TranceAddict Forums (www.tranceaddict.com/forums)
- Canada - Toronto & Southern Ont.
-- is israel poking a beehive ???
Pages (4): « 1 [2] 3 4 »

quote:

Originally posted by LightsOut it was something like... ...in the last 10 years, Palestinian suicide bombers have been directly responsible for 50 something deaths inside Israel, and in retaliation, surface-to-surface rocket attacks by Israel on 'suspected militant locations' inside Palestine has resulted in over 2300 civilian deaths.... 50 to 2300...that's a pretty disgusting ratio...

Figures don't lie (although these ones are wrong), but liars can figure.

First of all, the actual number of terrorist-related deaths in Israel during the past 10 years is about 1200, with about 2/3 of those being civilians, and another 8000 wounded. (Source - and please don't be a loser and scream "bias", there's a detailed account of every incident that can be cross-checked with media sources)

Second, everyone in Palestine is a "civilian" - that is the problem. There is no Palestinian military or security force. Terrorists are lumped into the same category as innocent bystanders, they wear civilian clothes and even hide in densely-populated civilian locations while they fire rockets. So it should come as no surprise that there are a high number of "civilian" deaths in Palestine.

Third, the fact that the Israeli death count is lower than the Palestinian death count is not for lack of trying on the part of Palestinians; the fact that they are less effective at actually killing their targets (Israelis in the border towns are never more than 5 minutes away from a bomb shelter) does not make them any less responsible.

So thank you for the incorrect and ultimately very uninteresting second-hand statistic.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Figures don't lie (although these ones are wrong), but liars can figure.

quote:

and please don't be a loser and scream "bias", there's a detailed account of every incident that can be cross-checked with media sources)

quote:

So thank you for the incorrect and ultimately very uninteresting second-hand statistic.

Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed or something? It's one thing if you don't agree with the statistics, but no need to be a c**t about it.

I merely contributed something that IF true, would be something quite significant. If you think the figures are skewed (and they very well could be), then express it and tell us why, their is no need to be calling me out or whatever your trying to do here, I'm just relaying something I found interesting and I've always considered Ross Kemp to be a fairly unbiased journalist, perhaps I'll think twice from now on.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut You obviously don't follow the politics there to any extent. Beware of drawing too many conclusions from a few out-of-context articles. Israel has not substantively changed any of its policies, with the notable exception of playing the Obama administration's recent games, ceding control of certain territories and - originally - stopping new construction as requested. That led them to where they are now - more violence, more rocket attacks, and more pressure from Obama to cede even more territory and give into even more demands. On the flip side, not a single serious demand has been made against the Palestinians - like, for example, I don't know, stop shooting rockets into Israeli cities? So try, for a moment, to put yourself in Netanyahu's shoes (and I know, it's hard to feel any sympathy for the jooooos!). Obama now appears to be playing the exact same shady political games that the Palestinians have been playing for the past 20 years, and has now escalated to demands that are absolute non-starters, such as negotiating a "right of return." These simply aren't negotiable, and Obama knows that - or else he's even stupider than I could possibly have imagined. No other U.S. president, Democrat or Republican, has ever tried to be more than a "mediator" in the dispute. Suddenly, the good ole' USA starts putting pressure on Israel to throw the match, at the same time that domestic terrorist activity has already been starting to escalate. The actual likelihood of any party being interested in a peaceful and equitable solution is vanishingly small. So what would you do, in his position? Give into further demands, stop construction that has already started, release more prisoners, cede control of more territories, and bring Hamas back to the "negotiating" table, all with the knowledge that this would at best result in an ephemeral pause in the "violence" that already exists? Hezbollah's already been in on the fight; the "threat" of them starting up again isn't news. Or would you simply reject such demands out-of-hand - knowing full well that it can't make the terrorism situation much worse than it already is - and risk possibly souring relations with a U.S. president who's already clearly communicated that he's not batting for them anyway? Ultimately the only nation that this is really going to hurt is the U.S., because Israel is their proxy against Iran. Obama has already proven, to himself and to the public, that he is not capable of achieving his aims by diplomacy alone. He na�vely believes that by souring relations with Israel, Iran and the other Arab states will somehow be more likely to cooperate with America. He knows that Israel cannot and will not accept the new demands, which is precisely why he's made them. Israel really does not have much choice in the matter; they can either accept a completely unreasonable set of demands (and receive nothing in return), or reject them and risk negative publicity, oh wait, they already have that. Really tough choice there.

