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-- Bush Suspends Minimum Wage
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Oh the timing!

Who woulda thunk such great coincidences like these? I mean, first Bush suspends minimum wage for rebuilding, then we find out all the backscratching Bush continues to do with all his good 'ol boys:

quote:

"Companies with ties to the Bush White House and the former head of FEMA are clinching some of the administration's first disaster relief and reconstruction contracts in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina." http://edition.cnn.com/2005/POLITIC...reut/index.html

Hey, it's good to know the king!

I'm afraid ppl eking out a living on minimum wage without health benefits might hurt corporate profits. got to love "compationate" conservatives

Well, as someone already pointed out, lower labor costs equal lower prices. A lower cost of living means people can get by with less money. Its just simply more efficient.

quote:

Originally posted by igottaknow I'm afraid ppl eking out a living on minimum wage without health benefits might hurt corporate profits. got to love "compationate" conservatives

How so?
The largest financial albatrosses (albatrosi? ) around any corporation's neck are pension funds and health care benefits.

While min. wage does suck; gross is gross and net is gross(er); one would hope it should only be a stop-gap towards getting a better job...

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r How so? The largest financial albatrosses (albatrosi? ) around any corporation's neck are pension funds and health care benefits. While min. wage does suck; gross is gross and net is gross(er); one would hope it should only be a stop-gap towards getting a better job...

Delta and Northwest filed for bankruptcy yesterday. This ought to be interesting. 40% of the seats flying in American airspace are now under bankruptcy. Northwest has a $63 million pension plan contribution that was supposed to be made today, but now they don't have to. See what high labor obligations does to a company. And imagine the employment losses if these companies aren't able to emerge from bankruptcy. Oh, and in response to an earlier post, even if say the CEO was getting paid $2 million, what's cutting his salary to $500,000 really going to do for companies like Delta and Northwest? Nothing!

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r How so? The largest financial albatrosses (albatrosi? ) around any corporation's neck are pension funds and health care benefits. While min. wage does suck; gross is gross and net is gross(er); one would hope it should only be a stop-gap towards getting a better job...

I was being sarcastic that corporations are suffering because they're required to pay minimum wage, a rate of pay that has fallen far behind what is necessary to support a family on. Its laughable to think the laws that are decidedly written in corporations favor should be overturned for even more accommodating rules. They would like you to believe it serves the greater good of the country, when in reality their intentions are motivated by greed.

They're always going on about in order to stay competitive in the global market they can't afford to pay Americans workers a decent wage and give them benefits. Katrina rebuilding is a clear cut case of the hollowness of that argument. Its a domestic job that will involve only American workers and the government will be writing out huge checks to do the work, so what seems to be the problem with paying them at least a minimum wage?

I don't know which is worse corporations who squeeze the lowest paid workers the hardest or politicians like Bush who oversee and facilitate their exploitation. The imbalance of salaries between executives and the common worker has never been greater and yet the common worker is always the one who's at fault. The underlining tragedy of Katrina wasn't the storm but the utter abandonment of the lower class by our government. The local, state, and federal government all turned to each other and said the poor weren't their responsibility.

We all have come to expect that the big corporations who benefit from our country won't lift a hand to help it. Where are all the oil and grain companies who used the New Orleans port for their commerce? Instead of price gouging us at the pump they should be the ones who contribute the most to the rebuilding of N.O. So, don't feel bad for them being obligated to pay minimum wage.

Btw, labor costs have nothing to do with the series of airlines bankruptcies. The sudden rise in jet fuel prices which by far is the airlines largest expense, has sent them into bankruptcy. Who's fault is that? The federal government who in their infinite wisdom has felt no need to lower the demand for oil by promoting conservation, funding the development of alternative energy, requiring car companies to build more fuel efficient cars, or funding mass transit. Every step of the way our government has shirked its responsibilities to our country's long term interest in favor of short term profits for greedy corporate America.

quote:

Originally posted by igottaknow The imbalance of salaries between executives and the common worker has never been greater

(before i reply, please dont take the tone of this reply as a direct attack on yourself.. I'm replying more to the issue, not your statement )

my question to this statement.. so what? Honestly, why does this bother people?? Why should they care what someone else is earning?? it's really none of your business..
If you think execs get paid too much, then offer the company to work in the position at a lower wage.. that's right, you're probably not good enough for the job. There are only a very small handful of people who are capable of the job within a market that demands their services so much. It's supply and demand people.. It's why the common worker gets paid relatively less (because every tom, dick and harry can do the work)

quote:

Btw, labor costs have nothing to do with the series of airlines bankruptcies. The sudden rise in jet fuel prices which by far is the airlines largest expense, has sent them into bankruptcy. Who's fault is that? The federal government who in their infinite wisdom has felt no need to lower the demand for oil by promoting conservation, funding the development of alternative energy, requiring car companies to build more fuel efficient cars, or funding mass transit. Every step of the way our government has shirked its responsibilities to our country's long term interest in favor of short term profits for greedy corporate America.

