoking too much of his own hype or not), he's proposing an ideal that starts out with a perfectly mixed, perfectly mastered track.

Like I said, though, I've heard songs I'd previously heard on decent sound systems lose their charm, entirely, when put through a negligible sound-system. If I were a producer who was confident in his work, I'd find a list of DJ's who regularly played on a Funktion One (or similar), and start marketing to them.

How that fits into building a revolution, in terms of marketing, is that, hypothetically, you're delivering a product to a niche. It affords them better control over what they're getting if you can consistently deliver a quality product with such sensibilities in mind as to be both exquisite and compatible with their sound-system. If you can get a select few people to do things this way, where you have much more control over the quality, then you can help advance product quality for Funktion One clubs and Owners. It's not some hyper-mastered MP3 that gets downloaded from Beatport and people should just stop selling music that way.

The other part of my recommended solution is to stop feeding the machine. I think a lot of people are mislead that it's going to be some milk & honey experience when they get signed to a label who's selling on Beatport but then the song doesn't make the artist more than $100.00 (but feel free to correct me on that - I'm certain there are variations).

There's also the fact that Beatport is involved in a law-suit concerning how it's leveraged its artist's bay out of Denver night-clubs it doesn't own. I agree with not talking about the problems as much as the solution, but I think part of the solution is not to be part of the problem. Don't feed it with the revenues it gets from your product.

Really, this is all just spit-balling here, but ditch the labels and start one up as a cooperative, where label mates share administrative responsibilities. The middle-man makes most of their money because a large pool of artists is belting out a large amount of product. Again, stop feeding this part of the beast and let it die.

Finally, there's an old adage that says, "If you want to take a look at what you want, take a look at what you've got." And really, what do we have? If you're unsatisfied with bad promoters and shifty contracts, stop playing the game. Drop out, do something else for a living, continue to make music but fuck the riff-raff.

It may take a little while for it to start happening and you'll probably have to save up for a few years, or at least pay a loan, if you really want to drive a used BMW but I suspect a comfortable living could be made with a little discretion.

we need to take the game back. 2 years of parody dance music, by the time the idiots on the dance floor and the coked out douche bags booking the shows realize what they are gyrating to, we will have already made a clean getaway. check mate.

quote:

Originally posted by EddieZilker Here's my thinking, outside the box:

I'm impressed and feel like your text holds a lot of truths. While I do not know what the added value of audio fidelity would be to most people I like how you're talking about a niche market defining a scope (audience) for the operation at hand. Great thoughts.

Sounds kinda like the illicit drug trade. Odd, que no?

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller I'm impressed and feel like your text holds a lot of truths. While I do not know what the added value of audio fidelity would be to most people I like how you're talking about a niche market defining a scope (audience) for the operation at hand. Great thoughts.

Well, I've been thinking a lot about it just because there are a LOT of people talking about the current state of affairs, in the industry. I'm even thinking of coagulating links to all the blogs, threads, and web video interviews into a single thread. JOOF's even been talking about it.

It's kind of funny how intertwined all this stuff is.

Any link to similar discussions elsewhere is appreciated

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller Any link to similar discussions elsewhere is appreciated

Are you looking for the state of the scene type of discussions, such as the one in the thread by cryophonik?

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...3&forumid=48&s=

It's duplicated in the OP, here:

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...74&forumid=1&s=


Or are you looking for more proactive sorts, like yours - even though his take isn't really that pessimistic there are some which are downright despondent, I mean to include if only as a bit of an archive for the time.

quote:

Originally posted by EddieZilker

That little bit of about how the ear can discern down to 15-20 millionths of a second is really fascinating.

There was this thread on gearslutz about groove, and people were saying that the MPC was groovier than just sticking percussion in a sequencer. I'm not talking about any sort of template or swing, just a straight MPC rhythm. When it was analyzed the MPC rhythm actually had slight deviations, less than a millisecond that the strictly quantized version did not. People thought the MPC rhythm sounded "tighter" when in reality it was not.

Professional drummers have impeccable timing where they are controlling how much forward or behind their timing is. This isn't necessarily obvious to people either because it usually less than a few milliseconds.

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