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-- Caught on Video:Savage destruction of a church by muslims
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| Originally posted by erdega If it really happened as western controlled media reports, why do they have to LIE, EXAGGERATE and appeal to emotions rather than facts? |
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| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 It's a muslim conspiracy. Forget the jews, muslims are the new big conspiracy players in town! |
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| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 It's a muslim conspiracy. Forget the jews, muslims are the new big conspiracy players in town! |
So this muslim/jewish (they do like each other!) tag team of conspirators managed to convince the Bosnian Serb government to admit to genocide:
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The Bosnian Serb government has admitted for the first time that Bosnian Serb forces were responsible for the mass slaughter of Muslims in Srebrenica in July, 1995, Europe's worst atrocity since the end of the Second World War. The details about the massacre of 7,500 men and boys by Bosnian Serbs in the UN-protected Muslim enclave of Srebrenica were revealed on Monday night by a local television station in the Bosnian Serb capital, Banja Luka. The station obtained a copy of a secret government report on Srebrenica, compiled under pressure from Paddy Ashdown, the top international official for Bosnia-Herzegovina. Analysts believe the government's admission could prepare the population for the possible arrest of the Bosnian Serb war hero, General Ratko Mladic. He has been indicted for genocide for the Srebrenica massacre by the UN war crimes tribunal in The Hague and is thought to be in hiding in Serbia. For many Serbs in Bosnia this might mean finally coming to terms with their past on the road to reconciliation after the 1992-95 war that took the lives of more than 200,000 people, the majority of them Muslims. Official propaganda has always denied that any war crimes were committed in Srebrenica, and for many Bosnian Serbs the television report was the first time they had heard that "in the period between 14 and 17 July, a large number of Bosniaks [Bosnian Muslims], captured in Srebrenica, were taken to different locations of Zvornik municipality, where they were detained". The report did not mention the exact number of detainees, and did not specify who gave orders for the massacre or how many men were executed. However, it revealed that the code name for the Srebrenica operation was "Krivaja 95". Krivaja is a small town and a river in central Bosnia. The report named five detention centres where men were held - the farming centre of Vranjevo, schools in Orahovac, Teskovci and Rodjevici, and a cultural centre in Pilici. A large number of Bosnian Muslims were executed nearby, the report said, and their bodies buried in the villages of Petkovici, close to the Drina river dam, Kozluk, Branjevo and Orahovac. "There is evidence that the mass graves were dug up and relocated," the report said, confirming what is already well known outside the country. The television station reported that more than 30 civilians, soldiers and policemen testified about the war crimes in Srebrenica. The investigation was undertaken by the military, police and intelligence service of Republika Srpska, the Bosnian Serb entity of Bosnia-Herzegovina. The report quotes witnesses who were ordered to remove bodies from makeshift graves to other locations, long after the massacre. The orders for relocation came from Colonel Ljubomir Beara, a prominent Bosnian Serb army officer, and aide to Mladic. Like Mladic, Beara is currently in hiding. But many others have faced justice before the war crimes tribunal. The officer who is accused of leading the cover-up operation, Momir Nikolic, pleaded guilty as charged last week. Dragan Obrenovic, the deputy commander of the operation, has said he is sorry for his crime and has offered an apology to the families of victims before the tribunal. "I'm guilty for what I did and did not do," Colonel Obrenovic told the court last week. "Thousands of innocent people were killed, only the graves remain ... Part of that is to be blamed on me". Obrenovic reached a plea bargain with prosecutors in May and testified against his co-defendants last month. One of the commanders of the Srebrenica operation, General Radislav Krstic, has already been sentenced by the tribunal to 45 years in jail for genocide for his role in massacre. But most of the public in Republika Srpska have been living in denial of the incident. The surrender of their war heroes to the tribunal and the sentences pronounced against them have been viewed as a conspiracy against Serbs, while memorial services for victims have been seen as a provocation by Muslims. Earlier Bosnian Serb reports on the Srebrenica events stated: "Muslims who were considered to be missing after the fall of the enclave have made their way through enemy lines to Bosnian government territory." http://news.independent.co.uk/europ...sp?story=460554 |
