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-- Fluid Night Club - Racism
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Dunno what to make of this.

It just makes no sense to me. A well established Club like FLuid, refusing to let black people enter (while the bouncers are black and just take this???), risking not only getting shut down but risking criminla charges. I just don't understand why a sussessful clubowner would make some descision like that. The guy might as well shut the place down now b4 the racial groups get involved or the authorities. Well, that is if this Rumour is true....

Just gotta wait and see what happens. I just don't beleive a club owner of a successful and well established club would RISK his investment as well as the reputation of himself and the club. It all just makes no sense to me.

Regardless if it happened or not I shouldnt have posted without having real facts.

Anyways, now that we know it seems to be true. I know where _I_ won't be going clubbing.

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Originally posted by King_Mack ouch. thats sad, i used to go to fluid a lot also, this guy i know, his friend got denied entrance at Indian Motorcycle because he was wearing a turban(apparently no headgear allowed)..but religious headcover *IS* allowed by the government of canada. I dunno how true this story is cuz I dont know the guy well..but this is what he told me. Its really odd, because there are more than a few indian patrons that always reach IMC

Plus, its Indian Motorcycle..

That's false advertising.

Re: Dunno what to make of this.

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Originally posted by E*Master Just gotta wait and see what happens. I just don't beleive a club owner of a successful and well established club would RISK his investment as well as the reputation of himself and the club. It all just makes no sense to me.

Exactly. It is very risky for a successful club owner to try to pull off something like this. He'd have to be brain-dead.

The role of the media is to investigate stories like this and get to the bottom of it and tell the story to the public. When people start gossiping about things like this, it undermines what the media is
supposed to do.

it prolly did happen because their are some real racist wops out there...trust me i grew up all around wops..im a wop....theres a huge number of them mainly older who immigrated here who are very ignorant...not use to the northern american way of life...trust me theyre racist as hell especially to their own kind which is ironic...my father is one of them...not ignorant nor racist he just hates everyone equally...he hates wops germans blacks spanish u name it he hates them....i think he just says it though he doesnt mean it....but like i said theres a huge number of old italians that are very very racist...what can u do....its their business right? if they want to lose their clientelle let them

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Originally posted by Skipper This kind of thing really, really pisses me off. Minorities get an advantage because of all the disadvantages they've had throughout history? History that neither them nor I were a part of? Thank god I won't be applying for law school in the states - but law schools up here DO try to accept a diverse group of students - however, the procedures for doing so are much less formal. Re the illegality thing - perhaps I am thinking of the states. Private venue owners are allowed much more discretion down there than here - for example, golf courses can refuse a woman from entrance simply because she is a woman. Sexism, racism - same deal.

i think it's limiting to say 'history that neither them not I were a part of.' that history does affect minorities, esp afro-americans. the economic oppression that slavery and post-slavery created has continued to plague that community. if you follow the laws and policies that ensued after slavery was aboloshed this is evident (ie moynahan report). it's a shitty situation when affirmative actiion type policies have to be used, but i consider them a necessary evil.

I just have to say this is really disggusting. just to hear it. Man!. Gino night?come on guys. you can't just tell people to leave your establishment and come back on a another day. So what? White people can't come on Wensdays? and that Italians aren't allowed on Thursdays cause its "Black" night? Fucking club is retarded. Thanks for the post loconet. Iam sure all TA's aggree with you. You did the right thing.

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Originally posted by charmscars i think it's limiting to say 'history that neither them not I were a part of.' that history does affect minorities, esp afro-americans. the economic oppression that slavery and post-slavery created has continued to plague that community. if you follow the laws and policies that ensued after slavery was aboloshed this is evident (ie moynahan report). it's a shitty situation when affirmative actiion type policies have to be used, but i consider them a necessary evil.

Of course we are each a part of our respective histories, but only in a very broad sense. I don't think this justifies what schools are doing these days.

To simply reverse the subjects of inequality is not going to solve matters. Two wrongs do not make a right. Minorities should demand that they be treated as equals with whites, but giving them preferential treatment with academic admissions is going too far.

quote:

Originally posted by Skipper Of course we are each a part of our respective histories, but only in a very broad sense. I don't think this justifies what schools are doing these days. To simply reverse the subjects of inequality is not going to solve matters. Two wrongs do not make a right. Minorities should demand that they be treated as equals with whites, but giving them preferential treatment with academic admissions is going too far.

What she said.

Affirmative action policies are the corporations' (and government's) lazy, half-assed methods of complying with the law by ensuring the presence of minorities, even if they're unqualified, because the average adult white male would be laughed at if he complained about not getting in because of his background. It's the old "some of my best friends are black" (some of our best students/workers/etc are black). This does not counter racism at all - it just promotes the "token black/hispanic/chinese boy/girl" paradigm that everyone hated in the '80s.

What they should be doing is proper audits of their acceptance/hiring practices - i.e. having higher-ups or government officials examining their records to make sure that the reverse isn't true. Doing this would also enable them to discover obvious corruption, i.e. bribes, backdoor deals, or simple nepotism. Business people like to take the attitude that it's not possible to do this, but really what they mean is that it's not cost-effective.

But we've all seen it - bigots are usually stupid people who don't try to hide their bigotry. It's not hard to audit - truly discriminatory practices are plainly obvious to anyone who bothers looking.

