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-- When will the obsession with "analog" stop?
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quote:

Originally posted by Twilothunder23 Man... some of you are busters. Talking about how well it is going on mp3 so it doesn't matter what you use.

That's not at all what I said.

Hi, Existo.

I wasn't talking specifically about you I was addressing the mentality people have here. Waaaay too many ignorant noobs that have never made a half decent record like to take off their pants pull out their penis and take a piss at the entire recording industry. Way too many people are too quick to dismiss the entire recording industry... the tools of the great mixing and mastering studios with the great engineers that have been mixing for a living since some of you were shitting in diapers as ''unnecessary shit'' when you and I know very well that the best sounding records were not made itb on computer shit they were made on real industrial strength gear aimed to the professional market. And that is the bottom line. Those records from the 90s that we grew up listening to sound better than the stuff being put out today and for me it is worth paying the extra dime if your music is really up to par or at least be humble and learn.

I mean...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CCIjz1ZXAs

^ Sounds pretty good to me.

Seems like the basic discussion is more about how our modern digital technology can accurately model analogue in a much cheaper fashion, and why people are still going apeshit over analogue when there's no audible difference.

thing is, it's really a moot argument anyway...it's all about personal preference and what makes you hard with regards to producing music. If you need that multi-thousand dollar Roland synth to give you a musical stiffy, then by all means...But that's not to say even a Rompler like Nexus couldn't give you equally (or near equally :P) as good sound...Or something like Sylenth1 or Zebra that could in fact model something as good.

Hell, I've heard ALOT of Nexus in Armin van Buuren's work, and it's still pretty good.

And there are some variables to "well produced" music...the quality of the producer his or herself for example...And many TA'ers seem to think that as a whole, the overall quality is going down since any "newbie" can get their hands on digital software...So it would stand to reason that these newbies would still produce garbage with analogue at their disposal.

So I can see how Analogue elitism might reek of bullshit as well after having read through this thread...You have to have lots of money to make well produced music? I'd say go fuck yourself...Not like there's a shitload of money to be had in the music industry anyway unless you're a Tip-top producer, so why invest so much when an equally as good alternative is available...especially when you stand never to make it back by selling your music.

quote:

Originally posted by Twilothunder23 I wasn't talking specifically about you I was addressing the mentality people have here. Waaaay too many ignorant noobs that have never made a half decent record like to take off their pants pull out their penis and take a piss at the entire recording industry. Way too many people are too quick to dismiss the entire recording industry... the tools of the great mixing and mastering studios with the great engineers that have been mixing for a living since some of you were shitting in diapers as ''unnecessary shit'' when you and I know very well that the best sounding records were not made itb on computer shit they were made on real industrial strength gear aimed to the professional market. And that is the bottom line. Those records from the 90s that we grew up listening to sound better than the stuff being put out today and for me it is worth paying the extra dime if your music is really up to par or at least be humble and learn. I mean... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CCIjz1ZXAs ^ Sounds pretty good to me.

While analogue gear is great and all, there is a climate of people who defend it like it's the be all, and end all, without having ever made anything great themselves, kind of like the inverted same case as you describe with people who swear by all ITB and have never made great tune while pissing on analogue gear. It really goes both ways.

In terms of Analogue gear or even GS, you're right but you're also talking about such a tiny percentage of people on planet eart who actually BOTH have the talent, and the kit to warrant it.

Re: Re: Re: When will the obsession with "analog" stop?

quote:

Originally posted by Richard Butler No way. Nothing has surpased the look of Alien 1979 or Predator 1986.

Not so much Predator, but fucking Ailen and Aliens is right on the money. It was all racketeering and models, and it still looks incredibly good even to this day. A cartoonish, digital chest burster just would not be the same.

quote:

Originally posted by theterran Seems like the basic discussion is more about how our modern digital technology can accurately model analogue in a much cheaper fashion, and why people are still going apeshit over analogue when there's no audible difference.

It makes difference on the final product.
The final prodcut sounds better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CCIjz1ZXAs

^
Record a saw off an old korg synthi and listen to how it sounds then do the same thing on the es1. Yeah... no audible difference

quote:

Originally posted by theterran thing is, it's really a moot argument anyway...it's all about personal preference and what makes you hard with regards to producing music. If you need that multi-thousand dollar Roland synth to give you a musical stiffy, then by all means...But that's not to say even a Rompler like Nexus couldn't give you equally as good sound... Hell, I've heard ALOT of Nexus in Armin van Buuren's work, and it's still pretty good.

