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Posted by jp on Oct-06-2002 02:07:

As seen in many Northern American churches...

Posted by Bondor on Oct-06-2002 02:18:

quote:
Originally posted by jploveparade
As seen in many Northern American churches...

LMFAO!!!!

Posted by Arbiter on Oct-06-2002 02:19:

Re: Re: Re: "Conversation with God"

quote:
Originally posted by Michael Russo
I got an idea... since your're such an expert on the topic, why don't you list some arguments FOR the existence of God, and some against.

I'm not talking Christianity here, just God in general.

I don't believe any logically coherent argument exists to support or refute the existence of God. That's exactly WHY I'm agnostic.

Posted by torontotrance on Oct-06-2002 02:40:

More crap from davinox...sighs

Honestly i'm not going to tell you that what I believe is right or not right. Yes I am a christian and I make NO APOLOGIES FOR BEING ONE!. People is today's society want to jump religion and if you want to not believe then that is your point but don't call what other people believe BULLSHIT. Seriously, you can't prove God exists or does not exist with physical evidence, actually you can't prove one single religion (agnostic is also a religion) based on physical evidence but you can't disprove any of it either. Everything is based on faith, believing something you can't see.

Posted by biznology on Oct-06-2002 03:19:

St. Ignacious - patron saint of reach around|

Posted by dj_nomiz on Oct-06-2002 04:32:

watz the point of asking for an explanation if u are already one minded about the topic

Posted by davinox on Oct-06-2002 05:13:

Posted by Dmatrox on Oct-06-2002 05:15:

quote:
Originally posted by torontotrance
More crap from davinox...sighs

Honestly i'm not going to tell you that what I believe is right or not right. Yes I am a christian and I make NO APOLOGIES FOR BEING ONE!. People is today's society want to jump religion and if you want to not believe then that is your point but don't call what other people believe BULLSHIT. Seriously, you can't prove God exists or does not exist with physical evidence, actually you can't prove one single religion (agnostic is also a religion) based on physical evidence but you can't disprove any of it either. Everything is based on faith, believing something you can't see.

did they teach you to say that?

I used to go to a christian school until i finished grade 12, although i wasnt christian. It made me realize that there was such thing as religion. Anyways, what you said above ive heard before just about the same way from christians. I think the christian religion is great, all religions can be great, but ideas of talking to god and speaking tongue are beyond what i find truthful of religion. Im more of a science geek than a religious follower.

have you heard this one before:
"god is dead" -nietzsche
"nietzsche is dead" - god

lol

Posted by Arbiter on Oct-06-2002 05:19:

quote:
Originally posted by torontotrance
agnostic is also a religion

Agnosticism is not a religion, it is the acceptance of the fact that you cannot know the truth. Agnosticism does not assert that anything is true, and therefore there is no aspect of it that would require proof.

Posted by dj_hysterix on Oct-06-2002 10:58:

quote:
Originally posted by jploveparade
As seen in many Northern American churches...

ROFL!

Posted by dr me on Oct-06-2002 12:34:

i know this is not suppose to be a religious debate but i just can't stop myself.

1stly agonist is believing in a "greater power" but not knowing what it is.

2ndly. the one question i want answered is: who made god?

if the answer is no-one, he or she was always there then why can't the universe be always there. ie why have 2 unexplainable events

PS. the picture is LMFAO material

Posted by daydreamer on Oct-06-2002 20:10:

hey

this is what God is to some people. On the day of Sep 11. all americans where like God help us. They where devestated with the attack. I remember crying myself infront of the tv when i saw it the first time. What did i do? I got on my knees and praid for the people on the other building that was still standing asking to let them live. Did i hear a response in my ear. The clouds open and a light shine down on me in the middle of my living room. NO !!!!! I tell you no my friend. Do i feel like he listened to me. Yes he did. No you may say that it was because i praid some people lived. That is not what i am saying. Prayer in unison is what helped. For those of you who dont believe in the bible read on. I got something interesting for you to know. I think everyone knows about the whole 666 THINK right. How it is supposed to be the ends of time. In Hebrew language the "W" stands for "6". That you would not be able to buy or sell without it. Each time you buy or sell on the net. YOU use "WWW." to buy or sell. That equals "666" Is it a coincidence. Maybe, but do you really want to take a risk. Anyone with some actual question can PM me. Would be glad to inform more.

Posted by Dmatrox on Oct-06-2002 20:18:

Re: hey

quote:
Originally posted by daydreamer
How it is supposed to be the ends of time. In Hebrew language the "W" stands for "6". That you would not be able to buy or sell without it. Each time you buy or sell on the net. YOU use "WWW." to buy or sell. That equals "666" Is it a coincidence. Maybe, but do you really want to take a risk. Anyone with some actual question can PM me. Would be glad to inform more.

You had me...and then you lost me.

What does www have to do with buying or selling on the www (which stands for world wide web not 666).

Its just superstition bullshit, like what people think of 13 or millenium.

