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-- Are digital "labels" killing EDM?
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Lets face it, quality of tunes is just a point of view, with people like PVd and Armin Releasing tunes like "nothing but you" and "shivers" I see no wrong in digital lables signing up stuff, while you may not like all the realeases some of the finest tunes I have are from small digital lables.

E-TCR is different in that it releases on CD as well as digital, and has now started putting things out on vinyl too. It doesn't overpollute (for want of a better word) the scene by putting out too many releases, and it has consistently put out tracks that, if not to everybody's taste, can at least be acknowledged as quality. E-TCR is probably this way because it's only the digital arm of ATCR and Surface, two established labels.

Although I'm not familar with Real Music Recordings, it sounds pretty simlar to E-TCR. Neither of them is any worse at providing up with generic trance than Armind, or Vandit, for example.

ONION seems to have a point. However, there have been a few lovely new labels in the past year, most notably Intuition. New labels can break through from time to time, but vinyl labels tend to be good because they lose a lot of money if they aren't. Digital cuts so many costs that anyone can afford to chuck out rubbish, and it doesn't matter if it doesn't sell, because they haven't put much money in.

I can't say I care about the digital front, as I buy vinyl and will continue to do so as long as it's possibly to do so, but I can certainly see where you're coming from. Whether these labels are killing trance or no, there isn't a whole lot you can be doing about it besides voting with your wallet and not buying from them.

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Originally posted by Floorfiller that's just been my experience. most of the time when i go and find a new track that i would like to get...they don't have it for download.

Agreed. And also, someone said there is a mixture of big tunes and small more "underground" stuff. You find the big stuff is whatever and the small stuff all comes from these small crappy amateur labels which are being discussed in this very thread!!1

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Originally posted by DJ_Massive If you're talking about some of the most recent of their releases or perhaps those on the Platipus:Euro sublabel, I might just agree there.. can't really think of any of the old releases that are retarded though

I am talking about the sub label

Im caning Art of Trance - Persia at the moment

Re: Are digital "labels" killing EDM?

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Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Who's going to bother going through all those "releases" just to find the 1 or 2 good ones? Not me, that's for sure.

i can see exactly how you mean and have questioned this many times before, but i don't see it as purely a bad thing. DJs will have far more choice, and the ones who search the hardest will be rewarded the most. i personally find it far more satisfying finding something good after searching though pages of unknown tracks, as opposed to just picking up the new awesome vinyl release everyone's talking about.

Re: Re: Are digital "labels" killing EDM?

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Originally posted by isoterra i personally find it far more satisfying finding something good after searching though pages of unknown tracks, as opposed to just picking up the new awesome vinyl release everyone's talking about.

Thats what turns an average DJ into a talented DJ... Too many fags copying tracklists, only buying off big known labels only turns DJs into sheep...

Theres probably nothing better than rocking to a track at a party Ive heard for the first time... wondering what the name of the track is

Re: Re: Re: Are digital "labels" killing EDM?

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Originally posted by ONION Too many fags copying tracklists,

C'mon man. that's not cool

Well, as has been posted in this topic already, a lot of the digital labels started recently are simply acting as a garbage can for tracks rejected by the big labels.
Obviously, some tracks are rejected by those big labels for not fitting within a certain niche (and those could actually be interesting), but the vast majority gets rejected for being plain old crap.
When it comes to trance, the new digital labels (I'm not referring to offshoots for existing trance labels or labels going digital -J00F- ) have an awful track record , to say the least.
On the other hand, when managed in the right way, these labels do have the opportunity to uncover that gem that could interest me. I just don't see it happening with the current digital trance labels.

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Thats what turns an average DJ into a talented DJ...

Exactly. And it's what makes listening the most fun. As much as I find the underground mentality ("It doesn't matter how good it is, as long as no one knows about it.") apalling, there is a certain appeal to being one of the first people to like a song. Personally, as a producer, I'd rather have my music gain popularity from the ground up; give it a foundation, rather than let it take root from above, whereby my fame will be completely dependant on it being further promoted by the names that got me there in the first place.