This I do happen to agree on
Minimum wages (although not helping the situation of the airlines) is probably not the biggest cause of US airlines going bust. Sure, it's a factor in the process, but most definately the higher oil price and the post-9/11 business environment are definately to blame.

and yes, this is the fault of the feds.. creating an economy that's reliant on an unsustainable energy source while not promoting the development of more sustainable methods of living is definately an example of short-term goals creating long-term problems. We can thank the inherent nature of democracy for that though... people dont want the government to make longterm decisions (that may take 50yrs to become worthwhile) They want results within the next 4 years or they vote the pricks out... yay for democracy!!

quote:

Originally posted by Dupz (before i reply, please dont take the tone of this reply as a direct attack on yourself.. I'm replying more to the issue, not your statement )

As you can tell, I feel very strongly for the plight of the American worker. I haven't worked for min. wage in a long time so personally it doesn't effect me.

quote:

my question to this statement.. so what? Honestly, why does this bother people?? Why should they care what someone else is earning?? it's really none of your business.. If you think execs get paid too much, then offer the company to work in the position at a lower wage.. that's right, you're probably not good enough for the job. There are only a very small handful of people who are capable of the job within a market that demands their services so much. It's supply and demand people.. It's why the common worker gets paid relatively less (because every tom, dick and harry can do the work)

The only reason I brought up the imabalance was because if you're going to complain about labor costs you can't single out the lowest paid without talking about the hightest paid. This topic could be a thread in itself so I'll only skim the surface.

First and foremost, the imbalance is so great its morally repugnant. I forgot the latest figure, its something like corporate executives get paid 500 times the average worker.

Second the salaries are not fairly determined. Its like a old boys social club where executives sit on each other's boards to scratch each other's back with huge salaries and bonuses even when under their leadership the company has performed poorly.

Third you can't just sit back and say well that's just capitalism. The government responsibility is to keep capitalism in check for the greater good of society. That's why there is minimum wage. IMHOP I believe a salary cap should be implemented. Many sports organization have found it neccessary to implemented caps for the greater good of the sport.

Finally, what makes this country so great is the middle class. Do we want a country split into the ultra wealthy and the working poor? Countries with these condition endure social unrest where the lower class's only recourse is violence.

quote:

Originally posted by igottaknow I was being sarcastic that corporations are suffering because they're required to pay minimum wage, a rate of pay that has fallen far behind what is necessary to support a family on. Its laughable to think the laws that are decidedly written in corporations favor should be overturned for even more accommodating rules. They would like you to believe it serves the greater good of the country, when in reality their intentions are motivated by greed. They're always going on about in order to stay competitive in the global market they can't afford to pay Americans workers a decent wage and give them benefits. Katrina rebuilding is a clear cut case of the hollowness of that argument. Its a domestic job that will involve only American workers and the government will be writing out huge checks to do the work, so what seems to be the problem with paying them at least a minimum wage? I don't know which is worse corporations who squeeze the lowest paid workers the hardest or politicians like Bush who oversee and facilitate their exploitation. The imbalance of salaries between executives and the common worker has never been greater and yet the common worker is always the one who's at fault. The underlining tragedy of Katrina wasn't the storm but the utter abandonment of the lower class by our government. The local, state, and federal government all turned to each other and said the poor weren't their responsibility. We all have come to expect that the big corporations who benefit from our country won't lift a hand to help it. Where are all the oil and grain companies who used the New Orleans port for their commerce? Instead of price gouging us at the pump they should be the ones who contribute the most to the rebuilding of N.O. So, don't feel bad for them being obligated to pay minimum wage. Btw, labor costs have nothing to do with the series of airlines bankruptcies. The sudden rise in jet fuel prices which by far is the airlines largest expense, has sent them into bankruptcy. Who's fault is that? The federal government who in their infinite wisdom has felt no need to lower the demand for oil by promoting conservation, funding the development of alternative energy, requiring car companies to build more fuel efficient cars, or funding mass transit. Every step of the way our government has shirked its responsibilities to our country's long term interest in favor of short term profits for greedy corporate America.

How can you honestly say that labor costs have NOTHING to do with the airline bankruptcies? The reason that the companies are filing for bankruptcy is for protection from creditors, which includes contributions to pension funds...a very large contribution. Northwest filed in order to avoid their 63 million dollar contribution to their pension fund. Yes, jet fuel prices have gone through the roof and a company's inability to hedge a lower prices is a major cause. But the rise in jet fuel has made the airlines unable to make the SUBSTANTIAL payments to pension funds. And huge fixed costs with a highly variable revenue stream is a recipe for disaster. If they airlines did not have to make such large payments for pensions, then they wouldn't be in bankruptcy.

quote:

Originally posted by Vyper0987 How can you honestly say that labor costs have NOTHING to do with the airline bankruptcies? The reason that the companies are filing for bankruptcy is for protection from creditors, which includes contributions to pension funds...a very large contribution. Northwest filed in order to avoid their 63 million dollar contribution to their pension fund. Yes, jet fuel prices have gone through the roof and a company's inability to hedge a lower prices is a major cause. But the rise in jet fuel has made the airlines unable to make the SUBSTANTIAL payments to pension funds. And huge fixed costs with a highly variable revenue stream is a recipe for disaster. If they airlines did not have to make such large payments for pensions, then they wouldn't be in bankruptcy.

Did I miss something? What does this have to do with bush suspending minimum wage?

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