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-- A farewell message to the music industry from Fabio Stein
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quote:

Originally posted by DJRYAN� Holden says, "any dj over 30 needs to quit"... I'm 29... But I aint quitting... How old is Oakenfold??

holden can be compared to a man that was once sane then experienced his first acid trip and went fucking bonkers

also, any one over 30? what the fuck is dj'ing, playing a physical sport? what are your bones lacking calcium and hurting from twisting those knobz? age has no meaning, if you're good, you're good. if you know good music, you're still relevant in this field. people are fucking putting the musical pussy on a pedestal, man.

Honestly this sounds pretty reasonable. The scene is far from dead but it's pretty fair to say EDM is a completely different monster than it used to be. It's a genre almost defined by the technology used to create it, and that technology used to improve faster than most artists can keep up with...

We live in the age of software and the internet, bedroom producers are a dime a dozen, and nobody has any hurdles to try and overcome. I think most producers like me just listen to modern trance, think "That's what I want my music to sound like!" and all of their effort goes into emulation, rather than innovation.

I try to do new things with trance, I really do.. I don't know if I succeed, since my focus is on doing new things musically with the trance form, and few purists seem to give a shit about that. I'm not trying to make a divide between me, and other bedroom producers, but I really do think a lot of people see EDM as a technical exercise that has a final "goal", which is just being able to make music as good as your favorite artists. They don't want their own sound, they want to sound like Deadmau5 or Blueman or whoever.. I want my own sound, and I'm trying to achieve it, but I think that's lost on a lot of modern producers.

So, yeah, I guess I see where he's coming from.

i think any relatively successful EDM producer needs to first get a manager and a pr agent and discover that there is a world of opportunity in so many different areas of music for EDM producers to get involved.

The producers that get frustrated don't see to have a plan of action. YOu can make a very lucrative living as a EDM producer and not have to dj. I suppose you might have to be a little more flexible in that you might have to sort of stretch your range but still, the skills of a great producer are in need and it isn't hard to make a living.

People just have tunnel vision. I'm a producer, so I dj.A colleague of mine makes about 30 000$ a year doing audio for forensics on top of his main stuff. It works out to about 1000$ an hour. There are just so many ways. I think the main issue is that producers get stuck in this rut as to what is possible with their skill set. I also think they all tend to have drug issues at least the ones that start djing and experience a little success which is probably the number one fuckup noobs make.

There are so many opportunities to make a living even as someone that you might think specializes in a niche market. You can be a sound designer, pop co producer .....

Couldn't agree more to be honest.

No offense to this guy, but he doesn't strike me as having a skill set to get very far in the very competitive music industry. It looks like he started as a trance DJ, learned a little bit of production/remixes to support his DJing, and had some modest success with a handful of songs in a very niche market - not a good road map if you're looking to avoid dead ends IMO. Also, his woe-is-me resignation rant tells me that he has the wrong attitude to survive very long in the industry.

Incidentally, I had never heard of Mr. Stein before this thread, so I spent a little time listening to his tracks on youtube. Am I the only one who can listen to a track like the one below and find it very ironic that he is complaining about the lack of unique and special music in EDM and asking "where's the beef?" This track epitomizes lack of substance and original thinking - it's generic, formulaic, robotic, and I don't think I heard a chord change in the entire song (TBH, I sorta tuned it out from boredom after about 4 minutes).

I skipped 45 seconds into the track right away, all he changed at that point was add a hi-hat. seriously? almost an entire minute of the track is a boring percussion line that barely changes. very little variation, next to no layering, what the hell?

this guy is part of the problem he's complaining of. what a joke.

quote:

Originally posted by cryophonik No offense to this guy, but he doesn't strike me as having a skill set to get very far in the very competitive music industry. It looks like he started as a trance DJ, learned a little bit of production/remixes to support his DJing, and had some modest success with a handful of songs in a very niche market - not a good road map if you're looking to avoid dead ends IMO. Also, his woe-is-me resignation rant tells me that he has the wrong attitude to survive very long in the industry. Incidentally, I had never heard of Mr. Stein before this thread, so I spent a little time listening to his tracks on youtube. Am I the only one who can listen to a track like the one below and find it very ironic that he is complaining about the lack of unique and special music in EDM and asking "where's the beef?" This track epitomizes lack of substance and original thinking - it's generic, formulaic, robotic, and I don't think I heard a chord change in the entire song (TBH, I sorta tuned it out from boredom after about 4 minutes).

