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-- Who Actually Produces Dance Music/Who Claims To Produce But Doesn't
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quote:

Originally posted by Stassi Beatmixing is hardly the most difficult part of DJing, but rather reading a crowd and playing music catered specifically for them, rather than just playing a bunch of tracks that you thought sounded cool together while DJing in your bedroom.

o .. because you know so much about reading crowds?

I highly doubt a person who has a pre made tracklist sitcks to it fully.

I also don't think that the person with the pre made tracklist is going to somehow stick a shitty song into the mix that z0mg the crowd won't love!

gtfo of here with your lame response. as if "reading the crowd" is so fuking difficult.

if you went one step even further and had your cd's organized by key - and god forbid the crowd needs some reading- u can pull out a different track in that same key.


oh and i guess all the top 5 dj's suck at reading the crowd as they play the same fuking set sometimes months at a time.

I heard PvD July 3rd Sensation white in amsterdamn on ID&T... the next day he was in Miami -playing the same fuking set - for free.

Did I complain? fuk no!

quote:

Originally posted by MeLLyMeL oh and i guess all the top 5 dj's suck at reading the crowd as they play the same fuking set sometimes months at a time.

It's different when a DJ is selling a product and rather performing 'art' if that's what we can call it. The top DJs apparently are selling product, DJ sets in a can, and people eat it up. Thats a fact.

And I don't know much about reading a crowd, and thats probably why I am a shit DJ, good thing that DJing isn't my career.

quote:

Originally posted by Stassi It's different when a DJ is selling a product and rather performing 'art' if that's what we can call it. The top DJs apparently are selling product, DJ sets in a can, and people eat it up. Thats a fact. And I don't know much about reading a crowd, and thats probably why I am a shit DJ, good thing that DJing isn't my career.

Agreed aout the last part and that is why I am a critic - not a dj haha.

But I think if you love the music enough TO make this your career.. I don't think reading the crowd would be difficult.

Plus dj's have the upper hand of being in mailing lists/promos so sometimes they can throw in a song to test it out.

I just don't want to like a song and be like "oh this sounds like _______ " and then finding out it is that person. It's weak. Lame. No matter how much $$ these ppl are being given.

I could understand a writers block - having someone helping you out with a melody here and there.. but to not produce at all - tsk tsk

iput y two cents in on the other forum, but this is a pointless thread

i heard that all the guys on minus are just DJ's and that their productions are really all by hawtin. I don't believe it though

quote:

Originally posted by Tosh iput y two cents in on the other forum, but this is a pointless thread

then get out?

just a comment i'd like to make about pre-planned sets. i feel like experienced DJ's shouldnt have more than a few tracks planned out for the night. personally i'm new to DJing, and there's clearly huge advantages to having a preplanned set. but most of them i can see being lesser advantages for a more experienced/skilled DJ.

i have my first gig outside of my bedroom coming up next week and i've thought about planning the set out, or maybe just a guideline. but the only reasons i would do this is to avoid messy transitions and make sure i'm progressing properly and such. i was talking to eco and gmoney about this a few times actually. until having to actually do it out in public i was completely against a preplanned set. im still against more experienced DJ's doing it though :P

I think, obviously, the big DJs have to have a preplanned tracklist. When you're playing 3-4 times a week, you have to have some sort of set planned..

That's why I enjoy hearing locals play way better... Everyone brings a different flavor to each night, depending on who they're playing alongside, or the venue, or the night, etc... Ryan Tyas opening for Sean the other week, vs. Ryan Tyas opening for Chris Lake, just for example... Good shit, and good depth as far as musical tastes go. I think the same goes for most of the DJs on this board actually, and I'm not just saying that...

quote:

Originally posted by Jason Jollins And it is definitely Ableton that has allowed Producers to tour as DJ's.

I disagree primarily because CDJs are still the tool of choice among most producers / DJs. I don't know what every single DJ uses, but from those I do know out of the top 100 list I'd estimate that only a third use software, and only a third of those that do use software are using Ableton.

quote:

Originally posted by Jason Jollins As far as pre-made tracklists go, my cd book is filled with tracklists from practice sessions and notes about how particular tracks are structured. I don't think that is cheating, I think it's good organization. With vinyl you could literally look at the record and see how the track is organized, unfortunately with cd's you do not have that luxury.

Def have no problems at all with good organization or having runs of 2 or 3 songs that go together really well (we've all got a few eh?). I was talking more about pre-planning a set from start to finish which I do have a problem with � since I think it takes the art out of being a DJ (be it on vinyl, cd, Serato, or Ableton).

quote:

Originally posted by MeLLyMeL and how the fuk is a pre made tracklist cheating? lol. Does the pre made tracklist beat match for you??

