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-- Was the Canadian government right in severing diplomatic relations with Iran?
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I don�t understands why some believe that by keep on isolating and putting Iran into the corner that they would just simply change their behavior and give up their nuclear ambitions? Wouldn�t you get pissed off and fight back at some point if someone throws you into a corner and stops giving you food and water? The West is simply trying to eliminate all diplomacy channels and pushing more and more towards a military resolution with Iran.

Political double standards are being employed by all world powers, not just Canada, USA and UK but also Russia and China.

The embargo on Iran will not work, its obvious. If anything, Iran is shifting towards Asian markets which will bring enough money into Tehran coffers to continue their current way of things.

And democracy is just a pretty word, we all know that its merely a list of temporary privileges which can be revoked at anytime, just ask the 1942 Japanese Americans who were forcefully interned in camps and denied all their constitutional rights

I highly doubt that Israel will attack Iran directly. If they were gonna do it, they would have do it long time ago already. But the more they talk about it, the less its likely to happen. Its just sabre rattling. Although its evident that Israel has been waging attacks on Iran by proxy means, i.e. Stuxnet virus and assassinations of nuclear scientists. Which brings a question to mind - isn't that a terrorist act in itself?

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer I don�t understands why some believe that by keep on isolating and putting Iran into the corner that they would just simply change their behavior and give up their nuclear ambitions? Wouldn�t you get pissed off and fight back at some point if someone throws you into a corner and stops giving you food and water? The West is simply trying to eliminate all diplomacy channels and pushing more and more towards a military resolution with Iran.

middle eastern circle is finally closing with iran and syria. and im pretty sure you know exactly why is this happening.

im giving 3 years tops before same shit happens in venezuela, tops !!

what i find extremely immoral is fighting for human rights with bombs

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Originally posted by Magnetonium The level of human rights and democratic process is pathetic in Iran. Just this week I read this:

First of all as far as democratic processes go you can't really take criticism from the States as they've enabled so many dictators around the world they genuinely only care about that if it's in their best interest. Keep in mind the main reason Iran is as extreme as they are right now is because the US backed the Shah for 38 years there as a ruthless dictator. Current process is far from legit, but much better than what the States forced on them for many years. The list of similar US backed dictators is a long one so their complaints on worldwide democracy are as valid as anything from Russia or China imo...

Secondly, before you take stories like this hand fed to the public by mainstream US news you need to ask yourself why in a world of 7 billion people 1 person in 1 country is making headlines. There's a total smear campaign on for Iran as they're trying to muster as much public support for a war as possible. Saudi Arabia has a MUCH bigger list of human violations for much more ridiculous "crimes". A girl facing the death penalty for being a victim of rape beats someone losing citizenship over photos any day of the week. But, you'll never hear about any of that on ABC and here's why:

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Originally posted by GGM First of all as far as democratic processes go you can't really take criticism from the States as they've enabled so many dictators around the world they genuinely only care about that if it's in their best interest. Keep in mind the main reason Iran is as extreme as they are right now is because the US backed the Shah for 38 years there as a ruthless dictator. Current process is far from legit, but much better than what the States forced on them for many years. The list of similar US backed dictators is a long one so their complaints on worldwide democracy are as valid as anything from Russia or China imo... Secondly, before you take stories like this hand fed to the public by mainstream US news you need to ask yourself why in a world of 7 billion people 1 person in 1 country is making headlines. There's a total smear campaign on for Iran as they're trying to muster as much public support for a war as possible. Saudi Arabia has a MUCH bigger list of human violations for much more ridiculous "crimes". A girl facing the death penalty for being a victim of rape beats someone losing citizenship over photos any day of the week. But, you'll never hear about any of that on ABC and here's why:

Excellent post. The West is becoming very very desperate to push their agenda on Iran and they are trying to find anything they can against them. If only the people would read the history of Iran and understand whats really going on here. This is not about bringing Democracy into Iran. It is far from that.

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer I don�t understands why some believe that by keep on isolating and putting Iran into the corner that they would just simply change their behavior and give up their nuclear ambitions? Wouldn�t you get pissed off and fight back at some point if someone throws you into a corner and stops giving you food and water? The West is simply trying to eliminate all diplomacy channels and pushing more and more towards a military resolution with Iran.

