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-- Sasha is no longer spining Prog or using vinyl!
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EDM Dj's appear to be "washed up" pretty easily to some of you. You gotta step out of the uber fast releasing of EDM music these days and just look at the dj and say, is his shit good or is his shit bad. Just because he hasn't released anything that you would call good in like 3 years, doesn't mean he sucks. Imagine the beatles came back (even from the dead in some cases ) and played 1 more show. You think people would be saying shit like 'they haven't released anything good in decades!'

It's hilarious to see who everybodies NEW FAV DJ is every month (and quite entertaining to me i might add)

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EDM Dj's appear to be "washed up" pretty easily to some of you.

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It's hilarious to see who everybodies NEW FAV DJ is every month (and quite entertaining to me i might add)

Ummm who the fuck is this guy ?

someone who has an opinion

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Originally posted by The Highroller someone who has an opinion

I guess I take it kind of personally when he includes " " from my OPINION and then goes on to slander everyone with statements like new DJ of the month especially when he doesn't know me.
I could be wrong with that assumption though.

It amazes me at the breadth and scope of ignorance among many of those making contributions (and I say that in the loosest of terms)to this thread.

It is unfortunate that the term "Progressive" was pinned to a certain hybrid of House, Techno and Trance sound, as it was more meant to be a mindset to the approach and technique of creating music which liberates itself from the standard structure of the popular style of its time. The term Progressive was given to any music that discarded the predictable foundations and elements of song creation. Essentially, it is an adjective to a style, therefore, as an example, to say Progressive Trance is boring is to say no Trance that attempts to advance and experiment from the formulaic standard has any value or energy so to dumb it down......those that knock progressive music, whatever it's form, essentially advertise their desire for music to stagnate and grow stale.

Specifically, for those here that seem to make a hobby of bashing progressive music, stop the cozy little bubble which is your world for one minute and consider the FACT that Trance as YOU see it would have been long since extinct had not the elements of progressive and other forward thinking styles been injected into it by all the biggest Trance DJ's you blindly worship.

Let's look at Tiesto, on a lark, shall we? It seems quite clear that much of his best work (Flight 643) and sets, have more a Techno spirit to them then pure uncut Trance. Armin? His tracklists read like an essential list for Prog/tech-trance/breaks along side the GENUINE good trance that still exists if one cares to search for it.

I laugh when people balk at music that diverges from their micro-view of what is good. I can't help but picture those elderly people we chuckle at for still listening to Rag-time or Waltzes and think.........there lies YOUR future, except it will be Trance...atleast the kind that refused to evolve.


Progressive will not die, it's a contradiction in terms. Our current projection of what it is may die or change but forward-thinking music, the kind the keeps the scene vibrant and relevant, will remain steadfastly pushing ahead and creating new, powerful music.

FF

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Originally posted by Form&Funktion It amazes me at the breadth and scope of ignorance among many of those making contributions (and I say that in the loosest of terms)to this thread. It is unfortunate that the term "Progressive" was pinned to a certain hybrid of House, Techno and Trance sound, as it was more meant to be a mindset to the approach and technique of creating music which liberates itself from the standard structure of the popular style of its time. The term Progressive was given to any music that discarded the predictable foundations and elements of song creation. Essentially, it is an adjective to a style, therefore, as an example, to say Progressive Trance is boring is to say no Trance that attempts to advance and experiment from the formulaic standard has any value or energy so to dumb it down......those that knock progressive music, whatever it's form, essentially advertise their desire for music to stagnate and grow stale. Specifically, for those here that seem to make a hobby of bashing progressive music, stop the cozy little bubble which is your world for one minute and consider the FACT that Trance as YOU see it would have been long since extinct had not the elements of progressive and other forward thinking styles been injected into it by all the biggest Trance DJ's you blindly worship. Let's look at Tiesto, on a lark, shall we? It seems quite clear that much of his best work (Flight 643) and sets, have more a Techno spirit to them then pure uncut Trance. Armin? His tracklists read like an essential list for Prog/tech-trance/breaks along side the GENUINE good trance that still exists if one cares to search for it. I laugh when people balk at music that diverges from their micro-view of what is good. I can't help but picture those elderly people we chuckle at for still listening to Rag-time or Waltzes and think.........there lies YOUR future, except it will be Trance...atleast the kind that refused to evolve. Progressive will not die, it's a contradiction in terms. Our current projection of what it is may die or change but forward-thinking music, the kind the keeps the scene vibrant and relevant, will remain steadfastly pushing ahead and creating new, powerful music. FF

Thats what i meant to say.
VERY good points brought up i must say.