The guy really likes to drag out the intro.

quote:

Originally posted by Kysora Honestly this sounds pretty reasonable. The scene is far from dead but it's pretty fair to say EDM is a completely different monster than it used to be. It's a genre almost defined by the technology used to create it, and that technology used to improve faster than most artists can keep up with... We live in the age of software and the internet, bedroom producers are a dime a dozen, and nobody has any hurdles to try and overcome. I think most producers like me just listen to modern trance, think "That's what I want my music to sound like!" and all of their effort goes into emulation, rather than innovation. I try to do new things with trance, I really do.. I don't know if I succeed, since my focus is on doing new things musically with the trance form, and few purists seem to give a shit about that. I'm not trying to make a divide between me, and other bedroom producers, but I really do think a lot of people see EDM as a technical exercise that has a final "goal", which is just being able to make music as good as your favorite artists. They don't want their own sound, they want to sound like Deadmau5 or Blueman or whoever.. I want my own sound, and I'm trying to achieve it, but I think that's lost on a lot of modern producers. So, yeah, I guess I see where he's coming from.

Just like any other artform, its extremely difficult to truly express yourself. Everyone starts out emulating someone else, its just a fact of life.Most people won't make it to the point of perfect expression.

out of curiosity do you guys think he cleared the rights for that tetris track? we've been wanting to do something similar with a somewhat well known video game track..

back on topic though yes i tend to agree with everyone, he sounds like a whiney old fart who's more concerned with success than following his passion. good luck to the guy though

Of course he didn't clear the rights.

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller Of course he didn't clear the rights.

yeah that's what i figured, strange as hellhouse is a pretty big label too so you'd think they would be on top of that

quote:

Originally posted by Beatflux Just like any other artform, its extremely difficult to truly express yourself. Everyone starts out emulating someone else, its just a fact of life.Most people won't make it to the point of perfect expression.

Yeah, but you see it a lot more in art forms that don't really require a lot of effort or money to get started, which music production fits well enough into. There's not really a stereotype of most painters imitating Bob Ross, I imagine sculptors don't try to imitate.. uh, whoever the basshunter of sculpting is.

I just think there's too much information out there on how to sound like your favorite artists. People don't even approach music production as a creative skill, it's all technical and there's a "right" and "wrong" way to do everything to them, and the only ones who are doing it "right" are the artists they like.

I'm not saying everyone is like that but I think a large part of the stagnation of modern trance has to do with most artists getting into it purely to emulate instead of innovate. People get so caught up with how their mixes sound that the actual songwriting becomes secondary, hence the cliches found in uplifting trance. Using a certain melody somewhere becomes as much of a cookie-cutter process as using compression or anything else.

quote:

Originally posted by Kysora There's not really a stereotype of most painters imitating Bob Ross, I imagine sculptors don't try to imitate.. uh, whoever the basshunter of sculpting is.

Jeff Koons?

quote:

Originally posted by Kysora Yeah, but you see it a lot more in art forms that don't really require a lot of effort or money to get started, which music production fits well enough into. There's not really a stereotype of most painters imitating Bob Ross, I imagine sculptors don't try to imitate.. uh, whoever the basshunter of sculpting is. I just think there's too much information out there on how to sound like your favorite artists. People don't even approach music production as a creative skill, it's all technical and there's a "right" and "wrong" way to do everything to them, and the only ones who are doing it "right" are the artists they like. I'm not saying everyone is like that but I think a large part of the stagnation of modern trance has to do with most artists getting into it purely to emulate instead of innovate. People get so caught up with how their mixes sound that the actual songwriting becomes secondary, hence the cliches found in uplifting trance. Using a certain melody somewhere becomes as much of a cookie-cutter process as using compression or anything else.

The whole commercial culture revolves around selling you more equipment and more plug-ins. Hence, there's more articles and videos made for improving the technical aspects of music creation. Forum talk is also lined with an undercurrent of a relativistic attitude towards the creative process and a juxtaposing objective view towards mixing and mastering. Neither view is really correct, but that's what the forum goers will conscious or unconsciously pick up on and practice in their music making.

quote:

Originally posted by turpentine yeah that's what i figured, strange as hellhouse is a pretty big label too so you'd think they would be on top of that

not really a big a label in the grand scheme of things.

true, but in the sense that yoji is a fairly respectable artist so i assume there must have been loophole or something that allowed them to release it. i read on fabios soundcloud that corsten tried to get the rights some years back and was denied by nintendo so that why i was curious

quote:

Originally posted by Beatflux The whole commercial culture revolves around selling you more equipment and more plug-ins. Hence, there's more articles and videos made for improving the technical aspects of music creation. Forum talk is also lined with an undercurrent of a relativistic attitude towards the creative process and a juxtaposing objective view towards mixing and mastering. Neither view is really correct, but that's what the forum goers will conscious or unconsciously pick up on and practice in their music making.

