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-- I think some of you know Karim...This is his blog from Lebanon.
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quote:

Originally posted by riskytrader If anything the entire world is being far too lax about the situation. It's unbelieveable that no the UN or other country has stepped in and done something.

I agree. How can they just stand there and watch them blow each other to bits? I just don't understand this BS sometimes.

/me walks away shakin his head

quote:

Originally posted by Skipper what? I don't know Karim well enough to contact him personally but because I started a thread to share his blog website doesn't mean I don't care.

ok, sorry Sarah, I didnt mean to offend u...
my reply was directed to whoever said that "his friends suck cause they havent started this thread before"

Hoollyyy crap, I was not looking to pick any fights with anybody. As I said, I don't know the dude at all, all I know is that he left TOTA because he got pissed off with all the bullshit that goes on in here, so when I see a new thread saying "he's in lebanon, here is his blog", I assume that's it's more likely that he's there since recently rather than he moved there some number of years ago.

And sorryy for being politically incorrect and saying "shit bombed out of a country" instead of "political tensions".

For the record, I do not read Tribe, and I am not Mona, so I don't completely agree with what she said, but you guys are getting way too uppity over my post where I specifically said that I do not want to see his body in a bodybag because of "political tensions".

Edit: My post is a little late as I see the dicussion is closed, so ... not trying to get people riled up again.

be safe Karim.. prayers are with you..

For those who care, I spoke with Katy today and Karim is safe out of Lebanon and should be home on sunday.

Wow when did he go to Lebanon? I just saw him recently at some party...he's a great guy, hope to see him back here soon.

quote:

Originally posted by Tordan I agree. How can they just stand there and watch them blow each other to bits? I just don't understand this BS sometimes. /me walks away shakin his head

I am genuinely asking this - what do you think UN countries could do that wouldn't initiate more violence?

This article is a very good read. Pretty much sums up why the UN isn't interfering in the matter. Its a well known fact that the states has the UN by the balls and I cant beleive its refusing to call for a cease fire until Israel rescues its kidnapped soldiers.

212 lebanese and 29 israelis have been killed and thats a huge difference. So even if lebanon has 20 soldiers hostage and lets say hypothetically kills them, i wonder if the states will call for a cease fire then despite the casualties still being hugely in israels favor

I used to always support israel in its conflict with lebanon and because Indian relationships with them are very good but they seem to be starting shit all around them since they became independent.

quote:

NEW YORK (CNN) -- We Americans like to think we're a pretty smart people, even when evidence to the contrary is overwhelming. And nowhere is that evidence more overwhelming than in the Middle East. History in the Middle East is everything, and we Americans seem to learn nothing from it. President Harry Truman took about 20 minutes to recognize the state of Israel when it declared independence in 1948. Since then, more than 58 years of war, terrorism and blood-letting have led to the events of the past week. Even now, as Katyusha rockets rain down on northern Israel and Israeli fighter jets blast Hezbollah targets in southern Lebanon, we simultaneously decry radical Islamist terrorism and Israel's lack of restraint in defending itself. And the U.S. government, which wants no part of a cease-fire until Israel is given every opportunity to rescue its kidnapped soldiers and destroy as many Hezbollah and Hezbollah armaments as possible, urges caution in the interest of preserving a nascent and fragile democratic government in Lebanon. Could we be more conflicted? While the United States provides about $2.5 billion in military and economic aid to Israel each year, U.S. aid to Lebanon amounts to no more than $40 million. This despite the fact that the per capita GDP of Israel is among the highest in the world at $24,600, nearly four times as high as Lebanon's GDP per capita of $6,200. Lebanon's lack of wealth is matched by the Palestinians -- three out of every four Palestinians live below the poverty line. Yet the vast majority of our giving in the region flows to Israel. This kind of geopolitical inconsistency and shortsightedness has contributed to the Arab-Israeli conflict that the Western world seems content to allow to perpetuate endlessly. After a week of escalating violence, around two dozen Israelis and roughly 200 Lebanese have died. That has been sufficient bloodshed for United Nations Secretary General Kofi Annan and British Prime Minister Tony Blair to join in the call for an international security force, ignoring the fact that a U.N. force is already in Southern Lebanon, having failed to secure the border against Hezbollah's incursions and attacks and the murder and kidnapping of Israeli soldiers. As our airwaves fill with images and sounds of exploding Hezbollah rockets and Israeli bombs, this seven-day conflict has completely displaced from our view another war in which 10 Americans and more than 300 Iraqis have died during the same week. And it is a conflict now of more than three years duration that has claimed almost 15,000 lives so far this year alone. An estimated 50,000 Iraqis and more than 2,500 American troops have been killed since the insurgency began in March of 2003, which by some estimates is more than the number of dead on both sides of the Arab-Israeli conflict over the past 58 years of wars and intifadas. Yet we have seen no rescue ships moving up the Euphrates for Iraqis who are dying in their streets, markets and mosques each day. French Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin has not leaped to Baghdad as he did Beirut. And there are no meetings of the Arab League, and no U.S. diplomacy with Egypt, Syria and Jordan directed at ending the Iraqi conflict. In the Middle East, where is our sense of proportion? Where is our sense of perspective? Where is our sense of decency? And, finally, just how smart are we?

