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-- TOTA's being primary MEN who are studying something COMPUTER related ..
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^ The can of worms you are opening has more to do with gender inquality, power struggles, and the role of women in public/private settings.

guys .. i was just wondering why the majority of the TOTA men were in something computer related. not why computer related jobs are primarily dominated by men. that issue is something that has been debated over for years now and is better left with economists and sociologists..

Gender inequality is a thing of the past. There should be no reason to blame modern events on gender inequality.

Why men dominate politics/computer related jobs is a mystery.

If women just don't want these jobs then its not a society's fault, but the choice of the people living in it. No-one said that all jobs should be 50% male 50% female. Its up to the liking of the employees.

Why there are more males on TOTA? I don't know for sure. Only one statement can be drawn. Men like Trance more than Women.

Now, Why?

i think it boils down to who uses the computer more, girls or guys. And as we can see its definitely guys that use computers more. I wouldn't say that guys like trance more then girls. In fact, it surprises me that there are so many dudes that like trance and to the extremes that they do on here. Dance music was always considered girl music since girls like to dance. When I was growing up if dudes liked dance music then they were considered gay so this whole phenomenon on this website is very strange. If you look at a university population you sure aren't going to see huge numbers of guys saying they like trance. I think because of this website we are disillusioned. Guys mostly like hiphop and punk and shit like that. But that's my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Z Gender inequality is a thing of the past.

- equal work, equal pay? men make like 35% more than women do for the same work
- women in high ranking business positions are very rare
- women in politics, there is something like less than 8% of women working in the HoC or Senate, which is pretty sad for houses that are supposed to be representative of its population
- constant discrimation (still)
- many would argue (not I) that the pornography industry is based around ideologies attached to women being submissive, thus degrading

And these are all Canada, don't even get me fucking started on countries with serious inequality issues. The attitute you have really makes me sick. I find it weird how I'm sitting here defending all of a gender I don't belong to. Women? Anyone out there?

quote:

Originally posted by StereoPrincess When I was growing up if dudes liked dance music then they were considered gay so this whole phenomenon on this website is very strange.

maybe that means all the guys on TOTA are gay .. ?

I'm doing Electrical Engineering at Ryerson and from what I've seen, I would have to agree that the field is mostly dominated by men.

As for the politics issue I think it simply boils down to the fact that we live in a very patriarchal society, and women are simply not widely accepted in politics. Though some would argue that if there were more women governing countries we would have less wars, and that is probably true since males seem to enjoy conquering things, its all about who's got the biggest guns/weapons (pun intended).

Then again what do I know? I'm just a 3rd year Engineer who likes trance

I studied Computer Engineering at Humber north for a year.That course is very competitive.But the fact that its mostly programming didn't really keep my interest.Now Iam studying Archetictural Technologist.Lots of AutoCad involved in it.I really enjoy it.

quote:

Originally posted by jenna_rae Hell where are all the hot IT guys??

True that My guy friends always complain to me about the lack of girl-selection in our class. But I look around and can't help but think to myself, the selection of guys we have isn't particularly strong either

quote:

Originally posted by DJLocoMoco I'm doing Electrical Engineering at Ryerson and from what I've seen, I would have to agree that the field is mostly dominated by men. Then again what do I know? I'm just a 3rd year Engineer who likes trance

Yo Sonny didnt tell me that u went to rye...u should chill with me and desidel sometime @ oakham...oh and we are lookin for more people to form the electronic music student union or watever in rye

quote:

Originally posted by Jayci True that My guy friends always complain to me about the lack of girl-selection in our class. But I look around and can't help but think to myself, the selection of guys we have isn't particularly strong either

wells then i guess that means that ppl who are in the tech industry are generally regarded as ugly as well .. ?? now who has an explanation for that stereotype ... ?

quote:

Originally posted by halo20 - equal work, equal pay? men make like 35% more than women do for the same work

Wtf? You pull this out of your ars?

quote:

- women in high ranking business positions are very rare - women in politics, there is something like less than 8% of women working in the HoC or Senate, which is pretty sad for houses that are supposed to be representative of its population

True or not, this has nothing to do with discrimination. Women have the same rights as men now. Why women have lower ranking positites now, is the result of the type of work that women chose to do.

quote:

- constant discrimation (still)

Can you give me one good example how women are (still) discriminated in Canada. Pornography is not one of them because pornography is a business.