While I give Iranian govt a little more credit for rationality than North Korea, even with that nutjob as president, appeasing North Korea didn't work. Appeasement never works. It just makes you look weak.

While I'm all for keeping diplomatic channel open, Canada is not going to be a major player in influencing Iran, so in reality, closing down the embassy really has very little effect in world politics stage.

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Originally posted by Yohan While I'm all for keeping diplomatic channel open, Canada is not going to be a major player in influencing Iran, so in reality, closing down the embassy really has very little effect in world politics stage.

That's the problem though. Canada used to be the country always on the negotiating table and the last to leave but things have changed a lot under Harper.

I'm so sick of hearing about Iran. I don't even know why Canada bothers making these little political statements. This is an Israel-Iran conflict, always has been. If the US wants to get involved and play Big Brother, that's their perogative, but I really don't think the average Canadian cares one way or the other.

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Originally posted by Yohan so in reality, closing down the embassy really has very little effect in world politics stage.

maybe not world politics but the consequences will be horrible. as somebody pointed out already, there is hundreds of thousands of Iranians living in Canada who have millions of relatives still living in Iran. how will they visit their families??

i am completely baffled by this move.

also, as GGM pointed out, why not cut off all ties with Saudi Arabia?? Iran financing terrorist is just a hearsay at the moment but Saudis ties with all kinds of bad things that have happened in the past decade are well documented.

this looks really bad on Canada.

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer That's the problem though. Canada used to be the country always on the negotiating table and the last to leave but things have changed a lot under Harper.

this is more of lulz than to be taken seriously, but seems some people think Harper is a great statesman

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...article4536110/

then there is latest rant from Ahmadinejad. seems Iran's enemies have developed weather controlling machines
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...article4536660/

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Originally posted by Yohan this is more of lulz than to be taken seriously, but seems some people think Harper is a great statesman http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...article4536110/

Nothing against the guy and his foundation. He's done some great work but there is definitely bias with an award coming from an organisation controlled by one person. This has more to do with Harper's unwavering support of Israel than anything.

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Stephen Harper will travel to New York this month to receive a �World Statesman of the Year� award from an organization called the Appeal of Conscience Foundation.

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Rabbi Arthur Schneier, (b. March 20, 1930 in Vienna, Austria) Founder and President of the Appeal of Conscience Foundation since 1965, and Senior Rabbi, Park East Synagogue, New York since 1962

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Originally posted by GGM ... is because the US backed the Shah for 38 years there as a ruthless dictator....

What makes you think they're not supporting the idiots in charge right now in secret anyway? There's a non stop cash flow in some asshole's pockets on this side of the planet for the past 30 years.

I heard a story that a year before the Iran Revolution no one gave a flying fuck about Khomeini and all the Islamist fundamentalist mother******s.

They pretty much caught everyone by surprise when they suddenly took power and came on top of all the other opposition.

And then the slaughter began (Left,right,center, anyone that didn't believe in their way of democracy) and it continues till today.


The World powers will always want conflict on that side of the World. It'll just never end...well Until they run out of all the natural resources.

In the name Of dictatorship, Democracy or theocracy..whatever works

USA will work with anyone who supports them. Russians support the brutal Assad regime, Americans supported the Shah, Chinese support Sudan. I am well aware of the Mossadekh thing in '53, as well as what could have been and when. Imagine if the Germans didnt help smuggle Lenin into Russia so that the Bolsheviks never came to power? Yeah, I imagine that too.

It is true that Canada is hurting Iranian Canadians with the embassy closure, but one must wonder as to how did the embassy manage to stay open for so long, given our political closeness and support to USA. The trade between our countries is weak to say the least.

Iran is a pathological liar, an authoritarian regime that is bent on destroying Israel. They are guilty of crimes against own people in a way that the Shah once was. There is no excuse to blame that on USA. Its a country based on strict religious values and Islamist code. Their leaders and military peeps at Revolutionary Guard have huge egos that prevent them from reaching any political compromise in the current mess between Iran and the West. They claim that they are againstn uclear weapons yet are weaponizing uranium and building illicit nuclear installations, covertly hiding the true nature of their nuclear program.