Posted by magicsushi on Oct-06-2002 22:06:

absence of proof is not proof of absence

Posted by mr. poopyhead on Oct-06-2002 22:37:

how can people apply their criticisms of a religion so broadly? not EVERY church is corrupt... the days of corrupt popes and crusades are long over. its ignorant to find one fault in a religion and point fingers at everyone. christianity is not some worldwide institution. just because a few churches may be corrupt or have been in the past, does not speak for the millions of devoted followers. how ignorant can you be? its exactly this kind of hate and fear of something you can't understand, that drove the catholic church to incite bloody conflicts in the past. that's exactly why there was a protestant movement back in the day, so how can you hold us responsible for things done in the past? i know for a fact that my church donates all its money to various causes, and supports missionaries and stuff.

accusing christians (or any other religion) of being corrupt is like accusing all germans of being nazis... that's just stupid.

for me christianity is not a religion, by that i mean, its not some set of rules that i follow. its a personal relationship with god. something you experience day to day. as for the talking to god, i mean, maybe you all have this idea that you hear some deep james earl jones voice blasting from the heavens every so often... just doesn't happen like that... for me, god speaks many different ways.. its not a literal voice. but i mean, he talks through people, through events, and i see things differently. he shows the way... its just something you have to experience... but i mean, i'm not gonna push this on anyone or anything. you either believe or you don't, but it takes faith...

its fine if people don't believe, but just don't be ignorant about it. i hate when people think that having no faith in anything unseen makes them more rational or intellectual than those who choose to have some faith.

and if i used the word YOU anywhere in my little rant, i was just referring to everyone.

Posted by Technaut on Oct-06-2002 22:48:

i dont believe in god or any form of religion at all. Never have, never will.

Posted by Nadi on Oct-07-2002 00:01:

quote:
Originally posted by magicsushi
absence of proof is not proof of absence

I like that quote a lot. As for speaking to god, it generally means through someone or something, and while I'm not sure I believe in that. I do know that if it is possible you already need to have faith in order to do so yourself.

Posted by attacc on Oct-07-2002 00:20:

I'm a non believer myself, but I envy those who really believe. It must be comforting to "know" it's true.

Posted by dr me on Oct-07-2002 12:54:

someone comment on my 2nd question above please

Posted by Arbiter on Oct-07-2002 13:06:

quote:
Originally posted by dr me
someone comment on my 2nd question above please

Ok. If God can do anything, then He is most certainly capable of spontaneous self-generation. Also, many faiths ascribe the quality of perfection to Him. Since perfection is inherently paradoxical, He would necessarily have to transcend logic. If something transcends logic, it isn't hard to naturally extend to it the ability to transcend sequential causality.

Now don't get me wrong, I don't believe in God. But if God does exist, the above is the only potential explanation I can muster.

Cheers,

Arbiter

Posted by dr me on Oct-07-2002 13:58:

arbiter
your answer is fair enough but it does not agree with ockham's razor (the simplest thing is probably the right one) (at least i think that's ockham's razor ). ie 1 miracle is more understandable than 2
if you read the bible, god's omnipotence is quite lacking. actually he shows very little omnipotence from what i can tell.

Posted by JPJH on Oct-07-2002 21:27:

quote:
Originally posted by davinox

Oooh a Christian!

Does God talk to you? Thats the only purpose of the thread, i dont want a religious debate.

If that was the case....then the people should have answered either yes or no...simple enough...no some people thought it was nice to elaborate by answering "bullshit" which doesn't apply to this question..therefore it deserves a response..

Posted by Michael Russo on Oct-07-2002 22:31:

quote:
Originally posted by JPJH

If that was the case....then the people should have answered either yes or no...simple enough...no some people thought it was nice to elaborate by answering "bullshit" which doesn't apply to this question..therefore it deserves a response..

Ok, the answer is... I don't know. Maybe God talks to people, maybe he doesn't. If He wanted to He certainly could, and has before in the (distant) past for sure.

quote:
Originally posted by Arbiter

I don't believe any logically coherent argument exists to support or refute the existence of God. That's exactly WHY I'm agnostic.

Be careful now, agnosticism is really atheism if you don't continually address the issue of whether or not God exists.

And there are plenty of good arguments... Aquinas comes to mind.

quote:
Originally posted by dr me
i know this is not suppose to be a religious debate but i just can't stop myself.

Stop yourself from what? Looking like an idiot?

quote:
Originally posted by dr me
1stly agonist is believing in a "greater power" but not knowing what it is.

Firstly, no.

quote:
Originally posted by dr me
2ndly. the one question i want answered is: who made god?

if the answer is no-one, he or she was always there then why can't the universe be always there. ie why have 2 unexplainable events

Umm.. obviously no one made God b/c if someone did then God wouldn't be God ie) there would be a higher power.

The universe wasn't always there because it is something finite, not infinite, therefore it is not eternal and has to be created at some point in time.

I don't see what's so difficult to understand here...

Posted by Trance-Canada on Oct-07-2002 23:34:

Re: "Conversation with God"

quote:
Originally posted by davinox
cuz it sounds like bullshit to me.

it is.

Posted by Dmatrox on Oct-08-2002 00:26:

whatever happened to: if its too good to be true, it probably is

Im still on the fence when i comes to religion

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