quote:

Originally posted by MarkT CPC Hypocrisy at it's finest. a few gems from Stephen Harper in May 2006: "Fixed election dates prevent governments from calling snap elections for short-term political advantage...They level the playing field for all parties and the rules are clear for everybody." "...fixed election dates stop leaders from trying to manipulate the calendar simply for partisan political advantage". "The only way we can have justice is to have a fixed election date, because an election without a fixed election date is a tremendous advantage for the party in power". He qualified his desire for fixed election dates by saying that the gov't has to still be able to govern and there are scenarios where calling an election is necessary: "If the government is defeated, loses confidence, it's obliged by the constitution to hold an election." while this is the angle he's now playing, it's complete bullshit. The CPC has not been defeated or officially lost the confidence of either the people or parliament. The CPC is even or ahead in the polls, has been able to pass whatever legislation it wanted, and has put through a rather high number of bills during it's time in office. Clearly the CPC has been able to effectively govern according to its agenda. this election is being called to derail several byelections, to avoid dealing with economic issues that might expose some flaws in the CPC fiscal policy, and to take advantage of the fact that the opposition is not in a strong position to defeat them. Stephen Harper = a hypocrite and a LIAR. funny how the same term that was repeatedly thrown at the Liberals is now an apt description for Harper and the CPC themselves. so, in the midst of an economic downturn, lets spend ~$300 million on an unnecessary election. what a douchebag.

Oh get over it. The policy is for majority governments. You can't seriously expect to have minority governments in place for a fixed term and if all parties need to have the abiltiy to force an election. You're just worried that Harper may pull off a majority since the alternatives are awful.

quote:

Originally posted by musicsnob_NOT Oh get over it. The policy is for majority governments. You can't seriously expect to have minority governments in place for a fixed term and if all parties need to have the abiltiy to force an election. You're just worried that Harper may pull off a majority since the alternatives are awful.

I love a PM who can run the country into debt......Harper is doing a great job at that...that 2% GST cut has just made the world of difference in my life....once he bans gay marriage and abortion then Canada will be perfect.

quote:

Originally posted by musicsnob_NOT Oh get over it. The policy is for majority governments. You can't seriously expect to have minority governments in place for a fixed term and if all parties need to have the abiltiy to force an election. You're just worried that Harper may pull off a majority since the alternatives are awful.

where in the legislation does it state that it only applies to a majority? you can't be suggesting that he's incapable of manipulating parliament with his minority gov't...he's been doing it ALL ALONG by making virtually everything a confidence motion.

no one, Harper included, suggest that a CPC majority is remotely possible...so I'm far from worried about that (but what a fucking nightmare that would be).

my concern lies with him cicumventing his own legislation and wasting $300 million on an unnecessary election when gov't coffers are bare.

what a conincidence that he pulled this right before 4 by-elections, before the possibility of a liberal President in the U.S., before the CPC fiscal policies come under closer scrutiny during an economic downturn, etc.

he *claims* he's calling it because parliament is "dysfucntional" and because confidence in his gov't is lost (hence the bogus meetings with the opposition beforehand to "confirm" that)...because that's the only way around the legislation. but how is this the case? Has the CPC not passed everything it wished? What is going to change with another CPC minority?

it's a sham...and you know it

I'd love to see a televised request for the GG to disolve parliament...only she refuses and asks the opposition to form a coalition, lol. not because I believe it would ever actually happen, but just to see the look on Harper's face.

quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer The Conservaties dont give a shit about climate change or the environment.They have the same attitude as their fellow Republicans in the south "DRILL DRILL DRILL".

Energy sustainability are big issues for North Americans (moreso for the US). Why is exploration and production of our own resources so much worse than paying middle eastern countries to pollute over there and then transport thousands of miles?

The same people who are against domestic E&P are the same ones who cry when a pipeline gets built in their state or gas prices go up. Domestic exploration and production of oil and gas increases worldwide energy storage levels and puts downward pressure on prices. It reduces our dependence on foreign energy and boosts our economy by keeping jobs here at home, keeping cash inside the country and providing more royalty and tax revenue to government, which eventually finds its way back into the hands of Canadians.

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT my concern lies with him cicumventing his own legislation and wasting $300 million on an unnecessary election when gov't coffers are bare.

