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oh, just one more thing.

spam, if bunch of terrorists took over a school in, lets say toronto, and start shooting people outside, throwing hand granades and stuff like that, would you give them fair warning before blowing up the building with kids inside??

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Originally posted by Yohan I've heard a good quote the other day. How do you train best killers? Start training and indoctrinating the kids early. Just like those madrassahs in NW Pakistan, or rebel armies in Africa or Hitler Youth You're right. Perhaps the kids aren't hamas. Maybe they just want to look cool holding assault rifles

goddamn, terrorist in training right here in canada !!!!!!!

edit : or usa. im not sure where was this picture taken

quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer This is what Israels tiny brains cant seem to get,why the fuck would these people want have peace with a bunch of killers who dont give a fuck about them?

If you and your enemy had chance at peace agreement, and your enemy is most likely will leave you alone, you wouldn't take it? Knowing that if you continue fighting, the chances of you and your family dying will be high?

What is more important, your cause or your family?

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Originally posted by Xavier Moriarty goddamn, terrorist in training right here in canada !!!!!!!

of course he is

he is an expert at nintendo, therefore excellent button masher

he'd make an awesome suicide bomber

edit : youre right. you win.

It seems like Israel is taking their revenge of the holocaust on the Palestinian people.so much for being compassionate to others..

quote:

Originally posted by Xavier Moriarty oh, just one more thing. spam, if bunch of terrorists took over a school in, lets say toronto, and start shooting people outside, throwing hand granades and stuff like that, would you give them fair warning before blowing up the building with kids inside??

No I wouldn't. If I knew the children inside were still alive, and I was in charge of the military operation, I would arrange for a squad of men to infiltrate the school and take out the terrorists with as little civilian casualties as possible. But I WOULD take action.

I'm in agreement that bombing a school full of kids was a horrible, unjustifiable act when other options are available.

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Originally posted by Spam My own people? Please, I'm straight-up white Canadian. I agree that Israel is doing horrible things. Where we differ is that you hold Hamas blameless, and I place a portion of the blame on them, based on their foolish decision to continue bombing Israel when they had DAYS to stop while Israel said "Stop bombing us, or we will retaliate." That was their chance, right there, to stop all of this current bloodshed from happening. And they rejected that opportunity. I would hope that my elected government of Canada, for instance, would not decide to launch rockets at the United States, while the US was warning my government to stop, or face retaliation. To continue would be foolish, and Hamas was either foolish, or they deliberately continued to provoke Israel to pursue a purpose that does not serve the Palestinian people.

Well ok tell me something? If you take hamas away what do you want the people or women of palestine to do throw their shoes at the israeli army just like how he reporter in Iraq did with bush dood.......these people they will fight till there last breath not dont fear for their life because to them its a cause they are fighting for....... because its not about hamas and israel its two people fighting over a HOLY LAND which israel has its eyes on from such a long time........you can go on with your assumptions of how Israel is this it can bring you down to stone age and how its foolish to continue or provoke Israel.......Let me tell or give you one example......The US tried to fuck with Iraq till this day they dont know whats happening there its a war that they wasted soo much money on what did they achieve? rats ass ....... keep messing with these people you wont get anywhere......sooner or later someone like Iran will jump in and then it will be dooms day or a world war 3 atleast.

I also have a question, barring the reasoning Hamas do what they do, violence only equals more violence (on BOTH sides),
does it not make sense to go the route of the more logical, reasonable and sensible Palistinian Authority for any type of control? Instead of a more radical organization (Hamas?) no matter their reasoning.

Or am I way of in thinking the PA has some sort of militant wing that wants Israel destroyed?

I have no emotional bias either, just trying to look at it from a rational (non religious, brainwashing, etc) point of view.

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Originally posted by Yohan oh I get it. you want to play semantics fine. instead of jewish, how about hebrews? more acceptable? if you're talking about european jews immigrating back to israel, i'm pretty sure israel's law of return means you have to have some sort of jewish ancestry (meaning, they are related by bloodline somehow to hebrews who used to live in modern day palestine)

A polish jew is from the middle east?? ahahahahahahhaah

Stop trying to complicate everything with YOUR semantics...

Just becuase Israel has a stupid "law of return" doesnt make it valid.. they do it becuase of demographic advantages that come with bringing more people into the state. All you have to be is Jewsih.. thats it!!!..