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Originally posted by ShAwZy Ummm who the fuck is this guy ?

does it matter?

if i wanted to quote you i would've used the quote feature most likely.

after browsing and participating in these forums for over a year I come to the conclusion that most people have a flavour of the month dj. There are the odd few who are die-hard tiesto fans or pvd fans, but a lot of people go nuts over who has put out the latest greatest set for the month.

Disagree with my conclusion? then say why

edit: after re-reading my post i should've made it more clear the i was generalizing. It wasn't really meant to be in response to Shawzy's post, who sounds like he genuinly doesn't care for sasha much, which is fine.

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Originally posted by Form&Funktion ^^

well put.

who cares what sasha starts playing. if it's good music it's good music

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Originally posted by Form&Funktion It amazes me at the breadth and scope of ignorance among many of those making contributions (and I say that in the loosest of terms)to this thread. It is unfortunate that the term "Progressive" was pinned to a certain hybrid of House, Techno and Trance sound, as it was more meant to be a mindset to the approach and technique of creating music which liberates itself from the standard structure of the popular style of its time.

This is a fancy definition of purpose, but I still have never been given a clear definition of what characterizes progressive music. (and I've asked...)

Could you answer this for me? (you sound like you know progressive music very well and speak about it easily.)

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Originally posted by Elmo-On-XTC Disagree with my conclusion? then say why

I disagree with your statement because when you type "everybodies" you are meaning me and everyone in TA and I don't have flavors of the month. Got it ?
AND in your post you quoted "washed up" in quotations. I am the only one who typed that in this thread so it leads me to believe that you were quoting me.

Sorry if I am wrong.

Edit: just read your above post and now we are on the same track.

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Could you answer this for me?

Hardly an expert Sarah...hehe....but I do think...as you may attest to in terms of the techno realm....that too many people blindly heap judgement or draw rash conclusions on diverse and richly-emotional music while only exploring it through the spance of a proverbial key-hole.

To TRY to answer your question...and I'm not sure if i will succeed...Progressive, (if you want to speak of it in the specific genre sense) to characterize it bluntly, is a fairly formless blend of Trance, house, techo and sometimes breaks. I say formless, because by-and-large the best Prog offerings utilize hybrid programming approaches, melody and key structures, samples and new ideas on synthesizing that MOSTLY tries to avoid duplication and blends seemingly unharmonious ideas together thus preventing it becoming formulaic. Yes, indeed, there is Prog out there now that has become predictable and stale, and on the polar end, overly experimental and pretentious for it's own sake....and to that I grant no defense...but the kind that moves me, and this is fairly, a personal reflection, always offers surprise and intrigue in terms of its foundation, layers and inter-woven emotion.

Basically, It's characterization lies in layering and subtletly. That's not to say it cannot be monstrous and pounding and rampant with energy....just that it attempts to accomplish those goals in different and hopefully unique ways. Where Trance relies on the mostly cookie-cutter concepts of a simple massive synth build, predictable baseline and similar melodies, Prog and GOOD Trance, find new ways to evoke energy, emotion and rhythm by intertwining many more sub-melodies, percussion patterns, and harmonizing effects.....agian, the soul (for me) of Prog is in the layering.

To be analogous of my perception of people who say ALL Prog is boring or ALL techno is uniform or too minimal is like reading a Stephen King novel and saying ALL fiction is scary and unrealistic.

I hope that atleast attempts to answer your question Sarah

Mossey, you never cease to amaze me --

I couldn't have defined 'Progressive' any better and I hope this sheds some light to the bashers out there.

that's what i always thought progressive was too, but the thing that confuses me, and most people, is what we call that run of the mill "chug chugga chug" stuff. just plain "progressive"?

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Originally posted by The Highroller that's what i always thought progressive was too, but the thing that confuses me, and most people, is what we call that run of the mill "chug chugga chug" stuff. just plain "progressive"?

I would say depending on the rhythm and what kind of melody and chord progressions are in it, it would either fall into a form of House, or Trance really...

yet again, "Progressive" in this nature is being regarded as a main Genre, not an adjective like it was in the past...

