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Originally posted by melech_mike Dont roll your eyes at me!! If you dont agree with one or more of these websites please refernce what site and what part you have a problem with. Refute anything that you feel is wrong/propaganda/lies/incitment!

Do you think peace will be found by finding blame?

If there is ever to be peace both sides have to forgive and forget. Neither side wants to do that, both sides want to prove who's right or wrong.

Truth is in the eye of the beholder.

Peace is only attainable if you end the blame game and end the hate.

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Originally posted by Thor Do you think peace will be found by finding blame? If there is ever to be peace both sides have to forgive and forget. Neither side wants to do that, both sides want to prove who's right or wrong. Truth is in the eye of the beholder. Peace is only attainable if you end the blame game and end the hate.

Well if you're going to tell melech-mike to absolve himself from the blame game you have a lot of people on the opposite side to tell as well.

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Originally posted by occrider Well if you're going to tell melech-mike to absolve himself from the blame game you have a lot of people on the opposite side to tell as well.

That IS the point. It never ends the cycle of hate, violence, blame.

As an outsider that chooses no side in this issue and I think that peace comes from people willing to lay their differences aside and work towards making peace.

Eye for an Eye until everyone is blind right?

I really don't see this problem. I spend a lot of time reading this forum, and many of the other forums on these boards as well, and I can tell you straight up that flaming is no more common here than it is on any other forum I visit, nor is it more severe.

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Originally posted by melech_mike Dont roll your eyes at me!! If you dont agree with one or more of these websites please refernce what site and what part you have a problem with. Refute anything that you feel is wrong/propaganda/lies/incitment!

just one last time. i'm not saying what u or your websites say is not the truth. i'm saying there is no such thing as truth 4 us humans, only God can know that. we r limited to interpretation. if u don't get it this time, i suppose u never will...

and i'll roll my eyes to whoever i want.

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just one last time. i'm not saying what u or your websites say is not the truth. i'm saying there is no such thing as truth 4 us humans, only God can know that. we r limited to interpretation. if u don't get it this time, i suppose u never will...

I beg to differ!
I believe that there is such things as absolute truth. I believe that if each of us individually looks deep enough, looks hard enough and actually wants to see the truth, we will find it.

Its easy to dismiss things as misinterpreted, or interpreted differently for each of us, but when we dig deep enough, we will all come up with the same answers. Some may need more clearification than others, but all will prevail to see the truth that surrounds us!
If not now, than later in life when we are able to let our biases evaporate, and lift the wall of ignorance from before us.

If nothing in those websites goes against the code of conduct of this board (lies, incitement, hate, racism, propaganda ect.), i dont see any reason why it was "...deemed offensive". Thats what i'm trying to get at!

*on a side note*
I found this on one of the websites (debka.com). In the past they have published reports of upcomming terror attacks (kenya bombing), and they're sources were right on. The attacks in Kenya came just three days after the website reported the threat.
Here is the new threat. Lets see what happends this time!

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debka.com wrote: Al Qaeda publishes new threat over affiliated Web site to carry out big terror attack in the United States in ten days� time

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Originally posted by melech_mike I beg to differ! I believe that there is such things as absolute truth. I believe that if each of us individually looks deep enough, looks hard enough and actually wants to see the truth, we will find it. Its easy to dismiss things as misinterpreted, or interpreted differently for each of us, but when we dig deep enough, we will all come up with the same answers. Some may need more clearification than others, but all will prevail to see the truth that surrounds us! If not now, than later in life when we are able to let our biases evaporate, and lift the wall of ignorance from before us. If nothing in those websites goes against the code of conduct of this board (lies, incitement, hate, racism, propaganda ect.), i dont see any reason why it was "...deemed offensive". Thats what i'm trying to get at! *on a side note* I found this on one of the websites (debka.com). In the past they have published reports of upcomming terror attacks (kenya bombing), and they're sources were right on. The attacks in Kenya came just three days after the website reported the threat. Here is the new threat. Lets see what happends this time!