Theres a bloodline tracing back 2000 years ago?? AHHAAHAHAH WOOOOOOW.. the lengths you zionists try to justify that land as yours is hilarious.

Even IF you could trace back your lineage, that would be a SLIVER of your genetics.. heck.. if I could trace back my genetics back 2000 years ago.. and one of my ancestors happen to be from Spain.. i should start beleive that i actually have roots in Spain ahhahahahaah


You are or other European Jews ARE NOT FROM THE MIDDLE EAST!!!!

HEBREWS DO NOT EXIST ANYMORE.. only Jews.. which are people who follow the jewish faith!!!

.. YOU ARE EITHER SEPHARDIC OR ASHKANAZI

Hey.. Alexander the Great conquered persia once.. maybe i should tell people my ancestors are Macedonian.

Nigga... PLEASE

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Originally posted by Endlesswave I also have a question, barring the reasoning Hamas do what they do, violence only equals more violence (on BOTH sides), does it not make sense to go the route of the more logical, reasonable and sensible Palistinian Authority for any type of control? Instead of a more radical organization (Hamas?) no matter their reasoning. Or am I way of in thinking the PA has some sort of militant wing that wants Israel destroyed? I have no emotional bias either, just trying to look at it from a rational (non religious, brainwashing, etc) point of view.

They are fighting for their own land for those who dont know the History of Palestine:-

quote:

Originally posted by Endlesswave I also have a question, barring the reasoning Hamas do what they do, violence only equals more violence (on BOTH sides), does it not make sense to go the route of the more logical, reasonable and sensible Palistinian Authority for any type of control? Instead of a more radical organization (Hamas?) no matter their reasoning. Or am I way of in thinking the PA has some sort of militant wing that wants Israel destroyed? I have no emotional bias either, just trying to look at it from a rational (non religious, brainwashing, etc) point of view.

You're wasting your breath. These guys are set on Israel as the sole party to blame, and will occupy a school and shoot out of it to defend that stance.

lol

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Originally posted by Xavier Moriarty almost 1000 people is dead. isnt that genocide or ethnic cleansing???

umm, nope, genocide or ethnic cleansing is reserved for the balkans

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Originally posted by Spam My own people? Please, I'm straight-up white Canadian. I agree that Israel is doing horrible things. Where we differ is that you hold Hamas blameless, and I place a portion of the blame on them, based on their foolish decision to continue bombing Israel when they had DAYS to stop while Israel said "Stop bombing us, or we will retaliate." That was their chance, right there, to stop all of this current bloodshed from happening. And they rejected that opportunity. I would hope that my elected government of Canada, for instance, would not decide to launch rockets at the United States, while the US was warning my government to stop, or face retaliation. To continue would be foolish, and Hamas was either foolish, or they deliberately continued to provoke Israel to pursue a purpose that does not serve the Palestinian people.

dude, israel broke the cease fire agreement...they fired first and killed 6 palestinians....and hamas fired back..

if anything, you can say that hamas should have shown more restraint....

and to be honest..the blockade placed on gaza to me is just as bad as israel bombing them....you either kill them instantly or you starve them, better yet let them die from a lack of medical care...if the americans were making sure we were not receiving food, medical care or basic human rights..you would be on your computer right now screaming that our government should bomb their asses....

we can't even handle it when there aren't enough trance parties in the month of january..

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer STOP fuckin giving excuses for the Israeli terrorism against the people of Gaza.THERE IS NOWHERE TO HIDE GET IT? 1.5 million people living in a 350k radius.where the fuck can they hide? fuckin Israeli apologists never stop with the propagandas.

I don't think I'm spreading any propaganda here, I'm really asking for alternate explanations on what Israel could possibly do. They didn't have to attack Israel constantly. They had warnings, they continued. Israel responded.

I, again, don't condone everything Israel does - but stop making it seem like they're innocent and don't have any other choice just over the border. The objective in Israel's mission right now isn't to take over Gaza, because if it was, it would be done (they DO have the manpower for it). The intention is to remove the weapon stores and anyone who's using them. Once that's done, ceteris paribus, they're supposed to be out. Whether that happens or not, time will tell - but enough accusing me (or anyone who doesn't 100% support Hamas' actions) of spreading propaganda or any sort of nonsense; stop being a child.

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Originally posted by Cyrus King Nigga... PLEASE

You dip shits must have pea sized brains. I have never seen such stuborn stupid fucks in my life. Worse then fukn mules.

