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-- The motivators for people to follow religion.
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Originally posted by Seventil I wouldn't call them "expectations". However, believing in God does put a "higher purpose" calling into your life. It's the opposite of the humanist way of thinking - actual purpose to life. Self deluded or not, I think it's a better way to live life.

Just for reference, oldskoolraver is me, I'm back online.

So its actually a better way to live life now? Thats crap.

They only real benefits are the ones that happen after you die, and well there is a bit of luck attached to these turning out.

Some religious types point to benefits now such as living a cleaner life, no STDs or unwanted pregnancy etc but this is just spin that you would usually see from large corporations.

There is no way that a life with restrictions could be better than a life without them, unless you were weak and recovering from serious problems. If you were smart and healthy, than you should make your own decisions without the need to worry about a higher purpose.

So you think God takes an interest in every decision you make?

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Originally posted by Matty V What i have always wondered is if Allah and God are seen as the same god? And if not, does it say in islam that Allah created the world? And if he didnt then wouldnt the christian God be the bigger god because he did? And if both these gods are seen as the main gods then doesnt that conflict prove that there is no god? I mean how can there be 2 Gods when one of them created the earth! or if there is which one is the real one? And if the cristian God created the earth why didnt he make everyone worship him without lettin other religions begin?

Ecumenical ideology. As well as any other type of religion where you have a god of war and a god of creation. A god of animals. A god of harvest. A god of cheese and wine.

The god of Islam and the God of Christianity are two different beings. If allah were a creator why does he need people to do his bidding:

quote:

Originally posted by Qur'an, Chapter 8:12 When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

Or:

quote:

Originally posted by Qur'an, Chapter 2:190-191 2:190 YUSUFALI: Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. PICKTHAL: Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors. SHAKIR: And fight in the way of Allah with those who fight with you, and do not exceed the limits, surely Allah does not love those who exceed the limits. 2:191: YUSUFALI: And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith. PICKTHAL: And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers. SHAKIR: And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.

That just goes in line with another great prophet:

quote:

"The streets will flow with the blood of the non-believers" - Beavis

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Originally posted by Seventil Thoughts on the Catholic church and it's acceptance of slavery , non-involvement standpoint of the prosecution of Jews and now the acceptance of evolution?

Those are the exact reasons why I dislike Christianity, as well as most other religions. I do have to admit, however, that the current Catholic church does not accept slavery and jew prosecution, as well as it accepts evolution as a most likely theory. The non-acceptance of evolution exists only in minor non-catholic churches.

fear. traditionally, human beings have difficulty accepting the possibility that they are alone...that nothing happens after you die. to explain what happens and give themselves hope, religion was created. it's good to have ideas of the spiritual nature, but religion takes it too far.

religion doesn't kill people, people kill people.

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Originally posted by Yoepus religion doesn't kill people, people kill people.

"Guns don't kill people. I do."

--UHF, best Weird Al movie ever.

simple. i follow because i believe.

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Originally posted by tranceaholic simple. i follow because i believe.

That rather circular reasoning is not logical.

For the meaning of life, and faith . Makes you a good person, with good deeds.

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Originally posted by ogvh5150 The god of Islam and the God of Christianity are two different beings.

no they are the same...

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In the early seventh century a new religion came blazing out of Arabia fueled with the word of the prophet Mohammed and afire with his admonition to spread it. Islam (meaning "submission" or "surrender" to Allah's will) was seen by Mohammed as a continuation of Judaism and Christianity, and his God was the same as in both the Old and New Testaments. His followers spread quickly throughout the middle east (and much further). http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/m...stforpeace.html

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Originally posted by .montecarlo. no they are the same...

Ecumenical ideology.

So I take it you will ""surrender" to Allah's will" and kill me because I am an unbeliever just like Allah commands? Are you advocating my death because I refuse to do as the koran says? If you equate the two as being the same you have to go by both ideologies. One of them would be:

quote:

Originally posted by Qur'an, Chapter 8:12 When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who disbelieve. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

The other would be:

quote:

Originally posted by the Gospel according to Saint Matthew 19:18-19 ...Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19:19 Honour thy father and [thy] mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Or

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Originally posted by Paul's Epistle to the Romans 12:17-19 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men. 12:18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men. 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but [rather] give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance [is] mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

God is saying He will repay. He is not saying for me, you or anyone else to do any killing. If God created, then God can destroy or kill what he made.

Allah is saying the he wants you or any believer (of Islam) to kill for him. Well if allah created why does he need you or I or anyone to kill for him?

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Originally posted by spec That rather circular reasoning is not logical.

you asked me why i follow and i answered..wether it makes sence to yo,u or whatever ur opinion is ,doesnt matter to me..