On the topic, though, I agree with Aquarian. I don't think the electronic music scene will "die." so to speak. It will definitely be very changed by this change. The industry, by which I mean established labels like Netwerk, Platypus, MoS (generally ones that have relied on vinyl for the past few years), etc. will feel a great deal of pain, for sure, but they'll adapt eventually, if very slowly. Essentially, there will always be electronic music, but it's popularity will simply become more dependant on internet savoir-faire than on radio, TV, vinyl or CD.

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I'll say, though, that I like the fact you implicitly question their status as labels. Personally, I don't see any reason to continue the "label" tradition. Labels came from a time when it was difficult for a single person to get recognized outside of their own town through their own efforts. Now it's easy for one person to show his music to someone on the other side of the world through AIM or Yousendit; they don't even have to pay money to promote and distribute. The label grows increasingly unnecessary for this reason. Artists shouldn't act as their own middleman if they don't need to. No one said it was wrong to just release music as oneself.
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I don't entirely agree with Nik here. I see the online sale of music and online-specific releases as actually very good things to happen to the scene as it is great for avaiability. It also raises the value of the DJ role since picking music becomes harder and more time-consuming - I see this a good thing for EDM altho it does make it harder for the general listener that prefers singles and artist albums to mixes.

However the fact that digital labels exist is nearly retarded. Hello, there are barely any costs of "publishing" a track online. On the digital era, there are two reasons to want a label: credibility and promotion. We can drop already the first since most of these labels are ridiculous, only the naive producers that sign their tracks to them think otherwise. Promotion however is a good reason, altho I don't believe neither these new labels have the capacity to promote artists adequately. I can only hope a new era comes soon (i have some faith it will come): when artists instead of signing their tracks to a label sign their tracks directly to the stores, *then* hire some kind of musical-specific marketing company to promote their tracks to djs and such. I'm not sure this would be a big advance, but I don't think the old concept of "label" is the most adequate to the digital era neither.

As for the quality of tracks, I don't think it has anything to do with the online sale of mp3s, but rather results from the huge avaiability of prodution software and the general desire to fit certain musical standarts so certain dj's can play the tracks.

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Originally posted by paranoik0 I don't entirely agree with Nik here. I see the online sale of music and online-specific releases as actually very good things to happen to the scene as it is great for avaiability. It also raises the value of the DJ role since picking music becomes harder and more time-consuming - I see this a good thing for EDM altho it does make it harder for the general listener that prefers singles and artist albums to mixes.

Well... I did say I don't think the digital music business is bad in itself. It's the other things that come with it.

Digital labels are both good & bad but im to lazy to write more..
One thing for sure that i will never buy for a mp3, never. I rather spend money on real cds which i can have all my life instead of a file which can go lost just if the computer crashes..

cds do wear out, perhaps less than an hard-disk, but aren't forever

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Originally posted by paranoik0 As for the quality of tracks, I don't think it has anything to do with the online sale of mp3s, but rather results from the huge avaiability of prodution software and the general desire to fit certain musical standarts so certain dj's can play the tracks.

i think it's down to both. the latter caused the first wave of so-called quality decrease, and the former will probably cause a 2nd wave... which in turn could lead to a positive backlash? perhaps older more established artists will pull their fingers out and start aiming to stand out by raising the bar for quality & innovation, leaving the software kids behind?

who knows. though even saying all that, i'm not the kind of person who moans about music getting worse (even if alot of it is) providing there's enough around to satisfy me. so this whole digital movement doesn't bother me in the slightest, whichever way it goes

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Originally posted by trancedanne Digital labels are both good & bad but im to lazy to write more.. One thing for sure that i will never buy for a mp3, never. I rather spend money on real cds which i can have all my life instead of a file which can go lost just if the computer crashes..

i don't think so, if anything, you just have to be selective, as there is more available. i'm doing just fine with my music.

Re: Are digital "labels" killing EDM?

