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-- At least 186 killed in Madrid bombings.
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I second that borron ...

But i belive that there isn't n never will be a solution to this kind of problems n conflicts ...

we live in a f*cked up world due to f*cked up ppl n thats a humam conditon that will never change.

if ppl stopped trying to change other ppl point of view just because they think they'r right.
No one is right or wrong we all have to have different perspectives about life n the world we'r living.

It would be nice if ppl could just live other ppl alone, without interfere with their way of thinking n accept the differences among us human beings ( this serves for everyone ).
No one needs to be with the ones that go against their beliefs ...

but this will never happen ...
my sentiment n respect to "nuestros hermanos"

quote:

Originally posted by borron So you people think that killing the al-qaeda is the only solution? I think that will only strenghten them.

That's hilarious. Look at all those walking dead! They're so powerful!

Anyhow, who cares if it was ETA or al Qaeda? Destroy them both.

quote:

Originally posted by trancaholic Agreed.

What the *** you are agreeing with me?

quote:

Agreed - aren't we doing this already?

Stop it your scaring me now....

But the EU nations can provide better economic support for the war on terror. Currently they aren't paying for it and aren't doing much. Some nations such as Italy have been doing troop commitements, but the more money coming into Iraq the quicker and the higher the chances that Iraq will turn into a liberal democracy.

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We have "beefed" up our security a notch, but I think that most of us (me at least) would protest a patriot act.

Altough most Europeans countries actually have most of the "patriot act" powers today, they seem to do little with the necessities to capture terrorist.

Had the Spanish police tortured the driver of the van who had 500kg of dynamite last week, they could have probably avert this event. Europeans are generally very averse to taking this point of view, even though if they had tortured the driver (and I'm not even talking abouttaking off eyes and limbs, simply waking him up every 5 min for 2 days) perhaps 1800 people would have been alive or uninjured today.

quote:

What good would that do? How did Bush's "axis of evil"-speech help him control events in North Korea and Iran?

I'll tell you what good. But understand you must understand this concept first. Force is as powerful when you don't use it as when you do. America doesn't have to actually use its military force in every case, many times just the threat of it is enough to make people think twice.

When Europe dismays the "axis of evil" they bring those nations a false sense of security, "Americans would never invade us the world would cry out against them". So the American theoratical force disappears, and the USA is forced to either act with REAL force, or no force at all. The middle option disappears when you don't recognize force, there is no 'theoratical force'.

For instance, imagine the USA in a world with no "internatioanl community". If it told Iran to change its policies and stop supporting terror of all kinds or else.
Well lets just sya, I don't think Iran would chose the or else bit.

So in this hypothetical the outcome would be as equal to the use of force, but just with the threat of force, no actual usage of such.

This is the same principle that makes a man under gunpoint give a the theif "all his money", because the guy is pretty sure the theif will blow out his brains if he doesn't.

Yet when you take away the threat of force, you are then left with either to do nothing, or something. And I understand Europeans are opposed to force, but by doing such you actually force the use of force in more instances then needed.

If Europe just "shuts up and stands behind the USA" more progress like this can be achieved. And most likely the demands the USA would impose to terror sponsering regiems is stop supporting terrorism (which would benifit both Europe and USA), not necissairly the dismanteling of regiemes.

well enough of that

- This is soo bad. My condolences to the spanish people. Al Quaida has said it was them.. ETA has refuesed its them.

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Originally posted by Palestinian Comparing Spain's problem with the Palestinian one is a mistake. Spain is not literally killing and expelling Basque people from their homes and stealing their food and water everyday... Palestinians are fighting for independence after an invasion and destruction of their homeland.

I don't want to get into another Israel/Palestine debate, as they're already too prevalent on this forum, and I don't think we should be comparing Spain to the Middle-East, as there is certainly little if any room for comparison...

But accusing Jews of "Stealing food and water everyday" implies that Jews just walk into Palestinian homes and take food off their tables and drain their water wells at will. I won't get into the merits of whose land is whose, but one thing that is fact is that when the Jews went to Israel it was not much more than the sandy wasteland that is a lot of the middle-east. They brought irrigation technology and developed the land, making it more fertile. If nothing else the Jews made it more productive for all. If anything, water and food are more abundant because of the Jews. I'm sure this doesn't sit well with you, but right/wrong/occupational issues aside, it is true.

You forget humans are also part of biology. Some humans are viruses. Viruses kill until they're killed themselves. No negotiation whatsoever possible. Why do some people so strongly believe that everything in this world can be resolved through talking.