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Originally posted by ogvh5150 Ecumenical ideology. So I take it you will ""surrender" to Allah's will" and kill me because I am an unbeliever just like Allah commands? Are you advocating my death because I refuse to do as the koran says? If you equate the two as being the same you have to go by both ideologies. God is saying He will repay. He is not saying for me, you or anyone else to do any killing. If God created, then God can destroy or kill what he made. Allah is saying the he wants you or any believer (of Islam) to kill for him. Well if allah created why does he need you or I or anyone to kill for him?

Well, we can also find some interesting Bible verses...

Numbers 25:6-13

Then an Israelite man brought to his family a Midianite woman right before the eyes of Moses and the whole assembly of Israel while they were weeping at the entrance to the Tent of Meeting. When Phinehas, son of Eleazar, the son of Aaron, the priest, saw this, he left the assembly, took a spear in his hand and followed the Israelite into the tent. He drove the spear through both of them - through the Israelite and into the woman's body. Then the plague against Israelites was stopped; but those who died in the plague numbered 24,000.

The Lord said to Moses, Phinehas son of Eleazar, the son of Aaron, the priest has turned my anger away from the Israelites; for he was as zealous as I am for my honor among them, so that in my zeal I did not put an end to them. Therefore tell him I am making my covenant of peace with him. He and his descendants will have a covenant of a lasting priesthood, because he was zealous for the honor of his God and made atonement for the Israelits.

Numbers 31:17-18

Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

It's not just Islam that's retarded, it's the characteristic of every religion.

Back then in the OLD TESTAMENT did the Israelites do things for God to perpetuate a bloodline that would lead to the seed of the woman who would be Messiah.

By your use of the OLD TESTAMENT, I am to believe that you are mandating it's laws. Especially the Levitical laws. Now by the use of Levitical laws you are saying that I shouldn't eat pork and other good stuff? Or are you saying I should kill for the perpetuation of the Messianic bloodline?

quote:

Originally posted by Pauls' Epistle to the Hebrews 9:14-17 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions [that were] under the first testament , they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. 9:16 For where a testament [is], there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. 9:17 For a testament [is] of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

and THE NEW

quote:

Originally posted by Pauls' First Epistle to Timothy 4:3-5 Forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. 4:4 For every creature of God [is] good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

and THE OLD

quote:

Originally posted by the third book of Moses called Leviticus 11:7-8 And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he [is] unclean to you. 11:8 Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they [are] unclean to you.

quote:

Originally posted by tranceaholic you asked me why i follow and i answered..wether it makes sence to yo,u or whatever ur opinion is ,doesnt matter to me..

Maybe its the other way around and you believe because you follow.

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Originally posted by tupsox Reasons for religion: 1. The realization that some things in life can never be explained. 2. The need to live life in reverence to something other than yourself. Just off the top of my head. Also, to the guy who said religious people are only blindly following their parents....well that statement just shows how ignorant and inexperienced you are in life. It's a demonstratably false notion. Many people are far more religious than their parents. I also am saddened by the ignorance of those who clearly have no concept that religion gives a culture its morality, its definition of what is good and bad, right and wrong. Just because you dont actively believe in God and attend church/synagogue/mosque doesn't mean that the teachings of religion hasn't profoundly affected your worldview.

Are you really going to say that religion is the reason for morality? Yes it is true that religion in many if not all cultures was the first written law but by no means does that mean it gave culture its moral values.

Religion has been a teaching tool for morality but it did not create it. We would have killed each other off long before the first words were written if religion created morality.

And morality is based on the time period we are in. Morals.... Morals are created carried and continued by those that choose to follow them. If I showed you a book that was written 2000 or more years ago and said here this is the real religion you should follow and it said to steal rap and murder. Would you follow it?

No? Why not? It�s in our basic instinct, its fear that holds us to morals, fear of the consequences if we do not follow its laws and code.


Religion to me is a list of laws written a long time ago in times completely different from now worked into a very, very, well written, interesting story.

I love how ppl of each religion attack each others faith, looking for holes and inconsistencies, as if that makes their faith oh so much more true. NEWSFLASH they all have holes and inconsistencies, how about you look for your own religions flaws first since you insist on living your life based on it.
Eveyone is so convinced they are right, they are "chosen". Which is the problem, they see themselves teh favoured children of the creator making them special. Thus seeing the others as less human, less chosen, hence killing them or harming them is no big deal,...I mean since they arent worthy anyway. Thats another thing, this whole, "not worthy" horseshit really irritates me, especially about christianity, as one person mentioned here before, it creates the sickness in you so it can offer you the cure. feed me with guilt so I can spend my life a slave trying to break even, no thankyou.

religion = worst thing the world has ever had!!!

sorry thats all i can say...

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Originally posted by taltul religion = worst thing the world has ever had!!! sorry thats all i can say...

Interesting *opinion* ...

Care to shed some light on your view?

C.S. Lewis: "Religion, if false, is of little importance. Religion, if true, is of the utmost importance.

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