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-- what is a popular trend these days
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Originally posted by guster Those ass-ugly skirts with all the pleats that girls are wearing, trucker hats, and around my town, the prick high schoolers are starting to wear '60s floral shirts and have started listening to Bob Dylan because someone in the upper-echelon of their ranks decided that Dylan is now "cool".

ok... everything you just said is not "hip", it is "fashionable" and girls tend to wear "fashionable" clothing... which the above imo makes a girl look like a trashy skank with little to no personal initiative and a low self esteem. she believes that she will look better if she dresses the way the sexah skankah bitches in magazines dress... WRONG! you look like a skank who needs sex and you dont need slutty clothes to get a guy - if you're good looking you'll get a root. simple as that. dressing the way that every other 17/18/19 year old model dresses just makes you look like a fucken sheep.

[/rant]

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Originally posted by Orbax generalizations help us move through life I dont know if youve ever seen someone die, or seen an animal dying, you just get this instant gut feeling that this is WRONG. Gayness does that to me. I have had gay friends, co workers , etc... they are out there and fun a lot of times. Its not all "gut instinct" though. Im not going to really get into this, cuz its not the point, but while a lot of people think its Not Wrong, they seldom say HOMOSEXUALITY IS RIGHT! whats right about it? Love? I love dogs, doesnt mean im sexually attracted to them. Also, on the religious level, the man/woman relationship has been thoroughly defined. on a social level i think that paternalness and maternalness cant be faked, or superceded by any convention. Not to say there arent bad parents and role models in the straight community, but I dont think its really an argument on whats better for society. maybe there is. I dont really care. I think its dead wrong, and I dont support it. I support the people who have to go through the alienating, lonely, and scary world of a homosexual, however. It aint an easy life, and I dont believe in making it more difficult for them. -- Motivation is a tool. Thats like saying guns are evil. youre first thought was about how its a weapon and it kills people. It also can be used to hunt and provide for a family. People are good and evil, and they use tools to those ends.

Ill start with the Gun generalization, I am sure a rifle can be an excellent tool used for hunting and providing for ones family, but what purpose does and Uzi or an AK-47 provide for such things? They do not, they serve the purpose of mass killing and destruction, nothing more. Guns are evil by nature because they are weapons used for pain and death, and most of them are not used for hunting for food, atleast not in this day and age.

As for the homosexual discussion, as I said in a different thread, Marriage is a man made word, not a God made word. Meaning, if one does not believe in your religion, why must it follow your religious definition of what you feel marriage is? and please, I hate the whole slippery slope anology of loving dogs or ponies and comparing it with gays, its just way too stupid.

quote:

Originally posted by Rodrico Then why is it bothering you that being a single, white, christian, male who is well educated, and well dress is the un-cool thing to do? For someone who preaches confidence, you sure do care about what obviously "morons" think about you. Unless you were being un-christian like in becoming a well educatied, well dressed single white successful male, but thats a whole nother story?

I define cool

Technically there is no logical coherence in your paragraph there. Its called loose association. There is no logical progression from premise to conclusion.

Example:

Its mainstream "cool" to be ______

therefore I hate being not ______?

Thats inferring quite a bit there. And by inferring i mean assuming.

Im happy no matter how much I fit in. I have an active social life, and am generally looked up to as a role model and counselor by peers and, more generally, any one who actually knows me. I have experience, intelligence, and compassion. It tends to put me in the leadership role a lot, and as someone who has had to watch people being miserable and desperately trying to "fit in" those would be some of the problems ( the aforementioned lists)

Trying to hard to be someone you arent, is un cool.

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Originally posted by Orbax I define cool Technically there is no logical coherence in your paragraph there. Its called loose association. There is no logical progression from premise to conclusion. Example: Its mainstream "cool" to be ______ therefore I hate being not ______? Thats inferring quite a bit there. And by inferring i mean assuming. Im happy no matter how much I fit in. I have an active social life, and am generally looked up to as a role model and counselor by peers and, more generally, any one who actually knows me. I have experience, intelligence, and compassion. It tends to put me in the leadership role a lot, and as someone who has had to watch people being miserable and desperately trying to "fit in" those would be some of the problems ( the aforementioned lists) Trying to hard to be someone you arent, is un cool.

