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-- Politically Correct Pop Machines!
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I think you are seriously underestimating children and their maturity today...There are plenty of 8 and 9 graders that sniff coke get drunk and fuck randomly at parties...I don't see vending machines dealing in drugs

I'd have to agree with Jayx1 this time...these companies are competing for sponsorship...the top sponsor wins and that's the only way schools can get funding for IMPORTANT things...don't blame the vendors it's not their fault...the money the schools get from them should be put to good use.

Obesity is a part of a much larger problem and it has nothing to do with vending machines in schools alone...once again little kids smoke and smoke a lot...don't tell me that they started smoking when they turned legal age of 19.

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Originally posted by starsearcher I think you are seriously underestimating children and their maturity today...There are plenty of 8 and 9 graders that sniff coke get drunk and fuck randomly at parties...I don't see vending machines dealing in drugs I'd have to agree with Jayx1 this time...these companies are competing for sponsorship...the top sponsor wins and that's the only way schools can get funding for IMPORTANT things...don't blame the vendors it's not their fault...the money the schools get from them should be put to good use. Obesity is a part of a much larger problem and it has nothing to do with vending machines in schools alone...once again little kids smoke and smoke a lot...don't tell me that they started smoking when they turned legal age of 19.

Just because something is not the sole cause of a problem does not give reason to ignore it.
Every little bit contributes to a bigger problem. Children are at school for 6+ hours a day. It is important that they have good food available.

Just because children are getting high at recess doesn't mean they know the consequences! In fact, I would imagine they DONT. That is the worst analogy I've ever heard.

If corporations didn't offer sponsorship money in return, would you still argue so strongly for fast food in schools, or would you not care either way?

This is just a matter of opinion of whether the money is worth the health of children. To me - it's not. For you - it is. I can't imagine that you're actually arguing that schools should endorse unhealthy food choices, regardless of the money involved.

quote:

Originally posted by Skipper Just because something is not the sole cause of a problem does not give reason to ignore it. Every little bit contributes to a bigger problem. Children are at school for 6+ hours a day. It is important that they make healthy food choices. Just because children are getting high at recess doesn't mean they know the consequences! In fact, I would imagine they DONT. That is the worst analogy I've ever heard. If corporations didn't offer sponsorship money in return, would you still argue so strongly for fast food in schools, or would you not care either way? This is just a matter of opinion of whether the money is worth the health of children. To me - it's not. For you - it is. I can't imagine that you're actually arguing that schools should endorse unhealthy food choices, regardless of the money involved.

Schools dont endorse unhealthy food choises...you make it sound as if they are evil devil look a likes with horns sitting in the horner rubbing their hands and thinking....hmmm how can we make our kids unhealthy...
What I'm trying to tell you is that schools need money, and unfortunately that's the only way that they get it. Without it...the crumbling schools will completely collapse...and like I said before it's not the vendors to blame but the way governmet runs the school system.

Speaking of healthy food choises...what would you like to be served/sold at schools?

And kids do know it's bad for them they just don't care...much like the adults...so what are you gonna do? You know just as much as I do that they will get their hands on it later on anyway...

I'm not even going to argue with you - it's pretty obvious you don't have a clue what I'm saying.

(as an aside, schools CAN operate without sponsorship money - they did for MANY years.)

So then how come we have no textbooks, less workers, more strikes, collapsing schools, smaller budgets, less janitors, less councillors and etc and etc...?

quote:

Originally posted by starsearcher So then how come we have no textbooks, less workers, more strikes, collapsing schools, smaller budgets, less janitors, less councillors and etc and etc...?

I wonder as well, considering how much money schools get from sponsorships these days compared to years past!

Sooooooooooooo why blame the sponsors? Blame the people in charge of the school system...the money probabbly goes to their pockey anyway

Bottom line... if kids dont get these things at school they will get them at lunch hour at the plaza or after school anyways. Who suffers? The school! Educate kids with gym and health classes. After that you cant force them to do what you want. You can trym but they will just take their money elsewhere.