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Originally posted by DigiNut What she said. Affirmative action policies are the corporations' (and government's) lazy, half-assed methods of complying with the law by ensuring the presence of minorities, even if they're unqualified, because the average adult white male would be laughed at if he complained about not getting in because of his background. It's the old "some of my best friends are black" (some of our best students/workers/etc are black). This does not counter racism at all - it just promotes the "token black/hispanic/chinese boy/girl" paradigm that everyone hated in the '80s. What they should be doing is proper audits of their acceptance/hiring practices - i.e. having higher-ups or government officials examining their records to make sure that the reverse isn't true. Doing this would also enable them to discover obvious corruption, i.e. bribes, backdoor deals, or simple nepotism. Business people like to take the attitude that it's not possible to do this, but really what they mean is that it's not cost-effective. But we've all seen it - bigots are usually stupid people who don't try to hide their bigotry. It's not hard to audit - truly discriminatory practices are plainly obvious to anyone who bothers looking.

Can you talk in simpler words ??

While I don't necessarily agree with the new university acceptance policy, there are plenty of arguments for it. Think about it.. Black and Hispanic population is growing at a much larger rate then white population. And the sad reality is that too many of them are uneducated and many are even illiterate. Unless things begin to change America will enter 22nd with 70% of population uneducated and illiterate. Personally, I wouldn't want to live in a country like that.

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Originally posted by Durafei ...Think about it.. Black and Hispanic population is growing at a much larger rate then white population. And the sad reality is that too many of them are uneducated and many are even illiterate.

I don't understand the reason for the "eye rolling", but let me get this straight. According to your post:

- Blacks and Hispanics will eventually be making up a greater percentage of population than whites, and
- Many of them, as you say, are uneducated and illiterate.

Your conclusion, therefore, is that the universities should make a policy of accepting them over whites despite this fact? You want to have universities full of uneducated and illiterate people? I don't have statistics to show that pre-university whites are more literate, but if what you say is true, then you've presented a very good argument AGAINST the "quota" policies!

University, law school, etc. is what we call higher education or post-secondary education. It is for people who are already educated and want to pursue further studies. Let's not turn it into an institution for learning the alphabet.

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Originally posted by DigiNut Let's not turn it into an institution for learning the alphabet.

Well, I learned all my important letters while attending a professional school....e, k, g....

In all seriousness, werd to everything you said. AND how you said it - I like people who write properly on message boards! (not that this post of mine was much of an example!)

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Originally posted by DigiNut I don't understand the reason for the "eye rolling", but let me get this straight. According to your post: - Blacks and Hispanics will eventually be making up a greater percentage of population than whites, and - Many of them, as you say, are uneducated and illiterate. Your conclusion, therefore, is that the universities should make a policy of accepting them over whites despite this fact? You want to have universities full of uneducated and illiterate people? I don't have statistics to show that pre-university whites are more literate, but if what you say is true, then you've presented a very good argument AGAINST the "quota" policies! University, law school, etc. is what we call higher education or post-secondary education. It is for people who are already educated and want to pursue further studies. Let's not turn it into an institution for learning the alphabet.

1) The fact is that universities like Harward have for years been accepting sons/daughters of rich lawyers, doctors etc.. Harward was accepting those students not because they are smart but because of their parents. I don't see you complaining about that. Of course GMAT(or whatever those american exams are) matter, but at the end it's all politics. If you are a sibling of a wealthy and powerful person will they reject you? Not if it means grants for university.

2) I don't want university full of uneducated kids. Uneducated is not the same thing as smart. Whoever is stupid and doesn't deserve being at university will ultimately fail out.

3) If only whites got law degrees, who the hell will be judging/defending/prosecuting in black neighbourhoods?? Don't you think a black judge would be more appropriate there? Racist, not racist.. but to be a good judge you better understand people you are judging. And if you are white person coming from a wealthy family I doubt you'll understand them.

Well, that's blatant racism if you ask me.

But if I owned a club, I wouldn't have any of the Dj's play hip hop either. No fucking way. Not because it's "black" music.....not at all. But I personally hate it, and I don't like the crowd that the genre attracts. Whenever I go to a hip hop club in London, it's always the "thug" types hanging around (yes, a lot of them are black). I just don't like that culture at all.....the whole hip hop image that influences youth so much. I wish everybody listened to trance.

My friend is black and he dislikes rap/hip hop but loves trance and house. How do you think he would feel if he couldn't get into a club because he was black? That's ridiculous. I'd lay charges.

quote:

Originally posted by Durafei Harward was accepting those students not because they are smart but because of their parents. I don't see you complaining about that.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Doing this would also enable them to discover obvious corruption, i.e. bribes, backdoor deals, or simple nepotism.

So there.

quote:

2) I don't want university full of uneducated kids. Uneducated is not the same thing as smart. Whoever is stupid and doesn't deserve being at university will ultimately fail out.

Haha, damn right uneducated isn't the same as smart. I understand what you mean though, and indeed, check out the failure rates of some of these kids accepted under affirmative action policies (as well as "legacy" policies) - you may be unpleasantly surprised.

quote:

3) If only whites got law degrees, who the hell will be judging/defending/prosecuting in black neighbourhoods??

This implies that caucasians are unable to judge minorities simply because they are caucasian. This sort of flawed logic is exactly the type of thing that causes these policies to come into effect - it's simply not true. And even if it were true, those same black judges could be equally biased against the white people in the courts they reside over.

Fluid has a history of racist reputation. Once an Indian friend of mine said her and three friends were lining up there (they too were indian) and asked three white girls infront of them if they knew what sort of night it was inside the club. The white girls told them that it was their first time coming to this club and they had absolutely no idea.

Well, the line moves and the white girls go in...the bouncer stops my friend and says "sorry ladies, tonight is a private party"...they tell the bouncer that the white girls infront of them didnt know that...and he repeated his lame sentence again. They were denied entry becuase they looked Indian.

Sorry, but I don't believe this story one bit. It is almost word for word the same story I read on TNC half a year ago.

I'm calling in the bullshit squad.

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