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quote:

Originally posted by inconspicuous p.s. watts, frequency ranges, & pretty much any other numbers used in audio are worthless.

Mostly true. One number I do pay attention to is the dBL at 1 watt at 1m at 1000 Hz. 98 dB is good, 100+ is great. This is a measure of the relative volume that you will receive from the speakers. With a high dBL rating, you have the ability to use a lower powered amp, which can save money, and, in my experience, sounds better.

Ok, so I decided to go with 2 speakers, won't be buying a subwoofer because that would cost me too much in total.

I figured something out now... The stronger the speakers, the stronger the amp has to be (d'oh).
However, the price goes up with the power, drastically, and I didn't know amps were that expensive, so here's the new question:

Which pays off more?

Combination of these:

Wharfedale Diamond 9.1 100W
Denon PMA-700AE 2x100W
(Total: $760)

Or these:

Wharfedale Diamond 9.1 100W
Denon PMA-500 2x70W
(Total: $590)

Or simply this:

Logitech Z-5500 Digital
(Total: $540)

how much are those two denon amps? they only make the 2000 now and your site isn't loading for me.

PMA-700AE is 2330 kn ($480) and PMA-500 is 1500 kn ($310).

Just a note... I probably wouldn't be using Z-5500 for surround in movies and games, but they have a pretty good subwoofer, included amp, 505W RMS and big frequency range, all for a very good price (compared to buying components separately). Even Logitech X-210 (worth $50) I have now sounds very good for music, can't imagine what would Z-5500 sound like...

go with whichever of the two Denon amps you are willing to pay for, but swap the speakers for a pair of Epos ELS-3 bookshelves, instead. May as well get some 4-ohm speakers on an amp that can handle it if you're looking for value.

lol.

quote:

Originally posted by dark_Omens Mostly true. One number I do pay attention to is the dBL at 1 watt at 1m at 1000 Hz. 98 dB is good, 100+ is great. This is a measure of the relative volume that you will receive from the speakers. With a high dBL rating, you have the ability to use a lower powered amp, which can save money, and, in my experience, sounds better.

hence why I said 'pretty much.' that is one of the only things that manufacturers can't manipulate & skew to the point of utter uselessness (like 1000w HTIBs & subwoofers).

even with efficiency, though, it's great if the speaker sounds good. Klipsch makes ridiculously efficient speakers, but they sound like cramming shards of glass into your eardrums imo.

also, those ratings should give you an idea of how full of shit most power ratings are, because if speakers actually played at 100w, you would go deaf instantly. 130db is a plane taking off, and you can get there with 4-5w (rated properly) on most speakers iirc.

quote:

Originally posted by Gauss What are KRKs?

http://www.krksys.com/prodland_vxt.php

a lot of folks on here swear by them.

just buy some CLXs & be done with it.

quote:

Originally posted by inconspicuous yuck. Fuck KRKS!!!!!

ok, ok calm down

why do think the KRK's are "yuck" ?

iseewhatyoudidthere

quote:

Originally posted by inconspicuous hence why I said 'pretty much.' that is one of the only things that manufacturers can't manipulate & skew to the point of utter uselessness (like 1000w HTIBs & subwoofers). even with efficiency, though, it's great if the speaker sounds good. Klipsch makes ridiculously efficient speakers, but they sound like cramming shards of glass into your eardrums imo. also, those ratings should give you an idea of how full of shit most power ratings are, because if speakers actually played at 100w, you would go deaf instantly. 130db is a plane taking off, and you can get there with 4-5w (rated properly) on most speakers iirc.

Watts are cheap. dB efficiency becomes much more serious when discussing prosound where you're on the level of many many many many kilowatts.

For a speaker to put out 130dB @ 4w/1m @ 1kHz it would need to be 124dB @ 1w/1m @ 1kHz. That's approaching prosound/PA type levels.

A speaker at 100w will not make you go deaf instantly. I'm doing tests with stuff in the hundreds of watts, and hitting 1kw peak regularly.

Peak power is what you need to pay attention to. Dynamics, folks, dynamics. Music is frequencies and dynamics.

Remember that the room dominates the low end. Going from crappy placement to proper placement in a room can make you go from "I need a sub" to "I... don't need a sub."

If you're willing to spend some extra dough, I recommend this: http://www.soundstage.com/diwhy/diwhy200804.htm If I wasn't going to build my own speakers with my own driver designs, I'd get these and a simple two channel amplifier.

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