Just looking over those sites they look all pro Israeli or run by Israeli's..

If you wanted accurate information you goto non partisan, 3rd party sources that have no agenda.

Truth can be twisted into whatever you want it to, but those sites you read are biased information.. If you could focus more on information from non pro Israeli or pro Palestine then I would be glad to read those.

Outside of that my point still stands that it doesn't matter who started it, who's right or wrong, etc.. What matters is finding a solution to the violence and hate. Finding blame, accusing each other, none of that helps towards the goal of lasting peace.

You are either part of the problem or part of the solution.. Is your solution finding truth to say the palestinians are wrong? You think that will end the violence or make things better? Of course not, its an argument that can not be won.

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Just looking over those sites they look all pro Israeli or run by Israeli's.. If you wanted accurate information you goto non partisan, 3rd party sources that have no agenda. Truth can be twisted into whatever you want it to, but those sites you read are biased information.. If you could focus more on information from non pro Israeli or pro Palestine then I would be glad to read those. Outside of that my point still stands that it doesn't matter who started it, who's right or wrong, etc.. What matters is finding a solution to the violence and hate. Finding blame, accusing each other, none of that helps towards the goal of lasting peace. You are either part of the problem or part of the solution.. Is your solution finding truth to say the palestinians are wrong? You think that will end the violence or make things better? Of course not, its an argument that can not be won.

Your right, they all lean towards Israels side. It doesn't matter who wrote what, the information is correct and cannot be refuted!!
If an Arab wrote the same information only than you would find it to be 'good' information? Thats crazy! The truth is the truth, no matter who states it!

I am looking for a solution and thats why i'm posting those sites. We cant find a solution to the problem without first fully understanding what the problem is!
It seems as though people have misconceptions of whats happening in the mid east not only now, but what has taken place in the past.
I evidence is overwhelming. One of the two sides has a history of fucking up. Unless we find where the problems are, we will never find a solution to them!
If the world realizes whos the problem child in this case, than they will condemn the actions of that party/organization. If we dont but blame on someone, than they will not feel like they have done anything wrong... therefore they will not correct they're actions and there will never be a solution!

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Originally posted by melech_mike Your right, they all lean towards Israels side. It doesn't matter who wrote what, the information is correct and cannot be refuted!! If an Arab wrote the same information only than you would find it to be 'good' information? Thats crazy! The truth is the truth, no matter who states it! I am looking for a solution and thats why i'm posting those sites. We cant find a solution to the problem without first fully understanding what the problem is! It seems as though people have misconceptions of whats happening in the mid east not only now, but what has taken place in the past. I evidence is overwhelming. One of the two sides has a history of fucking up. Unless we find where the problems are, we will never find a solution to them! If the world realizes whos the problem child in this case, than they will condemn the actions of that party/organization. If we dont but blame on someone, than they will not feel like they have done anything wrong... therefore they will not correct they're actions and there will never be a solution!

Truth as they see it though. You ask Palastinians to read those sites and they will disagree with their facts and call it propoganda.

So after you have proven to everyone that you are right and the palastinians are wrong; will this then cause peace. All the palastinians will just one day go "Oh shit we are wrong, ok lets stop the violence and thank those who pointed out our wrong ways, VIVA LA ISRAEL!"

My point to you is still what you hope to accomplish arguing and fighting over how right the Israeli's are and how wrong the Palastines are? You think that is the way towards peace?

Cause you have to know that the Palastinians feel exactly the opposite and feel very strongly about their views.. So what exactly do you do to find peace when both sides are convinced they are just and right while the other is dead wrong and deserves to die.

Peace is not found by proving anyone wrong, peace is found by letting go of the past wrongs and starting on a hard road to break the cycle of violence.

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Truth as they see it though. You ask Palastinians to read those sites and they will disagree with their facts and call it propoganda.