All your arguments and counter arugments are meanless. This bullshit has been going on for years, The biggest problems is not who's on first whats on second. No one will ever win this argument don't you fucktards get it.

Both sides are at fault and the time to settle this conflict is over. No more killing will settle this nor will your bickering about who started this bullshit. Your like little fuckn kids he started it no he did. GROW THE FUCK UP YOU DIP SHITs.

Its only two bad someone doesn't grab the leaders of both sides and beats the living fuckn shit out of them till they get it through their thick fuckn skulls. Then to skin them alive for being such douche bags.

So before you present another argument stop being so fuckn stupid. The time for conflict resolution is over. The time for smackin them upside the head is now.

Personally they both deserve what they get. Teaching hatred to young children forever corrupting the most innocent of souls. It disgust me to see young children on tv waving their fists and chanting in the same manor as Hitler. FUCKn revolting!!! THIS GOES FOR BOTH SIDES. The only way this will end is if the leaders of both groups are captured and tried for crimes against humantiy. I would also have the UN take over the whole region putting those that incite the violence to death.

Don't agree big fuckn whoop.

Severe measures for severe conflict.

and now for you Cyrus you dumb ass fuck!!! Yeah You heard me. It is insulting personally that you use the image of someone so noble as Ernesto "Che" Guevara for your profile picture. He would never support your argument as he was a firm believer that relgion was a poison and had no place in society. That was not what he was about. It disgusts me that palestinians use his image to support their cause. HE WOULD NEVER SUPPORT EITHER SIDE. What he tried to instill was the value of people and life over monetary driven societies. To teach and educate the young to live a life of peace. In the words of "CHE" FUCK Capitalism. Which is what he did to america.

Wake the fuck up.

Onward to victory always. (Ernesto "El Che" Guevara)

Hmm.. pickle huh?

I really couldn�t help notice the tons of arguments made about this topic from the �I majored in social science� context.. But this problem is far more convoluted... So while I wait for my sets to download and insomnia to wear off, I�ll share some thoughts.. Take �em or leave �em...

First off� WHOOAH.. Pretty god damn entertaining I have to say, and I barely read a quarter of this thread!...There�s a whole cocktail of arguments, some based on emotions, some based on origin, some based on the amount of shit that got stuffed up someone�s nostrils that night, and finally some absurdly ridiculous ones.

In general, people in North America are basing their opinions on two things only; current news and the history (facts) that led to the escalation of the current event, besides any education they may have achieved in international law, political science, etc... All fair n� square� Whoever tells you that you�re not entitled to have an opinion -> punch them in the nuts!

But I�m sorry to say that does not suffice.. If you haven�t been around it since that ****** shot Isaac Rabin back in 1995, you�re missing some bits and pieces that will help you establish a better, clearer opinion of the situation� And by been around, I mean forced to watch daily marathons of news broadcasts just cause the one TV in your household was constantly being used for that reason..

So a quick note -> 1995: peace DEAL was soooo close.. then poor Rabin got shot.. then what?

Before I say anything, let�s get this straight..
1.FATEH -> Established by Yasser Arafat in 1954: based on nationalist ideology
2.HAMAS -> Established by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin in 1987: based on extreme Islamic movement (even though they will claim that they are not extreme �til the end of time)
3.On annual basis, Palestine receives a nice chunk of money as international donations from several countries and organizations such as Saudi Arabia, Egypt and UNRWA, which is obviously given to the government (party with most seats)

Rabin is dead.. The Palestinians & Israelis still want peace� So typically let the people vote for a government to do that for them, right? But when you have government leaders as aggressive as Benjamin Netanyahu and Ehud Barak along the rise of extreme Islamic movement, members of the opposing political party saw an opportunity for PERSONAL INTESREST� (I�ll let you guess who they are!)

So what do they do? Simple, start shit.. And consequently, Israel fought back� Now with people wondering wtf happened� What easier reason was there to find than RELIGION, especially in a region where people are entirely fueled by faith.. But does it stop there? NO, fuck, No.. While we�re at it, we�ll brainwash the fuck out of the young ones with extreme Islamic religious propaganda to get them on our side.. This way when they grow up they�ll vote for us.. Fourteen years of that and what do you get? A nationalist government turns into an extreme Islamic movement government, which now have complete control of how the donations are disposed and allocated, and have decent firearm power to maintain order within the Palestinians.