I disagree. I think pre-planning a set ignores the essence of what a DJ can and should be. To me a DJ has one job � to play the perfect song for that exact moment in time and space. Done correctly, a DJ should be taking as much in from the crowd as they give back. I like to think of a DJ set as a mutual journey between the crowd and the DJ himself � it's a connection of emotion, energy, and trust. When a DJ pre-plans a set from start to finish, that connection is lost. Again, I don't have problem with lining up certain runs of tracks that go well together like many of the big guys do, but even then I think (and hope) most still listen to the crowd and structure their sets according to the mood.

quote:

Originally posted by Excess i have my first gig outside of my bedroom coming up next week and i've thought about planning the set out, or maybe just a guideline. but the only reasons i would do this is to avoid messy transitions and make sure i'm progressing properly and such. i was talking to eco and gmoney about this a few times actually. until having to actually do it out in public i was completely against a preplanned set. im still against more experienced DJ's doing it though :P

Don't worry for a first gig everyone gets a get out of jail free card Any DJs first night out is pretty much spent just trying to keep things from catching on fire, and it's def not easy. I'd recommend using song runs instead of pre-planning everything tho, and then experiment with crowd response by placing those runs accordingly. You'll take some of the pressure off of yourself but still have some fun experimenting with the crowd.

As you get more comfortable with your tracks and playing out in general, I think you'll find that playing on the fly will come naturally. Just remember that it's always better to play the perfect song for that moment than to choose something that's easy to mix. While your transition may only last 30 seconds, that song will be there for 6 min so make every one count! If you know the next song is out of key or not going to be easy to mix, do it cleverly like mixing in at the very end where it breaks down to percussion or doing a quick fade. A lot of times mixing out of key can also be very helpful as it breaks up the color of the set and makes people take notice (careful though, this can be both a good or bad thing). Good luck!

quote:

Originally posted by BradMiller I disagree. I think pre-planning a set ignores the essence of what a DJ can and should be. To me a DJ has one job � to play the perfect song for that exact moment in time and space. Done correctly, a DJ should be taking as much in from the crowd as they give back. I like to think of a DJ set as a mutual journey between the crowd and the DJ himself � it's a connection of emotion, energy, and trust. When a DJ pre-plans a set from start to finish, that connection is lost.

+1... You nailed it on the head... Excess knows how I feel about this, he's spoken to me about it in depth...

quote:

Don't worry for a first gig everyone gets a get out of jail free card Any DJs first night out is pretty much spent just trying to keep things from catching on fire, and it's def not easy.

Yeah haha... My first gig, I showed up with 30 vinyl only for them to tell me I needed to bring my own needles. I was like 16 or 17 at the time and had no idea. So thus, that was the first time I ever used CDJs. Also, it was my first time I used a rotary mixer... all in one night, all for the same gig!!!!

The tricky thing with playing live, during my first time, was my understanding of "feedback" and the booth monitor... It's a hard thing to grasp, and something you don't learn in the bedroom or in DJ manuals or whatever...

You guys are reading into this "exact song at this exact moment"

Ffs. Lol. Are u new to raving or something? If the song is epic - it will stand out.

No offense dude - but I only read the first 2 sentences. Not gonna even bother because QUITE FRANKLY ( I love stepen a smith) .. you know what you did outside the boards and I can never take what you say at face value.

Agree to disagree that pre planned sets ( and I don't know many that do ) is "" cheating.

My boyfriend always knows what first 2-3 songs he will start to play with and I know my boyfriend has good enough musical selection where it will mesh with a mushy crowd - hah!

But so many times my bf has been like "dammit I should have played this song" maybe he should have a list of songs he wants to play at his side bc flipping through cd's - is easy to look over some.

I think we're actually on the same page about the set thing, have no probs with the first 2-3 songs being planned out or having good organization for choosing tracks. I think the problem was my use of the word "tracklist." I didn't mean that having a printed out piece of paper for organizing tracks was bad, only that having a pre-made setlist from start to finish was. I've seen your bf rock it out behind the decks first hand, and I know he's a great DJ.

___

In regards to the other:

Mel, please know that I'm honestly sorry for that situation - it was unfortunate what happened but I want you to know that all I ever said was the truth - and what was told to me word for word. Believe it or not I was very torn over what to do, but in the end I did what I did because I would rather any of my friends tell me a hard truth than to lie to me. I don't claim to know everything about the situation or where all the pieces fit, but I don't believe in lying to a friend - which I consider you both to be.

I'd like to get in touch with you to talk more about this since I honestly didn't know that it had caused such a rift between us. Give me a call sometime and let's clear the air.

how does any DJ plan his first songs when he has no idea what the previous DJ will close with?

quote:

Originally posted by MeLLyMeL My boyfriend always knows what first 2-3 songs he will start to play with

This is the case with most djs.

DJs who tell you that they just walk into a booth and 'wing it' are either trying to sound cool, or they are lazy, and are probably playing sets that are all over the place.

