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-- Bear with me...the art of mixing?
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quote:

Originally posted by Clovis Yeah I see what you're saying. I think another thing about it that is so cool is that everyone has their own very peculiar way of approaching it and thinking about it. At least it seems so about people who invest a lot of time & energy into it.

I definitely agree with all of this - I guess I've just become so tired of the standard "It's all about the journey, man" bullshit that I've heard for years from both the EDM raver kids and the epic jamband set that anything sounding remotely like the above statement instantly fucks me off.

At the end of the day I guess my only point is that rather than trying to nail down a definition of the "art of mixing" I think what people would be better suited to focus on is just whatever it is about deejaying that makes it fun for them, because just what that is won't be the same for any two jocks who really love what they do.

If you look at guys like Howells, Garnier, Vath, Burridge, Blake Jarrell, Max Graham, et al., you'll most likely find that they play and mix in vastly different ways - and other than the fact that some of them play somewhat similar tunes (you could easily throw jocks from other genres in there - just writing this quickly before bed), the only real common thread between them is just how much fucking fun it looks like they're having when they play.

I don't care if Blake tells me he's going to build Unicorn symphony where he throws the radio in the tub when a track hits that magic note or Garnier plays an hour of drum & tech-house with hints of detroit acid in the middle of a full on techno set while mixing in some godforsaken way I'll never understand anyway - the only thing I can always relate to is how much they enjoy themselves.

Is RJT the new Spirit5 too?



Only time will tell.

I think you're about 2,000 words and 40 repetitions short.

quote:

Originally posted by RJT I don't care if Blake tells me he's going to build Unicorn symphony where he throws the radio in the tub when a track hits that magic note

i do. damnit, that's my whole reason for living.

Forget this mixing in key nonsense...more often than not the "right" track to play next isn't going to be in the same key. Just play tunes that get the girls dancing and the guys will follow.

quote:

Originally posted by Blake_Jarrell Forget this mixing in key nonsense...more often than not the "right" track to play next isn't going to be in the same key. Just play tunes that get the girls dancing and the guys will follow.

and if the girls don't dance then they're fucking skanks.

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec so here are some links to david mancuso sets: http://deephousepage.com/ search "david mancuso" here. there is a seven part loft party recording As far as Francois K goes, I can give you links, but it's really something you have to see live! (can't wait for the deep space party tonight) It doesn't exactly make sense outside that ideal little room. http://deepspacenyc.com/modules.php...wdownload&cid=1 these are links to live sets. check out some tracklists here: http://deepspacenyc.com/modules.php...ategories&cid=1

Thanks for the links! I know what I'll be listening to this week...

DJPat: "Learning" your tracks isn't as hard or time-consuming as you're making it out to be. The easiest thing you can do is to burn a CD of the tracks that you want to play out, and listen to it in the car, at work, etc. Make a mental note of where the breakdowns are, where the baseline comes in. How long do you have before the "meat" of the song starts? Even just listening to the songs to get familiar with them will help when you go to play them live.

Ted: They didn't dance to my set either (girls don't like Madonna?)

But they had a good time, and that's what counts.

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Promo and if the girls don't dance then they're fucking skanks.

No, if the girls dont dance, play Pantera

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Km8xIs24UeY

I think mixing in key is pretty appropriate for some styles of music/mixing - doesn't matter for all, but key clashes during mixes make me cringe hard.

There's more to mixing in key than simply avoiding clashes, though. If you play a track in the right key after the previous one, you can get that "go up a gear" key change, which can be very effective.

I use key info when I think I need it, with tracks that have heavy melody or constant notes, but more often than not I think it works to just go by instinct.

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec As far as Francois K goes, I can give you links, but it's really something you have to see live! (can't wait for the deep space party tonight) It doesn't exactly make sense outside that ideal little room.

I'm right in jersey and I think I may have to shoot up to the city on a monday night to see him, got me interested.

quote:

Originally posted by RJT At the end of the day I guess my only point is that rather than trying to nail down a definition of the "art of mixing" I think what people would be better suited to focus on is just whatever it is about deejaying that makes it fun for them, because just what that is won't be the same for any two jocks who really love what they do. If you look at guys like Howells, Garnier, Vath, Burridge, Blake Jarrell, Max Graham, et al., you'll most likely find that they play and mix in vastly different ways - and other than the fact that some of them play somewhat similar tunes (you could easily throw jocks from other genres in there - just writing this quickly before bed), the only real common thread between them is just how much fucking fun it looks like they're having when they play.