No no, I wasnt assuming that last line on you, I was only pointing towards other non christian like successful males, who pride themselves in being religious but obviously not acting loving and caring as a religious person really should be doing. I wont name names, but I think you get the picture of what I was pointing at.

quote:

Originally posted by Rodrico Ill start with the Gun generalization, I am sure a rifle can be an excellent tool used for hunting and providing for ones family, but what purpose does and Uzi or an AK-47 provide for such things? They do not, they serve the purpose of mass killing and destruction, nothing more. Guns are evil by nature because they are weapons used for pain and death, and most of them are not used for hunting for food, atleast not in this day and age.

That actually doesnt work. Gun:A weapon consisting of a metal tube from which a projectile is fired at high velocity into a relatively flat trajectory.

now, just because people dont use AKs for hunting, doesnt mean they couldnt. You are, again, blaming humans misdeeds on the tools they are using.

Pain and Death would actually be more natural to a non-religious person, because everything would die, if nothing else ever did. Unless you believe in the Garden of Eden

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As for the homosexual discussion, as I said in a different thread, Marriage is a man made word, not a God made word. Meaning, if one does not believe in your religion, why must it follow your religious definition of what you feel marriage is? and please, I hate the whole slippery slope anology of loving dogs or ponies and comparing it with gays, its just way too stupid.

I believe I stated my intentions on that argument quite well. I mentioned religion in there, but I mainly stated that I had a "human instinct" that didnt like that idea. You can cut that either way you want, and ignore some of the questions surrounding the issue, but to pass anti-homosexuality as something that only religion could have spawned is ridiculous. If indeed, all religion is man made as you imply, than the anti-homosexuality is also manmade. Therefore man would be the one judging the action, and youd have to wonder why so many agree.

quote:

Originally posted by Orbax That actually doesnt work. Gun:A weapon consisting of a metal tube from which a projectile is fired at high velocity into a relatively flat trajectory. now, just because people dont use AKs for hunting, doesnt mean they couldnt. You are, again, blaming humans misdeeds on the tools they are using. Pain and Death would actually be more natural to a non-religious person, because everything would die, if nothing else ever did. Unless you believe in the Garden of Eden I believe I stated my intentions on that argument quite well. I mentioned religion in there, but I mainly stated that I had a "human instinct" that didnt like that idea. You can cut that either way you want, and ignore some of the questions surrounding the issue, but to pass anti-homosexuality as something that only religion could have spawned is ridiculous. If indeed, all religion is man made as you imply, than the anti-homosexuality is also manmade. Therefore man would be the one judging the action, and youd have to wonder why so many agree.

You would hunt with an AK-47 and load an animal full of bullets just before you would eat him? Either way, certain guns cant be used for hunting, and they are only created for killing other humans in war, which doesnt really make them all too "family friendly" in my books.

I have no idea what your talking about the pain and death thing, are you saying a religious person finds a gun less painful or a less definate cause of death than a non-religious perosn? less natural? I dunno, funny choice of words.

Well what is human instinct? I never knew that we all had agreed that it was human instinct to abolish homosexuality (or that soooo many of us agree on that). I always thought that there were certain human instincts in all of us, like self-preservation, or the giving of ones love to others, that was what instinct was, but you cant define something that is un-definable, so that puts its merely at a stalemate of what I believe is a difference of our opinion on what is natural, and what is not.

Lastly, Religions are man-made, in the likeness of what he believes God has or would of translated...I mean after such a long time, you would think some sort of broken telephone happened inbetween all these prophets and scripture writers.

I dunno.. you could easily hunt with the civilian-legal AK47s and M16s just because they're semi-automatic. This gun, however, is insane. Supposedly it'll take down a bear.

Call me cliche here, but I try not to worry about what's hip and what's not. If i do something, it's because i like it. If it happens to be in, then cool. If not, then oh well. It's kind of weird because i was caught up in "what will other people think?" stage for a while until i grew more confident. As I observe the changing of trends, I always see the people trying so hard not to follow the trend becoming it and then they have to change their positions on everything again just to be different. It's kinda weird.

quote:

Originally posted by Rodrico You would hunt with an AK-47 and load an animal full of bullets just before you would eat him? Either way, certain guns cant be used for hunting, and they are only created for killing other humans in war, which doesnt really make them all too "family friendly" in my books.