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Originally posted by TranceGiant You forget humans are also part of biology. Some humans are viruses. Viruses kill until they're killed themselves. No negotiation whatsoever possible. Why do some people so strongly believe that everything in this world can be resolved through talking.

WTF??? Some humans are viruses? Who? Morpheus ane Neo? Get off the crackpipe man.

(actually, I understand what you're saying and agree with you, I just think virus is the wrong word. Some people have been brainwashed and cannot think for themselves in terms of right and wrong--their actions are dictated by someone who has influence and control over their thoughts. They basically have tunnel-vision and are in pursuit of some sort of destruction, which generally ends in their own destruction as well--much like a virus D'0h!).

People who think discussion can solve everything are idealists. Nothing wrong with their intentions, but they limit their ability to solve problems by closing off certain avenues due to their idealistic approach to things. Basically, they ensure that they will lose because they don't have the will to do what it takes to win.

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Solutions for Europe: -Support the US in its war on terrorism, or at least remain silent, not like France, even if you disagree with it. Stop arguing about the necessities of fighting a brutal war such as Guantanumo Bay. -Provide economic assistance to Iraq to build a liberal democracy and champion the crusade of liberalisim throughout the middle east. -Create your own 'patriot acts' and beef up your security. -Threaten the destruction of terrorist-supporting regiems such as Iran, Syria, and Saudia Arabia. - Start condeming terrorism in all its forms strongly especially in the international forums you dominate. - Open charities and media stations to shift the Arab mind. - Build up your own military and intelligence services

And that will erradicate Islamic terrorism? Fat lot of good its done so far (seeing as Europe has actually done most of the things on your list). The ONLY way to erradicate terrorism is to erradicate the reasons why people feel the need to take up arms. Americans and Israelis more often than not simply pass this off as something inherent in Islam - well its not, I know plenty of Asians and I have never met one who has had fundamentalist veiws...guess what? They are just like us, go out, have a laugh.

Get this through your thick heads please - Europe DOES NOT have the military strength of the US. It is NOT CAPABLE of mounting any kind of large scale military operations. EU nations HAVE HELPED (unlike Israel for example) America's military operations in its war on terror.

And as for invading Saudi Arabia...what a fucking joke!!! Seriously tho, you'd expect that to be the number one target wouldn't you? They are the largest sponsor of terrorism and have made it their mission to spread fundamentalist Islamic views aroud the world...but guess what? Why did they get left out of the report into 11/9? I wonder? Anything to do with the nice little arrangements with America over oil? Wouldn't want to do anything to upset the largest oil producer in the world!!!

No, military operations are easily seen in the Muslim world as an attack on Islam. Terrorism will never go away unless you change that perception...and invading country after country only reinforces that view.

Lets say we did invade all the Middle East countries we wanted to...what would that solve? (Apart from swelling al-Qaida's ranks by 1000s) Nothing, cos al-Qaida does not have a country. How many members of al-Qaida are there with American or British passports? Alot at a guess...

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Originally posted by Juanma now 131 confirmed kills and 400 hurts. Im This is incredible. Madrid is a caos. Is like the 11 September

It's awful this happened,but it's not like 9/11.

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Originally posted by Q5echo Trying not to come off as a smartass because i agree with everything in your post, but was this an ironic statement? It seems to the rest of the non muslim world that al-queda does have a true following of not just middle easterners but a global pool of fresh hearts and minds to pull from. All it takes is a few to affect many in more ways one. i fuckin hate'm

I would say that they don't. They are no longer appealing to the mainstream masses of muslims, they are attracting the extremists who share their views. If you think about it, a good 70% of their attacks are directed against muslims and muslim nations. This is no longer a muslim vs. non-muslim struggle they are waging. It has become fundamentalist vs. non-fundamentalist battle. And if they continue to wage the attacks that they have been waging, then I believe that their support within the muslim community will eventually diminishh over time ... especially after the US transition of power in Iraq. Therefore, I think that the intelligent use of force over time will destroy Al-Qaeda. And once again, I would state that there is no feasible way to bargain with Al-Qaeda or give in to their demands, therefore force must be used.