They may disagree... i for one disagree with many things.
Whe the truth is presented to me, than i have no choice but to accept it. It seems as though the truth in this situation isn't so clear cut. It seems as though those who dont want to see it, have the choice of listening to others who make up historical falacies, lies ect... There will always be an excuse.
If those who dont believe that the site is supporting facts, and rather is spewing out propaganda, than once again, i'd like to see what they feel that is. I myself, along with many other TA's saw no problem with these sites. The information on them checks out and should be regarded as the truth, and not "israeli propaganda"!

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So after you have proven to everyone that you are right and the palastinians are wrong; will this then cause peace. All the palastinians will just one day go "Oh shit we are wrong, ok lets stop the violence and thank those who pointed out our wrong ways, VIVA LA ISRAEL!"

I dont need to prove anything... it has already been proven! There is string evidence supporting my arguement! Once again, the person who chooses to find the truth, will ultimately find it!
The Palestinians have no clue of whats going on, they are shut out from regular civilization! they're leaders regard them as animals! They are mistreated and threatend for having opposing views.
As the great Albert Einstein once said "Peace can not be achieved through violence, it can only be achieved through understanding".
Understanding the problems they lay in the mid-east is the key to finding a solution!! Hopefully one day the Palestinian people will be able to be more learned abuot the world around them and will stand up and fight their dictatorship! Maybe than we might hear "Oh shit we are wrong, ok lets stop the violence and thank those who pointed out our wrong ways, VIVA LA ISRAEL!"

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Peace is not found by proving anyone wrong, peace is found by letting go of the past wrongs and starting on a hard road to break the cycle of violence.

My question to you and anybody else is, who do you think should initiate this supposed 'peace proposal'? Israelis dont trust the Palestinian Authority, they have proved time and again that they are not worthy of trust! They always have something up their sleve!
Five Israeli PM's couldn't find a solution with Arafat. Dont you think its time for him to step down and let 'his' people vote for who they want to represent them?
I feel that the PA has a lot of making up to do before anyone sees them as a partner for peace. They have fucked up one too many times to be considered a legit organization. Just look at the PLO and PA's track records (not trance records, although if they did produce anything it would probably be a repetitive 1980'2 style bassline with a women in arabic inciting children to become martyers AKA HOMICIDAL KILLERS)!!!

I think Peace has to start from the inside and come from outside, like with the UN peacekeeping forces.

I'm not sure about declaring a palestine state, but at this point I do think it's a step forward.

Yes Arafat HAS to go, and that will help things move in the right direction.

The desperation of the Palastine people with poverty, lack of education, etc.. Those things also have to be fixed, people with jobs and a reason to live want to live in peace; people who have nothing tend towards violence to those who they blame for their situation.

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I'm not sure about declaring a palestine state, but at this point I do think it's a step forward.

Would you give Osama Bin Laden Afganistan back?
I dont understand how people think by giving them statehood would solve all the problems plaguing the mid-east. You can't give Arafat and his dirty regime power over a country, he would abuse it and would make even more termoil in the region!
Perhaps the Palestinian people should demand him gone and a new more democratic leader put forth. only than will Israel have no choice but to try and make peace with this new leader. After things remain at a calm for a specified period of time, than the plans for a country called Palestine can be put to action. You cant reward terror -- it will only cause more crazed fucks to take advantage of peoples fears; more terror will arise!

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Yes Arafat HAS to go, and that will help things move in the right direction.

We finally found something we both agree on!!

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The desperation of the Palastine people with poverty, lack of education, etc.. Those things also have to be fixed, people with jobs and a reason to live want to live in peace; people who have nothing tend towards violence to those who they blame for their situation.

Those things cant be fixed by Israel. Those responsibilties were handed over to the PA who obviously messed things up. I dont doubt for a second that Arafat and his henchmen have pocketed a lot of money. i'm sure there is evidence on this somewhere; its not the case that i'm arguing right now. Israel let many Palestinians come into Israel to work, but after so many of those supposed workers blew themselves and many other them away, it wasn't in Israels security interests to continue letting these people into the country! Makes sense to me, and i'm sure it does to you too!