Now for all the lovely pro-hamas kittens that will argue.. If HAMAS is so good and innocent, why the fuck are your people starving? It�s not like you can�t sneak guns, so why the fuck can�t u sneak food??? A government is supposed to protect its people, not harm them, even if they have to COMPROMISE (land/resources), a word they�ll never understand as long as they keep driving to the negotiation tables in hordes of sl 500 mercedes cars�

The gist is, a bunch of people hiding behind beards and religion do not represent the voice of the average Palestinian family that just wants peace, and are sick and tired of this shit.. Whether you want to fight because you believe your land was taken away from you, awesome, just don't vote for idiots/scumbags to do it.. that give Israel the opportunities it needs to continue its occupation... But then on the other hand, the Israelis believe it's their land too .. Definitely a 'chicken vs. egg' scenario... Who was there first doesn't justify who owns the land imo... If that's the case, the atheist descendants of the cavemen that lived there might as well join the party and go claim their land back!

My one beef with Israel is, if I�m a 6ft guy buffed and muscled to shit, and my girlfriend is a 4 ft skinny midget, and one day she starts poking me with a stick, then starts poking some more til it starts to hurt� Why do I need to go grab a baseball bat and whack the fuck outta her head?? It�s not her fault she�s stupid� Just break the stick� And it�s not their first time fighting against them either.. When u fire a rocket, then hide right afterwards, not even knowing the target you�re hitting, you�re fighting like a mouse.. Whether its legit or not, that�s not the issue.. But when u get mice in your house, u don�t go storming through the place with an ak-47, you poison/trap them by knowing where they hide.. Clearly from the devastating civilian casualty figures for the Palestinians, they don�t care and they�re just pulling a terminator...

For the record, I�m neither jewish or muslim, and hopped around the region about half of my life�

I hope this helps end this thread, the need to rabble back and forth is completely useless.. At the end of the day, you�ve had your big mac, listened to ur sickest minimal set and bobbed your head all day, went to silver city and watched a shitty movie, and have had a good night of sleep.. Do you think they give a fuck about what you think?

Only tha music *tha music* .. can save us all..

<----- starts to "slow clap"

quote:

Originally posted by The Ear <----- starts to "slow clap"

LOL just for fun

quote:

Originally posted by HouseGuru You dip shits must have pea sized brains. I have never seen such stuborn stupid fucks in my life. Worse then fukn mules. All your arguments and counter arugments are meanless. This bullshit has been going on for years, The biggest problems is not who's on first whats on second. No one will ever win this argument don't you fucktards get it. Both sides are at fault and the time to settle this conflict is over. No more killing will settle this nor will your bickering about who started this bullshit. Your like little fuckn kids he started it no he did. GROW THE FUCK UP YOU DIP SHITs. Its only two bad someone doesn't grab the leaders of both sides and beats the living fuckn shit out of them till they get it through their thick fuckn skulls. Then to skin them alive for being such douche bags. So before you present another argument stop being so fuckn stupid. The time for conflict resolution is over. The time for smackin them upside the head is now. Personally they both deserve what they get. Teaching hatred to young children forever corrupting the most innocent of souls. It disgust me to see young children on tv waving their fists and chanting in the same manor as Hitler. FUCKn revolting!!! THIS GOES FOR BOTH SIDES. The only way this will end is if the leaders of both groups are captured and tried for crimes against humantiy. I would also have the UN take over the whole region putting those that incite the violence to death. Don't agree big fuckn whoop. Severe measures for severe conflict. and now for you Cyrus you dumb ass fuck!!! Yeah You heard me. It is insulting personally that you use the image of someone so noble as Ernesto "Che" Guevara for your profile picture. He would never support your argument as he was a firm believer that relgion was a poison and had no place in society. That was not what he was about. It disgusts me that palestinians use his image to support their cause. HE WOULD NEVER SUPPORT EITHER SIDE. What he tried to instill was the value of people and life over monetary driven societies. To teach and educate the young to live a life of peace. In the words of "CHE" FUCK Capitalism. Which is what he did to america. Wake the fuck up. Onward to victory always. (Ernesto "El Che" Guevara)

you forgot to add "only our underground plur can save the world".

quote:

In the words of "CHE" FUCK Capitalism. Which is what he did to america.

what are you talking about man????

quote:

