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-- McProgressive
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quote:

Originally posted by Ory Hey, it's you again! I see you've come back without a point. Now go think for a bit.

actually i am embarrassed that i even argued with you.

Jeez, gone for less than 24 hours and this thread doubles. What I find really frustrating (and revealing) is that many of the same flawed arguments have been repeated since, when I already addressed them. Don't people even bother reading the thread before posting?

quote:

Originally posted by Mechgear as a gdjb played producer id just like to say, if u dont like the music then fuck off and listen to your shitty hardcore/hardstyle/cheese in a can above and beyond look at my synths look at my synths music and leave the music i and the other producers work the fuck alone. if u dont like it, fuck off and dont listen, dont bitch cos about it cos it proves your some kind of fucking idiot who doesnt understand shit. prog gone formulaeic? welcome to edm u dumb twats, all EDM is formulaeic, intro, main verse, outro... at its simplest and dreamy sounding reverbed synths? hell yes and u know why? cos when u hear them u get that funny little feeling in your stomach which makes u happy and feel euphoric, THAT is why people use them, THAT is why people like them! personally id like to hear the prog sound go both deeper and more uplifting into two seperate sub genres, cos i think that prog has a lot of life in it. as for markus and armin killing prog, whats your problem? would you have even heard of it if it wasnt for them? simple answer... NO. its idiots like the fools who bitch on this thread that kill the fucking scene, so once again shove ur mc prog label up ur arse and kindly fuck off back to your cyberkiddies munching 20 pills a night destroying their braincells and listening to music which is too fast to dance to for more than 30 seconds, leave the decent music to the people who understand/deserve it Nick Thompson

The ignorance of this post just boggles the imagination. It alone gives better support to the argument against American prog than anything else in this thread. I honestly would not be able to craft a better parody if I tried. There's hateful generalization, ignorance of history, lack of experience, point-blank ad hominem, you name it. It's all there.

quote:

Originally posted by Wandii 4. There is NEVER any bad music, there are only opinions. Most of which should be kept to themselves.

This is not quite true. Objective quality does exist in music, though it's very difficult to pin down or measure in any way. People with experience in a particular form of music will differ in taste, yes, but there are always works that are more generally agreed upon to be better or worse. Therefore there is something that gives a measure of objective quality, but you can't really nail it down or quantify it.

quote:

Originally posted by Mechgear a lot of the people bashing the music are sasha fans etc (wow isnt that prog house?)

Sasha has played both progressive house and trance over the years. In the early to mid-nineties he played what you might call progressive house, but it was really a different genre back then, typically called "Epic House". Between 1998 and 2000, he went almost exclusively progressive trance, culminating in Xpander and GU 013. From 2001 onward he shifted decisively to progressive house, as did pretty much the entire progressive scene.

quote:

Originally posted by stevebutabi it's really fucking sad if progressive trance has evolved from Sasha GU 13 to "McProg"

Truly. Calling the Miami sound "progressive trance" is just criminal compared to the noble legacy of that genre, and doesn't fit either (because it's decidedly house based).

quote:

Originally posted by Durrrtysouth Have you noticed that all this bitching and negativity only started here on TA when the Global Underground message board was shut down (which by the way was nothing but Sasha and Digweed ass kissers and slagging everything else). Someone please start that board up again so these poor helpless progheads can have a place to bitch and moan again.

Having been on Trance Addict through our own rise and fall of prog-head arrogance, I must say you don't know what you're talking about here.

quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ quote: Originally posted by A.J. I don't "dig that sound". but it's sick. so many 'tight' tunes

See, "American Progressive" fits great!