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Originally posted by Jayx1 Bottom line... if kids dont get these things at school they will get them at lunch hour at the plaza or after school anyways. Who suffers? The school! Educate kids with gym and health classes. After that you cant force them to do what you want. You can trym but they will just take their money elsewhere.

My argument is based on principle.
You clearly don't have any!

Your arguement is based on dreamy lofty idealistic short sightedness. I happen to live in the real world.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Your arguement is based on dreamy lofty idealistic short sightedness. I happen to live in the real world.

Ok fattie.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Your arguement is based on dreamy lofty idealistic short sightedness. I happen to live in the real world.

In all seriousness, I recommend you read up on this issue before just saying "this is stupid." I don't think you fully comprehend all the factors at work, and how much of a problem youth obesity is becoming.

(as an aside, no one answered my question about cigarette sponsorships in schools and vending machines in classrooms.)

LOL.. me fat? yeah right

but nice come back.

I agree cig sponsorship and beer sponsorship would be wrong but only because THESE PRODUCTS ARE ILLEGAL FOR KIDS UNDER 19.

I have fully thought out what you are saying. Obesity IS a problem these days. But to suggest the solution would be to ban pepsi from schools (who use this money to buy GYM equipment of all things) is completelty ludicris. The REAL solution is education, parental responsibilty and offering the CHOICE of whether or not to have good or junky food. Im all for offering a choice between the 2. To NOT offer a health choice would be bad but to ban the CHOICE of healthy or junk food is wrong too. When i was in school we had the option of fries with gravy or a healthy sandwich. People chose accordingly. Same with juice and pop. Many times both selections at the school tasted like ass and we all went to the plaza anyways.

You and i both know that if kids dont like it, they wont buy it. You can force it all you want but the only thing that will make it work is education. After teaching them food values if they still go out and buy these things its now their problem and not ours.

The problem with people like you is that you think you can legislate everyone to be just like you (or how you think you are). If someone makes what you think is a bad decision then "obviously they arent capable of making decisions". well guess what, they are capable and they just made it whether you agree with it or not.

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Originally posted by Jayx1 LOL.. me fat? yeah right but nice come back.

Shit, I'm joking.
Trying to make this discussion a little light hearted. Ease up.

I don't think junk food has a place in schools. I don't think the money is worth it. You do. There's no point backtracking over the same points.

We all can agree that the primary responsibility for education children about choices lies with parents. Unfortunately parents do not always do this. It's sad, but many many parents just don't care enough about things like this. This is where the schools must step in.

If kids have to walk down the street for junk food, let them. But don't provide it to them in school. This doesn't remove the choice they have - this doesn't legislate children into making certain choices - it just makes bad choices more difficult. It also sets an example - the health of the school's children cannot be purchased.

Again... what you illustrate is idealism. What i illustrate is realism. While what you say on paper is nice and wonderful, the real world paints a different picture.

Besides, is having a pepsi machine in a school really such a bad thing when there are many other serious problems facing kids such as drugs, violence and sexual disease? Why not put more effort into fighting these problems?

The only people who ever accomplished anything great were idealists too.

Sadly sponsors and big corporations have stepped in to help fill the void that was left in schools because of less government funding. Cut backs in funding, aging schools, increased cost for maintenance and supplies meant they were forced to find dollars else where. (however, I wouldn't be surprise if someone was dipping into the funds somewhere ) We will never be able to stop the influence of the big bad advertising wolves on our children as advertising dollars make the world go round and contribute too much to our economy and drive so many other businesses. However, we can stop running away from our own responsibilities and teach our kids right from wrong. Having pop removed from the schools may reduce the number of kids drinking it while at school but I bet most kids who are sent to school with a lunch have a can or two already brown bagged from home and if not they have a pocket full of cash from allowances that will be spent at the corner store on recess or lunch.