It's a fucking mess any time fundamentalists run things.

There used to be a joke about the Iran- US standoff:

On the one hand, there's a country run by messianic, apocalyptic, religious fundamentalists...






... on the other hand, there's Iran.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Iran is a pathological liar, an authoritarian regime that is bent on destroying Israel.

You dont think Israel wants to destroy Iran if they get the green light from the big daddy USA? Come on now.

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They claim that they are againstn uclear weapons yet are weaponizing uranium and building illicit nuclear installations, covertly hiding the true nature of their nuclear program.

Yet as usual there is ZERO evidence of them making a bomb. I know you are smart guy dude but I'm not sure why you are not seeing whats happening here? Did you forget how they lied about Iraq? How is it different now?

I will also leave this for those you wanting to learn more about Iran's history:

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Originally posted by Wurm It's a fucking mess any time fundamentalists run things. There used to be a joke about the Iran- US standoff: On the one hand, there's a country run by messianic, apocalyptic, religious fundamentalists... ... on the other hand, there's Iran.

You nailed it.

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer You dont think Israel wants to destroy Iran if they get the green light from the big daddy USA? Come on now.

Nonsense. Israel is a tiny nation of 5 million people, while Iran is a very spacious gigantic country of over 70 million. Or something like that, but thats not the point. Israel cannot destroy Iran (albeit using nuclear weapons), they lack the arsenal, logistics, support and money to do so. There's absolutely no point in destroying Iran. They have no intention of destroying any nation in the region - Lebanon, Egypt, Jordan and Syria have not been wiped off the map, man! ... well, apart from the Palestinian statehood (but that's another topic)

Couple more points to add as to why Canada should not have political relations with Iran - mainly because Iran laughs at the rights of people with Canadian passports. Iran does not respect the Canadian Passport. Iran does not abide by Diplomatic Immunity rules. Just to give you some examples:



Zahra Kazemi, A female Canadian photojournalist was killed in Iranian custody after she was arrested for photographing a student protest. There are reports she was raped and tortured.

Hossein Derakhshan, an Iranian Canadian Blogger, has been in Iranian custody since 2008 for comments he made about an Iranian cleric. He was accused of spying for Israel and sentenced to 19 years in prison.

Saeed Malekpour, a web designer and programmer has been sentenced to death for his part in creating a photo sharing program that was used for pornography.

Ghassemi-Shall, Iranian Canadian shoe salesman, sentenced to death on charges of spying.

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Canadian stymied in efforts to help Hamid Ghassemi-Shall Published on Wednesday March 14, 2012 As Toronto shoe salesman Hamid Ghassemi-Shall awaits execution in an Iranian prison, efforts by the Canadian government to help him have been rebuffed. �Iran has repeatedly refused Canada�s requests to allow us to visit Mr. Ghassemi-Shall, a Canadian citizen, to provide consular assistance,� said a statement from John Babcock, spokesman for Diane Ablonczy, the minister responsible for consular affairs. �We are very concerned about reports that Mr. Ghassemi-Shall may be facing the death penalty.� Ghassemi-Shall, 43, was arrested in 2008 on a visit to his bereaved mother in Iran. He was charged with espionage and condemned to death after a trial widely decried as unfair. Although an Iranian judge has said he would review the case, and believed Ghassemi-Shall not guilty, apparent political pressure has ended hope of an appeal. Iran has executed more than 600 people in the last year, and the pace is escalating.

And then there's this - Ahmadinejad still calls for wiping Israel off the map, in nicer words this time:

