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-- Buying a condo
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quote:

Originally posted by 4-play there are some good rent to own schemes.

for instance? I only once found a rent to own scheme which was an extremely long time ago in the condo part of t-star.

quote:

Originally posted by torontotrncelvr its late and all I want to say that I am a licensed real estate agent and I do not agree with all that has been said up to now. There are stll a lot of good condos to buy, and yes a lot of terrible condos to buy. The factors show no slowing down of the Toronto housing/condo market. Agreed, there are a ton of condo's going up, and a lot of bad investments, but there are also still good investments. All the details cannot possibly be conveyed in ths forum, and you can feel free to contact me via PM for more info. I would be happy to get togther for a coffee and discuss any questions you may have. Michael

i do agree with eric's concerns about the hyper inflated real estate market. if prices plunge you can be stuck with a loss in the value of your property

BUT

as michael says. there are still good values out there worth searching for. if you're going to be making one of the biggest investments of your early career/life isn't it worth your time and effort to go shopping? there's a rule of thumb that Dolf De Roos (real estate guru) has tried to teach.

100:10:3:1

for every 100 properties you look at, there will be 10 that you will be interested in, of which you make 3 offers, of which 1 will be accepted. the deals are out there you just have to do your homework and research.

quote:

Originally posted by dance2dabeat eric says to rent for another yar..before thinking of buying.... any thoughts anyone??

i agree. basically my plan is to rent for a year in the area i would like to try and purchase a condo - make sure i like the area, etc.
lol, you've changed your mind back & forth about moving a bunch of times - once you sign that mortgage you won't be so free to alter your plans.

also the condo market is pretty flakey with all the new ones in development.

quote:

Originally posted by Vivid Boy beacsue the market is at its peak right now. its been in an inflatted bubble for the last 2 years and right now its abt to burst. unemployment is rasing, CPI is raising, and alot of focus now is out west. The market is gonna crash and we're going to be in a recession in the next 2 years. to buy a condo now when the market is at its peak is to throw away 200 g's. ull never recover the money u spent on your condo. EVER! the prices are riduculous now and condos don't retain their value. they depreicate as time goeson. theyre not like the housing market. leave the condos to the 70 yr old widowers who cant physically take care of a house anymore and have a fat ass bank account and not looking to make a buck. condos are not an investment. save ur money, the housing market is gonna crash soon too. thats when u buy. + right now condo fees are just as expensive as renting. ur gonna have to pay ur mortgage plus ur 600 dollar monthly condo fee that raises as the building gets older. plus when the market crashes u will not be able to afford the jump from 3% intrest rates to 16%. the bank is just gonna end up owning ur condoand ull be out on the street drinking puddles

Selling mine for $142,000 for 3 bedroom multilevel unit, negotiable (private sale). Maintenance fee is 549/month, which includes everything including Rogers Digital Cable Box with channel packages.

PICS

For example: You are buying a condo for 142,000, make $10,000 mortgage downpayment which will lead to following amount of 132,000.

25 Year Mortgage for 132,000 will make monthly payments of $775.28.

$775.28/month + Maintenance of 549/month + Property Taxes of 108/month = 1432/month for big 3 bedroom condo with everything included, TV, Hydro, Water, Underground Parking, Pool, Sauna and Gym.

Get a roommate for 500/month and you already get maintanence covered, which leaves you with pure investment into you own property.

If you are a starter and your income is so so, you will not get mortgage approval for more then 150,000 which is not enouph for Townhouse or Semi House, but you can afford condo.

Year or 2 passes by and you can sell condo for 149,000 depending on the unit condition. In 2 years you will have:

149,000(selling price) - (142,000(buying price) - 10,000(downpayment) - 7,000 (monthly mortgage payments)) = 24 thousand dollars of your own money in 2 years for the downpayment for a townhouse or semi-detached and you built up the credit score so you can get approved for higher mortgage amount.

quote:

Originally posted by Vivid Boy plus when the market crashes u will not be able to afford the jump from 3% intrest rates to 16%. the bank is just gonna end up owning ur condoand ull be out on the street drinking puddles

Don't listen to Vividboy without a grain of salt. Interest rates may be rising but not to the extent of 16%. The government has a much better hold on the economy than they did in the late 70's where interest rates were spiralling out of control. I do agree with most of the posters in the sense of it is much better to buy a house (even a freehold townhouse or an older, fixer-upper) as they will appreciate much more than any condo will given the same timeframe.

