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-- Metropass tax credit: To be implemented July 1, 2006
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quote:

Originally posted by Orko In the end the administration costs would be the same

I beg to differ. The costs of a new TTC subsidy would create new paperwork and new administrative positions, while a change to the tax code does not. (you might have to write in one extra figure on your tax form, and proof of purchase of your metropasses)

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict lol, if you can't fork over $100 at the beginning of the month, you've got some serious fiscal issues. Like paying the rent, or eating. One reason poor people stay poor is that they do stupid things like buying tokens everyday, instead of a metropass. Help yourself first!

that's kinda the point though ... since rent and metropass are due at the same time, it can really strain that paycheque. Poor people are poor because they have shitty jobs, its not really about spending habits.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko This is exactly what I was thinking. In the end the administration costs would be the same, because either way they have to file paper work telling the Fed how many passes they sold that month. I think collectively giving the money back instantly would save more people time and money. I'm sure it will be a simple rebate but its just one less thing to worry about at tax time. PLUS I am guessing you would have to save all your TTC passes for the year? That would be very annoying.

that last point is interesting.

anyone know the reporting guidelines yet from CCRA? Do people need to attach receipts (like for RRSP deductions, medical expenses) or is it being done on a declaration basis (like rent claims)?

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT that last point is interesting. anyone know the reporting guidelines yet from CCRA? Do people need to attach receipts (like for RRSP deductions, medical expenses) or is it being done on a declaration basis (like rent claims)?

With rent you have to be able to prove your rent in case of an audit. I don't think it would be too much of a burden for the ttc to issue a receipt when you purchase a metro pass.

quote:

Originally posted by TO guy that's kinda the point though ... since rent and metropass are due at the same time, it can really strain that paycheque. Poor people are poor because they have shitty jobs, its not really about spending habits.

you really would be surprised. Yes poor people are poor because they have bad jobs. But take a ride on the bus any day and you will see countless people using tickets/tokens, yet they have a new cellphone and new clothes etc. Take a walk in a ghetto sometime, a lot of people look fly with their gear, but that's all they have.. they are behind on the rent and behind on their bills. Spending habits are a BIG part of the equation.

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict you really would be surprised. Yes poor people are poor because they have bad jobs. But take a ride on the bus any day and you will see countless people using tickets/tokens, yet they have a new cellphone and new clothes etc. Take a walk in a ghetto sometime, a lot of people look fly with their gear, but that's all they have.. they are behind on the rent and behind on their bills. Spending habits are a BIG part of the equation.

I really don't see how a hundred dollar pair of jeans equates to a fifty thousand dollar income differential.

Full time (10 trips/week) = $21 (buying tokens)

Metro pass after rebate: $99.75 -15.5% = $84.28 / 4 = $21.07


People usually do not buy a metro pass because they don't take enough transit on the weekends to justify the extra cost. If they gave the rebate instantly, it becomes a very close and more people would probably start buying the passes

I now believe the true reason they are doing this as a tax credit, is for all the people that signed contracts for their monthly TTC passes. As the adverts promise, the price is garunteed for 12 months. If that is infact the case, then their prices would stay the same, and the people who buy from month to month would pay a lower price. The contract holders would surely be upset.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko I now believe the true reason they are doing this as a tax credit, is for all the people that signed contracts for their monthly TTC passes. As the adverts promise, the price is garunteed for 12 months. If that is infact the case, then their prices would stay the same, and the people who buy from month to month would pay a lower price. The contract holders would surely be upset.

perhaps ... although they could just issue a refund.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko People usually do not buy a metro pass because they don't take enough transit on the weekends to justify the extra cost.

Yeh, you're right.. all of us metropassholders just go driving around on the weekend with the cars we don't have.

quote:

Originally posted by TO guy I really don't see how a hundred dollar pair of jeans equates to a fifty thousand dollar income differential.

um.. want to clarify that a little bit?

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict um.. want to clarify that a little bit?

if they guys all decked out in the ghetto had a job that paid substantially more than whatever they have now, I think that would be a bigger factor in their wealth than their spending habits.

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict Yeh, you're right.. all of us metropassholders just go driving around on the weekend with the cars we don't have.

Please read my post again. I said people do not buy a metro pass because they have their own transportation on the weekends.

I do know people like that, some people on this board, and people at work.

I for one am not buying a pass because I can bike where I want on the weekends when not travelling down town.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko Please read my post again. I said people do not buy a metro pass because they have their own transportation on the weekends. I do know people like that, some people on this board, and people at work. I for one am not buying a pass because I can bike where I want on the weekends when not travelling down town.

touche

quote:

Originally posted by TO guy if they guys all decked out in the ghetto had a job that paid substantially more than whatever they have now, I think that would be a bigger factor in their wealth than their spending habits.

