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-- do you believe in paranormal stuff like ghosts, ufo, etc...?
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quote:

Ghosts IMO could easily exist in some other form or world.

Precisely my point.

If we take the laws of physics to be universal (i.e. pertaining to the entirity of the universe) then to have the detatched souls of dead organisms walking around in what appears to be the form of "light" (that is they seem to be composed of either light/electricity/some such element) would appear to be in direct contradiction of our natural laws.

If ghosts do exist in another universe that is not privy to the laws of ours, then surely there is no way we can know about it, much less see them walking around in our universe, contradicting the laws of our physics (they should not be visible at all - on film or otherwise - if they are, as I described, composed of either light or electricity).

quote:

Remember, YOU are YOUR BODY, YOU are not IN YOUR BODY. If your body dies, YOU DIE.

I'd have to agree.

For anyone who believes in the afterlife there are several problems that must be addressed.

Firstly, I am operating under the assumption that it is the "soul" that is carried through into the afterlife, or at least some comperable part of ourselves. That is, there is some transcendent part to our personhood that leaves our physical bodies when we die and enters some other dimension or universe.

Anyway, assuming that my above assumption is correct, we face a number of problems. Without appealing to abject, basless assumptions, please answer these questions:

• What form does the soul take? Is it physical (in which case it is most definately attached to the physical part of ourselves and can in no way be considered "transcendent") or entirely immaterial (in which case how can it inhabit our very physical bodies in this very physical universe)?
  
• If we die old and senile, are we doomed forever to live in such a state? What if we die just weeks or months after birth? What state do we live out our afterlife in?
  
• If you argue that in the case of dying "old and senile" our souls take the form of us at the "apex" of our lives (or some similarly arbitrary point in our lives) then who determines where this point may be, and by what criteria is this determination made? If we die at the age of 80 yet we adopt the mindset of ourselves in our afterlife at our "peak" at age 25, then are the final 65 years of our lives forgotten? What point would there be then, living past our peaks in this sense?
  
• If you argue that babies are sent into the afterlife assuming the form of their "potential peak" (that is, the person they would have grown up to be) then what does this say about free will? What is the point of existing at all if we are all treading down a predestined path? If our personhood and, indeed, our souls are shaped primarily by experience (you'll have a hard time arguing that they are not) then what kind of souls can babies possibly carry into the afterlife?
  
• Do you believe that the afterlife is destined to be better - a more pleasureable place to exist - than this life? If so, why do you continue to exist? What is to be gained from this mortal toil, when there is the expectation of a much grander life on the other side of death?
  
• Is the afterlife infinite? If not, then how long does it last for? How long would you like it to last for? If it is infinite, then the question must be asked, how long before you tire of living? How long before there is nothing left to experience? Is there an opt out clause? Do you really want to live forever? Infinity is a long time......

quote:

Originally posted by Renegade Aleins probably exist but there is no way that they are visiting this planet. Ghosts defy all laws of physics (as well as several other scientific laws presumably) and so probably cannot exist. God, in all likelihood, either does not exist, or, if he does then he doesn't like me very much.

quote:

Originally posted by MaGiK54 I shall see what happens, when I die. Maybe nothing, but maybe a lot. But I believe in that there is live on another planet in agalaxy far far away, but I don't believe that they come and visit it us.

YES that's what I was gonna say.

quote:

Originally posted by davinox OK...here's the deal. Why do people assume that your body will experience things after it is dead. Remember, YOU are YOUR BODY, YOU are not IN YOUR BODY. If your body dies, YOU DIE. You don't go to heaven if you are clinically dead, and when you get brought back to life you don't trumpet about it. (those who say it happened are the same ppl who claim about UFO abductions and Big Foot.) Now, of course energy is not created or destroyed. When you die, your energy is decomposed or cremated, or whatever. If a bird dies, same thing. Dog dies, same thing. If any living thing dies, same thing. It's not that hard. Afterlife is a ridiculous notion that quite frankly, makes me think of the human race as dumber. -- About ghosts and spirits, they all apear during emotional times, or times when the mind is wondering. Noone sees a ghost just walking down the street on a normal day, they see one when they are scared in the middle of the night, or their dad died recently, or something. Visions, hallucinacions, and seeing things incorrectly are not that uncommon. Personally, ghosts and UFOs are an incredible claim that requires incredible evidence. I just don't think it's around. And yes there is most likey life on other planets. The chances of them visiting us is very rare however, because they are probably very very far away.

very very well said too...