I don't remember ever having money in my pocket at school that I was free to spend on anything I wanted. I don't remember my mother ever packing a pop in my lunch. I don't remember ever being sent to school without a lunch but money so that I could buy whatever I wanted to at the junk food cafeteria. Those are the big changes I see. The influence of corporations is just thriving on the fact that we have been unable to discipline and educate our children. Why do you think children are so easily influenced these days? Because parents have not educated them, and parents don't pay attention to what their kids are doing, what they are watching on TV, what they are doing on their computers, or what they are eating, because parents have handed over their vulnerable kids and allowed them to be come completely accessable. We get angry at the corporations for being vultures but we are the ones who held the door open for them.

I am pretty passionate about this issue too Skipper so I understand where you are coming from and I like that you too, as a young adult, without children, care so much about this issue. I agree with you in that we are most likely now in such a sorry state that someone has to put a leash on the sponosors and corporations. But I do also believe that before that is done, I think we should start pointing some of those fingers at those who are ULTIMATELY responsible for the well being of our children. The parents.

Most true idealists can see the bigger picture and include realism in their ideals.

Sadly today you have nothing but shortsighted visionaries that do not take into account the consequences of their actions. Such as in this case, the loss of money to a school's gym fund thus actually making the problem they are trying to solve actually become worse.

The same sort of idea works with the anti-car lobby. By making it harder for people to drive downtown instead of making improvements to transit, they are actually making congestion and pollution worse by causing more traffic jams and more frustration.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

That's where I'm going huh? because I'm an idealist. okaaaaaay.

quote:

Originally posted by Skipper Schools need to stop endorsing the obesity epidemic. Period.

I agree with you 100% - but sodal machines are the last problem that schools need to worry about then. The obesity problem in schools is caused by the hamburger, french fry cafeterias - not a can of soda once or twice per day.

Why not go after the real problem here - the cafeterias.

The schools need the soda cash, so let them keep the machines and change the menu of the cafe into proper healthy food. That would make a bigger dent in the obesity issue.

A 120 kcal. can of coke compared to a 1000 kcal. burger, fries and gravy lunch - where do you see the problem?

Obviously the meaning to that phrase is that good intentions that are not well thought out can lead to even worse problems.

But nice way to steer away from the other points i raised.

quote:

Originally posted by rabbitjoker I agree with you 100% - but sodal machines are the last problem that schools need to worry about then. The obesity problem in schools is caused by the hamburger, french fry cafeterias - not a can of soda once or twice per day. Why not go after the real problem here - the cafeterias. The schools need the soda cash, so let them keep the machines and change the menu of the cafe into proper healthy food. That would make a bigger dent in the obesity issue. A 120 kcal. can of coke compared to a 1000 kcal. burger, fries and gravy lunch - where do you see the problem?

The REAL problems are more like drugs, guns, violence, nutbars that want to shoot up half the city, sexual disease. Pop Machines and burgers in school are not REAL problems.

COMMON SENSE HAS PREVAILED!!!!!!!


TDSB chooses Pepsi
June 24, 2004 - 10:06 am
By: 680 Staff


The Toronto District School Board votes yes to a five year deal with Pepsi.
Initially trustees had rejected the proposal for the soft drink maker to operate pop machines in 300 schools across the city -- but say in the end it came down to money. The contract is worth nearly 6 million dollars to the board. Part of the money will support breakfast and nutritional programs in schools. The board's contract with Coca Cola expires in July.

quote:

Originally posted by rabbitjoker A 120 kcal. can of coke compared to a 1000 kcal. burger, fries and gravy lunch - where do you see the problem?

True - but how many burgers do kids eat in a day? A can of soda can contain upwards of 200 or 300 calories, and kids are drinking 3 or 4 a day.

(my teeth hurt just thinking about it!)

jayx1, I'm avoiding your points b/c we aren't even arguing facts anymore. You and I have very different values, so let's leave it at that.

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