Source

quote:

Originally posted by Irishaddict when they left nothing like this was remotely on the horizon.

AFAIK Lebanon has been on the "NOT SAFE. TRAVEL NOT RECOMMENDED" list of Foreign Affairs Canada and US Department of State for over a year.

Glad to hear Karim & his father is ok.

lol, it's like the author of that article doens't know that America is run by Jewish people.

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur lol, it's like the author of that article doens't know that America is run by Jewish people.

why do you say shit like this.

I am happy to hear Karim is going to be coming home....

this is frightening - Thank you Sarah for bringing this blog to our attention. My thoughts and prayers are with the innocent in this country during this time. I have a friend I still have not heard from and have also an update from a girlfriend who lives there. Pretty much the same circumstances and an extremely scary time for them. Specially when this is there only place to live....

quote:

Originally posted by raveed This article is a very good read. Pretty much sums up why the UN isn't interfering in the matter. Its a well known fact that the states has the UN by the balls and I cant beleive its refusing to call for a cease fire until Israel rescues its kidnapped soldiers. 212 lebanese and 29 israelis have been killed and thats a huge difference. So even if lebanon has 20 soldiers hostage and lets say hypothetically kills them, i wonder if the states will call for a cease fire then despite the casualties still being hugely in israels favor I used to always support israel in its conflict with lebanon and because Indian relationships with them are very good but they seem to be starting shit all around them since they became independent. Source

casualties are casualties and ranking up the numbers is stupid. just because one side has been worse off doesnt mean that we should focus on stopping only one sides operations.

as to the shit that israel has been starting, most of it has been started for it by terrorists. just like this recent conflict has been started by hamas and hezbollah not israel.

and i really dont understand the point of the article. whats happening in iraq and lebanon are two different things.

quote:

Originally posted by MKpacha why do you say shit like this.

Oh come on! Look at the past history of America's involvement in the Middle East. 9 times out of 10 they have been on the side of Israel. You think all this happens by chance? That in every conflict Israel has been involved in, they are the ones who are wronged? Ever since the end of WWII and the massive amounts of Jewish people who immigrated to America as the safehouse, the Jewish influence on America has been very strong.

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur lol, it's like the author of that article doens't know that America is run by Jewish people.

Can he insult anymore people, really.

I think this may have been the dumbest comment you have ever made on these boards.

What makes you think these things, cause I would really love to hear it??

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur Oh come on! Look at the past history of America's involvement in the Middle East. 9 times out of 10 they have been on the side of Israel. You think all this happens by chance? That in every conflict Israel has been involved in, they are the ones who are wronged? Ever since the end of WWII and the massive amounts of Jewish people who immigrated to America as the safehouse, the Jewish influence on America has been very strong.

nevermind, you have already answered it.

Actually WWII was an extremely embarrasing episode for the US...when Jewish refugees arrived on American shores, they were sent back to Germany

US did not even enter the war until it was bombed by Japan, not to mention it's primary involvement in Europe only came after they realized that the Soviet Union is advancing so far it could take all of Europe - hence after the cold war started. The only thing they were doing is sending supplies...barely too, Canada even played a bigger role.

Regardless of the fact, it's a silly statement to make, Israel is not run by Jewish people, and the US has very many interests in keeping Israel on it's side (other than military)

Not to mention that in the current conflict it's of US interest that Israel destroys Hesbullah.