There are only a finite number of good jobs. If everyone got paid a bit more, then prices would just inflate to the point that people wouldn't notice much change in the purchasing power of their dollar.

On the otherhand, if someone can afford a $100 pair of jeans, surely they can afford a metropass. That is if they save their money for the metropass, instead of spending it on jeans.

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict There are only a finite number of good jobs. If everyone got paid a bit more, then prices would just inflate to the point that people wouldn't notice much change in the purchasing power of their dollar. On the otherhand, if someone can afford a $100 pair of jeans, surely they can afford a metropass. That is if they save their money for the metropass, instead of spending it on jeans.

all I'm trying to say is that employment is a larger factor than spending. Not so much on an individual group basis, but on a larger scale. Like the folks living in Rosedale are spending a lot more than the people living in Regeant Park .....

quote:

Originally posted by TO guy all I'm trying to say is that employment is a larger factor than spending. Not so much on an individual group basis, but on a larger scale. Like the folks living in Rosedale are spending a lot more than the people living in Regeant Park .....

In a perfect world we would all have great jobs. Sadly, that is not the case in REALITY. Job opportunities are dictated by your skill set and the opportunties provided to you. This is not equal for everyone.. however, all people have the ability, if not the willpower, to control their spending habits.

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict In a perfect world we would all have great jobs. Sadly, that is not the case in REALITY. Job opportunities are dictated by your skill set and the opportunties provided to you. This is not equal for everyone.. however, all people have the ability, if not the willpower, to control their spending habits.

yeah true, but if I didn't make anything, and didn't spend anything, I still wouldn't have anything.

upfront subsidizing would require agreements with the city of toronto, ttc and the province since transit is not under federal authority. And none of those people seem willing to work with the federal government. And if it did work, it would take ages to form an agreement and implement it. Federal income tax is already a federal jurisdiction so this is actually a clever way of implementing a subsidy without getting involved inr ed tape.

Doing it this way saves the aggravation and brings the savings to you starting July 2006.

The way the TTC and the city have been lately, i think its much safer to just deduct it from federal taxes

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 The way the TTC and the city have been lately, i think its much safer to just deduct it from federal taxes

In addition, with the current fiscal imbalance the feds can afford it

On a related note, some stations are accepting debit and credit cards for metro pass purchases. Nice, I hate cash.

quote:

Originally posted by TO guy yeah true, but if I didn't make anything, and didn't spend anything, I still wouldn't have anything.

Yup, but if you have a little, and didn't spend anything, that little can turn into a lot. There's a HUGE difference between "little" and "nothing".

The ammount of income you bring in is only the most important factor up to the point that you're making $12 an hour (I can live off $10, which means so can anyone else). Then, your spending potential is entirely based on spending habits. To put "making a living" into perspective... 10-12 bucks an hour is the bare minimum that most non-fast-food companies pay their workers. IOW, ANYONE can make a living. They just need to live within their means.

I've known many people who aren't well-off in my life, and they all share one thing in common. They have horrible spending habits. They waste money on new TVs and expensive clothes and shitty used cars and endless other peices of junk that they buy for who knows what reason. A couple of these families made MORE money than my parents brought in, but we were always 'well off' compared to these people because my parents were incredibly disciplined with their spending.

In other words, that cellphone and $100 pair of jeans probably has MORE to do with these people's poverty than the ammount of income they bring in. Awakened Addict is 100% correct that these idiots should be saving their money on those jeans and buying a metropass instead. If they want those $100 jeans, they can go out and get them... When they get their money back during tax season from all the metropasses they bought instead.

Awakened is also correct in spelling out for you that more money for poor people isn't the answer. If everyone was paid more, prices would just go up (that's how inflation works!!!). We've already seen a perfect example in Ontario as minimum wage is being raised to $8 an hour. Fast food prices have already jumped to cover the extra cost of labour. They will again next February too.

4 dolars back - wooooopie dooooooooooo
ttc

quote:

Originally posted by dallastar 4 dolars back - wooooopie dooooooooooo ttc

UH...


Regular Metropass Price: $99.75 per month
OR
Metropass Discount Plan: $91.50 per month
Federal Tax Credit: - $14.18 per month
Actual Cost of Metropass: $77.32 per month

That looks like 14 dollars to me.

quote:

Originally posted by Spam UH... Regular Metropass Price: $99.75 per month OR Metropass Discount Plan: $91.50 per month Federal Tax Credit: - $14.18 per month Actual Cost of Metropass: $77.32 per month That looks like 14 dollars to me.

The four dollars is from last month as a recovery of the strike day.

^^^ can you imagine the costs involved to process that credit?

lol

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