Originally posted by Shade Fair enough. @djeso What would you propose as a solution in a situation like that? (This isn't me attacking, I'm really asking you a genuine question)

Yohan's previous post will answer that for you

quote:

Originally posted by raymee_stylez My one beef with Israel is, if I�m a 6ft guy buffed and muscled to shit, and my girlfriend is a 4 ft skinny midget, and one day she starts poking me with a stick, then starts poking some more til it starts to hurt� Why do I need to go grab a baseball bat and whack the fuck outta her head?? It�s not her fault she�s stupid� Just break the stick� And it�s not their first time fighting against them either.. When u fire a rocket, then hide right afterwards, not even knowing the target you�re hitting, you�re fighting like a mouse.. Whether its legit or not, that�s not the issue.. But when u get mice in your house, u don�t go storming through the place with an ak-47, you poison/trap them by knowing where they hide.. Clearly from the devastating civilian casualty figures for the Palestinians, they don�t care and they�re just pulling a terminator...

If this is your one problem with Israel, you need to do more research - on both sides (and this is coming from an Israeli-Canadian who is CURRENTLY in Israel). That said, I'd like to change your analogy slightly to show you that it can be looked at in several other ways - and something that I experienced as I'm the youngest in the family.

Imagine two brothers, one 15, and the other 8. One day the little brother decides to try to punch his older brother in the stomach (whether as an act of retaliation or whatever is irrelevant and, as you can see, doesn't ever end in this thread). The older brother, who doesn't necessarily feel too much pain as a result says, "Don't touch me, or you'll be hurt" - which oddly enough is a common phrase in Hebrew. The little brother, enjoying his fun, keeps punching and bothering the older brother - ignoring the comments, regardless of how often they're repeated.

One day, tired of the little brother's bothersome ways, the older brother says "Ok, that's enough. I've had it", and returns the favour by hitting his little brother once. This, obviously, is enough to make the little one gasp in pain. They "resolve" and this action repeats itself over, and over, and over. If you were the older brother (not the parent), and you were tired of the little kid, wouldn't you return the favour?

I realize that I've skewed the picture entirely at this point, but I just wanted to show how far that analogy can be bent (in all reality, it can be bent further, but I imagine I'll get enough crap for this one as is).

quote:

Originally posted by Shade I realize that I've skewed the picture entirely at this point, but I just wanted to show how far that analogy can be bent (in all reality, it can be bent further, but I imagine I'll get enough crap for this one as is).

Ok lets agree with what you have said so far.......Keeping in mind that the litter brother did all that.....Now here is my question :-

Based on your surroundings and whatever you have seen so far since your are currently in Israel....Do you think Israel never did anything to provoke such acts in the past from the little brother?

Like these people in (gaza,palestine) side are the ones always starting it ?

Seriously, who the fuck cares who started what and when they started it. Both sides are too busy blowing each other up and neither side is willing to stop. When they have blown each other up enough then they one side will want to discuss an end to this. Unfortunately, in every war that has happened on this planet one side is going to be stronger then the other side. Yes, it sucks when your side is the weaker side. Instead of continuing the blood shed how about trying to get your side to understand that this can't go on and try to find a peaceful solution.

quote:

Originally posted by HouseGuru You dip shits must have pea sized brains. I have never seen such stuborn stupid fucks in my life. Worse then fukn mules. All your arguments and counter arugments are meanless. This bullshit has been going on for years, The biggest problems is not who's on first whats on second. No one will ever win this argument don't you fucktards get it. Both sides are at fault and the time to settle this conflict is over. No more killing will settle this nor will your bickering about who started this bullshit. Your like little fuckn kids he started it no he did. GROW THE FUCK UP YOU DIP SHITs. Its only two bad someone doesn't grab the leaders of both sides and beats the living fuckn shit out of them till they get it through their thick fuckn skulls. Then to skin them alive for being such douche bags. So before you present another argument stop being so fuckn stupid. The time for conflict resolution is over. The time for smackin them upside the head is now. Personally they both deserve what they get. Teaching hatred to young children forever corrupting the most innocent of souls. It disgust me to see young children on tv waving their fists and chanting in the same manor as Hitler. FUCKn revolting!!! THIS GOES FOR BOTH SIDES. The only way this will end is if the leaders of both groups are captured and tried for crimes against humantiy. I would also have the UN take over the whole region putting those that incite the violence to death. Don't agree big fuckn whoop.

+1

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