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo Trying not to come off as a smartass because i agree with everything in your post, but was this an ironic statement? It seems to the rest of the non muslim world that al-queda does have a true following of not just middle easterners but a global pool of fresh hearts and minds to pull from. All it takes is a few to affect many in more ways one. i fuckin hate'm

I would say that they don't. They are no longer appealing to the mainstream masses of muslims, they are attracting the extremists who share their views. If you think about it, a good 70% of their attacks are directed against muslims and muslim nations. This is no longer a muslim vs. non-muslim struggle they are waging. It has become fundamentalist vs. non-fundamentalist battle. And if they continue to wage the attacks that they have been waging, then I believe that their support within the muslim community will eventually diminishh over time ... especially after the US transition of power in Iraq. Therefore, I think that the intelligent use of force over time will destroy Al-Qaeda. And once again, I would state that there is no feasible way to bargain with Al-Qaeda or give in to their demands, therefore force must be used.

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Originally posted by NeoPhono First, I'm not a "war is the only solution" type of person. However, when there is no hope of diplomacy, I'm not going to kid myself. There is no way to meet the demands of Al Qaeda, much less get "them" in a room to even talk about it.

as many here has indicated, "diplomacy" in this case may be somewhat different from how you would define it. It doesn't mean that you have to negotiate with them and say that "okay we will convert half US to islam, happy?", diplomacy in this case may be more to solve the root of the problem, why do they exist? If you don't solve the root of the problem, there will be 10 new terror organisations as fast as you have exterminated one.

quote:

Secondly, can you give me examples of where a terrorist organization of this magnitude has ever been appeased by diplomacy? I can think of individual groups, or events being averted, but never an entire movement stopped. It may buy small intervals of peace, only to flare up again in violence (it does not solve the root problem, only elongates tension). I can give you a whole list where diplomacy didn't work. Northern Ireland, Libya, Chechnya, Afghanistan, Palestine, Haiti, Iraq, etc.

Northern Ireland:
This conflict first started because the discriminating laws from the occupier England, that made Catholics less worthy than protestant (much like the apartheid system in south africa). In late 1700 the laws became a bit better for the catholics, but they still had FAR from the same rights as the protestants. About that time there was also a revolution (inspired by the france revolution), that was hit down by the english. in the beginning of the 19 century the union between england and ireland was created. This meaned that ireland had no own political influence, except one man in the british parliament. The irish people was also very opressed by the police (which was very scared of uprisings). They were really bad treated of the english, and the hate started to grow more and more...
During the middle of the 19 century Ireland was the poorest place in europe and a lot of people emigrated to america, also there was a large amount of people dying in different sicknesses. The dissatisfaction of the union was big, and the anger grew even more.
Thanks to the liberals in the beginning of the 20 century, it was decided that ireland should be an own state in 1914, unforunaly a world war broke out then, so it was procrastinated. In 1915 the irish tried to do revolt, but due to some unlucky things it was hit down.
in 1919 was IRA founded and they started their terrorist war against the english, not all irish fought on their side though, the protestants (which almost all of them lived in the north part of ireland) wanted to keep the union with the English. A war broke out. There was a lot of critizism about the war in england though, the taxpayers thought that the war was pointless and didn't lead anywhere. this led to the split of ireland, one northern ireland, and one ireland, which soon led to a independent ireland (which was really peaceful...)
The terror still remained in northern ireland though. The majority of their population was/are protestants, and supporters of the union with england. But IRA had a strong position and did everything it could to make northern ireland free. violence turned into even more violence, and it went on so and too many people was killed whitout any meaning.. In 1972 London took over the ruling of northern ireland, they had now NOTHING to say, except that they now got some more representatives in the parliament. England sent 20 000 troops there and did the laws even worse, not that unexpectadly, the violence rise even more. Not until they got sick of all the violence and actually tried to solve the conflict diplomatically, they made _some_ progress.

i can't see how this shows that diplomacy don't work?!

anyway, this conflict is rather typical when it comes to terrorism, one people has been opressed and want to do something about it, they have no chance to do it through a normal war, so they use terror as a last option. This conflict also has religion included, which makes it even more typical.

to avoid those kinds of situations you have to stop doing the bad things in the beginning, but hey everyone can do mistakes, but it is really important to not give terror a chance to grow. As for example start a war with iraq without no real reason, except for oil...


