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- Canada - Toronto & Southern Ont.
-- Drug testing question
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quote:

Originally posted by Dr. DAS Well it's none of thier business as long as I do my job and keep my work and private lives seperate. You want it, petition the court. Even then I'd probably protest it.

i have a feeling they would fire you before they went to the court

quote:

Originally posted by Cro_Addict i have a feeling they would fire you before they went to the court

On what grounds? Standing up for my human rights?
This would be an unreasonable and illegal request. I'm sure they would 'find' some other reason in the meantime, but I'd do my best to make things messy.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. DAS On what grounds? Standing up for my human rights? This would be an unreasonable and illegal request. I'm sure they would 'find' some other reason in the meantime, but I'd do my best to make things messy.

if it is company policy then you would get fired for not obeying company policy.

and then you'd have to go through courts and shit if you wanted something done.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. DAS You want it, petition the court. Even then I'd probably protest it.

Or they could just fire you. Somehow I doubt that your wrongful dismissal suit would go over so well once the judge is informed that you were canned because you refused to take a drug test.

Remember, the constitution only protects you from the government performing random searches and seizures. In the private sector they can make any rules they want, and only the labour laws can get in the way.

quote:

Originally posted by Big Boss Correction on your attempted correction. It is a RANDOM TEST. The person took something because we were at Stereo for Chus and Ceballos and Red Bull wasn't keeping them away. And then the person was informed they had to take a random test. Even if the person tests positive, they can say it was Nyquil or something. Obviously, if they knew they would be tested, they wouldn't risk it. Smart ass.

If the job means that much to the person, maybe they should stop doing drugs? Otherwise, it's clear where their priorities are.

It IS possible to go to a club and not do drugs. And if red bull just isn't doing it...perhaps they should go home.

Keeping a job you like > staying out and partying for a night

At least in my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Or they could just fire you. Somehow I doubt that your wrongful dismissal suit would go over so well once the judge is informed that you were canned because you refused to take a drug test. Remember, the constitution only protects you from the government performing random searches and seizures. In the private sector they can make any rules they want, and only the labour laws can get in the way.

I take it you didn't read the case law I posted on page 2?
Companies have no right in Canada to make such a request.

And I think the JP would be on my side versus the big bad corporation trying to trample my rights. Refusing the test isn't tantamount to a confession like it is with a breathalyzer, it is refusing an illegal request. That's like getting fired because you failed to funnel money into your bosses' personal account because he asked you to help him embezzle.

quote:

Originally posted by Cro_Addict what? So by having some OTC meds you can test positive for some substances??

You can't test for MDMA/E, you can test positive for amphetamines. Haven't you heard of Olympic atheletes, etc getting disqualified because they test positive for amphetamines even though they took something like Nyquil?

An upper will be in your system, but they can't determine what upper.

This is out of my hands anyway, my friend made a choice and if something happens, that's his issue.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. DAS I take it you didn't read the case law I posted on page 2?

That "case" was decided by an arbitrator, not a judge. It has no value as legal precedent.

quote:

And I think the JP would be on my side versus the big bad corporation trying to trample my rights. Refusing the test isn't tantamount to a confession like it is with a breathalyzer, it is refusing an illegal request. That's like getting fired because you failed to funnel money into your bosses' personal account because he asked you to help him embezzle.

Yet another person who doesn't know the meaning of "rights". You've got an employment contract, they can demand whatever they want, and if you don't like it, you can quit. There aren't any "rights" in question for them to "trample" and courts are well aware of this.

Breathalyzers are administered by police, so they fall under constitutional protections from the government. Even in that case, you can't refuse a breathalyzer at a RIDE stop. Certainly you'll get nowhere trying to argue this in the private sector. You have no rights because you always have an alternative - quit.

It's not "like" your embezzling example at all because that would be asking you to be an accessory to a criminal act. It would be more like getting fired because your boss decided you were better equipped to make coffee and photocopies than handle customer calls, and you refused to do it.

quote:

Originally posted by Cro_Addict your face is a drug test!

totally off topic, but when me and my bf are arguing, we always resort to that statement. We could be arguing about pillows and we would say: "your FACE is a pillow!!" back and forth forEVER.

quote:

Originally posted by yankeeBaby totally off topic, but when me and my bf are arguing, we always resort to that statement. We could be arguing about pillows and we would say: "your FACE is a pillow!!" back and forth forEVER.

hahah jokes.

i say it to my gf all the time..she HATES it..lol

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut That "case" was decided by an arbitrator, not a judge. It has no value as legal precedent.

This case was decided by the Ontario court of appeal, which is binding as precedent. Arbitrators were used to this end.

quote:

Yet another person who doesn't know the meaning of "rights". You've got an employment contract, they can demand whatever they want, and if you don't like it, you can quit. There aren't any "rights" in question for them to "trample" and courts are well aware of this.

Yet another person who doesn't know how to research thier opinion before acting like a jackass...

"In 2001 the Ontario Court of Appeal released its decision in Entrop v. Imperial Oil Ltd., which has been considered as the leading Canadian jurisprudence on drug and alcohol testing of employees. The case, generally known as the Entrop decision, has been referenced and followed across the country.

Entrop set out the law with respect to when alcohol and drug testing would be permissible. The court considered random testing, post-incident testing and for-cause testing... The arbitration board then set out what it understood to be the state of the law, something it called the �Canadian model� for drug and alcohol testing in a safety-sensitive workplace:

�No employee can be subjected to random, unannounced alcohol or drug testing, except as part of an agreed rehabilitative program."

You can read the article here

quote:

Breathalyzers are administered by police, so they fall under constitutional protections from the government. Even in that case, you can't refuse a breathalyzer at a RIDE stop. Certainly you'll get nowhere trying to argue this in the private sector. You have no rights because you always have an alternative - quit.

You can refuse, but it is an offence. If you're really interested and have nothing else to do, you can read Section 254 (specifically sub-section 5) of te Ontario Highway Traffic Act here

quote:

It's not "like" your embezzling example at all because that would be asking you to be an accessory to a criminal act. It would be more like getting fired because your boss decided you were better equipped to make coffee and photocopies than handle customer calls, and you refused to do it.

I'll let this slide because it was a bad example, but there is a huge difference between the boss asking you to coallate and asking you to submit to a drug test.

Anyhoo, for more information, consult your local library.

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