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Thankfully it was the most cack-handed laughable attempt possible in Glasgow. Wonder if they were shreiking "ow-ahhh" rather than "allah" when they managed to set themselfs on fire and... broke a few windows... br-fucking-vo. Hope the 'true voices of god' or whatever the terrorist leaders call themselfs convince more of them to burn themselfs near to death.

But if you ask me I recon a bunch of friends (home grown 2nd gerneration) in (or around) Glasgow just desided amoung themself to do it. No internet links, no communications just a group of friends. Hence harder to detect.

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Originally posted by metalgearsolid Yeah too bad the bombs didn't explode. If it were the US chances are the attacks would have happened. But I did want to see some dead english.

Here I am, on a break, just looking for more info from other TAs about this bomb, and I read this comment.

I'm sick and tired of this already, metalgearsolid. I'm banning you now, and I'm not going to ask anyone to have your suspension lifted. Ever.

I've seen you hating enough people on this board, being full of prejudice against pretty much every bloody nation or ethnic group on Earth, and I'm yet to see some real contribution of any sort. Don't bother pm'ing me either, I can't be arsed to argue with you after all the warnings I've given you ever since I became a mod.

Now, please, go get a life.

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley Come back when you can spell "favourite" you retard! And btw, when people think like you, that ALL Muslims are terrorists and should be treated accordingly, then YOU make it into an us vs them war. But why should anyone listen to you? You've admitted your a racist so why should your views have any sway over anyone else? In fact, you've never once given your opinion on how to deal with this threat, all you do is write about how you hate Muslims...you're no better than the scum that commit these acts of violence...

Still upset over the fact that your limey spelling didn't catch on? Well, it's a f*cking shame, really.

and as far as me not being any better than them, i hope you think long and hard about that assesment next time the bomb is planted up your ass. Hope it's just you and bunch of your towel-headed camel jockey friends riding that bus when the bomb goes off. While it won't help their cause much, I know I'd be happy.

Meanwhile, f*ck off, ya annoying (unt. F*cking tired and bored of you, ya jizz rag.

quote:

Originally posted by emc^2 Still upset over the fact that your limey spelling didn't catch on? Well, it's a f*cking shame, really. and as far as me not being any better than them, i hope you think long and hard about that assesment next time the bomb is planted up your ass. Hope it's just you and bunch of your towel-headed camel jockey friends riding that bus when the bomb goes off. While it won't help their cause much, I know I'd be happy. Meanwhile, f*ck off, ya annoying (unt. F*cking tired and bored of you, ya jizz rag.

you have a real way with words

emc^2 - suspended

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley In fact, you've never once given your opinion on how to deal with this threat, all you do is write about how you hate Muslims...you're no better than the scum that commit these acts of violence...

very true

(ps. i wouldn�t put this attempted bombing past mossad )

Thank you Neo and Lira.

Could we all please try and stick to the topic a little better, and do away with the bullshit personal insults? It's tedious as hell.


Added in Edit: Back on topic. Hmmm, strange that another "bin Laden determined to strike the United States" memo seemingly turns up after the fact:

quote:

As ABCNews.com reported, U.S. law enforcement officials received intelligence reports two weeks ago warning of terror attacks in Glasgow and Prague, the Czech Republic, against "airport infrastructure and aircraft." The warnings apparently never reached officials in Scotland, who said this weekend they had received "no advance intelligence" that Glasgow might be a target. Homeland Security Secretary Chertoff declined to comment specifically on the report today, but said "everything that we get is shared virtually instantaneously with our counterparts in Britain and vice versa." http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=nation_world&id=5440551

Glad we're so on top of it.......

Hero!!