The afterlife thing is a kind of motivation I think. When people are down and can't achieve anything .... they say:

"ohh right, there's afterlife and we can do many thing there,we'll have time to enjoy ourselfs cos it lasts forever"

Well I also think that is nonsense becasue you are made up of 3 basic elements (C, O, H) and electricity(humans)

If there's the correct combination of those 3 elemnets, then there's life. There's no being without those 3 elements....but we humans have very important part called BRAIN you know..and there's electricity there so that we can think decide and be ourselfs....not anyother tree or something.

You can't take anything (any element or electrons) to an unknown place. If there's something like that...it doens't exsist YET!!!! Trust me

But there are certainly aliens (they are not UFO's...they don't have to fly)

Greetz
Dj Ahter

quote:

Originally posted by Renegade What form does the soul take? Is it physical (in which case it is most definately attached to the physical part of ourselves and can in no way be considered "transcendent") or entirely immaterial (in which case how can it inhabit our very physical bodies in this very physical universe)? If we die old and senile, are we doomed forever to live in such a state? What if we die just weeks or months after birth? What state do we live out our afterlife in? If you argue that in the case of dying "old and senile" our souls take the form of us at the "apex" of our lives (or some similarly arbitrary point in our lives) then who determines where this point may be, and by what criteria is this determination made? If we die at the age of 80 yet we adopt the mindset of ourselves in our afterlife at our "peak" at age 25, then are the final 65 years of our lives forgotten? What point would there be then, living past our peaks in this sense? If you argue that babies are sent into the afterlife assuming the form of their "potential peak" (that is, the person they would have grown up to be) then what does this say about free will? What is the point of existing at all if we are all treading down a predestined path? If our personhood and, indeed, our souls are shaped primarily by experience (you'll have a hard time arguing that they are not) then what kind of souls can babies possibly carry into the afterlife? Do you believe that the afterlife is destined to be better - a more pleasureable place to exist - than this life? If so, why do you continue to exist? What is to be gained from this mortal toil, when there is the expectation of a much grander life on the other side of death? Is the afterlife infinite? If not, then how long does it last for? How long would you like it to last for? If it is infinite, then the question must be asked, how long before you tire of living? How long before there is nothing left to experience? Is there an opt out clause? Do you really want to live forever? Infinity is a long time......

these questions all seem to be just asking what form we take in our afterlife...like i said our soul is our energy it cannot be destroyed...therefore when we die our energy does not...i dont believe we're in any form when we hit the afterlife or when we die and our "soul" parts with its shell...i believe we are just energy but at least that is something...energy doesnt come in any form or shape...and thats how we will be...

check out this site guys

www.torontoghosts.org

Lets go ghost hunting this October!


btw I'm new and would like to know if I can change my name, I already hate it

Thanks in advance.

I definitely believe in an afterlife.

All those who disagree with afterlife think about this:

Soul is to body as mind is to brain.
All our brains are basically the same shape. Most of us receive the same sorts of inputs from our environment during the course of our daily lives. Yet, when the time comes we all behave differently to the next person. And so too with our souls, that's why we are all different. It is what sets us apart from the rest of us. Same mould different flavours. "Like a box of chocolates"

quote:

Originally posted by InAcoma i don't believe any of it.. its all money making in my eyes, ghosts and goblims are very hollywood. i dont believe in an afterlife, i cant comprehend it, coz once ur dead ur dead... just my opinions

Very very Well said its all just to make money

IMO

i saw something that scared me once!! in a town called Springfield,La. one day back in, i think '86, this kid named Micheal Brown was walking back to his house with his dog. when out of nowhere he was hit by a car. the cops had no leads at all. the next few days they had the wake and the funeral. then the people from then headstone place where supose to come lay down the headstone. they laid it down that day at around noon. the next day micheal's mom went to the grave to put some flowers. when she got up to the grave there was a map CARVED on the back of headstone. it showed exacually what happen it showed a truck hitting micheal then coming back to see if he was ok. then it showed the route that the truck left the scene. it gave the man full name who hit him on the map!! the cops went to the mans house and questioned him about it, at first he tried to play it off saying that it wasnt him. then they took him down to grave and he confesed to the crime. people thought that the headstone people had something to do with it, but the owner said that that no shop machine capable of do that in such a short time. he said i would have taken over 24 hours plus taking the stone out of the ground and putting it back. if yall could see this map, just thinking about it makes my eyes water. it looks like a little kid drew it on the stone and it just sank into the stone. this was also on unsolved mysteries a while back. I'll try to get down there and take a picture of and post it.

I do believe and if you saw this you would have no doubt!!

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