Another comment: higher ranking positions usually require some type of leadership. Men have been the natural leaders for the longest time, so they have the natural ability to lead a business. Most women just end up not trying because its too difficult.

Hope that didn't offend anyone.

quote:

Originally posted by jenna_rae Hell where are all the hot IT guys??

Here we are, posting on TA at 2am... what a hell am I doing here at this time anyway?!

quote:

Originally posted by fantom what a hell am I doing here at this time anyway?!

obviously drinkning and typing

dont drink and type..it could save millions of flames

j/k

its a hard knock life

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Z Wtf? You pull this out of your ars? True or not, this has nothing to do with discrimination. Women have the same rights as men now. Why women have lower ranking positites now, is the result of the type of work that women chose to do. Can you give me one good example how women are (still) discriminated in Canada. Pornography is not one of them because pornography is a business. Another comment: higher ranking positions usually require some type of leadership. Men have been the natural leaders for the longest time, so they have the natural ability to lead a business. Most women just end up not trying because its too difficult. Hope that didn't offend anyone.

I think your wrong. Women are not treated as equals in all fields.. Legally, they should be, but that's not always the case. The statistic on mens pay being 35% higher than womens for the same job is probably accurate, I've seen stuidies stating similar numbers.

Also, with regards to women not being leaders for not bothering to try? That's an absurd statement. Women who try just as much as men often don't make it, as they have to try harder than men, and be better by a considerable margin before the public will take them seriously... This is an example of peoples prejudice towards women.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Z Wtf? You pull this out of your ars?

Umm, no its actually a stat. Look it up.

quote:

True or not, this has nothing to do with discrimination. Women have the same rights as men now. Why women have lower ranking positites now, is the result of the type of work that women chose to do.

Why would a woman choose to do the same job for less money?

quote:

Can you give me one good example how women are (still) discriminated in Canada. Pornography is not one of them because pornography is a business.

How about the bullshit that you are saying. That's discrimination. So you really don't think that if a man and a woman apply for the same "high ranking" job with the same qualifications that the man is not going to get hired 9 times out of 10? That is discrimination.

quote:

Another comment: higher ranking positions usually require some type of leadership. Men have been the natural leaders for the longest time, so they have the natural ability to lead a business. Most women just end up not trying because its too difficult. Hope that didn't offend anyone.

You obviously don't have a mother. If only she could see the ideas you hold in your head about women she would slap you!
I am not even going to talk about your last comment since its the ultimate in biggotry and if you ever have the thought that something may offend someone then it probably will so do say it.

i remember comin up with a theory back in high school when there was a presentation about the "glass ceiling in organizations" and i stated that in large corporations, its hard to find women at the top because of the fact that men dont really let them get tehre. this IMO was not due to discrimination but because of the fact that women tend to be more stressed and have more functions/ responsibility in their families. as foor men, men have the easy way out of just gointo work and coming home while the wife does everything at home. slowly the gender roles in society are changing from thistraditional aspect but its going to take a really long time..maybe 2 or 3 generations further in time will have accomplished this Utopia where women and men share the same responsiblities in a home and women can rise in teh workforce just as men do.

to all the women out there, HELP REACH THE UTOPIA

PS. i didnt mean to be discriminating in my post. i have 2 sisters and a really hard working mother and i see what women go through.


PEACE
LKD

quote:

Originally posted by StereoPrincess You obviously don't have a mother. If only she could see the ideas you hold in your head about women she would slap you! I am not even going to talk about your last comment since its the ultimate in biggotry and if you ever have the thought that something may offend someone then it probably will so do say it.

ok...
1) I have a mother, and yes she works, but she takes the house wife business more seriously than her work. She respects her duties to the family, and happly works to better our family's lives. She would agree with me 100%, and she believes that women should be house wives (although I don't care) because, yes, they are very good at it.

2) I was trying to us Logic. Obviously one of those traits that many people here lack. So I will discontinue to post because the only thing that I will get is flaming from the people who absolutely hate sexism.

Last thing to say. Please please, read everyone's comments to their fullest and make it possible for their comment to actually be correct. If you believe that what you think is always correct, then you will get nowhere.