again, just because a man creates something with an intention of its use, doesnt mean it has to be used in that way. A hammer might have been originally invnted for killing (war hammers existed, brutal weapon) but they are now used for things from bird houses to sky scrapers.

quote:

I have no idea what your talking about the pain and death thing, are you saying a religious person finds a gun less painful or a less definate cause of death than a non-religious perosn? less natural? I dunno, funny choice of words. [quote] Im saying that a garden of eden life had no pain and death and hunting wasnt needed. Pain and death are a part of the chain of life. I would say that getting eaten alive by Hyenas is less pleasant than getting a shot through your brain or heart. [quote]Well what is human instinct? I never knew that we all had agreed that it was human instinct to abolish homosexuality (or that soooo many of us agree on that). I always thought that there were certain human instincts in all of us, like self-preservation, or the giving of ones love to others, that was what instinct was, but you cant define something that is un-definable, so that puts its merely at a stalemate of what I believe is a difference of our opinion on what is natural, and what is not.

exactly. I put "human instinct" in quotes because it wasnt a precise term, and one that when used, is generally misunderstood. Some people think its wrong, some people think its not wrong. My point is that few people tout it as "right" or something that everyone should be or do. I like taking ideas to the extremes to show their potential.

"what if everyone did this"

i am aware it doesnt always work, because diversity is one of the things that helps amalgamate humanity, in the end. However. I still think that a certain level of universal morals can be applied.

Ok, CS Lewis did something that was interesting. It was about arguing moral issues. Now, is what shoes you wear a moral issue? No. What about what shoes you wear to a funeral? yes. What changed?

are suicide, compassion, eating fruit, spanking babies, sex with minors, doing drugs, drinking water, etc.. moral issues? What makes them so? How is it that you INSTANTLY know whats a moral issue and what isnt?

This is what I refer to as "human instinct" on one level at least.

quote:

Lastly, Religions are man-made, in the likeness of what he believes God has or would of translated...I mean after such a long time, you would think some sort of broken telephone happened inbetween all these prophets and scripture writers.

Unless God was the go between. it ends up being a point that cant be proven at this time. Plus "Even if I wrote my name in the stars people still wouldnt believe" goes the other way too. Even if someone "disproved" the Bible or God, most wouldnt change their minds.

that would be something Id call the "Human Condition"

quote:

Originally posted by NomadaNare Call me cliche here, but I try not to worry about what's hip and what's not. If i do something, it's because i like it. If it happens to be in, then cool. If not, then oh well. It's kind of weird because i was caught up in "what will other people think?" stage for a while until i grew more confident. As I observe the changing of trends, I always see the people trying so hard not to follow the trend becoming it and then they have to change their positions on everything again just to be different. It's kinda weird.

I gotta agree with this. I wear the clothes I like to wear. If they're in style, so be it... I know in a couple months nobody will like it anymore but I'll still wear it. To me, limiting yourself to one "look" is kind of ridiculous. I wear everything from button up stretch shirt from Express, to college tees, to tight jeans and european looking tees, to polos, etc. Bottom line, if I like the clothing, I'm going to buy it and wear it until it wears out.

quote:

Originally posted by idoru They may be trends, but I don't/didn't watch shows like the OC, North Shore, nor Friends. I didn't like the shows, and I don't like being part of a huge, nation-wide trend. It reminds me too much of MTV, which I hate with a passion.

I think you have to decide for yourself whether you dont want to be part of a trend simply because you dont like the contents of the trend (ie you dont like the clothes), or the fact that you don't want to become part of the trend (and therefore be 'different', and in being different, trying to be cool again) because you don't like trends period.

If you're the latter, well then boo

Not that I care.

back on topic
-faded jeans
- dying your hair brown if you happen to live in east asia
- rap music (obviously) can you imagine rap music being played as oldies in say 50 years haha "yo shorty its yo birfday"
- trying to grow up as fast as possible
- and when you are actually old, try to act or look as young as possible
- trendy to be bi- this has been said i know

thats all I can think of right now
oh yeah and homosexuality isnt a choice

motivation is overrated?? that�s hilarious.


anyway..

