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-- sound build up
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quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Honestly, how the fuck can you claim to know how easy it is to learn something "inside out" when you haven't even learned 10% of what it can do, or even the basic concepts behind it what it does? You really need to learn how to keep your mouth shut. I can only assume you take out your frustration on the internet because you always get the shit kicked out of you face-to-face.

****.

vanguard has everything linked up through a gui. u cant see whats going on, so how is your dumb ass supposed learn the workings and move onto a decent synth u can progam on your own, instead of using presets on an interface. pish.

news flash: you can program vanguard. news flash: "decent" synths (?) come with presets too.

its all automated shit like the trance gate.

its like multiple choice. choose from all the options and it does the rest. other synths arent as preset like this

quote:

Originally posted by jey at first i used fl but found it dull ! reason 2.5 i loved but because u cant use vst's in it moved to cubase sx an have never looked back... to be honest i found fl hard to find my way round but found reason and cubase very easy !!

Haha!! I found the exact opposite... weird. I thought reason was extremely complicated this first few times I started using it. Though, to be fair, I didn't quite understand MIDI basics at the time, so I really had no effin clue what was going on or how to produce sounds. With FL, I just had to open a few channels and start clicking around, and boom, I had a very pathetic repeating song - but I actually had something, unlike my attempts with reason.

I have yet to try out cubase, but hopefully with some of the knowledge I've gained, I'll be able to transition easily.

quote:

Originally posted by rubez its all automated shit like the trance gate. its like multiple choice. choose from all the options and it does the rest. other synths arent as preset like this

And lastly... rubez, just make things simple and remember the phrase:

To each his own.

No need to rock the boat, especially if you're making broad generalizations.

quote:

Originally posted by rubez ****. vanguard has everything linked up through a gui. u cant see whats going on, so how is your dumb ass supposed learn the workings and move onto a decent synth u can progam on your own, instead of using presets on an interface. pish.

Your not making sense.

The fact it has a GUI helps you learn whats going on. The whole point of a good synth is to have all controls available on the front of a synth not hidden behind menus. Thats why analogue style interfaces are so popular. My basstation has only a few controls and rips the fuk outta most vsti around. TB303 is absolute solid gold classic. Some of Moogs too like the Source or Rougue as simple but effective beasts.

The keys to using Vanguard is the range of options available in the OSC section. As it carries a far wider selection of OSc's than most synths.

And the fact it has a gate bothers you? What about the arp then as most synths have these?

quote:

Originally posted by rubez its all automated shit like the trance gate. its like multiple choice. choose from all the options and it does the rest. other synths arent as preset like this

Extra features you can bypass do not limit the possibilities. Some very effective synths are very simple to use and have few controls, as FJ states.

it bothers me that u can load vanguard up, press play on your sequencer and u almost get a full on ready made synth.

everything else ive used u need to manipulate it a lot more to get decent results and at least u can actually see the waveform shape so it gives u a better understanding of the whole thing

Vanguard was designed for use by ppl making dance music and tbh trance and hard dance. So obviously the presets were all made to be suitable

I wouldnt really use it as a main synth but I like to layer it with another synth for leads and stuff. Although I made an awesome 303 that sounded alot like the one in DJ Misjah & DJ Tim - Access

Can make some good psy noises too!

ascess is bangin.

i dont like the new school sounds of vanguard synths. too clean

quote:

[i][b]DJ Misjah & DJ Tim - Access

Love that track. We blew out the monitors in the DJ booth one time with this track. Oops!

you only think vanguard is easiest because it comes with vengeance patches by default, i think virus are the only other synth to have manuel programming patchings for their default banks.. if you had some vengeance banks for other synths you would realise it's that easy to get a 'full on ready synth' with any synth even vsti, getting an original sound on the hand.. difficult.

quote:

Originally posted by rubez it bothers me that u can load vanguard up, press play on your sequencer and u almost get a full on ready made synth.

Just because you can do that doesn't mean you have to. You really don't make any sense.

I don't have Vanguard, but I do have many others. I sometimes use presets; I sometimes create my own sounds. Who cares if you use a synth with a good preset vs. one you make yourself. Those presets in many synths are created by professional sound engineers. If it sounds good, use it. So, if Vanguard has many good sounding presets, it shouldn't matter - its really about how you apply it to your production that ultimately matters. Most synths, even ROMplers allow some manipulation of their presets - filters, reverb, echo, etc....

I have the Virus TI, and here lately, I have been finding myself just tweaking the presets. Admittedly, I do need to sit down and learn to program it from scratch.

Rubez, just a few words...please be careful how you approach things in this forum. You are swimming in a river full of piranha. Many of the guys here have tons of experience; it would be wise to sit back and learn from them instead of argue with them. It's very easy to taint yourself here.

Adam

All software is is just 0's and 1's arranged in a different order.

I tend to find free plug-ins a lot more convenient and efficient and better sounding than things that cost hundreds of bucks.

As for FL, lets just say people can make better music on that than the most professionals can on software that is much more expensive such as Logic and Cubase. I don't stress this enough but I'm sure a handful of you know this. It doesn't matter if you use free vst's or if you use software that costs hundreds of dollars, it matters how you use it.

quote:

Originally posted by jupiterone It doesn't matter if you use free vst's or if you use software that costs hundreds of dollars, it matters how you use it.