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Originally posted by Jasperovitsj This isn't meant personally, or as a rection against McProg or anything, just a general thought I just had: What does not listening to it gonna help? Me not listening won't cease the problem to exist, nor will it diminish any effect it has on the scene. It's just like ignoring a fight between your parents. Going to your room and cranking up the volume of your stereo doesn't make the fight downstairs disppear, and it certainly won't miraculously erase all the pain and wounds it causes... So yeah, I personally think McProg has an influence on "the scene", kinda in a way like Eurodance has an influence on the "real trance"-scene. It's great to introduce willing listeners to a new kind of music, but with the meaning of those listeners to move on, explore further, and see beyond the crappy stuf that got them into it in the first place. I'm not calling McProg-artists crappy here, but you know what I mean, there's just a little difference between McProg and the real deal. Once again I compare it with Eurodance: Barthezz - On The Move, for example, isn't necessarily a bad song, but almost every self-respecting "real trance"-fan won't call it "pure proper trance"... And what do real trance-heads complain about? Cowboy-hat wearing breezah's that think Lasgo or that Barthezz track is the culmination of trance, and Dj Jean is the best turntablewizard the world has ever seen. Such people are called "ignorant fools", and are strongly advised to "look beyond that shit, and find the true trance!". Once again, same thing with McProg IMO. Sure, it's good to introduce people to a new style, but it should function as a stepstone to the "real" prog, somewhat like a bridge crossing 2 genres. But lately it just seems that a lot of people are standing still at the middle of the bridge, while thinking that they've already reached the other side completely... So basically, I wonder what this "If you don't like it, don't listen to it" attitude is gonna help? It's clear that there is some kind of problem with McProg, the simple fact that this discussion is being held and doesn't seem to end proves that quite easily. But "not listening if you don't like it" will just make you ignore the problem, and what does that help? It will only make the gap between McProg-lovers and pure Progheads get bigger and bigger... And I'm not gonna try to offer a simple yet genius solution to it all, cause I frankly don't think there is any (just like there really isn't any in the Eurodance vs Trance debate). But you could at least be aware of the problem and acknowledge it. IMO, using the "If you don't like it, don't listen to it" argument, is just as constructive as saying "McProg sucks adn so do you for listening to it"... As I said, this isn't anything personal, just a general annoyance about this comment being one of the most used on musicboards, but in fact being kinda bullsh*t IMO...

I agree. And it reminds me of another argument against the "if-you-don't-like-it-don't-listen-to-it" argument, which I posted on page 8:

quote:

Originally posted by Cobalt Actually, it is that difficult. You're assuming that there's perfect knowledge and access to music. When a particular genre is flooded by a sound like that of American Progressive or ASOT, the minority sounds still attached to that genre becomes much more difficult to find. This is the current state of trance for me, and others on the board. I search through record shops. I listen to a variety of sets. But I have to sift through an increasingly large volume of material that sounds the same, that is diminishing in quality. It's not so simple that people who don't like American Progressive and Dutch Trance can simply get up and leave for something else, because all the available distribution channels are filled with the stuff. It becomes increasingly frustrating as time goes on, particularly when one feels that better material is becoming unjustly buried. So naturally myself and others will put up a fight and speak out against it.

quote:

Originally posted by Az I think Ozgur Can has the capability of producing some fine records as do Leama and Moor, but by their own admission, they're not into it anymore, and churning out the tunes for bucks.....

I agree. And I fear the Tilt project slipping in the same direction, though it's not too late.

quote:

Originally posted by Cobalt I agree. And I fear the Tilt project slipping in the same direction, though it's not too late.

it involves Andy Moor, so I assume thats why the Tilt alias has been resurrected
a quick buck

quote:

Originally posted by Az it involves Andy Moor, so I assume thats why the Tilt alias has been resurrected a quick buck

I think that applies somewhat to The World Doesn't Know. But I doubt I Know You're Afraid was put through Quivver with the intent of sale.

And I honestly, genuinely like 12 quite a lot.

So if more material follows in an even more watered-down format than The World Doesn't Know, I think hope is lost. But that remains to be seen and I don't believe Parks & Wilson will go that way.

I think "Miami Prog" is a great name for "McProg"

cause the music is pretty and shallow just like miami lol j/k

quote:

Originally posted by stevebutabi I think "Miami Prog" is a great name for "McProg" cause the music is pretty and shallow just like miami lol j/k

And I think we need to come up with a name for the idiots who post countless negative rants about a genre they dont care for.