Besides needing a translator, for god sakes you people invented the focking language this guy is being heralded as a hero. They even have a fund for him at the airport bar to buy him beers! ha ha
in the time of action, this baggage handler stepped up to the plate and took action against the cowardly dogs that tried to do him and the people harm...
cheers !!!

quote:

As thousands of Glaswegians queued, moaned and sneakily sipped Buckfast on a rainy Saturday afternoon, one man stood vigilant outside the airport terminal. Baggage supervisor, hero, smoker. John Smeaton. Little did he know, as he happily dragged on his fag, that two crazed al-Qaeda operatives were preparing to meet their maker. But they didn�t meet their maker. Instead they met BAA�s answer to Jack Bauer. As the Jeep�s engine revved and the passenger started chucking the petrol containers out the windows like he was Santa in Shettleston, one man stepped in to help The Law take control. Those hapless al-Qaeda boys were to find out that Glasgow has no respect for international terrorism. Nobody gets between 10,000 Weegies and a �99 week in Ibiza booked on Thursday night through Barrhead Travel. And most of all, no-one messes with The Polis. Not in this town. That�s right Osama, this is how we do things in Raintown. This ain�t London. There�s no stiff English upper lip here, no WAGs. And it sure ain�t Edinburgh - they�d all be hiding in Harvey Nicks and hysterically babbling about their Tuscan villas. There�s no �Big J� in Edinburgh airport, there�s no �Smeato� at Heathrow. Here we take the law into our own hands. And feet. He�s Shouting Allah - Allah Smeato Censored? The clips above are rare footage hunted down from ITN�s late Saturday night news. That�s right. For a few crazy hours, the English media went a bit mad and let our very own Braveheart rule the airwaves. When the camera cut back to the studio, you could see them blinking and wondering just what language it was they had just heard. But what happened in Big J�s later interviews? The later CNN interview shows a more caring side to the one-man anti-terrorism unit. Or is it something more sinister? CNN Interview Now the �big boy� is only getting �subdued�. Or has Smeato�s stream of consciousness been censored? Big Media don�t want you to know that the public are getting involved. The Polis don�t want you to know that without Big J, it could have been curtains. This is one of the many mysteries that we want to get to The Truth of with on our Holiday Inn night out with John. BBC News grabbed Big J too. Hear him talk about the famous gas canister on a bonfire analogy as he demonstrates the intensity of the fire. BBC Interview Blitz Spirit Here�s to John. This man shows us that the law-abiding, honest, brave citizen is still very much with us. Here�s to his heroism, his straightforward belief in right and wrong, his support for Law and Order, and his willingness to give a good kicking to someone richly deserving it. Do you know John? Help us find him Want to buy him a pint? Donate here Read commentsCLICK HERE TO DONATE A PINT!!! >>SOURCE<<

lol, Lira and Neo have both gone way up in my books!

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British Muslims offer help in bombs probe by Lachlan Carmichael Mon Jul 2, 10:04 AM ET LONDON (AFP) - British Muslim leaders urged their communities Monday to help fight extremism after three failed car bombings, amid signs that the new government may be better able to win over their "hearts and minds." ADVERTISEMENT Prime Minister Gordon Brown has argued that cooperation from Britain's estimated 1.6 million Muslims is key to defeating the threat from Islamist militants at home and abroad. Ghayasuddin Siddiqui, head of the Muslim Parliament of Britain, urged Muslims to support the government and security services, saying "all the evidence suggests" the three failed attacks were carried out by Islamists. He assured the "government of his support against the forces of anarchy and extremism and called upon the Muslim community to help uproot extremism" in its midst. The British Muslim Initiative (BMI), a lobby group which promotes Muslim participation in public life, echoed the remarks. "Whoever was responsible for planting the devices clearly intended to cause maximum damage and loss of innocent lives.... We urge all British Muslims to fully cooperate with the authorities to apprehend and bring to justice the perpetrators," the BMI said. Siddiqui said he hoped it would be easier to cooperate with the Brown government than with that of his predecessor Tony Blair. "I think there is a distinct difference" between the two governments in reacting to extremist threats, he said. The responses so far from "Gordon Brown and his home secretary (Jaqui Smith) are more measured that we would have expected from Tony Blair," he said without elaborating. The Guardian newspaper said Brown shunned the "politics of fear" with his sober responses to the threat, while Blair was more impulsive when he announced "the rules of the game" had changed after the July 2005 bombings on London transport. Brown's spokesman said Monday that the government has been keeping in touch with Muslim organisations, though not the prime minister himself. "As we urge vigilance on the public, as we increase the security levels, we also have to ensure that we need to do more to win hearts and minds across all communities. "We are in constant contact with all of those affected by the London incident." On Sunday, Hazel Blears, whom Brown appointed as the communities secretary, spoke to a Muslim conference at Ghamgol Sharif Mosque in Birmingham as part of the government's efforts to win the "hearts and minds" of British Muslims. "I pledge today that the government will work with people in every community working to tackle violent extremism and terrorism," she said. Mohammed Sarwar, a member of the governing Labour Party and Britain's first Muslim member of parliament, told a Glasgow mosque gathering at the weekend: "We should be together against those who want to divide us." Daud Abdullah, deputy secretary general of the Muslim Council of Britain, said there was "a sense of relief" at news reports that those arrested in connection with the failed attacks were allegedly citizens of Middle Eastern countries. The shock of the July 7, 2005 suicide bombings, which killed 56 people and injured 700 others in London, was compounded when Britons discovered that the four bombers were British citizens. However, he suggested government appeals for help were misdirected, saying the Muslim communities did not have the same resources as the government. "Let's not make unreasonable demands on the community," Abdullah said. "People have been engaged, trying to come up for solutions, for creative ideas to deal with this problem. Muslims have not been sitting back in a state of apathy. They are as much victims as anyone else," he said. He said that Brown seems to be saying the right things by stressing not just security but also winning support and cooperation. "If you want the help of the community, as it is being demanded, then you win that trust, by not alienating them," he said. >>SOURCE<<