The PA wants to keep they're populus stupid and ignorant to whats really going on. For if they dare find out the truth, they will topple Arafat and his regime faster than the US will demolish Bagdhad! Its obvious that Israel is not to blame for the Palestinian people misfortune, but rather their own leader. A leader that hasn't done anything for them in over 30 years of his chairmenship.

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Originally posted by melech_mike Those things cant be fixed by Israel. Those responsibilties were handed over to the PA who obviously messed things up. I dont doubt for a second that Arafat and his henchmen have pocketed a lot of money. i'm sure there is evidence on this somewhere; its not the case that i'm arguing right now. Israel let many Palestinians come into Israel to work, but after so many of those supposed workers blew themselves and many other them away, it wasn't in Israels security interests to continue letting these people into the country! Makes sense to me, and i'm sure it does to you too! The PA wants to keep they're populus stupid and ignorant to whats really going on. For if they dare find out the truth, they will topple Arafat and his regime faster than the US will demolish Bagdhad! Its obvious that Israel is not to blame for the Palestinian people misfortune, but rather their own leader. A leader that hasn't done anything for them in over 30 years of his chairmenship.

How can you be so ignorant to say that Israel will "fix" these problems up when they are the very reason why these problems (poverty, no health care, and lack of proper education) exist in the first place. Israel has repeatedly, under the excuse of weeding out terrorists, bombed the ministries of health and education there, basically destroying the very infastructure needed to facilitate these institutions.

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How can you be so ignorant to say that Israel will "fix" these problems up when they are the very reason why these problems (poverty, no health care, and lack of proper education) exist in the first place. Israel has repeatedly, under the excuse of weeding out terrorists, bombed the ministries of health and education there, basically destroying the very infastructure needed to facilitate these institutions.

Haha, you again!

Anyways, i never said Israel would fix these problems... i clearly said that its not Israels responsibilty! Read it again my love!

Israel is not the reason for the Palestinian peoples poverty stricken existence. Its easy to blame someone for your misfortune, its hard to look at yourself and re-evaluate whats wrong from within.
Israel is the scapegoat for the whole Muslim world. If anything wrong happends its because of Israel (it would be more acurate to say because of the Jews, but i dont want to take this towards calling them anti-semites), Israel this Israel that. Wake up Cyrus. I know you cant really be that stupid! (thats not a flame!)
They destroy those facilities because there was terrorist activies taken place there. these places were chosen because Arafat knew that he would get busted, and what better place to start a PR war than health and education. He knew that Israel would destroy those facilities, and he could make it look like Israel is a lose canon, destroying the Palestinian peoples hope for any education or health care! What kind of education was being taught in those facilities before they were destroyed? And what health care was provided?

The fact of the matter is those places were terrorist hubs... They were destroyed for a reason (a simple search on yahoo will give you more than enough sources on the real reasons behind the destruction of those buildings).

Do not try and pull a cover over peoples eyes Cyrus, in the end it will only work against you.

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Originally posted by melech_mike Would you give Osama Bin Laden Afganistan back? I dont understand how people think by giving them statehood would solve all the problems plaguing the mid-east.

If Israel offered to accept a democratic Palastine state would you not support that? The comparison to Osama bin Laden is a flawed one, come on lets not get silly here.

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You can't give Arafat and his dirty regime power over a country, he would abuse it and would make even more termoil in the region!

Arafat will step down, and if the world wants to start a real peace process why not have the UN step in and start work on making Palastine a democratic state and also help to rebuild it.

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Perhaps the Palestinian people should demand him gone and a new more democratic leader put forth.

I think they are too busy hating Israeli's and not realizing the problems with their own government. Its scape goating at its finest, they are too pre occupied with Israel to focus on their own internal problems. Another reason why the UN should be there and why declaring a palestine state will get things moving in the right direction.

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only than will Israel have no choice but to try and make peace with this new leader. After things remain at a calm for a specified period of time, than the plans for a country called Palestine can be put to action. You cant reward terror -- it will only cause more crazed fucks to take advantage of peoples fears; more terror will arise!