Just wondering where this figure comes from?

quote:

Originally posted by Skipper Energy sustainability are big issues for North Americans (moreso for the US). Why is exploration and production of our own resources so much worse than paying middle eastern countries to pollute over there and then transport thousands of miles? The same people who are against domestic E&P are the same ones who cry when a pipeline gets built in their state or gas prices go up. Domestic exploration and production of oil and gas increases worldwide energy storage levels and puts downward pressure on prices. It reduces our dependence on foreign energy and boosts our economy by keeping jobs here at home, keeping cash inside the country and providing more royalty and tax revenue to government, which eventually finds its way back into the hands of Canadians.

this is too complicated for tree huggers to understand...

they preach by local, but that doesn't apply to local Oil

quote:

Originally posted by Orko Just wondering where this figure comes from?

its the average cost of a federal election.

quote:

Originally posted by Dj Smitty20 or how about being able to drive an electric car that you can recharge? That won't ever happen under a Conservative government. I've heard rumours that Harper has called the election in part due to the effect that an Obama Presidency would have on Canadian voters. ie, it would definitely be a boost to the Liberal Party. I suppose there is some truth in that. I am generally a centrist with both left leaning and a few right leaning tendencies. As much as I am unhappy with how the Liberals have gone about reforming their party since Chretien left office, I simply cannot vote for the Canadian Alliance Party...because that's exactly what they are. The old Progressive Conservative Party is dead, which is unfortunate, because now Canada's only truly right wing party has its base in the west, where they are less educated, more religious and definitely more "rural". As someone from Ontario, that's not the kind of party I will ever vote for. So, bring on the minority Torie administration again, where little to nothing is accomplished among all kinds of bitter fighting in Parliament. This entire election is just a fucking waste of tax payers money and is a huge distraction for Canadians concerning the very important American election campaign.

All I see here is ignorance on your part here. Alberta continues to have the one of the strongest curriculums not only in Canada but internationally, with Alberta scoring well above the national average in test scores.
A recent McLeans Artice detailing the smartest cities in Canada:

Smartest Cities:
Ottawa
Victoria
Calgary

Toronto is somewhere down there below Regina

Most Cultured:
Calgary
Victoria
Gatineau

Perhaps you are confusing our different opinions on national matters as a lack of education?



Alberta�s 15-year olds place among world�s best on international tests

Edmonton� For the second time in a week, international test results have placed Alberta students among the world�s best. This time, the results of the 2006 Programme for International Student Assessment (PISA) show that Alberta's students have jumped from fourth to second place in science, the focus subject for the 2006 tests.

In science, Alberta scored second highest in the world behind Finland. Alberta is the only province whose overall science score, as well as each individual test score, is significantly higher than the Canadian average. In the two minor areas of study, Alberta tied for third in reading and tied for fifth in mathematics.

"Alberta's students are achieving incredible things," said Minister of Education, Ron Liepert. "Student success is a collaboration of the efforts of teachers, parents, students and all educational stakeholders. This ensures that Alberta is recognized as an educational leader worldwide and our students are positioned for great things in a global context."

Comparison of performance in science between immigrant and non-immigrant students is another area of interest in PISA 2006. Alberta is the only jurisdiction whose immigrant students not only performed significantly better than, or as well as, the average non-immigrant students in Canada, but these students also demonstrated no difference with their non-immigrant counterparts within Alberta. This is contrary to international and national trends that non-immigrant youth tend to outperform their immigrant peers.

"Our results show that Alberta can be held as a model for helping immigrant students achieve excellence in their education," said Liepert.

PISA is administered every three years by the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development. The tests assess the international achievement of 15-year-old students in reading, mathematics and science. In Alberta, approximately 2,000 students from 90 schools, together with other sampled students from 57 countries, participated in the test in the spring of 2006. 2006 marks the third time Alberta participated in this programme.

Supporting student learning is part of Premier Ed Stelmach�s plan to secure Alberta�s future by building communities, greening our growth and creating opportunity.

http://education.alberta.ca/department/news/2007/december/20071204.aspx

�I have heard that they (the Conservatives) are changing from attack ads to porn movies (on gas pumps) so you can watch someone else being screwed at the same time that you do. They are, after all, in bed with the oil companies.�

-Councillor Howard Moscoe

quote:

Originally posted by Orko Just wondering where this figure comes from?

The AFP reported $290 million right after the election call. IIRC, Elections Canada made that estimate.

It's very much in line with previous costs of ~$200 and ~$278 million for the 2000 and 2004 elections, respectively:

http://www.cbc.ca/canadavotes/voter...ctioncosts.html

Another source (that I now can't locate offhand) pegged the 2006 election at ~$270 million.