A typical Digi commment. what? you want us to feel sorry for Israel? not goona happen. After all these land take overs the Palestians have every right to fight back. Dont tell me you expect them to sit back and watch Israel build new houses over their own land.

quote:

Originally posted by LightsOut Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed or something? It's one thing if you don't agree with the statistics, but no need to be a c**t about it. I merely contributed something that IF true, would be something quite significant. If you think the figures are skewed (and they very well could be), then express it and tell us why, their is no need to be calling me out or whatever your trying to do here, I'm just relaying something I found interesting and I've always considered Ross Kemp to be a fairly unbiased journalist, perhaps I'll think twice from now on.

The parenthetical wasn't directed specifically at you, it's just something that many other people on this forum have a tendency to do. In that sense, it was pre-emptive.

As for the rest... well, not trying to be a "c**t" here, but I do have a kind of a thing about statistics that appear to be made-up, taken out of context, or both. I'm not questioning your intent or Ross Kemp's - just the specific information that was presented in that post.

No hard feelings, no offense intended, just trying to set the record straight.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Figures don't lie (although these ones are wrong), but liars can figure. First of all, the actual number of terrorist-related deaths in Israel during the past 10 years is about 1200, with about 2/3 of those being civilians, and another 8000 wounded. (Source - and please don't be a loser and scream "bias", there's a detailed account of every incident that can be cross-checked with media sources) Second, everyone in Palestine is a "civilian" - that is the problem. There is no Palestinian military or security force. Terrorists are lumped into the same category as innocent bystanders, they wear civilian clothes and even hide in densely-populated civilian locations while they fire rockets. So it should come as no surprise that there are a high number of "civilian" deaths in Palestine. Third, the fact that the Israeli death count is lower than the Palestinian death count is not for lack of trying on the part of Palestinians; the fact that they are less effective at actually killing their targets (Israelis in the border towns are never more than 5 minutes away from a bomb shelter) does not make them any less responsible. So thank you for the incorrect and ultimately very uninteresting second-hand statistic.

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW you actually want us to belive your source that is directly from Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs is legit?

Here some statistics for ya:

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/stats/children.html

and more:

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/stats/deaths.html


Dont play your biased zionist games here. People nowadays are a lot smarter than you think.

quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW you actually want us to belive your source that is directly from Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs is legit?

IF it can be verified by independent media/credible source, yes

no source is without bias. you know that

quote:

Originally posted by LightsOut Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed or something? It's one thing if you don't agree with the statistics, but no need to be a c**t about it.

Thaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat's Digi!!!






Parenthetical??? Really???

quote:

Originally posted by Yohan IF it can be verified by independent media/credible source, yes no source is without bias. you know that

I understand but this dude pretty much bashed anything that might be against his beloved Israel not matter how much proof you put on the table. It is scary actually.

quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer I understand but this dude pretty much bashed anything that might be against his beloved Israel not matter how much proof you put on the table. It is scary actually.

considering you are about same level of militancy when it comes to palestine/israel issue...

quote:

Originally posted by Yohan considering you are about same level of militancy when it comes to palestine/israel issue...

I will admit if I'm wrong if there is legitimacy to the discussion but when it comes to Digi NO WAY. He is like a fuckin bully around here and it pisses everyone off.

I notice that nobody's actually bothered to debate any of the issues, just hurling random accusations about my background/motives/language/etc.

Can I assume that means you have no counterargument, or just haven't learned how to express yourselves with anything more than one-liners full of typos and exclamation marks?

lol good same old TA

quote:

Originally posted by dEsidEL lol good same old TA

come one man you know you wanna say it..... khal.....

quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer and then you have Israel's response which is to demolish the whole Neighbourhood and turn it into ground zero and kill as many people as they can just to kill that one "terrorist. It is a neverending god damn cycle there.

Well fuck, when you punch the biggest guy in school, you gotta expect that your ass is getting whupped in return.