You can't reward terror, I do agree there. But we have to give consessions sometimes in peace agreements. Both sides have to give up something in order to gain true peace.

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Those things cant be fixed by Israel. Those responsibilties were handed over to the PA who obviously messed things up. I dont doubt for a second that Arafat and his henchmen have pocketed a lot of money.

Again another great reason for the UN to step in.

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i'm sure there is evidence on this somewhere; its not the case that i'm arguing right now. Israel let many Palestinians come into Israel to work, but after so many of those supposed workers blew themselves and many other them away, it wasn't in Israels security interests to continue letting these people into the country! Makes sense to me, and i'm sure it does to you too!

I agree, but then there is also the issue of how do you stop this from happening? Obviously retaliation isn't working for either side, so something new must be done.

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The PA wants to keep they're populus stupid and ignorant to whats really going on. For if they dare find out the truth, they will topple Arafat and his regime faster than the US will demolish Bagdhad!

I think its more 'blinded by hate' than utter ignorance about the situation.. The Palastine's are focused on the evil Israeli's and evil Americans being the ones to blame.. If they were finally given a state they could start focusing on other things like rebuilding their homes and starting to focus on important things like health, education, and a better living.

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Its obvious that Israel is not to blame for the Palestinian people misfortune, but rather their own leader. A leader that hasn't done anything for them in over 30 years of his chairmenship.

Israel isn't innocent, yes Arafat shoulders a lot of blame but both sides are guilty of many things.

But again, the point being not what has happened but what to do now.. Remove Arafat, bring in the UN peacekeepers and create a new government based on democratic system. Help to rebuild the country, declare Palastine a state and start to work on the long peace process and ending the cycle of violence.

Wow melech_mike. You use the word "truth" alot. How do you know what you read is the absolute truth or a biased truth? how do you KNOW? you can't. It is impossible. You agree with their views therefore its easier for you to accept it as the truth.

I, and I'm sure many others as well, find it to be extremely arrogant of you to think that your view of the truth is the ABSOLUTE truth of all truths, as if you were some sort of all-knowing superior being. :P

Until you can find humility in that way, its simply pointless to debate with someone who thinks he's absolutely right with no exceptions.

Don't you think that's kind of closed minded?

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."

I think that Melech Mike's "truth" is as truthful as Thor's. Perosonally I stay out of the Israel/Palestine issue but I can't help but recognize that while melech mike's sites speak of very factual events, I think that it is very one sided and that Thor has a very significant argument as well which is not stated in Melech Mikes's sites. Overall, however, I really love how you guys are exprssing your difference of opinions. It's been enjoyable how we havent resorted to flaming at this point in time. I think that goes to show how much we really want our forum to stay in place!

there is no palestinians

FACT AND TRUTH SAYS THAT THERE ARE NO SUCH PEOPLE AS PALESTINIANS!

THESE DISPICABLE ARAB PROPAGANDISTS THAT SAY THEY ARE PALESTINIAN ARE FILTHY PEOPLE THAT WANT TO DESTROY THE LIVES OF GOOD DEMOCRATIC CITIZENS OF THE FINE STATE OF ISRAEL!!!

G-D BLESSES ISRAEL, AND MAY HE CONTINUE TO DO SO!!!!!!

I used to be a liberal idiot, saying everyone can do whatever they want, have their own truths... BUT THAT IS BULLSHIT!!!!

please please please!!! grow up guys... this is how I realized how bad drugs are, and TV! They screw with your minds! make your logic mushy!!!

First of all, as stated many times.

There is no palestinians, they are not a people. Because if they are, then Fuck You! I'm part of the world people, and whereever you live your living in my native homeland! So get out now! your massacring my children!!! your destroying my struggling economy!!

As obsurd as that sounds, bottom line there are palestinians!

These arabs can take a hike! thats what they will do anyways! and all you freedom fakers out there can watch and make angry faces as the world moves and you sit there like an old granny talking smack all the time to justify your pathetic lifestyles full of sympathy for murderers and dictators!!