Agreed completely, though I can't really tell if you're agreeing with me or not.

quote:

Originally posted by turpentine true, but in the sense that yoji is a fairly respectable artist so i assume there must have been loophole or something that allowed them to release it. i read on fabios soundcloud that corsten tried to get the rights some years back and was denied by nintendo so that why i was curious

corsten is on another playing level. Fabio is an underground artist that could remix a lady gaga track and interscope wouldn't lift a finger.

quote:

Originally posted by Looney4Clooney corsten is on another playing level. Fabio is an underground artist that could remix a lady gaga track and interscope wouldn't lift a finger.

oh, i meant corsten tried to clear the samples so he could release fabio's track. im still curious though, i can only assume it's because he re-produced the sounds and didn't sample them directly, though im pretty sure there's still some interpolation rights clearance involved in "reproducing" melodies. not sure exactly. then again as you mentioned maybe he's just small enough that nobody cares

Melodies fall under copyright, if I remember correctly. So it wouldn't matter if you made the actual sounds yourself.

SID chip synths are around and I doubt Tchaikovsky is gonna sue. Even if you used the original from the game, you could just say it was a remake. Major labels do this. If you can get away with it and show that you have the paperwork to show you did a soundalike, then you are fine.

quote:

Originally posted by Kysora Agreed completely, though I can't really tell if you're agreeing with me or not.

Mostly agree. I think if you want to be successful you have to have some chops for songwriting.

Well...

I'm brazilian, I know Fabio Stein personally, I did visit his studio in S�o Paulo.
He is a very humble guy, he used to share his production techniques and skills with patience and attention. He gave feedback for lots of producers here in Brazil (Danilo Ercole for example, yet they have different production styles).
Fabio is a rare person in this $cene.

In my opinion, judge his technical skills by one track only (Techtris, one of his first ones when he used to produce with Buzz tracker yet) is totally unfair, because I dont think you would do the same with artists you like.

He is very talented, versatile, and creative, but ok, its matter of opinion.
http://www.discogs.com/artist/Fabio+Stein
He is not a wannabe or newbie in the scene... He could produce an Arty/Cosmic Gate/Dinka/Mark Knight or whatever famous guy style track in beatport if he wants, but it was-not-his-style... Think a little and you can understand this...

In the end, he was bored with the scene and quit, c'mon guys, what is the problem with this? Just respect him and try understand him, lots of producers do that (ie. vincent de moor, andy blueman).

I read his farewell message and I can understand him, so I wish him good luck.


***

And Laurent...

I accompany your work, blog/trance.nu/tranceaddict posts since 2002 when I knew trance music, obviously you are one of my classic producers that I admire.
But like you said, you (and Yves Deruyter) used to do like Fabio Stein, the difference is: he complained once and quit, he is moving on. You complained million of times and you didnt quit, YET.
I'm your fan too but when you quit for some reason, maybe you will understand Fabio Stein and others that leave the scene.
I wish you last longer before this...

And dont understand me wrong, please... But quoting "Fabio who?" because you have literally hundreds and hundreds of releases was not cool, imo... You used to be very humble and helpful.

Good luck and peace,

Anthony.

quote:

Originally posted by Vector A Melodies fall under copyright, if I remember correctly. So it wouldn't matter if you made the actual sounds yourself.

you'd still need to clear it with the publisher

quote:

Originally posted by PlasticSoul In the end, he was bored with the scene and quit, c'mon guys, what is the problem with this? Just respect him...

The problem with it is exactly what I stated and quoted in my earlier post. He called out the entire industry for not living up to his expectations. Not only is it a totally self-centered and dick-ish thing for someone in his position to say, it is also very juvenile and, as mentioned, hypocritical considering that he himself is as guilty as anybody for the lack of originality in EDM. Yes, I only posted one (terrible) track, but I listened to several other more current tracks and they weren't anything special either. So, to get up on a pedestal and tell the world that he is going to take his ball and go home because the industry isn't doing what he himself can't do (i.e., make dance music that is unique and special) is not something that is worthy of respect. Beyond that, I don't know a thing about him and wish him no ill will, but he clearly needs a lesson in humility.

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