could this be the start of Muslims starting to take back their religion from the pigs that have hijacked it in the name of Allah?? Let us wait to see what takes hold..........

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Originally posted by LazFX could this be the start of Muslims starting to take back their religion from the pigs that have hijacked it in the name of Allah?? Let us wait to see what takes hold..........

These individuals and organisations say the same after every incident because if they don't everyone wants to know why every Muslim in the country isn't speaking out against Islamic extremism. It obviously hasn't had much effect in the past and I doubt it will make any difference now

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Originally posted by George Smiley These individuals and organisations say the same after every incident because if they don't everyone wants to know why every Muslim in the country isn't speaking out against Islamic extremism. It obviously hasn't had much effect in the past and I doubt it will make any difference now

so what you are saying that UK Muslims are just white washing their religion as it pertains to the present atrocities against civilized society? Are these groups just speaking out in vain cause the UK Muslim approves of such actions??

Man!! Two of the best contributers and intelligent posters banned in one thread in one day.. thats sad.

I just want to say is that metalgear and emc you both will be missed and remembered by many of us. You have left legacy behind, which will always be with us and will show path to these other nerds in here for real freedom.

God bless you all.

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Originally posted by Purple Man!! Two of the best contributers and intelligent posters banned in one thread in one day.. thats sad. I just want to say is that metalgear and emc you both will be missed and remembered by many of us. You have left legacy behind, which will always be with us and will show path to these other nerds in here for real freedom. God bless you all.

and you are next....

those two just got caught up in the heat of the moment, well at least EMC, metalgear is another story...

It is safe to say that Purple is nothing more than a tr0ll. His posts invariably rub you the wrong way. And he seems to do that on purpose.

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Originally posted by Omega_M It is safe to say that Purple is nothing more than a tr0ll. His posts invariably rub you the wrong way.

ya you are right and with that... ignore I shall

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Originally posted by LazFX so what you are saying that UK Muslims are just white washing their religion as it pertains to the present atrocities against civilized society? Are these groups just speaking out in vain cause the UK Muslim approves of such actions??

Not so much even that, see the problem is in England the civil libertarians who keep wandering around gormlessly in their P-C wonderland without their feet ever touching the ground while happy fairy's will sprinkle magical peace over the whole country the next morning and convince everyone that it's all apples.
The reality is that there are islamist movements who are actively seeking to destroy the west and all we get from the moderate muslims is lip service and the vast majority of muslim leaders decline to denounce attacks on western countries. The people that do these attacks rarely have a political motivation which is where it sometimes seems focused, they do it because it's a secular or religious ideology which makes them want to do it.
They don't care what the foreign policy is.
They certainly don't care about anything happening in Iraq, Palestine, Afghanistan, Pakistan or Saudi Arabia in so much as it has nothing to do with their day to day lives living where they are.