There are absolute truths out there, as melech_mike stated, and you don't want to look for it because you know it will force inner reflection which is not done at all in todays society!!

NO TO PALESTINIAN STATE!!! THEY CAN GO LIVE AMONG THE OTHER 22 OR SO ARAB COUNTRIES!!! ANYONE WHO WANTS TO STICK YOUR NOSE IN IT!!

TALK ABOUT AMERICA OR SOMETHING ELSE!!

ISRAEL WILL DEAL WITH THESE TERRORISTS AS IT HAS SO FAR!!!

SCREAM ALL YOU WANT! WE DONT WANT TO KILL ANYONE EXCEPT THOSE THAT STOP US FROM LIVING IN SeCURITY!!!!

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

talk tlak talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk atlk talk talk talk

go read and listen to the truth all you ignorant argumentative people!!!!!

and whats the problem with a site being pro-israel?
does being pro-israel mean its wrong?

if so, then

----- FUCK YOU!!!! -----

you anti-semetic pieces of shit!!!! Being pro-israel is PERFECTLY GOOD AS BEING PRO AMERICA, OR PRO FREEDOM!!!! OBJECTIVE TRUTH IS NOT SIDED!!!! ITS THE TRUTH!!! SO MAYBE YOU NEED TO RETHINK YOUR DEFINITIONS AND ALIGNMENTS!!!

anyways have a nice weekend everyone!!

if we talk about the world in general you will all see that my and melech_mike's views are different,

BUT BUT BUT we keep responding to stuff about Israel and the 'palestinians' really 'terrorist arabs trying to kill off the only democracy in the middle east'!!!

can't you see we know more then you ignramouses(sp??) here?? stop talking about the palestinians like they're anything good, cause they are not!!! We shove facts down your throats but you just ignore them!!

stop creating unnecesary tension on this board by psostingf about palestinians! they are homewrecking filthy arabs=because-even-other-arab-countries-don't-want-to-take-them-in!!! So thats by their own standards! so if you want to bash me for calling them

DIRTY ANIMALS, FILTHY BEHEMOTHS, BARBARIANS, OR ANYTHING ELSE, the base is the example given by the arab countries that don't want to take them in..


or how about this.... the country of Jordan is population of 80% 'palestinians' so why is it run by the 20% hashamite population??

stop looking at israel, and look to the truth you good people of planet earth..


And about absolute truths...

here is one

G-d is perfection by definition. I don't care how warped your minds are from drugs, you cannot argue the fact that in this world, if we all strived to be like G-d which is perfect as taught in the OLD TESTAMENT AKA THE TORAH, AKA THE BIBLE (christianity added man made changes and so did muslims to the original torah given by G-d)

you want to see how jews REALLY are?

go to http://www.aish.com to read how the jews of today think...

go read 1 essay, and then come here and argue that what is said is no truth... and I don't care WHERE you are from, or WHO YOU ARE!!!


IGNORANCE RUNS THIS WORLD TODAY!!!! I HAVE A MISSION TO END IT!!!

SHLOMO ELIYAHU

hahaha, theres no fuckin around with you huh!

*Roll in the flamers*

Shlomo_hamelech... you have a very unique way of putting things into prospective... one that i dont have a problem with, but I think that some TA's (pro-arab ones) are gonna be crying about this.

You cant expect to change the views of every ignorant person out there... i commend you for trying, and wish you the best of luck in the future!

Re: there is no palestinians

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Originally posted by shlomo_hamalech FACT AND TRUTH SAYS THAT THERE ARE NO SUCH PEOPLE AS PALESTINIANS! THESE DISPICABLE ARAB PROPAGANDISTS THAT SAY THEY ARE PALESTINIAN ARE FILTHY PEOPLE THAT WANT TO DESTROY THE LIVES OF GOOD DEMOCRATIC CITIZENS OF THE FINE STATE OF ISRAEL!!! G-D BLESSES ISRAEL, AND MAY HE CONTINUE TO DO SO!!!!!! I used to be a liberal idiot, saying everyone can do whatever they want, have their own truths... BUT THAT IS BULLSHIT!!!! please please please!!! grow up guys... this is how I realized how bad drugs are, and TV! They screw with your minds! make your logic mushy!!!

