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-- Geoengineering
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basically:


earth is being destroyed by powerful and unpredicatble machines

solution is - build an even more powerful, wildly unpredictable machine to UNDESTROY it!

quote:

Originally posted by tubularbills and if we don't deal with it, then BILLIONS of people are going to die, right? that's what the IPCC and Fox News are saying. i can really only care about this whole GC thing so much. because really, unless they make it illegal, i'm still going to drive my nissan frontier and get 18 miles to the gallon. fuck it. that, and i'm a severe weather nerd. weather is my thing. and i don't see how we can use modern day weather anomolies to predict long-term climatology. /just my beef

I'm going to refrain from engaging in any more of this discussion with you because there is no possible way it can go any further without me losing any respect I've still got for you.

quote:

Originally posted by RJT I'm going to refrain from engaging in any more of this discussion with you because there is no possible way it can go any further without me losing any respect I've still got for you.

+5

But this is where we are on the issue in America.


One day maybe people will see that it's about "environment" and not whether or not the sea level will rise in 25 years.

quote:

Originally posted by Clovis +5 But this is where we are on the issue in America. One day maybe people will see that it's about "environment" and not whether or not the sea level will rise in 25 years.

Hopefully before it is too late. I mean, it can't be any more obvious but look at some of the posts in this thread. People simply don't care.

quote:

Originally posted by tubularbills i'm still going to drive my nissan frontier and get 18 miles to the gallon. fuck it.

Thats actually decent mpg for a truck. I have a diesel & a gas truck. My diesel gets 15 mpg & gas gets about 12 mpg.

quote:

Originally posted by DOOMBOT Hopefully before it is too late. I mean, it can't be any more obvious but look at some of the posts in this thread. People simply don't care.

I think we'll just be able to keep arguing about what "too late" is, as the quality of our environment on earth continues to be degraded and destroyed by our recklessness, without ever having the chance to have real discussions on what we're doing to the earth without it turning into a "climate change" argument. Climate change, which has now become the forefront environmental issue to the detriment of all the rest of our destructive impact on this planet.

I am more interested in geoengineering in order to produce climate change rather than to prevent it (although arguably we are already doing that in at least one respect, heh.) I don't know why environmentalism always seems to imply preventing environmental change, but personally I don't think that simply trying to preserve the environmental status quo is what's best for the environment, or for us.

quote:

Originally posted by Arbiter I am more interested in geoengineering in order to produce climate change rather than to prevent it (although arguably we are already doing that in at least one respect, heh.) I don't know why environmentalism always seems to imply preventing environmental change, but personally I don't think that simply trying to preserve the environmental status quo is what's best for the environment, or for us.

Man I saw that you posted and was looking forward to a nice awesome long post.

quote:

Originally posted by Clovis I think we'll just be able to keep arguing about what "too late" is, as the quality of our environment on earth continues to be degraded and destroyed by our recklessness, without ever having the chance to have real discussions on what we're doing to the earth without it turning into a "climate change" argument.

Yeah. I could write alot more about the stupidity of people who actually try to turn it into an argument, but I'm way too lazy.

On the topic of geoengineering, some solutions seem OK, particularly seeding oceans with iron, as it should have a relatively low impact on existing ecosystems. All it would do is help life grow in areas where there isn't any. Of course there is potential for problems and more research is necessary, but at first glance it seems like a decent means of carbon sequestration.

However, many of the other solutions seem extremely objectionable, particularly sulfor dioxide, or any other "global shading" type of solution. The amount of sunlight we would have to block to offset our warming is on the order of 1% of the total incoming solar radiation, which, with a few minor exceptions, is the only source of energy for every ecosystem on the planet. Therefore, I dont think its a stretch to assume a similar drop in global Net Primary Productivity will be a result. I am almost certain such a drop in energy will cause MANY more problems than cooling the earth will solve.

Really, the only good solution is to stop using fossil fuels. Thankfully, the high oil prices are helping to push everyone in the right direction.

quote:

Originally posted by RJT I'm going to refrain from engaging in any more of this discussion with you because there is no possible way it can go any further without me losing any respect I've still got for you.

that's fine. quite honestly, i just don't care that much about the subject anyway.

edit,

my only main concern is the people who take the issue to the extreme. the environment is like religion. you have people who don't give two shits about it, you have people who are radicals in it, and then you have people like me: it's there, i respect it, i do my own thing...and occasionally i'll take a bite into it. but don't try to force your thoughts into my head.

quote:

Originally posted by Sadface However, many of the other solutions seem extremely objectionable, particularly sulfor dioxide, or any other "global shading" type of solution.

quote:

The year is estimated to be around 2199, and humanity is fighting a war against intelligent machines created in the early 21st century. The sky is covered in thick black clouds created by the humans in an attempt to cut off the machines' supply of solar power. The machines responded by using human beings as their energy source, growing countless people in pods and harvesting their bioelectrical energy and body heat. The world which Neo has inhabited since birth is the Matrix, an illusory simulated reality construct of the world of 1999, developed by the machines to keep the human population docile.

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