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-- Why diamonds suck
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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles I don't have a problem with diamond production at all, and it's great that countries like Botswana are making money off of it, but I think it's worthwhile to point out the labor conditions and the reasons diamond prices are so high and diamonds are popularly considered "valuable."

So are labor conditions in the diamond industry any different than any other industry in these countries? Are you arguing that poor labor conditions are actually justifiable because clothing and shoes have greater legitimacy to warrant such conditions???

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And how on earth is oil a "monopoly?"

Ummm what?

I remember back in high school my chemistry teacher told the class that a diamond is nothing more than a tightly bound piece of allotrope also known as carbon. You're literally getting a very expensive lump of coal, that is, if you're getting one for christmas.

That doesn't mean I won't treat my future wife to a diamond, but it sure disillusioned me to the prospect of owning one. All I'm saying is that it amazes me how valuable I thought this piece of rock was when in reality I was just another victim of clever marketing.

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Originally posted by occrider So are labor conditions in the diamond industry any different than any other industry in these countries? Are you arguing that poor labor conditions are actually justifiable because clothing and shoes have greater legitimacy to warrant such conditions???

Nope. Poor labor conditions are pretty much dictated by the economics of the situation -- where the cheap and unregulated labor is, there the megacorps will go -- and won't go away very soon unless really draconian regulations are implemented. The situation of blood diamonds and the like is different, though, because it involves actively retarding the political development and infrastructure of poor nations rather than just capitalizing on the already-existing low price of labor.

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Ummm what?

I guess OPEC is kind of a monopoly, but I thought the subject was corporate monopolies.

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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Nope. Poor labor conditions are pretty much dictated by the economics of the situation -- where the cheap and unregulated labor is, there the megacorps will go -- and won't go away very soon unless really draconian regulations are implemented. The situation of blood diamonds and the like is different, though, because it involves actively retarding the political development and infrastructure of poor nations rather than just capitalizing on the already-existing low price of labor.

What I am trying to argue is that unless De Beers can be characterized as being anything worse than any other major globalized business, I'm disinclined to warrant it special attention over anyone else. Now if it were a major facilitor of conflict diamond trade than I would feel obliged to canvas against them.

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I guess OPEC is kind of a monopoly, but I thought the subject was corporate monopolies.

Well it's a conglomeration of state sponsored corporate monopolies. It's much much worse than De Beers since the monopoly of resources is far more difficult to manage and maintain at the unsanctioned corporate level.

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What I am trying to argue is that unless De Beers can be characterized as being anything worse than any other major globalized business, I'm disinclined to warrant it special attention over anyone else. Now if it were a major facilitor of conflict diamond trade than I would feel obliged to canvas against them.

True enough, I guess I could have started a thread on "shitty labor practices in general," but it builds more interest for a thread if: (1) you talk about something more specific than "bad labor practices" and (2) you talk about something that many people have a specific strong emotional attachment to, as opposed to something like clothing or shoes.

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Originally posted by occrider Dumb people deserve to have their money taken from them.

I was skimming through the thread, and I just wanted to give this a fuck yeah!

haha talk about waking up to something that has been going on for a long time.

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Yeah, and two of those are necessary. Guess which one had most of the demand created for it out of thin air by ad agencies.

But what about that diamond Victoria Secret bra. You gonna tell me women shouldnt wear bras.?

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Originally posted by jonSun But what about that diamond Victoria Secret bra. You gonna tell me women shouldnt wear bras.?

They can wear diamond bras with synthetic diamonds. They'll cost less that way, too.

don't be fooled by the rocks that i got, im still im still allied nations from the block

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Originally posted by DinoXpress don't be fooled by the rocks that i got, im still im still DinoXpress from the block

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Originally posted by Ygrene

oh shiiit...

oh no you di int!!!!!!!

Re: Why diamonds suck

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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Diamonds are mined and sifted under horrible conditions by workers in "third world" countries who earn very little money (and in some cases no money at all).

Can't provide a source but last I heard Around 1/3 of the world's diamonds are mined in Western Australia.

As for the rest of the thread I agree with most of what occrider has said. Personally I think boycotting a product all together is unlikely to improve the situation for the workers. At best they'll just lose their jobs and the economy of the source country will be further destabilised. In the long term I think free markets have to be a large part of the mechanism that will eventually lead to better governance and transparency in the developing world.

Another point that hasn't been raised is that diamond mining for the most part is not terribly good for the environment. But that's a drop in the ocean of problems facing the environment globally.


edit: on a separate point there have been some good threads in the cor lately... Is arbiter's awareness-raising campaign behind this?

There are so many other gorgeous stones...I don't know why diamonds have this legacy and reputation of being "the best". I think pearls are so much more interesting, espeically how they are naturally occurring, way better than any diamond is.

Re: Re: Why diamonds suck

quote:

Originally posted by astroboy edit: on a separate point there have been some good threads in the cor lately... Is arbiter's awareness-raising campaign behind this?

don't suggest that.

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