I have been also reading Karim\'s blog.

Eventho we really don\'t get along, I am concerned and interested in what is happening with him.

quote:

Originally posted by starsearcher Regardless of the fact, it's a silly statement to make, Israel is not run by Jewish people, and the US has very many interests in keeping Israel on it's side (other than military)

That is something that Ive been wanting to know. Besides security, what interests could the US have in Israel.

Its a known fact that Israeli intelligence is the best in the world and a lot of israelis work in the CIA/FBI but if anything, Americas relationship with israel seems to have harmed its realtionship with the oil producing community in the middle east.

After the 1967 war, america pledged its support to israel and most of the middle east went to russia so im keen to know how exactly is this relationship beneficial to american interests.

Most beautiful quote ever:

quote:

Originally quoted by Ariel Sharon �Every time we do something, you [Shimon Peres] tell me America will do this and will do that... I want to tell you something very clear: Don�t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.� -Knesset, Tel Aviv, October 3, 2001

This is a pretty good article (although old, but nothing has changed since then, instead the iad to isreal has been constanly increasing): http://www.washington-report.org/ht...d_to_israel.htm

quote:

Since 1992, the U.S. has offered Israel an additional $2 billion annually in loan guarantees. Congressional researchers have disclosed that between 1974 and 1989, $16.4 billion in U.S. military loans were converted to grants and that this was the understanding from the beginning. ... In addition, there is the more than $1.5 billion in private U.S. funds that go to Israel annually in the form of $1 billion in private tax-deductible donations and $500 million in Israeli bonds. The ability of Americans to make what amounts to tax-deductible contributions to a foreign government, made possible through a number of Jewish charities, does not exist with any other country. ... Total U.S. aid to Israel is approximately one-third of the American foreign-aid budget, even though Israel comprises just .001 percent of the world's population and already has one of the world's higher per capita incomes. ... Since 1949 the U.S. has given Israel a total of $83.205 billion. The interest costs borne by U.S. tax payers on behalf of Israel are $49.937 billion, thus making the total amount of aid given to Israel since 1949 $133.132 billion. This may mean that U.S. government has given more federal aid to the average Israeli citizen in a given year than it has given to the average American citizen. ... U.S. government officials argue that this money is necessary for "moral" reasons-some even say that Israel is a "democracy battling for its very survival." If that were the real reason, however, aid should have been highest during Israel's early years, and would have declined as Israel grew stronger. Yet "the pattern�has been just the opposite." According to Zunes, "99 percent of all U.S. aid to Israel took place after the June 1967 war, when Israel found itself more powerful than any combination of Arab armies�." ... Recently Americans have begun to read and hear that "Israel receives $3 billion in annual U.S. foreign aid." That's true. But it's still a lie. The problem is that in fiscal 1997 alone, Israel received from a variety of other U.S. federal budgets at least $525.8 million above and beyond its $3 billion from the foreign aid budget, and yet another $2 billion in federal loan guarantees. So the complete total of U.S. grants and loan guarantees to Israel for fiscal 1997 was $5,525,800,000. One can truthfully blame the mainstream media for never digging out these figures for themselves, because none ever have. They were compiled by the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs. But the mainstream media certainly are not alone. Although Congress authorizes America's foreign aid total, the fact that more than a third of it goes to a country smaller in both area and population than Hong Kong probably never has been mentioned on the floor of the Senate or House. Yet it's been going on for more than a generation. Probably the only members of Congress who even suspect the full total of U.S. funds received by Israel each year are the privileged few committee members who actually mark it up. And almost all members of the concerned committees are Jewish, have taken huge campaign donations orchestrated by Israel's Washington, DC lobby, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), or both. These congressional committee members are paid to act, not talk. So they do and they don't. ... The lobby that Israel and its supporters have built in the United States to make all this aid happen, and to ban discussion of it from the national dialogue, goes far beyond AIPAC, with its $15 million budget, its 150 employees, and its five or six registered lobbyists who manage to visit every member of Congress individually once or twice a year.

quote:

Staunch American support for Israel is nothing new. In February 2005, Gallup reported similarly lopsided findings -- 69 percent of the public viewed Israel favorably, 25 percent unfavorably. In 2004, when Israel was being denounced in Europe and the United Nations for its assassination of Sheik Ahmed Yassin, the leader of Hamas, 61 percent of Americans said Israel was justified in killing him. In 2002, when a CBS News poll asked whether Israel's actions against Yasser Arafat and his forces were equivalent to US actions against Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda, 59 percent agreed that they were. In short, solidarity with Israel is an abiding feature of American public opinion. Because the American people are pro-Israel, the American government is pro-Israel. And because Americans so strongly support Israel in its conflict with the Arabs, American policy in the Middle East is committed to Israel's defense.