http://in.reuters.com/article/2012/...E8JH4XX20120817

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DUBAI, Aug 17 (Reuters) - Many thousands of Iranians shouted "Death to America, death to Israel" during state-organised protests on Friday and President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad told them there was no place for the Jewish state in a future Middle East. Iran, penalised by tough Western sanctions, faces the threat of an Israeli or U.S. military strike on its disputed nuclear facilities. With popular uprisings reshaping the region, the Islamic Republic is also trying to prevent the overthrow of its closest Arab ally, Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. "You want a new Middle East? We do too, but in the new Middle East ... there will be no trace of the American presence and the Zionists," Ahmadinejad told worshippers at Tehran University in an event broadcast live on state television. The Iranian leader, whose own authority is under challenge from hardliners as well as reformers, was restating Tehran's familiar goals as the Middle East undergoes a very different upheaval from the 1979 Islamic revolution that toppled the U.S.-backed Shah and brought Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini to power. "Saving the existence of the Zionist regime (Israel) is a joint commitment by most arrogant Western governments," Ahmadinejad said in a speech to mark the annual Al-Quds (Jerusalem) Day decreed by Khomeini and held on the last Friday of the Muslim holy fasting month of Ramadan. He called for Muslim unity to foil Western support for Israel, which he described as a "cancerous tumour" for its occupation of Palestinian land. But there was little unity on display at an Islamic summit in Mecca earlier this week when the 57-member Organisation of Islamic Cooperation suspended Syria despite Iran's objections.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Nonsense. Israel is a tiny nation of 5 million people, while Iran is a very spacious gigantic country of over 70 million. Or something like that, but thats not the point. Israel cannot destroy Iran (albeit using nuclear weapons), they lack the arsenal, logistics, support and money to do so.

They dont have to go after Iran alone they have US OF A right behind them.

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There's absolutely no point in destroying Iran. They have no intention of destroying any nation in the region - Lebanon, Egypt, Jordan and Syria have not been wiped off the map, man! ... well, apart from the Palestinian statehood (but that's another topic)

They have not been wiped off the map but they have been bombed to death over and over again. Lebanon 2008 rings a bell? Are you suggesting that Israel is a Democracy living peacefully with all those countries? Hmmmm..

Why should Canada bend so much for Israel? Why cant we be mutual and not take sides? Would you be ok for us to go to war to fight for Israel? FUCK NO.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Nonsense. Israel is a tiny nation of 5 million people, while Iran is a very spacious gigantic country of over 70 million.)

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Israel is widely believed to possess nuclear weapons[6][7] and to be the sixth country in the world to develop them.

while Iran "has a potential to develop weapons of mass destruction:"

lol

oooh, here's the fun fact for you :

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Today for the 20th year in a row, the UN General Assembly has voted to condemn the United States� 50-year-old economic embargo on Cuba. How did the votes turn out this year? YES (against embargo) � 186 NO (in favor of embargo) � 2 ABSTAIN � 3 (details of the country lists in the vote count have not yet been published) Last year there were 187 votes in favor of ending U.S. sanctions on Cuba, two against (Israel and the U.S.) and three abstentions (Palau, Marshall Islands, and Micronesia). Again, we are reminded of the fact that the rest of the world is against us for our policy towards Cuba.

in the past 40 or 50 years, there has been 3 countries voting yes on Cuba embargo: usa, masrhall islands (whatever the FUCK that country is, sometimes for, sometimes against) and of course Israel.

now, i can totally understand why usa has a grudge against Cuba. and, if i knew what the FUCK is marshall island) i could totally understand what do they have against them. but....israel...against Cuba??

but lets set all that aside and try to be realistic about it.

almost 200 countries say NO year after year, BUT usa and israel say YES and....fuck everybody else. fuck.everybody.else.

im Orthodox Christian and its in my nature NEVER EVER to take a Muslim side. unless its a fucking rape of a nation. rape, like what they did to Saddam or Gaddafi. or whatever is going on right now.

right is right and wrong, its fucking wrong. you sound like a bright indivindual. they are taking georgias and chechnias side against you, your and mine brethren, one day (right now) they will take sides with them where its profitable and against them where it suits them.....

where do we draw the line???

open your fucking eyes, everybody. line has to be drawn somewhere, it just depends on your perspective !!!

there is no government like no government !!!!

now im reaching for the popcorn...........

Abolish all religion worldwide (this isn't the 12th century anymore, live in the now), smoke weed everyday, high five the shit out of everybody

That's how the political process should go from here on out, IMO.

At least in Toronto I've been to parties with Israelis and Iranians having a good time together.

Hmm, what's thE common denominator?

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer They dont have to go after Iran alone they have US OF A right behind them.

And you really think that American public will support a war against Iran? After what happened in Afghanistan and Iraq?


Check opinion polls. Consider the consequences.

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