If you're djing right...building a set, mixing tracks in key, mixing more than just intros and outros, then you're going to have a pretty good idea of what you want to play going into a gig. I'm not talking about having a full tracklist written out that you follow to a T. For my opening sets, I know where I want to start, I know where I want/need to end (based on what the headliner will be playing) and I have a list of tracks in my head that I know I will want to play throughout the night. Piecing it all together is the fun part, and obviously you need the crowd to vibe off in order to do that.

quote:

Originally posted by Stassi how does any DJ plan his first songs when he has no idea what the previous DJ will close with?

Depending on how familiar you are with the person playing before you, you can gauge (roughly) where they will end off (style wise, energy wise).

Obviously in a lot of cases you'll need to play some "segway" tracks first to get into the stuff you want to play.

But if you're a headliner, there really isn't much need to smoothly mix into the openers last track. A lot of big time djs just wait for the openers last track to wind down, then they start their intro.

For example, there is no way whatsoever that ATB didn't have his Pacha intro planned out before he went on last Friday. I'm sure he knew what the next track after it was going to be, and the track after that...

here it is btw...

Holy crap Firestarter?!?! Jeezus I'm kicking myself for not going now. Would have killed to hear that in a club!

This thread is

yep, looks like atb had his intro planned out.... lol

just got around to reading through this thread and i really appreciate the suggestions for my first gig. i think im going to make a list of tracks that i definitely want to play for intro/finish and a few tracks in between and then piece together the rest as i go

quote:

Originally posted by Excess i think im going to make a list of tracks that i definitely want to play for intro/finish and a few tracks in between and then piece together the rest as i go

Here's some more pointers for your first gig, in response to this ^^... I think I speak for most people here when I say that I don't like epic intros or anything crazy and drawn-out... The top 10 DJs in the world can start their shows with some crazy amazing tune, but I think the real art in us little guys' sets is how we carry on from the previous DJ. It's really a fun game to play, and the real music-lovers will like it if you do it well. Especially since your first gig isn't in a big club, but a lounge with other locals, people aren't really interested in the OMFG intro or mouthdropper, kinda kills the vibe actually, in my humble opinion...

Local nights, to me, have been some of the most enjoyable to play. One gig I had was playing the basement at Shelter from 2-430AM before and after guys like Deepspell, Billy Disciple, and some others. I showed up and sure enough, they all decided to throw the timeslots out the window and just tagteam. I was pissed at first, but ended up having a lot of fun being part of the musical journey we were collaborating on.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Eco Here's some more pointers for your first gig, in response to this ^^... I think I speak for most people here when I say that I don't like epic intros or anything crazy and drawn-out... The top 10 DJs in the world can start their shows with some crazy amazing tune, but I think the real art in us little guys' sets is how we carry on from the previous DJ. It's really a fun game to play, and the real music-lovers will like it if you do it well. Especially since your first gig isn't in a big club, but a lounge with other locals, people aren't really interested in the OMFG intro or mouthdropper, kinda kills the vibe actually, in my humble opinion...

shit there goes my epic 3 minute long symphony intro....back to the drawing board...

in all seriousness that'd be majorly egotistical on my end. people arent coming out to see me, especially me. everyone confirmed is a product of promotion from the other DJ's so far ahah. i already have my intro track picked out and trust me, it's far from epic :P

my real worry is if the venue will limit the type of my music that i can play. a lot of TA's are coming out but for a lounge i feel like there's definitely a bpm or intensity barrier, ahah


ughhh...thread jacking isn't something i like doing :P

quote:

Originally posted by zizack

That was awesome, brings me back to the days of "Wipeout XL", best video game ever







-

quote:

Originally posted by zizack here it is btw...

zack thats not the opening, thats something he was doin in MID set, which i thought was really awesome, i recorded that vid btw, in the opening he had some countdown in his own voice which went like 10..9...8..7....

then he dropped the first track whatever it was

quote:

Originally posted by coolestrl zack thats not the opening, thats something he was doin in MID set, which i thought was really awesome, i recorded that vid btw, in the opening he had some countdown in his own voice which went like 10..9...8..7.... then he dropped the first track whatever it was

ahhh, ok lol. I assumed it was his opening track. Cool as hell either way.

BLEH...

Someone please link me to the "Rulebook" that lists how and what a DJ is supposed to do.

If you go see a band, do they change their set according to the 'reading' they get from the crowd? No? They play what they're currently playing on thier tour. Most play the same show in 20 cities. If you're a fan of a DJ you should support what he chooses to play.

The big producer has replaced the big DJ because it's harder to produce. DJ's are a dime a dozen. There are plenty of people to mix the music together, the people actually making the music are the ones that matter.

With DJ equipment that is out now, anyone can get the hang of mixing in a month or two. Try mixing on some belt drive turntables with warped vinyl and no BPM counters.

And while we're ripping on Ableton how about DJ's using Serato or something like it. Any fool can match up little lines on the screen. Most of these guys spend the whole night staring at their laptop screen.

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