Maybe I spoke too soon ...

Closing this forum wouldn't solve anything... you'd just see these kinds of threads cropping up in the COR all the time again, and they'd only be worse. Seems like a simple-minded answer to a simple-minded problem, if you ask me.

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Originally posted by melech_mike hahaha, theres no fuckin around with you huh! *Roll in the flamers* Shlomo_hamelech... you have a very unique way of putting things into prospective... one that i dont have a problem with, but I think that some TA's (pro-arab ones) are gonna be crying about this. You cant expect to change the views of every ignorant person out there... i commend you for trying, and wish you the best of luck in the future!

If people can't discuss their differences without resorting to name calling then please stay out of this forum. Nobody wants to listen to that nonesense.

So just for the record, am I ignorant?

Re: there is no palestinians

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Originally posted by shlomo_hamalech FACT AND TRUTH SAYS THAT THERE ARE NO SUCH PEOPLE AS PALESTINIANS! THESE DISPICABLE ARAB PROPAGANDISTS THAT SAY THEY ARE PALESTINIAN ARE FILTHY PEOPLE THAT WANT TO DESTROY THE LIVES OF GOOD DEMOCRATIC CITIZENS OF THE FINE STATE OF ISRAEL!!! G-D BLESSES ISRAEL, AND MAY HE CONTINUE TO DO SO!!!!!!

So I'll ink extremist under your name, oh and what then is the difference between an arab extremist and a jewish extremist?

NONE.

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I used to be a liberal idiot, saying everyone can do whatever they want, have their own truths... BUT THAT IS BULLSHIT!!!! please please please!!! grow up guys... this is how I realized how bad drugs are, and TV! They screw with your minds! make your logic mushy!!!

Wow you have a mighty intellect, I'm confounded by your logic and profound arguments.

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As obsurd as that sounds, bottom line there are palestinians! These arabs can take a hike! thats what they will do anyways! and all you freedom fakers out there can watch and make angry faces as the world moves and you sit there like an old granny talking smack all the time to justify your pathetic lifestyles full of sympathy for murderers and dictators!!

Eye of the beholder.

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There are absolute truths out there, as melech_mike stated, and you don't want to look for it because you know it will force inner reflection which is not done at all in todays society!! NO TO PALESTINIAN STATE!!! THEY CAN GO LIVE AMONG THE OTHER 22 OR SO ARAB COUNTRIES!!! ANYONE WHO WANTS TO STICK YOUR NOSE IN IT!! TALK ABOUT AMERICA OR SOMETHING ELSE!! ISRAEL WILL DEAL WITH THESE TERRORISTS AS IT HAS SO FAR!!! SCREAM ALL YOU WANT! WE DONT WANT TO KILL ANYONE EXCEPT THOSE THAT STOP US FROM LIVING IN SeCURITY!!!!

Do you support wiping them out? Why not kill them all and that way you don't have to ever worry about terrorism.

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talk tlak talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk atlk talk talk talk go read and listen to the truth all you ignorant argumentative people!!!!!

I think the ignorance is quite obvious, you just don't realize that the ignorance comes from your own mouth.

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and whats the problem with a site being pro-israel? does being pro-israel mean its wrong?

Nothing wrong with being pro Israel, as long as it doesn't make you pro - stupid.. Sadly you seem to have no clue.

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if so, then ----- FUCK YOU!!!! ----- you anti-semetic pieces of shit!!!! Being pro-israel is PERFECTLY GOOD AS BEING PRO AMERICA, OR PRO FREEDOM!!!! OBJECTIVE TRUTH IS NOT SIDED!!!! ITS THE TRUTH!!! SO MAYBE YOU NEED TO RETHINK YOUR DEFINITIONS AND ALIGNMENTS!!!