Shmuel Bar-
Islamism is not a
"consequence of political and socioeconomic factors alone"
"the centrality of the religious culture that allows it to flourish"
Is because Islamic leaders keep issuing fatwa's on the west.
He's an interesting person but I'm not so sure about all his writing, it's a pretty heavy read and he tends to waffle.
But, unlike the civil libertarians, at least he's looking at the source of the problem rather than denying the existence of a religious war against the west.
Libertarians and islamists alike will hate the guy

In some ways it reminded me of the same set of libertarians and pacifists prior to WW2 who where in denial about other forms of fascism which where moving to seek the destruction of that temporary bit of democracy and liberty after WW1.
All in all though it probably gets more of a focus than it deserves at this point, you'll get maybe a 1000 people a year die globally from terrorist attacks and we'll get how many that die from car accidents and heart disease? So in a sense the libertarians and pacifists are right, a personal threat to your own safety is unlikely, but it would be completely ignorant to consider the threat from radical muslims as being nothing more than lip service either.

quote:

Originally posted by Omega_M It is safe to say that Purple is nothing more than a tr0ll. His posts invariably rub you the wrong way. And he seems to do that on purpose.

Nah, he was just never loved as a child.

quote:

Originally posted by LazFX so what you are saying that UK Muslims are just white washing their religion as it pertains to the present atrocities against civilized society? Are these groups just speaking out in vain cause the UK Muslim approves of such actions??

No the UK Muslim population certainly does not approve such actions. It is a tiny fraction. But my point is, why should all the UK's Muslims condemn these attacks? They didn't do it or agree with it. The vast majority of people in this country don't care about politics. They just wanna keep their head down, do their 9-5 job and enjoy themselves at the weekend. Everyone on here is politically minded or we wouldn't be here, but we are not representative of any of our nationalities in that respect. UK Muslims are no different to the rest of the British. And just because some Muslim commits a bad deed it does not mean it is representative of the entire Muslim population. Every single Christian in the world doesn't condemn when a Christian does a bad deed, and when a crime is committed in a community every single person in that community does not come out and hunt the criminal down.

Basically, UK Muslims are pretty much the same as the rest of the British and therefore we should expect any more, or any less from them. They are probably more religious by proportion to the Christians but this is quickly changing as the generations go by (the Muslim youth is probably not much more religious than the White youth).

However, Muslim leaders should speak out but I'm not sure how much influence they have over the extremists hence me saying earlier I don't think it will change much.

When we come across these British Muslim extremists, we seem to fall into the trap of believing that the Muslim community can help oust them, but the fact is, whilst ever we align ourselves with American Middle East policy these characters will just keep popping up.

(Not that I am blaming their radicalism on America or the UK, but their foreign policy is a contributing factor and must be part of the solution, if our governments really care about a solution...)

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Originally posted by George Smiley When we come across these British Muslim extremists, we seem to fall into the trap of believing that the Muslim community can help oust them, but the fact is, whilst ever we align ourselves with American Middle East policy these characters will just keep popping up. (Not that I am blaming their radicalism on America or the UK, but their foreign policy is a contributing factor and must be part of the solution, if our governments really care about a solution...)

They aren't political.
If they where political, they'd be doing what the IRA, PLO and other groups would do in the past, which is to issue demands, warnings and then blow something up with a bit of property damage and minimum danger to human life.
Political groups realise it's really not in their best interests to be killing people who might listen, scare them, make a bang and fuss which will get some press for the message to be said, but that's it.
This, is theological.
What that theological message being sent is that it's good to kill westerners and non-muslim countrymen, women and their kids as a way of establishing Sharia law where they live because the liberal, democratic process of law is an antithesis to that as much as fascism is.

And sadly for the UK, they're just not very fussy about who lives there and who will not cause this kind of activity. They've made this nice long line about not pressuring minority groups to conform to existing standards in-country when they move there as it's seen to be politically incorrect. Fair enough I suppose, but there's a limit that line should be extended too, otherwise they're going use it to their advantage, to loop it over your head, kick out the chair and leave you twitching from it because it's the perfect weapon to use against pacifists and moderates.
Their cultural norm to be accepting of anything based on the fact it's wrong to pressure people to assimilate as they respect their beliefs, all this falls down as we've seen when the politically correct pacifists make these to protect the minorities from extreme vilification. Rather than doing what they should as part of the democratic process where the majority has the say to make the laws as they see fit to conform to their existing cultural norm.

