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-- Did Ferry Corsten killed trance?
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quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 it is possible to like the epic style without enjoying average or copied music

let me use an example that you can understand.


remeber when flannels and jeans were really cool in the mid 90's. guess what? If you're still wearing that shit now your out of touch with fashion. You can still wear it but you KNOW that is shit. You're not pretending that it's something fashionable.

same with music.


remeber when epic trance was new and refreshing back in the day. guess what? If you still think listening to epic style trance is still new and refreshing you're out of touch with music. You can still listen to epic trance but you KNOW its cheese. And you can't act like it's something new or refreshing.



Hopefully you understand now. Fashion is like music. Both 'subjective'. But those who know fashion or those who know music will know whats hot and whats not. Very simple.


The problem with fashion and music is that the general public is always last to know.

The public is last to pick up on a trend and last to exit.

The public was last to pick up on epic trance and will be last to understand that its shit .

Does the fact that one style of music is 'hotter' that another make it better?

If so, then why aren't you listening to hip-hop?

You have definately picked a good example to relate to me with. While kids were wearing the flannel and jeans in the 90's I wasn't, and I got picked on for it alot, I am very out of touch with fashion to say the least.

But the aproach to realizing that one fashion is hot and the other is in no way objective or scientific, and it doesn't proove that the new thing is any better either.

That kind of stuff is the realm of trendiness, and I'm not much for following trends.

I find that the kids listening to epic styles aren't listening to the stuff because it is new or refreshing, but because it is fun, it does not really matter to them what everybody else thinks is the hot style.

Maybe my scene is just blessed with talented locals or something, but they find ways to play epic styles that are very uncheesy. I find that on many nights of going out people are capable of playing euphoric styles without over-recycling and being cheesy.

I agree that the dominant figures in epic style are being quite cheesy and hard to enjoy, but I dont agree that this is because the whole epic style is inferior.

But you are right, when I listen to those guys I know that the style is not what many consider hot, I just dont give a fuck.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 If so, then why aren't you listening to hip-hop?

hip hop is hot with the public now but those famialr with music know it cheese ball shit.

so do all of "those who know music" agree on what is hot?

if so then enlighten us, please

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 That kind of stuff is the realm of trendiness, and I'm not much for following trends.

Not pop culture trends but trends amongst the �intelligencia�

who are these �intelligencia� and what does it take to be a part of them?

do you have to have the same tastes as them for them to let you in?

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 Does the fact that one style of music is 'hotter' that another make it better? If so, then why aren't you listening to hip-hop?

well, because the average rapper today knows more about diamonds and silk than beats and rhymes.

I'm thinking that the people you deem as the intelligent ones are just the ones that agree with you.

how about you tell me some good ways to measure how musicaly intelligent a person is

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 so do all of "those who know music" agree on what is hot? if so then enlighten us, please

http://www.ishkur.com/music/

all intelligent people like ghetto tech!!!


woot woot!

actually

the trance music isn't dead but it is more in deep shit. That's Tiesto and Ferry's fault. Their success has made them confused because of the money being made and that leading to what trance is today. We really need new talented producers who has the ability to make good trancemusic not some newbies making crap on ejay.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 who are these �intelligencia� and what does it take to be a part of them? do you have to have the same tastes as them for them to let you in?

I am not apart of this group. I just like to listen and/or debate with them.


you know when you meet someone who is apart of the EDM Intelligencia when they can explain and deconstruct EDM.


For example TA's like,

Ian

UWM

Cobalt

Twig ( aka Lushimee,davidclarke,etc)

Floorfiller

SandStorm

Ishkur

Swamper

Wicked Neo

Aplha Starred

UnWordly

and many more

I am almost 100% certain that those people you listed don't agree on what music is better, I imagine they have a stance very similar to my "just like what you like" approach

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls I am not apart of this group. I just like to listen and/or debate with them. you know when you meet someone who is apart of the EDM Intelligencia when they can explain and deconstruct EDM. For example TA's like, Ian UWM Cobalt Twig ( aka Lushimee,davidclarke,etc) Floorfiller SandStorm Ishkur Swamper Wicked Neo Aplha Starred UnWordly and many more

I forgot one very important TA ....

torontotrance

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 I am almost 100% certain that those people you listed don't agree on what music is better, I imagine they have a stance very similar to my "just like what you like" approach

If you were to ask them to defind dutch epic trance, what are examples of good and shit dutch epic trance, and what they think of the genre currently you would get a variety of intellegent answers.


It was only recently that I read cobalt,Ian, and torontotrance say some very interesting things on the topic.

they are intelligent, but not in agreement, because they do not have an ojective view of music

I just don't like impossibly long breakdowns.

My favourite trance tracks are the ones that have small ones (2-4 bars, tops), or none at all.

quote:

Originally posted by Zombie0915 they are intelligent, but not in agreement, because they do not have an ojective view of music

but more importantly they will explain themseleves if you ask them.

This fosters the debate and exchange of ideas. Thus an objective view of EDM can be created. You compare the similarities and undserstand the differences.

But in order to make a discussion on EDM objective you need people to explain themselves and provide examples. The good arguements are kept alive whilst the poorly shaped arugemnts are shit on.



Thus far Ishkurs defintion of Epic Trance still stands. Please view his EDM Guide for his defintions on http://www.ishkur.com/music/#.

Prove and show me examples of Dutch Trance that doesn't fit his defintion.

Re: actually

quote:

Originally posted by dj christian the trance music isn't dead but it is more in deep shit. That's Tiesto and Ferry's fault. Their success has made them confused because of the money being made and that leading to what trance is today. We really need new talented producers who has the ability to make good trancemusic not some newbies making crap on ejay.

John O'callaghan and MArcos are just two of the great producers around at the moment.

quote:

Originally posted by Ishkur I just don't like impossibly long breakdowns. My favourite trance tracks are the ones that have small ones (2-4 bars, tops), or none at all.

Keep up the good work !!!

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls Thus far Ishkurs defintion of Epic Trance still stands. Please view his EDM Guide for his defintions on http://www.ishkur.com/music/#. Prove and show me examples of Dutch Trance that doesn't fit his defintion.

Vimana - Dreamtime

made by tiesto & ferry and does not have a breakdown.

Corsten is definetly NOT killing trance. If anything hes just extending it!

How can you say Rock Your Body Rock is killin it!

Ishkur is a nerd.

quote:

Originally posted by Ishkur Actually, Oakenfold killed trance, but since it was a Dutch trance music node, I felt it'd be proper to put a Dutch guy, less I get a million stupid emails from people wanting to "correct" me that Oakenfold is british.....but the name is really not that important. It could've been Tiesto or Armin, it didn't really matter to me, so long as it was someone prominant and Dutch enough to rile trancecrackers. And from the looks of things, it succeeded. There's a reason why I only cited you guys in the credits. I love you all so much. As for the rest of it.....am I joking? Am I being serious? Or am I being serious about joking? I think that's part of its charm.

Brilliant

quote:

Originally posted by Blue Balls Brilliant

You are either ishkur logged in under a different name or just love the taste of his ass.

j/k

quote:

Originally posted by JakeC and does not have a breakdown.

That means it is not Dutch Epic Trance.

Because by defintion Dutch Epic Trance must have a long break down.

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