Hi,

Sandy here from Canada. As I have seen your comments & I am obliged that you have share a lot of information with us.

Thanks
Sandy



dell laptop repair

quote:

Originally posted by VDub Grossman is a Jewish name no???

That was pretty Ann Coulter, Nick. Are you suggesting myself and Navid fly a magic carpet or camel to travel too?

quote:

Originally posted by Abercrombie That was pretty Ann Coulter, Nick. Are you suggesting myself and Navid fly a magic carpet or camel to travel too?

Both are better than a fuckin white Miata!!!

:-p

quote:

Originally posted by VDub Both are better than a fuckin white Miata!!! :-p

LOL flying carpet FTW

I'd take a camel probably get a better MPG over any car even a Prius and I could sort of go off road LOL

I agree with much of what Diginut has said. People often blindly accuse Israel of their actions without thought or regard to what is actually going on there. Visit the region and you may have a very different view of things. Israel is building these new settlement in Jerusalem, the Capitol of Israel. Jerusalem will never be given up in any peace agreement. The government is building to accommodate growth in an area that is disputed but will NEVER be given up. They are acting as a responsible municipal government to accommodate the housing needs of the city. If it was a further expansion into the West Bank than I could see it being more of an issue. Anti-Israel lobbyists are trying to make a big deal over nothing.

All this talk about the oppression of the Palestinians by the Israelis is over-hyped. The Israeli Defense Forces take extreme cautions to try and minimize civilian casualties. They warn building days in advance of bombings. They drop pamphlets informing civilians of future military actions. Do you think that the US Forces warned civilians in Iraq before entering a town? Unlikely. If you talk to Israelis, you will know that they want peace badly but not in lieu of their safety.

Every country has a right to defend themselves. What do you think would happen if San Diego was bombed by Mexican Militants and their citizens were constantly under a barrage of rockets. There would be a response, and I guarantee it would make Israel's actions seem minuscule. I am just saying that there is blind support for the Palestinians and bias against Israel generated by the media. Look into how other Arab nations and Plasetinian Leaders have treated the Palestinian People in the past and present. It may shock you. Start with Black September. Then check out how Yasser Arafat's wife is living off of all the money he stole from his people.

�We will have peace with the Arabs when they love their children more than they hate us� Golda Meir, ex-Israeli PM

where's the popcorn?

wow what a thread.. some really interesting opinions here. i'm definitely getting back to this tomorrow

quote:

Originally posted by Satchel I agree with much of what Diginut has said. People often blindly accuse Israel of their actions without thought or regard to what is actually going on there. Visit the region and you may have a very different view of things. Israel is building these new settlement in Jerusalem, the Capitol of Israel. Jerusalem will never be given up in any peace agreement. The government is building to accommodate growth in an area that is disputed but will NEVER be given up. They are acting as a responsible municipal government to accommodate the housing needs of the city. If it was a further expansion into the West Bank than I could see it being more of an issue. Anti-Israel lobbyists are trying to make a big deal over nothing. All this talk about the oppression of the Palestinians by the Israelis is over-hyped. The Israeli Defense Forces take extreme cautions to try and minimize civilian casualties. They warn building days in advance of bombings. They drop pamphlets informing civilians of future military actions. Do you think that the US Forces warned civilians in Iraq before entering a town? Unlikely. If you talk to Israelis, you will know that they want peace badly but not in lieu of their safety. Every country has a right to defend themselves. What do you think would happen if San Diego was bombed by Mexican Militants and their citizens were constantly under a barrage of rockets. There would be a response, and I guarantee it would make Israel's actions seem minuscule. I am just saying that there is blind support for the Palestinians and bias against Israel generated by the media. Look into how other Arab nations and Plasetinian Leaders have treated the Palestinian People in the past and present. It may shock you. Start with Black September. Then check out how Yasser Arafat's wife is living off of all the money he stole from his people. �We will have peace with the Arabs when they love their children more than they hate us� Golda Meir, ex-Israeli PM

lol. ask for some more bombs then !!!

with your set of mind you will never have peace !!!!

quote:

Originally posted by jad i'm definitely getting back to this tomorrow

Thanks for the heads up on that.

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright © 2000-2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.