Cancelling the 4 byelections costs a few bucks too:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008...ction-bill.html

The gay and abortion issues are dead. Get over it. Harper put it to a free vote, and he repsects the vote as any democratic politician would.

And as for all this bullshit calling him a liar because he is "breaking his own legislation". Minority gov't's are meant to function as an interm government and as such are not to last for more than 2-3 years. This is not just for federal politics but provincial as well. Harper could not let the gov't sit for a year and get dick all acomplished. It would cost the country more then 300 million to sit and do nothing progressive for a year.

In all honesty I feel like I'm wasting my time writing this however. This is a thread in the Toronto page. Toronto loves their Liberals no matter how much they prove to be corrupt and ineffiecent with taxpayer money.

The best thing to happen to this country would be a majority Consevative country. I will be voting conservative and I am very proud to support them.

quote:

Originally posted by tempoman Most Cultured: Calgary Victoria Gatineau

I find that odd... I lived in Gatineau for a number of years, and the most culture I got out of that city is La Pigale.

quote:

Originally posted by Abercrombie I find that odd... I lived in Gatineau for a number of years, and the most culture I got out of that city is La Pigale.

right across from the burger king.......i love la pigale

I'm more then a little pissed that we need to spend another $300 million so that we can end up with a house of commons that is not significantly different then the one we have now. I suppose; however, if I were Harper - currently running a deficit, entering poor economic times, with popularity trending downward - I'd want to cut my losses now too.

quote:

Originally posted by Moral Hazard I'm more then a little pissed that we need to spend another $300 million so that we can end up with a house of commons that is not significantly different then the one we have now. I suppose; however, if I were Harper - currently running a deficit, entering poor economic times, with popularity trending downward - I'd want to cut my losses now too.

And a new study which was to give us a total for the war in Afghanistan was just put on hold till after the election.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko And a new study which was to give us a total for the war in Afghanistan was just put on hold till after the election.

How convenient for Mr. Harper!

quote:

Originally posted by Nick Cenik How convenient for Mr. Harper!

and lets not forget the "in & out" scandal investigation... also on hold pending the election.

quote:

Originally posted by Moral Hazard I'm more then a little pissed that we need to spend another $300 million so that we can end up with a house of commons that is not significantly different then the one we have now. I suppose; however, if I were Harper - currently running a deficit, entering poor economic times, with popularity trending downward - I'd want to cut my losses now too.

running a defecit?? not true at all.

And I believe Harper will come out with a stronger minority, close to a majority.

quote:

Originally posted by malek running a defecit?? not true at all. And I believe Harper will come out with a stronger minority, close to a majority.

We were in the red in August. I imagine that is likely because quarterly income tax installments had not yet been collected; however, even if that is the case it's fuckin' scary... especially since neither I nor my country are better off today then two years ago. It would seem that increasing program spending by 14% and decreasing your revenue is not the most fiscally sound policy.

Is adding or taking away a few seats from the Conservatives really worth $300 million?

you are referring to the 500M defecit of april and may, but we had a 1.7B surplus in June... so there's no defecit in sight.

I think Harper didn't believe that he would be in office for so long, his 5 points program has been fulfilled and he wants to come back again with another program for the next few years. He proved everyone that he sticked to his plan throughout (best PM since I have been following politics)... not trying to defend him, but i have to give him credit for that!

quote:

Originally posted by malek you are referring to the 500M defecit of april and may, but we had a 1.7B surplus in June... so there's no defecit in sight. I think Harper didn't believe that he would be in office for so long, his 5 points program has been fulfilled and he wants to come back again with another program for the next few years. He proved everyone that he sticked to his plan throughout (best PM since I have been following politics)... not trying to defend him, but i have to give him credit for that!

I'll give him credit in that he stuck to his 5 point plan; however, their fiscal management has been terrible, they've managed to lower themselves to the same shitty brokerage politics they slam the Liberals for, and he's calling an election needlessly for his own political advantage (cutting his losses). I was excited when the Conservatives were elected... they promised more transparency and accountability, unfortunately what we got was far less of both.

BTW, I'm refering to August... we were in deficit in August, I was unaware about April and May. Being in deficit in May but surplus in June suggests to me that my hunch about August's deficit being due to quarterly tax payments not yet being collected is correct, but it's still too close for comfort.

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