I can't believe more women aren't posting against mr. misogyny over there.

at least Nat?

quote:

Originally posted by halo20 I can't believe more women aren't posting against mr. misogyny over there. at least Nat?

nah..i think nat is too smart for him and she knows it

Wowie... I hate falling out of the loop, there are like 25 quotes I'd like to respond to already... but I'll spare you guys. Still, here's my take on some of the stuff that's been said:

Computer industry - yes, men dominate it, there's no question. We had more than our share of cute girls in Engineering first year (before streams), but very few of them went into Electrical or Computer.
HOWEVER...
Someone made a comment about women being afraid of advanced mathematics. I don't think this is accurate. It's true that both electrical & computer eng. courses have CRAZY math - my mom's a math teacher and I can honestly say she would not have the slightest clue how to even begin solving some of the problems we get. But the funny thing is, the disciplines with OBNOXIOUSLY INSANE CRAZY math, like Applied Mathematics or Engineering Physics, seem to be at least 50% girls! Dunno how to explain it, but that's how it is. Oh, and a lot of them are pretty cute, they don't look like men at all.

Politics - personally I think men dominate that for historical reasons. Since nobody under the age of 86 goes into politics (being facetious here), we probably don't see a lot of women in it because the feminist "era" hasn't been around for long enough to see a real change. We do have some women in politics, so I think it's safe to say it's changing.

Women not being treated as equals - alright, this is pretty touchy here, but I have to take a stand. Yes, many men treat women like dirt. Perhaps we've forgotten that many women also treat men like dirt? However, once again, for reasons that I would call historical, we have a much higher percentage of men in high positions that treat women like dirt than vice versa - I truly believe, however, that this is no longer really a "societal" issue but more of a "personal" issue based on certain assholes that have powerful influence.

Just because the rules have changed, does not mean women who want to be in high positions don't still have to take responsibility, and take a stand, and make sure they get what they deserve. Neither men nor women are going to just automatically rise up to the top - and I personally believe that males are more likely to walk up to their bosses and demand a promotion than females. I think it's hard for anyone to deny that men are more confrontational than women are.

The times are changing, guys and gals, but real change is never instant. It's a gradual process and might take another hundred years, or more, to reach the ideal. Equal rights under the law doesn't necessarily mean equality.

And just to stir up some shit:
"Calling people equal when they're clearly not equal is called what, class? COMMUNISM!"

quote:

Hell where are all the hot IT guys??

I'm right here :

j/k

Seriously though, most IT guys are ugly or at least don't take care of themselves. Take me for example.

* I got so many assignments on my hands, that I barely have time to shave in the morning. LOL, I often don't even have to eat, so forget shaving.

* There are so few girls in our school, that it doesn't even make sense for me to look presentable. I mean I can go to school in my pyjamas - guys wouldn't give a shit, and girls - well, there are almost no girls, so there is no one to impress.

Can't we all just get along, and work together?

Why must there be competition on who is at the higher positions? Life is much more intersing than power, just helping someone, or sacrificing something for someone can make your life so much more happy. We are people, men, women, humans, we can't live without eachother. In fact, we love each other.

Life can be so much more interesting.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Z Can't we all just get along, and work together? Why must there be competition on who is at the higher positions? Life is much more intersing than power, just helping someone, or sacrificing something for someone can make your life so much more happy. We are people, men, women, humans, we can't live without eachother. In fact, we love each other. Life can be so much more interesting.

Hell, I wouldn't want to be in upper management. F-in' boring-as-hell job, just telling people what to do, never getting to actually do anything yourself. Still, power is money, and you can't argue with money. It can't buy happiness but it can buy hos. Kidding, kidding, but no money = no parties.

P.S. Maybe you love me, but I just don't play for that team.

wells.. sorry guys for inciting and laying the foundations for another flame war on TOTA again.. wells atleast to those who are involved in the flamming. My original question was actually why most of the TOTA's were primarily comprised of guys and of that group why most of the guys were all studying something computer related. I just found it interesting that this similarity existed in so many of us so i thought i'd get some ideas from you guys ..

i don't know how this all deviated on some tangent about women being upper/lower in the job markets when it comes to tech and non-tech jobs and the whole issue about politics .. ?!?!

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