Its funny you should say this because my thoughts on this subject at the beginning of this thread were exactly that, looking for a so called definition. I see now, though, after all these responses that its, as you said, not about that.

Seeing the "art of mixing" explained in such a way as these posts, i think, is much better than finding the "definition". It forces me, in a good way, to think about what it is "I" want to do or see done. Thanks for all the input.

and please any more opinions are encouraged and welcome

when you know whats going on with your music... you dont think, you just feel

i agree with this allied nations statement above me, but i don't really like the way it's been said (it's seems pretentious and implies that if you think, then you 'don't know what's going on with your music'. why is everyone too cool to think?

when i'm behind the decks i leave all this stuff behind and just go on intuition. all the things i am writing now are just post-rationalization. if you think about this stuff while mixing, you're going to suck, bottom-line.


in any case i've got to quote one of my favorite passages ever from Hesse's Steppenwolf:

quote:

"Then what does it depend on?/On making music, Herr Haller, on making music as well and as much as possible, and with all the intensity of which one is capable. That is the point, Monsieur. Though I carried the complete works of Bach and Haydn in my head and could say the cleverest things about them, not a soul would be the better for it. But when I take hold of my mouthpiece and play a lively shimmy, whether the shimmy be good or bad, it will give people pleasure. It gets into their legs and into their blood. That's the point and that alone. Look at the faces in a dance hall at the moment when the music strikes up after a longish pause, how eyes sparkle, legs twitch and faces begin to laugh. That is why one makes music."

That is a good quote! Thats exactly why i want to mix. Nothing fascinates me more than playing the music i love to people who love it just as much, if not more, than i do.

I also find it sad when djs i really enjoy lose touch with their initial reasons for making music and, instead, focus on money or something similar. It starts a decline that few rarely get back from. I know we all have several in mind

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec i agree with this allied nations statement above me, but i don't really like the way it's been said (it's seems pretentious and implies that if you think, then you 'don't know what's going on with your music'. why is everyone too cool to think? when i'm behind the decks i leave all this stuff behind and just go on intuition. all the things i am writing now are just post-rationalization. if you think about this stuff while mixing, you're going to suck, bottom-line. in any case i've got to quote one of my favorite passages ever from Hesse's Steppenwolf:

its not that im saying not to think (well i am, sorta) its more like theres no confusion... no indecision... when you're really in the zone that is...


i'm not saying its like that all the time, but when im really in the zone and i feel like im playing the best it all just happens so fast and there's a much different control over the vibe. It doesnt happen everywhere... if there's a shit soundsystem or horrible monitors it makes it much more difficult to achieve, but when everything really comes together (and id say it either happens more often than not or not much at all for most djs) theres no thought process anymore... just that tunnel vision when picking songs and movement all around the space... dancing bodies are always the best indicator...

yeah yeah

definitely


i know exactly what you mean




effortlessness is always the mark of greatness




side note: i was actually considering writing a blog on the 'theory of deejaying'. not that i have any authority to do such a thing (it would remain anonymous), but after you go to enough parties and listen to enough sets you kind of start to notice things. on one hand i see this as fascinating, and on the other hand I see it as terribly distracting and counterproductive, detrimental to deejaying. there would be some musicology, some psychology, some music history, some criticism, some art history. it would probably consist of articles/musings, liveset criticism and commentary, interviews etc. i probably wouldn't do it myself either since i don't have a lot of time. would something like this be an indicator that dance music is dead?

thoughts? fascinating or a fucking joke?

All this reliance on knowing the exact key of every track you own is a bit OTT for me, I think once you have been DJing for years you just automatically pick records which don't clash sonically.

I agree that (dependant on various factors such as if your recording a mix / in a club etc) then sudden genres changes (tech-house to prog breaks for example), drop mixing or layering are all far more immersive and interesting for the listener / clubber than 'Oh, I have two tunes that only just came out and they are the same key!!!'.

Another annoyance of mine is every up and comer trying to play the latest tunes just for the sake of being 'upfront'. Why can't you play a track that in your opinion is better than what came out last week, just because it is 6,12, 24 months, or even 10 years old?