Chechnya:
also this started loooooooong time ago (1780), when the russians first occupied chechnya, they oppressed the people and even deported a great amount of them, naturally the people didn't like the russians.
when the sovjet union colapsed in the beginning of the '90, the chechnyans (Dzjochar Dudajev) declared to have an own state, the russian government had its own problems then, so they didn't really care until 1994 when they after various tries to get a peaceful ending to the conflict sent troops to chechnya to reconquer the area, they planned that the operation would take some weeks, but it didn't... in 1996 a cease fire was negotiated. the anarchy continued though, and the "country" had enormous problems with local warriors... when chechnya attacked "dagestan" (i have NO idea what that is in english but i guess it's something similar ) in 1999 to etablish a new big "Islamic state", russia sent a great amount of troops there to avoid that. Russia was really afraid of a creation of such a state, and i think they had all reasons to be, but they used the wrong tactics to fight it.
inspired by nato's actions in serbia they bombed the shit out of the country from 10 000 meters high, that was very effective for the russians, but not for the civilians. this was also about the time when the terror war started. the chechnyans started to blow up things in moscow, and other terrible things. that is also an understandable thing to do considering what the russians did to them.

Putin has now (to my understanding) changed tactics in this war, the chechnyans now have some kind of self govern, but russia still have some control, this is probably the way to go, they get their own country and russia still got some control, tho it is probably kind of late now, since things are really fucked up now it will be hard. If they had used this tactic from the beginning perhaps everything of this could have been avoided. ie-->diplomacy works


Libya:
this is quite obvious an exemple of where diplmocy works.

this is just an example of it:
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/afric....wmd/index.html


Iraq
this is an obvious example of where war hasn't worked, at least yet. it could have been a good example of diplomacy, after all (under some pressure) they let the weapond expectors into the country.




Since i'm rather tierd now after all this, i won't go into the other ones, but i think i have my point proven already, i'm sure that there is not much different in those cases.

sorry for making this much of a history essay, that was not my intention from the beginning, but hope it helped to understand my point.fighting terrorism is all about understanding, without understanding, you won't come anywhere. it's also important to not make any new chanses for hate, for example play around in the world too much, that will just increase the terrorist networks. So iraq is probably a big missatake, at least it's a dangerous path to go.

terror will exists as long as the problems exists. no matter how hard you try to eliminate it.

quote:

Originally posted by trancaholic St Andrew: Nice posts.

thanks a lot, that actually made me very happy since i usually admire your posts

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Originally posted by St_Andrew terror will exists as long as the problems exists. no matter how hard you try to eliminate it.

This may apply to situations such as Palestine, Chechnya, etc., but we shouldn't attempt to generalize all sources for terrorism and apply a one-size fits all solution to everything. You're setting yourself up for failure. Like I've been saying, the so called "problem" that is the source of Al-Qaeda's existence is the growth of western culture in the middle east and its departure from complete religious fundementalism. Their overall cause is NOT supported by the majority, since their appeal is towards extremism (which is by definition not of the majority) Therefore, there really is no solution to their "problem". The only true way to resolve the situation is through the intelligent use of force and force only. Now how you go about applying that force (through greater involvement of other countries, eliminating rogue nations supporting these groups, etc.) is the real question.

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Originally posted by WhoaNellie1487 It's awful this happened,but it's not like 9/11.

Well if it happened 911 days after 9-11, than to me thats equivalant to the attack in the US.

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Originally posted by St_Andrew as many here has indicated, "diplomacy" in this case may be somewhat different from how you would define it. It doesn't mean that you have to negotiate with them and say that "okay we will convert half US to islam, happy?", diplomacy in this case may be more to solve the root of the problem, why do they exist? If you don't solve the root of the problem, there will be 10 new terror organisations as fast as you have exterminated one.

As occrider and I have pointed out before, their main purpose is to rid the world of western culture and to spread their own fundamentalist ideologies about Islam. That is the root of the problem, we aren't like them. So, unless you're proposing we become like them, to get rid of the "root" or the problem, there is not much we can do to appease them. Their goals are very simple.

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Northern Ireland: Not until they got sick of all the violence and actually tried to solve the conflict diplomatically, they made _some_ progress. Chechnya: Putin has now (to my understanding) changed tactics in this war, the chechnyans now have some kind of self govern, but russia still have some control, this is probably the way to go, they get their own country and russia still got some control, tho it is probably kind of late now, since things are really fucked up now it will be hard. If they had used this tactic from the beginning perhaps everything of this could have been avoided. ie-->diplomacy works Libya: this is quite obvious an exemple of where diplmocy works. this is just an example of it: http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/afric....wmd/index.html Iraq this is an obvious example of where war hasn't worked, at least yet. it could have been a good example of diplomacy, after all (under some pressure) they let the weapond expectors into the country.

