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-- End Of Trance ???
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Originally posted by moncster From examples such as DJ Sammy and Scooter, we can deduce that the inferior trance are NOT dying

Is it not possible that DJ Sammy and Scooter are simply mutations? And trance has evolved greatly,not so much in structure, but definitly in sound as soft- and hardware habe evolved aswell.

Evolving is not neccesarily becoming better, but adapting to a current situation to ensure high survival and reproduction rate. And there is a fierce competion amongst electronic dance music, the rate of mutations rises equaly, some will die, some will lead to evolution. Lets hope mutations like Sammy and Scooter will die

quote:

Originally posted by CynepMeH Here's my take. Trance is like p0rn - e.g. u see too many pics of the same stuff it gets boring. u listen to the same track progression in the same fasion and it gets dull after a while. there's no element of surprise in tracks anymore. and some tracks are like single use. e.g. it's awesome first time u hear it but next time is like watching "6th Sense" for the second time - it's no longer interesting, as the element of surprise is gone.

thats exactly the same as any other song, no matter what genre. if u listen to a rock song over and over again its going to get boring, same goes for EVERYTHING else.
that would have to be the most stupidest thing said ever.

I think there's unbelievable room for growth in tech-trance and prog-trance. The former has been pioneered by practically Marco V alone, with the exception of several producers, and even he has been moving in a rather trancy direction lately (don't even suggest Tiesto's total failure on this front). Prog-trance has been practically untouched since 2000 except for occasional productions like Cultivate - Broken Pieces, and no one has picked up the torch since Sasha and the rest of the progressive ilk dropped it a couple years back.

Trance has so much room to grow that it's hard to understand why it has remained so claustrophobically confined to the same old formulas. If it goes into a downward tumble there is no one to blame but producers who fail to innovate and DJs who refuse to evolve and experiment.

I think some people put so much emphasis on persons. It is true that Tiesto and others made good music but it doenst mean that they are the only ones who are doing it. Everybody will pass the flag to somebody else sometime in future. If Tiesto is going in a different direction doesnt mean that Trance should/will die. There will always be newcomers and there will always be new and better productions.

quote:

Originally posted by CynepMeH well......... one of my favorite topics... Comming from a former prog-hater, I gotta tell u folks, you just need to diversify... It's one thing when you're looking for something to put you in your 'euphoria' state as x is boiling in your blood, it's another to listen to the music soberly. Here's my take. Trance is like p0rn - e.g. u see too many pics of the same stuff it gets boring. u listen to the same track progression in the same fasion and it gets dull after a while. there's no element of surprise in tracks anymore. and some tracks are like single use. e.g. it's awesome first time u hear it but next time is like watching "6th Sense" for the second time - it's no longer interesting, as the element of surprise is gone. Here's another approach to this. Did you know that it's a lot harder to produce quality trance track than prog track? I'm not talking about ATRC, that's like 50/50 between prog/trance. I'm talking about your prog track that oakie cans, etc...? Let's put it this way, i'm trying my hand at producing and the easiest tracks for me to create now are prog-sounding... why??? I don't have to worry tooo much about synching up your "trademark trance build-up" to MIDI/Drums and like 30 tracks that make track sound "full"... I can take my korg, hit one note with drum backing, arpegiate the crap out of it and then just tweak the knobs to modulate the sound... I can stamp out prog tracks at the rate 20/day. One more or less "quality" trance track takes me about 2 weeks to put together, i"m not even talking about finding a unique "hook line" or fancy drum track to go with it. I'm not generalizing - there are some awesome prog that takes a serious effort to produce and is definitely hands-down brilliant but sadly they are rare to find. Also, some prog grows on you as you listen to it more than once. It all depends on tastes, mood, association with music, scene, people, environment etc... Music always changes - it's made of waves and it is a wave that always changes. there are no two waves alike, sadly trance has taken for the most part a sadly redundant form. what sucks is that there are actually samples that allow you to "cut and paste" trance track now, instead of building it like before. as u listen to most "trance" today and it sounds the same: drum beat===>>fade in synth line==>>raise freq==>>>intro pattern==>>>build up===>>> peak===>drop down===>>> outro pattern==>>>fade out synth==>>drum beat take 90% of trance and you'll see the pattern. so it all comes down to the fact that perhaps there is less quality trance produces because it is so much easier to dish out prog, considering most of trance today sounds the same? DJ like PvD or Armin they "read" the audience. whatever audience responds to is what they play, with your "staple" tracks thrown in between. It's not that hard as you think. so, perhaps it is just that people stopped responding to trance which sounds the same? ok, sorry for a long rant.

Dude, you're wrong.
Every form of art must have some structure.
The fact that tracks conform to a structure makes them professional and acceptable.
Something that is extremely experimental is just chaotic crap that nobody will listen to.
Structure is GOOD!
And let's talk about those "formulaic breakdowns" that you described... Every work of art - be it literature, music, theater - is based on the premise of culmination or conflict resolution. That is a direct analogy to builds/breakdowns in music. For God's sake you can't have monotonous beats banging all the time with the same beeps, you gotta create a moment of tension!!! (and resolution of that tension)

Ok this is my very quick 2 cents.

Trance WILL die if the same artist keep trying to make it stay alive, sure we are getting a few new artist emerging into the scene but we need MORE, there should be a way to teach people on how electronic music works so they can apply it.