DJ is becoming more and more of a lost art, with not enough people really understanding its history and evolution. Buying CDJs or some mixing software plus this weeks releases off Beatport, then putting them in key order through software and recording that is not my idea of 'real' DJing at all. I guess I come from an era of crate digging, collection buying and vinyl hourding though... each to their own.

quote:

Originally posted by Allied Nations when you know whats going on with your music... you dont think, you just feel

Never a truer statement spoken, well done that man.

quote:

Originally posted by Kris G DJ is becoming more and more of a lost art, with not enough people really understanding its history and evolution. Buying CDJs or some mixing software plus this weeks releases off Beatport, then putting them in key order through software and recording that is not my idea of 'real' DJing at all. I guess I come from an era of crate digging, collection buying and vinyl hourding though... each to their own.

i know what you mean, but cdjs still allow for proper deejaying

there's no way I could afford to play vinyl with the way I buy music. I need at least 200 tracks before I feel like I have enough breadth and depth to make a new promo for instance

the quality and depth of my record selection is always my biggest self-criticism. it's what drives me to buy and buy until i have no money left


it's always about digging


one of the things that is crucial for me in a live set is that I am not familiar with the music. this makes it easy to get taken away by it, be surprised by it, commune with it. this doesnt' mean playing new music or unreleased material, but just things that you have to dig so deeply for no one else bothers

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec one of the things that is crucial for me in a live set is that I am not familiar with the music. this makes it easy to get taken away by it, be surprised by it, commune with it. this doesnt' mean playing new music or unreleased material, but just things that you have to dig so deeply for no one else bothers

I feel much the same. And I think that when it comes down to it, the wealth of a DJ is in the music he owns. Knowing how to put it together right is one thing, but usually that comes naturally when you have the music with which to do so...

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec i know what you mean, but cdjs still allow for proper deejaying there's no way I could afford to play vinyl with the way I buy music. I need at least 200 tracks before I feel like I have enough breadth and depth to make a new promo for instance the quality and depth of my record selection is always my biggest self-criticism. it's what drives me to buy and buy until i have no money left it's always about digging one of the things that is crucial for me in a live set is that I am not familiar with the music. this makes it easy to get taken away by it, be surprised by it, commune with it. this doesnt' mean playing new music or unreleased material, but just things that you have to dig so deeply for no one else bothers

You mis-understood me, sorry. I have nothing against CDJs or downloading, I am not a vinyl elitist, I buy WAVs now and use burnt CDs or Serato as its more cost effective. The point I was trying to convay was its much much easier now to get access to dance music, so the learning curve of finding tracks and therefore defining your sound has deminished.

Buying what Armin played last week on ASOT (or more likely two months ago) is not DJing, its copying. Of course their are die hard music hunters still around, but there are also many more wannabe's diluting the DJ scene.

If you are a music addict then it shows, unfortunately just in London alone I know too many 'DJs' who really only got into the music for the image, prestige, culture and women. Some people may rate them, fine, it's their life, but all my 'idol' DJs I respect I know have got into music through sheer passion.

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec side note: i was actually considering writing a blog on the 'theory of deejaying'. not that i have any authority to do such a thing (it would remain anonymous), but after you go to enough parties and listen to enough sets you kind of start to notice things. on one hand i see this as fascinating, and on the other hand I see it as terribly distracting and counterproductive, detrimental to deejaying. there would be some musicology, some psychology, some music history, some criticism, some art history. it would probably consist of articles/musings, liveset criticism and commentary, interviews etc. i probably wouldn't do it myself either since i don't have a lot of time. would something like this be an indicator that dance music is dead? thoughts? fascinating or a fucking joke?

Fascinating...This would be an indicator that some want to keep it alive. I dont think dance music will ever "die" though...its like anything else, popularity rises and falls, aboveground to underground depending where your at.

I know that when i meet someone from overseas at a club, they have a mentality towards the dj we're currently seeing that amazes me. I'll end spending the whole night with them talking, agreeing, disagreeing, or whatever. One that lives 10000 miles away, in a different country, and that i will never see again. End up apologizing to the ones u came with

Do you think that location can affect ones determination to become a dj? Like i live in sac, used to live in la, and my contact with the edm world is very small now. Gotta fo to san fran for a good time

Anyway, talking out my ass there. I think a blog would be a great idea. Give people like me a chance to see and learn about music and all of its sub categories that one might not have access to otherwise. I would like to help buuuut i think i would prove more useful reading them

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