I don't know. I think this argument only goes so far. Yes, it does matter how you use it, but given the same individual with the same capabilities, I feel their productions will sound better with more expensive software only because that software USUALLY (not in all circumstances) yields better source sounds.

Take the same song and have the same person use free software on one version and expensive software on the other. I would expect the song done with the expensive software to sound better.

Re: Re: Re: sound build up

quote:

Originally posted by rubez i said vanguard was toss and a toy, stupid ****

With the greatest respect in the world, you have no right to SAY anything related to EDM production as you clearly don't have the relevant experience or prior knowldege to substanciate you're statement.

You can however (begrudgingly!)give an opinion (which 99 percent of people will probably disagree with!). Bear in mind, you're making outrageously general sweeping comments about something you don't (comparitively) have a clue about. The purpose of an argument is not to see who comes out on top, it's to learn something. You should take a step back and start reading (as i have for the last 4 years).

If you decide that you want to get serious eventually with production, believe me you're going to need all the advise you can get 'cos it's a very complex minefield so don't get up peoples noses soft ollies!!.

As far as Vanguard is concerned, i agree that it isn't the best Soft synth out there although it does have a distinct character and tone of it's own(surely a good thing!).

If i were you i'd grasp Vanguard (or the likes) with both hands because it is programable enough for someone of your status and if you can't be assed, there should be a preset for you to manipulate straight from the box.

How you can say that this doesn't give you programing options is beyond me. From what i can recall, it has one of the biggest choice of pre-drawn waves to choose from, of which you can layer (is it 3 or) 4 Oscillators.

What more do you want?

its only 3 oscillators

im using albino that has 4 oscillators. it took a while to make a decent synth but is worth it. feels like u learn more using this as it shows u the actual waves and what happens when u change/manipulate them, even if i dont fully understand everything, u take information in by observing. with vanguard u cant see much its all hidden behind the gui.

Even though I don't like vanguard, it's probably the most simple and thought through design I've seen. It's straight on obvious, clean and simple. imo.

i dont like how you have to assign the envelopes to volume and filter, instead of having dedicated volume env and filter envs, but it does allow you to do more with the envelopes i guess..

and while albino may have 4 oscs i bet vanguard has way more osc types.

quote:

Originally posted by David Adams I don't know. I think this argument only goes so far. Yes, it does matter how you use it, but given the same individual with the same capabilities, I feel their productions will sound better with more expensive software only because that software USUALLY (not in all circumstances) yields better source sounds. Take the same song and have the same person use free software on one version and expensive software on the other. I would expect the song done with the expensive software to sound better.

That may be true if you randomly choose the software. But if it was the best freeware vs the best commercial software, it would be 50/50.

Ok, I hate to do this but I have to jump in on this thread... for one rubez Your an Noob, with a bit of an ego problem. First of all I respect that fact that you want to learn production, but I don't respect the way your going about learning. Its little punks like you that come on to the scene and want everything handed to you so you dont have to do some of the work that has taken some of 5 to 6 years to accomplish. I dont post on here much to stay out of the drama and 9 times out of 10 im always in the studio working on tracks. I may just be sitting around twiddling with knobs on my JP 8080 or flipping thru presets and tweaking from there. The point is I started out in Reason and moved to FL studios and finally wound up in Logic Pro. You know what there is one synth I started with I wish i still had to do because of its unique sound and that would be Vanguard. Im close friends with alot of producers in the industry and we do share ideas and thoughts more then once a day and your going to have your on and off views about This VSTI or that Program but the thing is it all boils down to the person using the equipment not the equipment its self... Hell I made my first track that got signed lol using MTV Music Generator on the Playstation if anyone rembers that :P.. So dont be dissing something just because it seems simple,,, remember sometimes something so simple is something mamoth......

To awsner your question, your question there are many ways you can achive this effect in production... You can use a Hi Pass filter, Low Pass Filter, Automate the low end EQ Cutt off of your bass, record changes on the insturment its self make the notes get shorter and shorter till the bass kicks back in full time. Automate the Velocity.. The key is just play around with crap and youll find what you are looking for...

Thanks,
DJ Wes Johnson

I <3 TA

quote:

Originally posted by Centra Spike That may be true if you randomly choose the software. But if it was the best freeware vs the best commercial software, it would be 50/50.

I don't agree, but that is fine. No big deal. It would be hard to prove either way. It's just one opinion against another.

Take care,
Adam

quote:

Originally posted by rubez its only 3 oscillators

i dont see what the problem is with 3 osc

vstations has 3

pro53 has 2...(im pretty sure...have never really used it)

quote:

Originally posted by ASFSE i dont see what the problem is with 3 osc vstations has 3 pro53 has 2...(im pretty sure...have never really used it)

There isn't a problem with 3. Rubez in his infinite wisdom just assumes that its better to have a synth with 4 oscillators than one with 3. I've just bought a virus ti. It only has 3 oscillators....maybe I should sell it and get albino..?

maybe u should try demos before spending money on potential shit.

albino is the best looking synth with a good amount of options, not too simple not too complicated, which i find all the other synths

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