Do you actually think Michael Woods productions would have ever existed if Matt Darey never taught him, Everyone has their own ideas stuck onto the brain just waiting to come out at the crucial moment, but if you don't know how trance works then that idea is worth shit and will probably get discovered in a few years after by someone that does know how it works.

My 2 cents, The same artists are just slowing the death of trance.

quote:

Originally posted by Eugene Dude, you're wrong. Every form of art must have some structure. The fact that tracks conform to a structure makes them professional and acceptable. Something that is extremely experimental is just chaotic crap that nobody will listen to. Structure is GOOD! And let's talk about those "formulaic breakdowns" that you described... Every work of art - be it literature, music, theater - is based on the premise of culmination or conflict resolution. That is a direct analogy to builds/breakdowns in music. For God's sake you can't have monotonous beats banging all the time with the same beeps, you gotta create a moment of tension!!! (and resolution of that tension)

There is an UNFATHOMABLY HUGE gap between "formulaic breakdowns" and "chaotic crap that nobody will listen to." If that open territory was an ocean, most trance producers haven't even attempted the kiddie pool.

Take most of the material on ASOT, for example. Collectively the variation is as flat as a pancake. At least Paul van Dyk, Marco V, Ferry Corsten, JOOF, and some other top DJs have supported deviation from this static constant. (For the note, I think Armin is, in general, much more developed in sound than ASOT suggests. But the usual sound of the show IS representative of the trite, formulaic trance that saturates the market right now.)

quote:

Originally posted by Dark Apostle Lets hope mutations like Sammy and Scooter will die

but hope can only go so far... *picks up knife*

quote:

Originally posted by fuct4less but hope can only go so far... *picks up knife*

wooohoooooo, lets play Extinction *picks up meatcleaver*

i heart trance

quote:

Originally posted by Dark Apostle wooohoooooo, lets play Extinction *picks up meatcleaver*

yes. lets. and while were at it ill go grab the meat hook too!

your description made me think of Johan Gielen, who has gone straight from solid uplifting trance tunes to grimy techno in late 2002 :v(.

quote:

Originally posted by Dark Apostle Lets hope mutations like Sammy and Scooter will die

Let's not. Without shit music one can't really appreciate the good stuff. Also shitty music is in the eye of the beholder and someones trash is anothers treasure, then again a lot of people have no taste but then again thats just our opinion.

Does it have to be 'true' trance to be good?
Btw i never heard that the definition of what you call "true" trance is set to be uplifting/vocal and anthems.
I happen to be in the vein of uplifting/vocal (my favourite kind of trance) but who told you motherfucks that uplifting and vocal trance are said to be TRUE.
if you dont like it well TUFF! you cant do anything about it, maybe try to become a DJ and produce your own original "true" trance but for the time being glance through some other forum

Oh and since you brought it up trance is prolly the most commercial genre, not that that it matters that much to me.

At first it was cheesy trance that it was commercial but now great djs like Tiesto and Pvd are really really well known by the average person that is tuned to a commercial radio program.
Sooner or later AVB will become commercial (marketable) but who really gives a shit for fucks sake.
You are into trance just because it's underground? well it isn't.

quote:

Originally posted by djtrancendance your description made me think of Johan Gielen, who has gone straight from solid uplifting trance tunes to grimy techno in late 2002 :v(.

�h? Last time I heard him spin, he played trance mixed with some techno..and was this year

Trance never died. People just got bored of most of the cookie cutter stuff so some moved on to other genres and some tried to incorporate elements from other genres into it.

If trance is done right, it's unarguably the best EDM.

Leama - Requiem for a Dream
Blackwatch & Quivver - Loveless
Sonorous - Glass Garden
Sonorous - Second Sun (Leama & Moor rmx)
Midtone - Pearl

Try these and listen for yourself.

Dont' often post here but there's an excellent interview with graham gold (UK DJ that's older than most) on his website and it was published on skruff.net I think.

Gives a good analysis of the scene here in the UK and abroad, no holes barred stuff, but he's known for speaking his mind.

www.grahamgold.com

check out the news section.

I have the upmost respect for this man, and I like the way 15 years in the business hasn't jaded his opinion at all.

people have been speaking of the death of trance forever, and I am still waiting to see that prediction come true, have a feeling it will be a long time, that is for sure. Trance isn't going anywhere. Vive Le Trance

1) Trance is what you make of it. for me trance expresses a variety of feelings - this is unique in music. you can feel happiness, joy, ecstasy, love, sorrow and a whole bunch of other feelings. and only if electonic music loses it's ability to provide this variety, trance is not dead.

2) i am from austria. no trance is played - everywhere, because the scene is all abot aggression-gabber-skinhead-nazis. i felt alone with my music taste - but i know i was not alone. as long as i heard trance i knew trance was not dead! it is us who make trance! and if the music drifts into another direction, it will swift into the 'right' direction again later. as i've been to the love from above 2003 and there was such a great crowd, i really had the greatest feeling i've ever had (and yes, i had several girlfriends )!

don't make trance die! don't!

you should all die for saying bullshit
same goes for me too
we are the all singing all dancing crap of the world

quote:

Originally posted by Sound Minister you should all die for saying bullshit

Heeeeeeeyyyyyy, for some of us, BS is a form of art

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