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Originally posted by Lilith They aren't political. If they where political, they'd be doing what the IRA, PLO and other groups would do in the past, which is to issue demands, warnings and then blow something up with a bit of property damage and minimum danger to human life. Political groups realise it's really not in their best interests to be killing people who might listen, scare them, make a bang and fuss which will get some press for the message to be said, but that's it. This, is theological. What that theological message being sent is that it's good to kill westerners and non-muslim countrymen, women and their kids as a way of establishing Sharia law where they live because the liberal, democratic process of law is an antithesis to that as much as fascism is.

That your expert opinion on every form of terrorism there's ever been is it?! Well it's wrong. It is political, it is as political as any other form of terrorism (in fact, very rarely is terrorism committed for any other reason).

The aim of these British-terrorists is to change British foreign policy in the Middle East, and yes, killing as many people is one way they think will achieve that aim. In their minds, if enough people die, and if enough British begin to blame UK Foreign Policy for the deaths instead of the terrorists and the effect is the government pulls out of Iraq for example, then that is highly political.

Of course they are also theological. But there is no difference when it comes to terrorism between theology and ideology. Both are motivating forces and all the other terrorist groups you mentioned above were used ideology to motivate their troops to achieve their political aims.

quote:

And sadly for the UK, they're just not very fussy about who lives there and who will not cause this kind of activity. They've made this nice long line about not pressuring minority groups to conform to existing standards in-country when they move there as it's seen to be politically incorrect. Fair enough I suppose, but there's a limit that line should be extended too, otherwise they're going use it to their advantage, to loop it over your head, kick out the chair and leave you twitching from it because it's the perfect weapon to use against pacifists and moderates. Their cultural norm to be accepting of anything based on the fact it's wrong to pressure people to assimilate as they respect their beliefs, all this falls down as we've seen when the politically correct pacifists make these to protect the minorities from extreme vilification. Rather than doing what they should as part of the democratic process where the majority has the say to make the laws as they see fit to conform to their existing cultural norm.

Oh go on then, how do we force people to become more "British"?

Oh come on, you must see some of the muslim communities in the UK becoming more insular and less inclined to interact with the rest of the country? I mean even on a micro level my little cousin in Derby tells me that she can't have some of her friends at school come over because she's not a muslim, because their parent's wont let them.

These attacks when Brown takes the reins and distances the UK from the US middle east activity, they're not going to stop when we pull all the troops out and even now, when we are pulling troops out, they're still running bombs in. Not on politicians, not on army bases or government buildings or part of the military infrastructure.
They blow up public transport which is full of the public!

They don't say as their final words "free my _____ in _____"
They say, "God is great" pull the trigger and murder people without warning or notice.
Make no mistake, it's about god and its most definitely about a theological mindset which tells them to love death and causing death because they'll go to heaven killing westerners

quote:

Oh go on then, how do we force people to become more "British"?

A start might be convincing them that they have a legal right to vote, not a carte-blanc right to kill as a first alternative...
I might not have a piece of published paper to deem me an 'expert' but most likely neither do you.

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Originally posted by Lilith Oh come on, you must see some of the muslim communities in the UK becoming more insular and less inclined to interact with the rest of the country? I mean even on a micro level my little cousin in Derby tells me that she can't have some of her friends at school come over because she's not a muslim, because their parent's wont let them.

Yes I see them, but I don't see what you want the UK to do about them? All I see on TA is people making observations and offering no solutions. What do YOU think the UK should do to tackle this problem?

quote:

These attacks when Brown takes the reins and distances the UK from the US middle east activity, they're not going to stop when we pull all the troops out and even now, when we are pulling troops out, they're still running bombs in. Not on politicians, not on army bases or government buildings or part of the military infrastructure. They blow up public transport which is full of the public!