Oh that is interesting, anyone differing your opinion is anti-semetic? You are pro-ignorance and stupidity. Please leave debate to people of maturity and class.

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DIRTY ANIMALS, FILTHY BEHEMOTHS, BARBARIANS, OR ANYTHING ELSE, the base is the example given by the arab countries that don't want to take them in..

You called others anti-semetic, yet you put the value of your enemies to that of animals.. Hmmm, 'calling the kettle black....'

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IGNORANCE RUNS THIS WORLD TODAY!!!! I HAVE A MISSION TO END IT!!! SHLOMO ELIYAHU

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at that statement, I choose... LAUGH MY ASS OFF

Seriously man, go away, if you can't debate like a civilized person then you should just avoid it altogether. Ignorance is your god obviously, good luck with a mission to end your ignorance, I fear it may just be hopeless

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If people can't discuss their differences without resorting to name calling then please stay out of this forum. Nobody wants to listen to that nonesense. So just for the record, am I ignorant?

Huh?? Why are you getting all upset and shit? i never singled you out and called you ignorant... i actually like debating with you... keep it up! (no sarcasim!)

I'm just talking in general. There are many ignorant people out there and on TranceAddict. People like shlomo_hamelech and i get very worked up when we see this, and thats why it may show in our posts. As someone whos life revolves around Israel, it gets very emotional to hear people saying shit thats so stupid you just wanna hit them. But you can't, because it wont solve anything. than you try and explain to them they are wrong and they wont even listen or go findf out more about what they are arguing. These people have been brainwashed to say certain things and cite specific events. They dont know shit and love to so easily through blame down on israel, or the supporters of Israel (ie. America).

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Originally posted by melech_mike Huh?? Why are you getting all upset and shit? i never singled you out and called you ignorant... i actually like debating with you... keep it up! (no sarcasim!) I'm just talking in general. There are many ignorant people out there and on TranceAddict. People like shlomo_hamelech and i get very worked up when we see this, and thats why it may show in our posts. As someone whos life revolves around Israel, it gets very emotional to hear people saying shit thats so stupid you just wanna hit them. But you can't, because it wont solve anything. than you try and explain to them they are wrong and they wont even listen or go findf out more about what they are arguing. These people have been brainwashed to say certain things and cite specific events. They dont know shit and love to so easily through blame down on israel, or the supporters of Israel (ie. America).

You don't think his approach is ignorant?

Like I said I don't see blame, its not in my character. I see a problem and in my experience the solution is not proving who's right or wrong..

Truth is in the eye of the beholder, and you know this. If you read pro Israeli websites you are getting their perspective. Truth can be twisted in many ways, thats not to say there isn't truth on those websites, I'm sure there is quite a bit of truth there.

I'll tell you my personal opinion, since I've made my points without doing that so far.

I do support Israel, I do agree that the Palastine's are so focused on hate and propoganda that they don't see the problem really is mainly with their own leadership.. I think its sick and shamefull that children are tought to be killers and that people become human bombs.. All sick things.

The thing is you have to ask why is this? Because they have nothing to lose. That means you have to give them a reason to change their ways.. Many Israeli's are furious and hate them with a passion.. For good reason.

But that leaves you with two choices as I see it. Continue hating them and supporting the things that in return causes them to hate you. Destroy them all and continue dealing with horrible terrorist attacks for generations to come.

OR

Take the hard road to peace, that involves forgiving them for the past and of course for them to forgive as well.. Think of it like a married couple talking to a shrink, what they would be told is to forgive and truly move on from the past fighting.

People can only seek peace if its in their heart, and if you have the will and energy to accept peace with your enemies; then you are a brave and honourable man in my mind. Those who support continued violence and hate are in my mind taking the easy way out.

Its quite simple, but we all know that past suffering is hard to get over and to ask people who've lost loved ones in the past to forgive and seek peace is hard to do.

But that is the choice, suck it up and seek peace or deal with neverending terrorism for your children and their children.

Again I think the UN should step in to this conflict and the UN council should start real Peace negotiations.

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