Okay, so in N. Ireland you're saying that it has helped, not solved the problem. In Chechnya things are still "fucked up" as you put it. Lybia was scared into their current practices by the US invasion of Iraq and Iraq is an obvious example of diplomacy not working through the UN. So how again in any of these situations did diplomacy solve a situation?

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Originally posted by dj_ilan_yosef Well if it happened 911 days after 9-11, than to me thats equivalant to the attack in the US.

What happened in the US,and what happened in Spain aren't near the same.

Terrorists tried to take out our defense,our finaces,our government,and our confidence. Fortunatly, they didn't get to the capitol. But, the attacks on 9/11 were much much worse.

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Originally posted by borron There are very racist views on this topic, especially against arabs...

yeah...take a look at what this mofo wrote

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Originally posted by imokruok Yep, ARABS!

This attack was just horrible, like any other terrorist acts.

Both extremist leaders of nations that support state terrorism, as well as terrorist cell networks shot be eradicated from this world.

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Originally posted by WhoaNellie1487 What happened in the US,and what happened in Spain aren't near the same. Terrorists tried to take out our defense,our finaces,our government,and our confidence. Fortunatly, they didn't get to the capitol. But, the attacks on 9/11 were much much worse.

the acts themselves had the same intentions...just the number of civilian casualties were different.

What scares me alot more is an audio tape attained by an Arab media outlet proclaiming that Al-Quaeda's next attack on America is 90% complete and that "the black wind of death" will sweep many lives.

I think many of you hear are also missing a problem.

If you can't fix the root cause, which you won't unless you invade some 0Arab dicatorships to esnure thriving liberal democracies in the middle east, then you should besiege the terrorist.

You can't starve them out of their caves unfortunatley, but the world could actually co-operate in this war, and confiscate all fiances. You realize Al Qaeda is probably a billion dollar organization or some high million figure. Where is all this money coming from? And why isn't it stopping?

The failure of the west in this war has been in the finances. The USA can outspend Al Qaeda anyday of the week, but if Al Qaeda had an operating budget of a million or less it would be the death of it.

Recruiting networks, safe houses, training camps, schools, explosives, military training and arnament don't come cheap.

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley The ONLY way to erradicate terrorism is to erradicate the reasons why people feel the need to take up arms.

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Originally posted by St_Andrew diplomacy in this case may be more to solve the root of the problem, why do they exist? If you don't solve the root of the problem, there will be 10 new terror organisations as fast as you have exterminated one.

ok, im really baffelled here... what do you guys think is the root of this problem?

as everyone has indicated here its a clash of civilization between the liberal west and the fundamental middle east. you want us to solve the root of this problem by becoming religious fanatics? or at the very least allow this inhumanity to fester and grow unrestrictedly in the heart of arabia?

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Originally posted by occrider This may apply to situations such as Palestine, Chechnya, etc., but we shouldn't attempt to generalize all sources for terrorism and apply a one-size fits all solution to everything.

I think they (Al Quaida, Hamas, Hizballah, Djihad, Chechnian groups)DO have something in common, and that is their ideological/religous motive. While ETA and IRA act primarily "politically", the political goals for the aforementioned Islamistic groups are merely a cheap justification, masking ideology. Theoretically those with political motives could be rather negotiated with, if the terrorists' minds included something like reason (the ability to compromise). However they don't seek a compromise but total defeat and POWER. Terrorism is fascism in that it oppresses , rules and constantly tries to extend its power. Add to that ideology like Al Quaida's dream of an Islamist empire and you lose any chance of solving by talking. The root of terror is not frustration or dicontent with the political situation. It is megalomania, greed for power and control and of course fanatism. I agree that these phenomena can and must be preemtively fought against in a social/cultural way. A long-term job. Terrorism, however, is already the end result and can only be defeated by force. At this stage the disease already broke out must be destroyed.
Crush the end result by force. Try to eliminate the ingredients socially (or, to use St. Andrews fav. word, "diplomatically").

edit: Where does frustration come into play then? Well, frustration surely "helps" when it comes to recruting and justifyng. But it's not the root. It just comes as a handy tool for an already established regime.

just to re-emphasise on the Giant's post;

Fustration is not the cause for terrorism.
If fustration was the cause, well we would see terrorism in far worse ways in other areas of the world that are fustrated, such as South America, AFRICA, Asia, and did I say AFRICA?