Afford as much house as you can within a decent area as location is key. Condo fees always go up and in terms of renting it's not necessarily as bad as people say in the sense of comparing how much interest you are paying vs. paying down the principal. It really depends as if you only put let's say 5% down you really are just paying mostly interest and a very nominal amount on the principal. Also factor in property taxes as they can definitely add to your bottom line as well when comparing vs. renting.

Try playing around with an amortization schedule of the mortgage you are looking to have. Plus another thing that isn't the greatest about buying vs. renting is all of the closing costs involved. They definitely add up as well.

That being said, I rented for about 4 years as I couldn't decide and kept wanting to wait out until the market crashed and it never did. I own a house in the 'burbs (boohoo) with a variable mortgage but am happy that I didn't buy the <600 sq ft condo because there's no way I could have kept living there given my expanding family.

the bubble is a myth, or so i have read.

seriously, if you want to buy then do it. if you think you have the means now. just make sure that you are able to cover the costs. budget out everything!

Try to find a building that is somewhat unique, in a good area, and it can be a good investment. There are always new condos going up in certain places downtown, so if your building is near one of them, chances are your unit will be tough to sell (since there are so many new ones for people to buy). It can be a good investment, but you really have to look for something nice & unique that people will want. Condos will not appreciate like homes, and many do go down in value after some years.

Also, consider how long you will be there. The first few years of your mortgage, you are just paying off interest (depending on you're DP). Keep in mind also that banks usually wont give you a loan that is 3x more than your yearly income. Many people dont discover this until they actually try and apply for one. Just another reason to save for a bigger down payment. So if you're only going to be there a short while before you sell, and you sell for the price you bought it for, you just wasted money paying interest & condo fees for a few years (which would cost a lot more than rent). So, be careful. You dont want to be stuck with a condo that wont go up much in value. Just make sure you buy something people will want over getting one in the production phase (which would save them about 20-30K). If you plan on having it for a long time, then this really doesnt matter.

If i was you, i would look at the price of condo's for sale (a couple years old) and condos for sale currently in production in the location you want to see what the difference in price is. Try to look at similar buildings (same area, features, amenities, etc). it should give you a ballpark figure of the condo value (rising, dropping,). Keep in mind its a sellers market right now.

Definately a good investment regardless... but be prepared to be broke...

it sucks..!

Lots of opinions thrown around..

What do you guys think of lofts (ie 1 or 2 storey, depending on finances).. Is that a better investment?

quote:

Originally posted by Superstring Lots of opinions thrown around.. What do you guys think of lofts (ie 1 or 2 storey, depending on finances).. Is that a better investment?

depends on what it is, and where it is. a friend of mine recently bought a condo at tip top lofts, and those i would say are a pretty good investment (as far as condos go) just based upon the fact that its different from all the typical highrises downtown.

Worst time to buy, experts predict that markets will slow down....

quote:

Originally posted by Candeeman Worst time to buy, experts predict that markets will slow down....

Experts predicted that 4 years ago and I can see no horizon to slowing down.

There are way too many people are immigrating to this country every year and they all have to live somewhere. The demand on the properly will always be here.

quote:

Originally posted by Superstring Lots of opinions thrown around.. What do you guys think of lofts (ie 1 or 2 storey, depending on finances).. Is that a better investment?

Lofts are pricey, good deal if you get mortgage approval.

quote:

Originally posted by riskytrader I own a house in the 'burbs (boohoo) with a variable mortgage but am happy that I didn't buy the <600 sq ft condo because there's no way I could have kept living there given my expanding family.

I was looking to buy a new condo from the builder in brand new building. The prices are just insane, you buy < 600sq ft 1 bedroom condo for over 250,000. There is no room for bigger TV. The newer the condos the smaller they get.

I was shopping around for a condo for about 6 month, looked at number of condos and extremely happy with mine 3 bedroom (over 1000 sq ft) for under $150,000. Too bad, Tonia's work relocated to Oakville so I will have to move west, closer to her work.

never a better time to buy condoms.

protect yourself.

quote:

Originally posted by arek never a better time to buy condoms. protect yourself.

yeah tahts a great investment too haha

but honestly 1400 a month for a condo is actually REALLY good, with everything included. Id buy it right now if i had the cash =P
In some places rent will run you up 1400 and here you arent just throwing money away its sorta being put in your pocket but you cant touch it.

My advice without reading every post here is don't buy a condo in Toronto. I have a condo and it is an investment for me but I also didn't pay 200k+ for it. I paid less than half of that in Kitchener.

I have looked at the market in Toronto for my own references and paying that kind of money plus a 400$+ condo fee a month is rediculous imo. And the condos that are within any reasonable price range for what I would spend are in the not so nice parts of TO and surrounding area.