Nexus ain't ntohing but SAMPLED presets. Straight of the 1080 straight off the jp8000 straight off the virus synth into SAMPLIT. For fucks sake there are even LOOPS OFF OTHER PEOPLES MUSIC. This dude created the ultimate trance rompler by sampling the factory presets of old digital synthesizers. And his product reflects his mentality. The whole shit is illegal why you think you cant buy nexus in guitar center? They will sue his ass in a split second hell they even sued roland in the 90s over those 1080 expansion cards.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN While analogue gear is great and all, there is a climate of people who defend it like it's the be all, and end all, without having ever made anything great themselves, kind of like the inverted same case as you describe with people who swear by all ITB and have never made great tune while pissing on analogue gear. It really goes both ways. In terms of Analogue gear or even GS, you're right but you're also talking about such a tiny percentage of people on planet eart who actually BOTH have the talent, and the kit to warrant it.

I went to the chicane website dropped by the forum and used wayback to see what he used to use to make his records. Chicane so amazing. Guess what he had a big ass studio but like I said the most important thing is the music. The only time when your average fan is gonna notice the sound quality is when the sound is really good or really bad. If you can get your music though and the sound quality does not get in the way of anybody liking the record like msz can then it becomes a personal decision like he said he is looking to upgrade his rig to sound even better.


If you are like that other dude that said I am building a ''Jacuzzi studio with inspiring lighting'' and started talking about acoustic reflections and shit like that when (ahem) lets just say he had a loooong way to go before he truly discovered his artistic potential (see see better wording than last time) then save your money and focus more on song writing. But gear is not unnecessary and no software is not JUST as good. Don't get it twisted.

quote:

Originally posted by Twilothunder23 It makes difference on the final product. The final prodcut sounds better. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CCIjz1ZXAs ^ Record a saw off an old korg synthi and listen to how it sounds then do the same thing on the es1. Yeah... no audible difference

You're comparing apples to oranges. How about comparing the Arturia Minimoog V to a real Moog Voyager? They sound virtually identical.

quote:

Originally posted by Twilothunder23 Nexus ain't ntohing but SAMPLED presets. Straight of the 1080 straight off the jp8000 straight off the virus synth into SAMPLIT. For fucks sake there are even LOOPS OFF OTHER PEOPLES MUSIC. This dude created the ultimate trance rompler by sampling the factory presets of old digital synthesizers. And his product reflects his mentality. The whole shit is illegal why you think you cant buy nexus in guitar center? They will sue his ass in a split second hell they even sued roland in the 90s over those 1080 expansion cards.

I've never had much love for it, but it's a rompler and I don't think anyone else is trying to say otherwise. It is what it is. That's what romplers do. They have samples of other shit.

I seriously doubt if that's the reason GC won't sell it - its more like they don't have a distributor relationship with Refx.

Roland is a different is a differnt story. They got sued for certain expansion cards (and even synths) for copyright (and patent infringment by moog) as the cards featured full multinote sequences ripped straight from original works. I don't believe nexus does that.

Also there's no copyright on sounds themselves. Exactly why deepdish were pissed with Tall Paul (make the world go round and Let me show you respectively), as they were exactly the same sound, used in the same way but it was a roland bass preset and therefore they had no legal chance to sue him for it.

quote:

Originally posted by Twilothunder23 It makes difference on the final product. The final prodcut sounds better. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CCIjz1ZXAs ^ Record a saw off an old korg synthi and listen to how it sounds then do the same thing on the es1. Yeah... no audible difference

The point isn't that a refined ear could hear the difference, it's that the "masses" couldn't hear the difference...especially on the majority of their garbage sound systems...And that song sounds like shit played through youtube.

You don't have to preach to me anyway, I love the sound of analogue and prefer it when I can get it...but I think that software/sound engineers will get to the point where it will no longer be necessary.

I've seen/heard a few true analogue software synths that put your soundcard through the same paces as an analogue synth. (Can't remember the names off hand but they were damn close to true analogue)

quote:

Nexus ain't ntohing but SAMPLED presets.