Yes it is a classic terror tactic used by every terrorist group I can think of. How strange that these terrorists use the same tactic of killing innocent people! And don't kid yourself about Brown "distancing" himself from Blair's foreign policy. It's not changed. We had already began moving troops out of Iraq and we had already planned for more. These attacks probably were planned to coincide with Brown's 'crowning' but if nobody, including the terrorists, think Brown's foreign policy has changed then I don't see how you can make the assumption that we would be bombed anyway "coz they hate us, innit"

Tell me how often the UK was attacked by home-grown suicide bombers following the 2nd Gulf War in 1990/91?

quote:

They don't say as their final words "free my _____ in _____" They say, "God is great" pull the trigger and murder people without warning or notice. Make no mistake, it's about god and its most definitely about a theological mindset which tells them to love death and causing death because they'll go to heaven killing westerners

Not quite sure what that mumbling in the first sentence was supposed to mean but you seem to be suggesting that these terrorists only have theological motivations for mounting these attacks, and no political motivation - is that what you think?

quote:

A start might be convincing them that they have a legal right to vote, not a carte-blanc right to kill as a first alternative...

Ah yes, I can just see Gordon Brown addressing the nation now: "Muslims of Britain, I bring you a message, you do not have the right to kill innocent white people in this country, instead you are supposed to VOTE to make a difference"

Or do you think that's just bullshit Les?

quote:

I might not have a piece of published paper to deem me an 'expert' but most likely neither do you.

I'm not claiming to be an expert, I just take exception when people make authoritive statements that I know for a fact is wrong, like the one you made about these terrorists having no political motivation.

For what its worth...
Why can't they just integrate with the rest of the UK without fuss?
It's not like the place isn't entirely un-accepting of outsiders, the Indian's, Italians, Greeks and many others who come from non-english speaking backgrounds are very much a part of the society and have enriched it with their presence.
So why haven't those from Islamic backgrounds done the same?
All they've done is retreat into secular communities which haven't exactly helped their public image when a small amount of their members of those openly pursue vendettas from the country they came from. I mean really, if you can't tolerate the country you migrate too, then it doesn't make sense to actually go there in the first place and even less sense to continue that line of social intolerance once you get there!

Don't force the tolerant, majority of society to bend to the whims of the marginal minority which chooses to be intolerant.
I will not, ever give up my moderate, democratic legal right to dress, do and behave as I am accorded within that countries normal behaviour, just on the off chance it offends some damn minority group. But the crying libertarians keep ignoring the fact that it's not just a case of feeling politically or socially isolated or marginalised which is causing this behaviour.
Its murder
Plain and simple murder under religious decree.

These are not classic terrorist attacks at all in the UK, during the 80s and 90's the IRA launched a lot of attacks at the UK and their civilian deaths over 25 years are statistically about the same as the damage which has happened since 2000-present.
Back then there where about 3.5mil with a small minority of angry Irish who didn't like the English government either, today the same form of intimidation and murder is being conducted by a little less than 2mil of the small minority of angry Muslims who do the same.
You can paint it anyway you want with technique, but these actual attacks only have secondary cause to terror and primarily designed to kill people.
Even the IRA had the gall to lob mortars into Downing street...

They are not a completely political motivation is what I think and they are firmly supported by the religious theocracy which endorses the killing of westerners.
Actual condemnation of this behaviour is at best very quiet on the eastern front, why isn't there a groundswell of condemnation from the Islamic clergy?

quote:

Ah yes, I can just see Gordon Brown addressing the nation now: "Muslims of Britain, I bring you a message, you do not have the right to kill innocent white people in this country, instead you are supposed to VOTE to make a difference"

As someone who's not white, I'd like the address to include people of non-white heritage as well.
But I mean really, even my rather marginal status for personal-social choice of lifestyle, rather than cultural background which I can't do much about, is not grotesquely offended enough to the point where I must feel I have to pick up a rifle again and start blazing away to defend my civil liberties. Much less if I decided to move back to the UK
When I can, I vote and I certainly don't seem to have suffered overly much socially or economically at the hands of the evil christian white people which always seem to end up in charge of the show. I might not like the extreme chrisitian white minority much either, but I've not reached the point where I've had to kill any.
That however, I could unequivocally kiss goodbye in any country I lived in which was under majority Islamic law.

I take exception when my civil rights and otherwise moderate 'don't bother anyone' status is impinged upon by people who come from a minority following religious dogma handed down to them when they could quite easily be a part of the social landscape. But instead, face the prospect of having civil liberties curtailed because of angry young men being told by stupid old men, who are too stupid and intolerant to accept the fact that it's ok to be different in the west and you don't really need to start killing people wholesale just to get the point across they don't like our politicians, religions and behaviour being different to their own.

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