Source: http://www.boston.com/news/world/mi...side_of_israel/

Make your own conclusions as to why relationship between Israel and America is as tight as it is.

quote:

+1 The comment's that I read from Misanthrope honestly make me wonder. Like this poor country is being completely destroyed and yet she claims we shouldn't be overly sensitive. If anything the entire world is being far too lax about the situation. It's unbelieveable that no the UN or other country has stepped in and done something.

TO be honest, you seem like you have absolutely NO idea what is going on. And that seems to be the case with most of the posts in this thread. MIddle-eastern relations with the Western world have been...quote complicated...to say the least, for the past 50 years, and yet people come in and make a 10 second summation about something they know nothing about, then comment on the lack of understanding on someone else's part.

We should all just wish him well. If only half of you knew what it felt like to see bombs and buildings falling in front of your face.

quote:

Originally posted by zokissima TO be honest, you seem like you have absolutely NO idea what is going on. And that seems to be the case with most of the posts in this thread. MIddle-eastern relations with the Western world have been...quote complicated...to say the least, for the past 50 years, and yet people come in and make a 10 second summation about something they know nothing about, then comment on the lack of understanding on someone else's part.

I was in Kashmir during 1989 when the insurgency started and although I didnt see much as i was young at the time, i remember my maid telling me stories about what was going on outside and we had to flee the very next day and I saw the carnage that one day of gun fighting had caused. Not to say that this remotely compares to whats happening in lebanon right now but I can imagine what karim's going through and I wish him and his family well in getting back to safety.

quote:

Originally posted by Goashem and i really dont understand the point of the article. whats happening in iraq and lebanon are two different things.

I just think the sense of 'proportionality' is what matters.

Yes, they are two different conflicts, but its the attention that throws some people off. The fact that so much attention is given to this particular conflict, but people just gloss over other places like Iraq, or Sudan.

Maybe its because of family, political, and/or economic ties that more 'importance' is being given to the conflict in the Middle East.

If a life is a life, then why are we not hearing more about Africa? There are probably more deaths/day in Africa than any other area in the world, yet politicians are not jumping at the same rate.

quote:

Originally posted by preppie chick For those who care, I spoke with Katy today and Karim is safe out of Lebanon and should be home on sunday.

Wow...That's good news. I honestly had no idea about any of this...that's quite a long read but I'll be sure to check it out on my spare time.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko I just think the sense of 'proportionality' is what matters. Yes, they are two different conflicts, but its the attention that throws some people off. The fact that so much attention is given to this particular conflict, but people just gloss over other places like Iraq, or Sudan. Maybe its because of family, political, and/or economic ties that more 'importance' is being given to the conflict in the Middle East. If a life is a life, then why are we not hearing more about Africa? There are probably more deaths/day in Africa than any other area in the world, yet politicians are not jumping at the same rate.

the reason why theres so much involvement in the current conflict is because there are alot of foreign nationals suddenly caught in this conflict. lebanon is known as the switzerland of the middle east and this current escalation is something very sudden unexpected and worrying.

quote:

Originally posted by raveed That is something that Ive been wanting to know. Besides security, what interests could the US have in Israel. Its a known fact that Israeli intelligence is the best in the world and a lot of israelis work in the CIA/FBI but if anything, Americas relationship with israel seems to have harmed its realtionship with the oil producing community in the middle east.

Research, military development, technology (Israel is considered the second silicone valley - all of latest Intel chips/technologies including Centrino and the new one to be out soon were developed in Israel), trading partner, and the only real ally in the middle east - Russia has influence on everyone else in the area, the US only has Israel...there's much more stuff actually without going into details.

lol the only thing Israel doesn't have is oil lol

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