The trend I can�t stand is young people going out of their way to be nonconformists. �Fuck society, this is who I am, bla bla bla�...yea you are so unique and different, just like everyone else w/ 10 piercings in their face, and tattoos everywhere. lol

Try making a statement in life by something you accomplish or by your winning personality, not your physical appearance. it just makes me think you don�t really have much to offer on the inside, so you set yourself apart from the rest of society to try and be different. I know there are a few exceptions, but generally, that�s how I feel about teenagers like that.

quote:

Originally posted by Slylee motivation is overrated?? that�s hilarious. anyway.. The trend I can�t stand is young people going out of their way to be nonconformists. �Fuck society, this is who I am, bla bla bla�...yea you are so unique and different, just like everyone else w/ 10 piercings in their face, and tattoos everywhere. lol Try making a statement in life by something you accomplish or by your winning personality, not your physical appearance. it just makes me think you don�t really have much to offer on the inside, so you set yourself apart from the rest of society to try and be different. I know there are a few exceptions, but generally, that�s how I feel about teenagers like that.

i think every teenager goes through that phase though..the i wanna be a rebel phase when u r like 16. i know i acted all tough and MR know it all when i was 16

sorry, i should have said "young adults"...like people who are still like that and in their 20's.

but to sum everything i said up, the trend itself is people going way out of their way to be "different"...but only physically you know?

another thing i find funny is hair dressers w/ short black and purple hair. i swear to god every trendy salon i go to, all the chicks in there have short, spunky hair w/ purple or blue in it...they look like a bunch of clones walking around, but i guess they do it to be different??

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Originally posted by mndeg back on topic oh yeah and homosexuality isnt a choice

Your custom status of non-elitist looks funny in conjunction with those two.

We actually were on topic, we were merely explaining ourselves to one another. Just because it wasnt in "list" form doesnt mean we werent on topic.

and for the record, saying back on topic, putting in your thing and then restarting the discussion with a little off hand jab of "oy yeah and its not a choice" comment is a pretty selfish little thing to do.

It doesnt make you look like you are trying to keep things going well, i makes it look like you want them just as bad, but first you want people to see what YOU think about cool stuff. Because you know.

Anyways, im sure you have no idea what you are talking about. People always try to polarize issues into either or. Its both.

In the end you have a choice on whether or not to act out your impulses. I guarantee im more of a sadist than most people are gay. American Psycho completed me.

Who knew?

so if you really are against elitism, i suggest getting off your (in your mind) high horse before someone riding a war horse decides to stomp you for good

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Originally posted by Orbax Your custom status of non-elitist looks funny in conjunction with those two. We actually were on topic, we were merely explaining ourselves to one another. Just because it wasnt in "list" form doesnt mean we werent on topic. and for the record, saying back on topic, putting in your thing and then restarting the discussion with a little off hand jab of "oy yeah and its not a choice" comment is a pretty selfish little thing to do. It doesnt make you look like you are trying to keep things going well, i makes it look like you want them just as bad, but first you want people to see what YOU think about cool stuff. Because you know. Anyways, im sure you have no idea what you are talking about. People always try to polarize issues into either or. Its both. In the end you have a choice on whether or not to act out your impulses. I guarantee im more of a sadist than most people are gay. American Psycho completed me. Who knew? so if you really are against elitism, i suggest getting off your (in your mind) high horse before someone riding a war horse decides to stomp you for good

*puts mndeg costume on*

YOU'RE A RACIST!!!!

*insert something about Asians here*

I thought they found the gay gene? I might be wrong. Anyway, homosexuality doesn�t really bother me, but I don�t think gay couples should be raising kids. Don�t ask why, it�s just how I feel. It would subject the kid to a lot of pressure growing up. one of my best friends (a girl) in middle school was raised by her mom and �aunt��I didn�t figure it out back then, but looking back (and after she told me), I was like, �oh yeeaaaa�. hehe her mom was gay and it was her lover, not her aunt. Anyway, my friend had a lot of emotional issues and a SHIT LOAD of resentment towards her mother growing up�always rebelling and disrespecting her. I�m sure it was because she was mad that her family was so different.

Also, a friend of mine is flaming gay and he�s a certified genius too...went to Princeton...the guy just knows how to sit around all day figuring out formulas and could probably teach himself latin in one day....lol

anyway, he said he knew he was gay when he was 5. I believe it.

Orbax, what if you were told that liking women was wrong and against God? Wouldn�t it be hard to NOT be attracted to them or act upon it? It sure would be. You can�t just say, �Oh don�t act upon your impulses�. It�s easier said than done.

quote:

Originally posted by guster ...started listening to Bob Dylan because someone in the upper-echelon of their ranks decided that Dylan is now "cool".