You may want to wait Kelly, or move back home with your parents and save that money you are spending on rent and put a good downpayment on a condo instead of just jumping right into it.

the thing is u guys are missiong out on is that ur paying 400 grand for a fuckin shared property. when u buy a condo u buy a unit plus a share of a common area of the building. so lets say average number of units on one floor is abt 10 we'll say the average condo is 30 floors usually the first 2 floors are common area. so ur looking at 28 floors of units with 10 units a floor. so u have at 280 units a building. average condo price is $400 000. so once a condo is sold out everyones pay altogether is a transaction of $112 000 000. ur gonna tell me thatthe condo on that piece of property is worth 112 million dollars?!?!?!?!??!?!


its a jip, ur getting ripped off, prices are inflatted. supply is already surpassing demand.


just another lil piece of info to help u realize something. all the big subtrade companie that work highrise residential are grabbing at jobs out west. there could be a reason for this?!??!?!


lets do some more calculations, 280 units in a building (established last example), condo fee per month is lets say average $500, $140 000/month, thats $1 680 000 worth of maintenance fees a year. i wont even begin to explain how scandulous and ludacrious 2 million dollars worth of maintenance fees a year is hahahahahhahahah. Well hey if u want to be stuck in a room made of concrete thats worth themax 30 grand and help pay maintenance fees of close to 2 million a year to cut grass and pay some bills go ahead lol. but i enjoy being the queen peice in rthe chess game not the pawn

quote:

Originally posted by torontotrncelvr its late and all I want to say that I am a licensed real estate agent and I do not agree with all that has been said up to now. There are stll a lot of good condos to buy, and yes a lot of terrible condos to buy. The factors show no slowing down of the Toronto housing/condo market. Agreed, there are a ton of condo's going up, and a lot of bad investments, but there are also still good investments. All the details cannot possibly be conveyed in ths forum, and you can feel free to contact me via PM for more info. I would be happy to get togther for a coffee and discuss any questions you may have. Michael

congrats i have a license too. pm me and lets go for cofee teehee


spam and look for someone to leech money off somewhere else. dont bring ur shitty advertising schemes over here buddy, this is a trance web forum not a cold call

quote:

Originally posted by vickyvale I say go for it. Think of how much of your mtg you'll have paid off in a year opposed to renting which will get you no where...speaking from experience here. Been renting for 7 years now...I would be half way to owning my own home/condo by now! Why do you think she should wait, Eric??

actually, you payoff almost *nothing* in the first year...mortgages are "interest-heavy" at the onset.

supply has NOT outstripped demand...particularly for 1st time home buyers and because of the continuing demand for investement properties (a huge % of condo purchases are for investment purposes right now).

Few 1st time homebuyers can afford to go out and get a house right away...so they get a condo instead. While a condo may not be as much "bang for the buck", the average new 2 bedroom condo costs a LOT less than most houses in the GTA.

I would avoid old condos, since resale opportunity is low and condo fees on aging buildings can be ludicrous...but most newer developments will not lose their value...you just won't see the ridiculously rapid appreciation that has existed in recent years.

do yourself a favour and get your knowledge from industry sources...some of the opinions in this thread are flat out wrong.

http://www.cmhc.ca
http://www.remax.ca/

two good sources for analysis of the market.

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT (a huge % of condo purchases are for investment purposes right now).

short term investments of max 3 years. please be specific next time

I say go for it Kelly and worry about the consequences later.

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT you just won't see the ridiculously rapid appreciation that has existed in recent years.

Which is good from an economy standpoint.

Insane appreciation and rapid growth is NOT sustainable!

Sustainable, steady growth is what needs to exist and should be supported..

quote:

Originally posted by Grinder I say go for it Kelly and worry about the consequences later.

what are u 13?

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT actually, you payoff almost *nothing* in the first year...mortgages are "interest-heavy" at the onset. supply has NOT outstripped demand...particularly for 1st time home buyers and because of the continuing demand for investement properties (a huge % of condo purchases are for investment purposes right now). Few 1st time homebuyers can afford to go out and get a house right away...so they get a condo instead. While a condo may not be as much "bang for the buck", the average new 2 bedroom condo costs a LOT less than most houses in the GTA. I would avoid old condos, since resale opportunity is low and condo fees on aging buildings can be ludicrous...but most newer developments will not lose their value...you just won't see the ridiculously rapid appreciation that has existed in recent years. do yourself a favour and get your knowledge from industry sources...some of the opinions in this thread are flat out wrong. http://www.cmhc.ca http://www.remax.ca/ two good sources for analysis of the market.

+1

best advice yet in this forum.

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