Fustration is a fuel for the root cause, but its not what started the fire, that is as people here have correctly pointed out the fundamental ideology. How do you defeat Isalmo-terrorism? You defeat its ideology. How do you do that? You offer a countering philosophy and world viewpoint. What countering philosophy and world viewpoint do you offer? That of liberal democracy (such as in the west) adapted for the mideast. How do you do that? By demonstrating it through reality by examples such as the new Iraq.

Until you guys are willing to prove your ideology, liberal democracy, is a powerful and better alternative to the people of the middle east than islamo-facisim, then you aren't going to win the war, its that simple.

Proving your philosophy is a hard thing to do, and it takes a long time. But defintely demonstrating the strength you posess (obtained by your philosophy) is one very effect means of doing this in the longrun, it worked with commie-facist philosophy, and I see no reason why it won't work against islamo-funadmentalisim.

ignore away...

Water

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Originally posted by Shakka I don't want to get into another Israel/Palestine debate, as they're already too prevalent on this forum, and I don't think we should be comparing Spain to the Middle-East, as there is certainly little if any room for comparison... But accusing Jews of "Stealing food and water everyday" implies that Jews just walk into Palestinian homes and take food off their tables and drain their water wells at will. I won't get into the merits of whose land is whose, but one thing that is fact is that when the Jews went to Israel it was not much more than the sandy wasteland that is a lot of the middle-east. They brought irrigation technology and developed the land, making it more fertile. If nothing else the Jews made it more productive for all. If anything, water and food are more abundant because of the Jews. I'm sure this doesn't sit well with you, but right/wrong/occupational issues aside, it is true.

Let me throw the facts in your face. When Israel plows up farms, orchards, and olive trees, they are destroying food and starving people. Many farms were plowed up so the wall can be built.

Facts about water:
75% of the Occupied West Bank & Gaza Strip renewable water resources are used by Israel.
Three million Palestinians are allowed to use 250 million cubic meters per annum (83 cubic meters for each Palestinian per year) while six million Israelis enjoy the use of 2.0 billion cubic meters (333 cubic meter for each Israeli per year), which means that one Israeli consumes as much water as do four Palestinians. Each Israeli settler is allocated 1,450 cubic meters of water per year.
The World Health Organization's recognized minimum of domestic water consumption is 100 liters per capita per day. The current domestic water supply for Palestinians is only 57-76 liters per capita per day. Many towns and villages are suffering from a severe water shortage as a result of closing the Palestinian territories.
Many villages in the Jenin Governate are suffering from serious water shortage due to the Israeli siege. The Municipality is not able to import needed spare parts for the well pump. Water Tankers cannot reach the villages due to the closure.
Continuous Israeli settlers' attacks on Palestinian water tankers prevent Palestinian Water Tankers from reaching their water supply source-taps--- which have been cut off by local Isreali settlers who solely own and control the flow of water in the region . Some of the Palestinian villages such as Dier Ibzi and Qabalan are particularily suffering from the cut off of the water supply by the settlers who are protected by the Israeli soldiers. Also, Israeli settlers from Humesh settlement cut off water pipes, which served seven surrounding villages. Many watertankers are obliged to return empty due to the high demand on exhausted source-taps in areas under Palestinian control.
As a result of the cut-offs, the price of tanked water increased from 2.5 $ per cubic meter to 7.5 $ per cubic meter. As a result of the drastic rise in the price of water, the amount of income spent per family on water has increased by 12%, making it more difficult for families to meet their basic domestic and vital needs.
There have been well pumps shut off because of fuel scarcity.
Israeli soldiers have targeted water roof tanks of Palestinian houses near Israeli checkpoints.
Israeli helicopters bombarded the water well in Mawasi area in Gaza.
Under the conditions incurred by the siege, civilians in the occupied territories are suffering from lack of access to necessary resources, necessary for even the maintenance of their daily needs and basic health. We have reached a state of emergency in the water sector in the Occupied Territories. We must call for an immediate end to the siege upon the water sector.

Thread now officially hijacked.

In the voice of Israeli-Palestinian Topics:

You can run but you can't hide!

Arabs don't want America's version of liberal democracy, you cannot force it on the Arabs. This is becoming clearly a war on Islam so that liberal democracy can be shoved down our throats so American companies can make more profit.

The only way to solve the problem is to first solve Israeli/Palestinian problem.

Second STOP SUPPORTING AND FUNDING NASTY DICTATORS AND MONARCHS IN THE MIDDLE EAST! E.G. SAUDI ARABIA

That's it. Then grab your popcorn and watch the Arabs as they revolt against their dictators and impose democracy.

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