Dylan has always been cool, you just didn't know it.

quote:

Originally posted by Orbax ...ever seen someone die, or seen an animal dying, you just get this instant gut feeling that this is WRONG. Gayness does that to me.

death is perfectly natural just because you haven't come to terms with it and homosexuality doesn't mean it's "WRONG"

why should we care if people are gay? how does it effect your life?

quote:

Originally posted by Slylee Orbax, what if you were told that liking women was wrong and against God? Wouldn�t it be hard to NOT be attracted to them or act upon it? It sure would be. You can�t just say, �Oh don�t act upon your impulses�. It�s easier said than done.

The thing is, however, that homosexuality has always been treated as different. Before someone brings up the Greeks, it was a power thing. In nature and in some societies (prison for instance) homosexuality, primarily gay homosexuality was used to dominate other men. The phallus being forced into someone is a power trip and thats why it happened. It established hierarchy.

Now actually being attracted to men and boys is something else. I believe Ive already gone past the religious part, and can say with a high level of confidence that mankind as a whole has never accepted homosexuality as a way of life. Until the "enlightened" days we are in now. The whole thing wraps two horrible ideas together. Gayness and Pride. Wtg...

Ive already stated some of the things that bother me about it, besides its societal impact on the group and the individual.

But: in other countries homosexuals are treated better, yes? Its because here in America where everyone takes such F*$#@!ing offense to everything said, that when the issue was first raised about homosexuality being wrong, the homosexual community, or at least the outspoken part of it, decided to get offended.

They took it personally and began to IDENTIFY themselves as gay. That became the focus of their lives. Im straight. Im a virgin. Thank god my sexuality isnt the keystone of my life.

As soon as someone takes a character trait, and especially ones where its currently perceived as negative, and then says That Is Who I AM. They #1 tie them selves to the anchor, so to speak and #2 lose a bit of their humanity by saying they are a thing. Which in turn makes them easier to hate.

At first the ploy was "love your brother" and "hes gay" so you had to love both of them. THat backfired and now there is a lot of hatred towards gayness AND gays.

Instead of just admitting, yeah, there are probably a male and female gender for a reason, they went off and said its natural, and that it, again, ISNT WRONG.

It aint right! thats my point. It is against whatever law you wish invoke be it religious or naturalist or secular.

Most people when defending homosexuality point to their friends, like Sly did. great. Doesnt mean they are doing the right thing because they are fun or neat or whatever.

So, when you look at the current treatment of homosexuals, it is in many parts self imposed. They decided to focus, much like the "black" community has on a negative aspect, and they have decided to stop any social movement and say "we arent moving until we are told we are good and you love us"

not gonna happen. It just alienates you further and further as the rest of society moves on.

Its the same negative impact as being referred to as "African American". It puts that barb that you arent entirely American in there. Whites are whites, even though they are just as diverse as the African community, but God forbid you call a black a black, because that is racist!

Its just the trend in America to take offense to something and immediately polarize the issue and then everyone gets to choose a camp. For or Against. and this is sad because it puts the chance of resolution and mediation to almiost nil.

it's probably because he's had gay tendencies and it scares the crap out of him.


sorry orbax, but they don't say that for no reason, that's usually the reason behind homophobics.

men experimenting w/ men is just as common as when girls do it, it's just not as accepted by society.

there are more and more closet gay men w/ wife and children these days...it's scary.

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Originally posted by igottaknow Dylan has always been cool, you just didn't know it. death is perfectly natural just because you haven't come to terms with it and homosexuality doesn't mean it's "WRONG"

You took that completely out of context. Dont do so in the future just to get your stupid little jabs in.

Ive killed. There are certain types of death that are un-natural and WRONG. Also, youre fucked up about being so blase` about death. It means they dont get to be on this world anymore, and thats messed up and sad. Death is wrong on at least 1 level every time, and for you not to see that is fucking pathetic.

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Originally posted by Slylee it's probably because he's had gay tendencies and it scares the crap out of him. sorry orbax, but they don't say that for no reason, that's usually the reason behind homophobics. men experimenting w/ men is just as common as when girls do it, it's just not as accepted by society. there are more and more closet gay men w/ wife and children these days...it's scary.

I suggest you refrain from such "insights" in the future.

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