Meneedit? Are you posting posting under Mr.Mystery's name again?

just because you dont like what somebody has to say, doesn't mean they don't deserve to have a voice

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Originally posted by Zombie0915 just because you dont like what somebody has to say, doesn't mean they don't deserve to have a voice

What if Stephen Hawking started bad-mouthing you?

ah this old chestnut.

Trance music has always been based around the vinyl ethos as a method for quality control and (imho) as a way for the superstars and labels to control the stylistic change of the music.

For a long time it seems labels have been resisting the change to the digital medium. Only in the past year or two have you been able to download half decent trance releases from digital networks. CD releases have always been and still are a bit of a joke. Sure you can get promos and hunt for cd singles, but most releases never see cd. This lack of drive towards cds or digital downloads has left a massive power vacuum that is currently being filled up with a lot of generic, worthless shit. Basically the internet is a free medium and producers or labels can make of it what they choose to.

Compared to psy and progressive, which is 99% based around digital, Trance seems to lack the understanding that sort of freedom and diversification is the key to growth. Look at the never ending stream of similar music being pumped out by the big labels. They are controlling the sound by limiting how and when it can be released. At the end of the day digital networks will diversify the sound and be good for the growth of the trance, but in the meantime, there is a complete lack of respect for digital from established labels, hence there is no quality control over it.

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Originally posted by Axolotyl ...there is a complete lack of respect for digital from established labels, hence there is no quality control over it.

But can there ever be quality control, save for the real shit just not being bought? Can labels match the powerful word-of-mouth that the internet thrives on? There are people I've never met listening to my music, and I've never even seen a contract from a label, and that was back when I was putting out pure shit. If labels are to get any semblance of control over digital, they need to be faster than the internet, and more omnipresent, and Microsoft can't even do that.

Personally, though, I can't see much harm in it. You just have to dig deeper. I highly doubt the most edm fans are the type to be used to having their music fed to them anyway, otherwise they'd be listening to the local continuous hits station.

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Originally posted by thoughtlessjex But can there ever be quality control, save for the real shit just not being bought? Can labels match the powerful word-of-mouth that the internet thrives on? There are people I've never met listening to my music, and I've never even seen a contract from a label, and that was back when I was putting out pure shit. If labels are to get any semblance of control over digital, they need to be faster than the internet, and more omnipresent, and Microsoft can't even do that. Personally, though, I can't see much harm in it. You just have to dig deeper. I highly doubt the most edm fans are the type to be used to having their music fed to them anyway, otherwise they'd be listening to the local continuous hits station.

If established labels are there offering tracks along side digital labels and their product is superior, it will bring the bar up. People will expect more for their download dollar. Increasing the expectations of people is a form of quality control.

I agree you have to dig deeper though. A lot of the best trance I've heard is unreleased stuff. At the end of the day, more people producing and releasing is good creatively for the sound I think.

Re: Re: Are digital "labels" killing EDM?

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Originally posted by Spacey Orange Meneedit? Are you posting posting under Mr.Mystery's name again?

No nonsense, please.

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Originally posted by SYSTEM-J What if Stephen Hawking started bad-mouthing you?

lol, guess this is what I get for trying to keep my post short, I guess I could just roll his ass down a flight of stairs.

I guess I just have an opposite POV, to me it seems all this music floating around the internet is a good thing. From my perspective we are really lucky, never has more quantitiy and quality been available as now, its a great time to love music. I just go on these serendipitous trips through the web and fill my hard drive with wild sounds like nothing I've ever heard. Maybe they arent quite trance sounds, some of them arent even dancable, but they are just great and are sooooo friggin easy to find. I like whats going on in the internet right now, its just bulging with great stuff and no single person could possibly hear it all.

I thinks its great that music is being liberated from the industry, their strangelhold is weakening and all this crazy weird sound is showing up, archive.org is now one of my favorite sites. Trance doesn't have that great of an internet presence, like axolotyl said, but plenty of great music is available online.

I think i listened to 300+ tracks the other day on various dl sites, and couldnt't find a single track that I liked.

They are crap, I could go on more, but whats the point...

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