Yeah I know what Nexus is :P. I use it to help practice emulating high quality sounds on my VST's. Safe to say, Sylenth1 does a damn good job replicating a high end 16T supersaw.

i herd ded mau five uzes analog stuff so its best







...please don't hurt me

Has anyone considered that the purpose of digital gear now is not to emulate analog gear? Sure this was the purpose of some of the earlier stuff, for example the bank on my Nord Rack which is a 'replication' of presets from a SC Prophet V.

Haven't we moved on????

Gear should be considered for it's application not it's construction.

Example, I want a Juno 106. Not because I want to sit it in my studio and wank over it's heritage, it's because I want to make pads on it due to the warm Chorus it uses because I can't find a VA, softsynth or software effect which gets it as close as I want.

Equally, at times I need to use the hollow digital sounds from a softsynth like Vanguard.

hopefully sooner rather than later.

Re: Re: When will the obsession with "analog" stop?

quote:

Originally posted by Timothy I have been thinking the same also. In movies, it's all digital now and when you look at movies such as Avatar, it looks much better than old analog films. So why do we have not seen the same evolution in audio.

Are you serious? You can't so easily compare one sense to another.

Digital looks better when it comes to film, but digital doesn't sound better, at least not in my view.

Digital synths can be too static where as their analog counterparts aren't and have the analog warmth. Vinyl is still a nicer sounding medium because of this.

quote:

Originally posted by MSZ LEAVE ANALOG ALONE. WHATS NEXT? SIDECHAIN?! FUK!!!

....cowbell is next....

It will never stop, as software will NEVER close the last 50% emulation gap. And it can't be downloaded, people will always want something real and authentic.

I guess a lot of people are happy with what software brings, others just want a different vibe that software can't bring. One is not better than the other, one just does something that the other still can't quite catch up with.

I really don't get it why all the VST boys still have the urge to start topics to justify that their emuations sound as good. Who cares?!?

And if others burn 20K$ on outboard? again who cares?!?
This whole debate is a non issue. Spend what you want, have pride of ownership, don't download and be happy and productive.

What I don't understand is why the word "analog" and "vintage" needs to be used for marketing new stuff. Can't new digital gear and vsti be great on their own?

However I do understand when people actually use real analog synths and other hardware. I don't give a f*ck if I'm not productive and make dozen songs a week. I do what I do for fun. To me having fun when producing music includes using analog and digital gear and virtual instruments.

Why should everyone use just vstis? should everyone also use same sample packs? should everyone use same presets? should everyone sound exactly the same? why can't there be variation? Just because you have found the way which suits you best doesn't mean that everyone should act and think like you.

Next you propably argue that vsti's and samples sound better in Mac than they do in PC.

lol, that's indeed a good point, all those crappy vsti's with "real analoque modelling filters"

let VSTi's be good in their own right, in the digital domain, not to piggyback ride trying to emulate something that can never be emulated, like UAD tries with analoque outboard....

Duplicated post error

This guy below, all analogue, much of it vintage. I read his FM interview and from reading was convinced he must have an awesome sound, but honestly it's run of the mill to my ears.

Myself I don't see why people polarise themselves. Analogue and digital are different, and one can use both, or either to make good music.

I do have an analogue synth (Leipzig) which I use for break leads.
My best mate had an Oberheim OBX (I think) and an SH101 and I had a Moog Rogue and we used to use them a lot but honestly most of the sounds were ok, but nothing particualry to get worked up about.

True, VST's are good in there own rights. It's like waterpaint and oil paint, both can make great paintings, though have different characteristics. At the end of the day, it's the painter that makes the difference.

Analog v Digital thread no. 123456

quote:

Originally posted by evo8 Analog v Digital thread no. 123456

Next on the agenda:
PC vs Mac no. 132435663900020022374288982

quote:

Originally posted by Raphie I really don't get it why all the VST boys still have the urge to start topics to justify that their emuations sound as good.

quote:

Originally posted by evo8 Analog v Digital thread no. 123456

That is not what this topic is about. At all. I own and use both analog and digital stuff myself.

This is about the seeming need for people who make or use VSTs or other digital synths to justify their choice in terms of them "sounding analog" or whatever. Rather than letting the sound stand on its own merits. And also about the tendency of some who use analog stuff to be purist or elitist about their methods.

I meant it as a discussion about user attitudes, not another stupid "analog versus digital, which is better, derp?!"

we're on the same page here, it is about SW guys for some reason wanting to have their cake and eat it. SW is fine, just don't try to sell it as HW ITB..... and stop all the analoque modelled marketing crap...

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