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Originally posted by The Highroller that's what i always thought progressive was too, but the thing that confuses me, and most people, is what we call that run of the mill "chug chugga chug" stuff. just plain "progressive"?

How about Chugressive ??

Latest news.. sasha's computer crashed, party cancelled. mp3s were lost

i doubt he'd use windows ;p

....and how about a round of beers now everyone? shots maybe? i say that was a good debate MATES!

^^^^^^^

I'll take you up on that mate

Cheers

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Originally posted by Form&Funktion Progressive, (if you want to speak of it in the specific genre sense) to characterize it bluntly, is a fairly formless blend of Trance, house, techo

That is exactly how I described it to someone at work the other day:

A mixture of trance, house and techno, but with more structural freedom (yes, I know it is an oxymoron, live with it) and more subtle elements.

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that's what i always thought progressive was too, but the thing that confuses me, and most people, is what we call that run of the mill "chug chugga chug" stuff. just plain "progressive"?

Yep...no arguments here...there certainly is boring, ininspired Prog out there that drags on (past ten minutes in track length lately) with no real movement or payoff but I attribute that to the mentioned degree of pretension (being artsy and minimal is cool on some levels and the fact that, admitedly, this is only occuring due to it's popularity.

Unfortunatly, when a genre flourishes, there are those that try to capitalize by slapping together weak and quickly made tracks without caring about capturing real emotion, space and energy with the thinking that, "as long as I make it fit into what people perceive is the cool, front-running genre, it will sell"....and sadly it often does.

I guess, the basic raw truth here is that WITH ALL genres, for one to see the full realized potential of whichever style of EDM they wish to explore, one first has to wade through the chafe and focus on the truly innovative.

No one here can deny that every style, flavour and genre has it's discount bin of dud tracks that cast a bad light on people's opinions....but I find it proven time and again, if one cares enough to truly explore the different genres with an open mind, they will find amazing music that energizes and changes perceptions...whether it be Trance, Techno, Prog, Breaks, House, Chill out etc etc

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Originally posted by Elmo-On-XTC i doubt he'd use windows ;p

like the Macs are any better.... I've seen it crash too at a party

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Originally posted by ShAwZy I've said it before and I will say it again. Sasha has been washed up for the last 3 or 4 years. People call it inovative but he is barely holding on. It's all of these die-hards that loved him so much in the past that won't let go to the fact that he is a washed up, junkie, who probably has no idea where he even is in life. I know I'm a little harsh but if you were to go see him live or have went and saw him live in past few years he has stunk the place out, bored people to death, or was the same as any other so-so DJ out there. I love the Sasha followers that stick by him and won't let go but trust me you will have to some day when it becomes obvious that he has lost his aura in the world of electronic music. Inovaters to me are the James Zabiela's out there who are doing things out of the norm, mixing genres in their sets, scratching and being real party DJ's. NOW, if Sasha were to go back to his roots when he was a legend, and start playing that dark trance he is known for in the late 90's then maybe he could revive my trust in him and I may think about going to see him when he is in town. Other than that, MEH = Sasha. Let it go people........

Its sooooooooooooo funny how you mention JZ to be an 'innovater', or doing things out of the norm...LOL...maybe but lets stick to the guy who this article's about, who himself is doing things out of the norm music wise, but some just cant handle it...BTW guys like JZ wouldnt be half the person he is w/o people like Sasha....washed up?? hmmmm.... IDK....different yes. Washed up for 3-4 years????!!! Are we talking about the same Sasha here...just check out his Buenes Aires mix from last year at Moon Park...

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Originally posted by Skipper This is a fancy definition of purpose, but I still have never been given a clear definition of what characterizes progressive music. (and I've asked...) Could you answer this for me? (you sound like you know progressive music very well and speak about it easily.)

here is what i think it is...


progressive is a "structure" in how music is made.

example:

house: disco, hard, latin, progressive...

trance: epic, hard, progressive...

breaks: funky, electro, progressive...

progressive (whatever genre) forward thinking music (intelligent brain music as i like to call it)....look @ rock music! you have brilliant progressive rock bands like led zepplin, pink floyd, the doors, frank zappa etc etc

hope this helps...

Since Sasha and Zabiela seem to be the hot topic here...

Eccentricbeats.com is sharing this mix on it's site now...in case you have not picked it up yet.

SASHA VS ZABIELA live @ MONDAY BAR, Stockholm

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