I know, lets calle them "Global Underground Orphans" since the GU board shut down they all wandered over here and brought the shitty vibe that board had along with it.

quote:

Originally posted by Cobalt Jeez, gone for less than 24 hours and this thread doubles. What I find really frustrating (and revealing) is that many of the same flawed arguments have been repeated since, when I already addressed them. Don't people even bother reading the thread before posting?

hehe

well not many people in this thread except you have the ability to discuss on a mature level. I've almost only read your posts cause those are about the only ones that doesnt automatically end up in a flamewar. Some people in here really need to grow up.

quote:

Originally posted by Ory Very true. However, I do think the listeners do "suck", so to speak (yeah, my own words, I know. :P). I mean, seriously people; when was the last time you actually put some effort into finding good music? All you do is sit back and listen to ASOT/GDJB, then go on and on about the tracks that are played on there, when there's much better stuff out there.

who are you to decide what is better music? if they are happy listening to one rolling Probspot-bassline after another, just let them.

why do people always have to label tunes?

This whole thread smells like musically rascism, if you ask me.
People see a name of a producer or see GDJB or ASOT and label it as mcprog and say it's cheesy. I really don't get it.

I think in terms of good tune/bad tune. I don't care about the genre that it's repressenting or the name on the cover. If Leama & Moor make a good track, I'll spin it. If Markus Schulz makes a good track, I'll spin it. Even if the most cheesiest artist you can imagine (DJ Jean or something like that)gets struck by lightning and starts making good tracks, I'll spin that too. And If they don't make a good record, I won't spin it.

I agree, many productions of last year by several artists named in this topic seriously lacks quality IMO.But that doesn't mean that an entire genre sucks or that the next record they make in the same style will suck. Every tune is different and every genre has it's good tunes and it's bad tunes, even if 90% of the production of that genre sucks in your opinion

quote:

Originally posted by The Freezzz why do people always have to label tunes? This whole thread smells like musically rascism, if you ask me. People see a name of a producer or see GDJB or ASOT and label it as mcprog and say it's cheesy. I really don't get it. I think in terms of good tune/bad tune. I don't care about the genre that it's repressenting or the name on the cover. If Leama & Moor make a good track, I'll spin it. If Markus Schulz makes a good track, I'll spin it. Even if the most cheesiest artist you can imagine (DJ Jean or something like that)gets struck by lightning and starts making good tracks, I'll spin that too. And If they don't make a good record, I won't spin it. I agree, many productions of last year by several artists named in this topic seriously lacks quality IMO.But that doesn't mean that an entire genre sucks or that the next record they make in the same style will suck. Every tune is different and every genre has it's good tunes and it's bad tunes, even if 90% of the production of that genre sucks in your opinion

I 100% agree with this. It's about the quality of the tune, not the name that's on the label.

mcprog 4 lyfe!!

Super-dooper uplifting, euphoric, supreme, driving, fantabulous power-trance 4 lyf, dogg!!

quote:

Originally posted by Az because it's extremely boring and unimaginative

but he's another guy whos making tracks that markus is caning, so he's going to be biased

This thread is still going?

I guarentee most of the people here saying they don't like McProg actually like supersaw power trance.

quote:

Originally posted by rooibos

What a nice tan for someone from Miami

out of interest.. do u guys consider my track to be "McProg"?

mike

quote:

Originally posted by Mike_Foyle out of interest.. do u guys consider my track to be "McProg"? mike

Well, don't know wich track you made, but you're avatar almost says enough, EE is the biggest McProg label around

Statica - Space Guitar

quote:

Originally posted by Mike_Foyle statica - space guitar

Listened the sample and yes i would consider this as Mcprog. Way too long break-down and a cheesy cheap melody, but that's just my opinion

ok

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Originally posted by Arno F What a nice tan for someone from Miami

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Originally posted by Mike_Foyle ok

But still quite cool that you got a track signed to a big label, congratz

quote:

Originally posted by Arno F Listened the sample and yes i would consider this as Mcprog. Way too long break-down and a cheesy cheap melody, but that's just my opinion

Wow, Arno being negative, this can't be right!

c'mon man, I've heard one of your sets and some McProg would fit in just right.

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