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Bulldozers unearthed the remains of dozens of people yesterday as investigators searched for about 700 missing Muslims in what is believed to be the biggest mass grave in Bosnia. The bones, dug up from an area the size of a tennis court, are thought to include some of the 7,000 men and boys who were slaughtered by Bosnian Serb forces at Srebrenica eight years ago - Europe's worst massacre since the Second World War. "We believe the grave contains several hundred bodies of 1995 Srebrenica massacre victims and those of Zvornik civilians killed at the start of the war," said Murat Hurtic, a member of the Bosnian Commission for Missing People. "It could be the largest mass grave ever found in Bosnia." The grave was found at Crni Vrh, near the town of Zvornik, north of Srebrenica, and is believed to be a site to which the bodies were moved from their original burial places near Srebrenica. Bosnian Serbs reburied victims to hide evidence of massacres from the UN war crimes tribunal in The Hague, which is prosecuting those accused of atrocities in Balkan wars of the 1990s. Experts say the excavations will take about two months, and expect the identification of the victims to be a slow and complicated process, probably requiring DNA analysis. In July 1995, Srebrenica, which was protected by lightly armed Dutch peace-keepers, was overrun by Bosnian Serb forces who separated Muslim women from the men and boys - thousands of whom were later executed. The mass grave was found in a mountainous area near the border with Serbia. It is close to the former front line and was surrounded by minefields. Soil samples from the site indicate the grave may also contain victims from a separate massacre at the start of the Bosnian war, which began in 1992. Experts say they were tipped off about the site by a person who witnessed the re-burial of victims, but its whereabouts were kept secret for more than a year to prevent any tampering with evidence. So far, the remains of more than 6,000 Muslim men and boys have been found in 60 mass graves in the area. The biggest grave contained 500 bodies. Kathryne Bomberger, from the International Commission for Missing Persons (ICMP), in Sarajevo, said: "We're working on trying to find evidence of identification of these remains, so that we can return the mortal remains to the families." Drazen Erdemovic, the first Bosnian Serb army member to admit taking part in the Srebrenica massacre, is due to testify on the crime later this week. He is expected to be a witness for the prosecution in the tribunal's case against the former Yugoslav leader Slobodan Milosevic, who is accused of genocide in Bosnia. The trial of Mr Milosevic was halted again yesterday because of the defendant's poor health. The ICMP said earlier this month that 1,000 bodies of Srebrenica victims had been identified through DNA matches. Two men accused of responsibility for the Srebrenica massacre, Radovan Karadzic, the Bosnian Serb wartime leader, and Ratko Mladic, his army commander, remain at large. http://news.independent.co.uk/europ...sp?story=428512 |
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Statement of Facts and Acceptance of Responsibility (Tab A to "Annex A" to the "Joint Motion for Consideration of Plea Agreement Between Momir Nikolic and the Office of the Prosecutor") 1 As Chief of Intelligence and Security of the Bratunac Brigade, and from my own personal knowledge and involvement, I am aware of the following: During the attack and takeover of the Srebrenica enclave by VRS forces in July 1995 it was the intention of the VRS forces to cause the forcible removal of the entire Muslim population from Srebrenica to Muslim-held territory. 2 On 11 July 1995, VRS forces captured and occupied the town of Srebrenica causing the Muslim population to move to the Dutch UN base in Potocari. During the day and evening, I received intelligence reports which provided as estimate of 1000 to 2000 able bodied men within the population of women and children around the Dutch base. I received this information from the intelligence officer of the Bratunac Brigade�s 2nd Infantry Battalion. I wrote up a report chronicling all the relevant intelligence and security information of the day including the estimate of 1000 to 2000 able-bodied Muslim men in Potocari and forwarded that report to my command and to the intelligence and security officers of the Drina Corps who I knew were present at the Hotel Fontana in Bratunac. 3 Later that evening I attended two meetings at the Hotel Fontana in Bratunac. The first meeting took place at 20:00 hrs. and was attended by General Ratko Mladic, General Milenko Zivanovic, Colonel Radislav Jankovic, and three Dutch Battalion officers including the Dutch commander Colonel Karremans. During the first meeting, General Mladic threatened and intimidated the Dutch officers, as can be seen from the video segments of that meeting in the possession of the Prosecutor. The second meeting occurred at 22:00 hrs. at the Hotel Fontana and was attended by General Ratko Mladic, General Radislav Krstic, Colonel Karremans, a Muslim representative named Nesib Mandzic, myself and other military personnel of the VRS. At this meeting General Mladic threatened and intimidated the Dutch officers present and Nesib Mandzic, which can also be seen from the video segments in the possession of the Prosecutor. At one point in the meeting General Mladic told Mr. Mandzic he wanted the Muslim army to turn themselves in and General Mladic stated to Mandzic that the future of his people were in his (Mandzic�s) hands, that they could choose to survive or disappear. After this meeting I escorted the Dutch officers and Mr. Mandzic back to Potocari. I did not return to the Hotel that evening, but went back to the Bratunac Brigade command and slept. 4 On the morning of 12 July VRS forces, including elements of the Bratunac Brigade, entered and occupied the town of Potocari and the area around the UN Dutchbat compound. A third meeting was scheduled to occur at the Hotel Fontana at 10:00 hrs. between the same parties. In the morning of 12 July, prior to the above-mentioned meeting, I met with Lt. Colonel Vujadin Popovic, Chief of Security, Drina Corps, and Lt. Colonel Kosoric, Chief of Intelligence, Drina Corps, outside the Hotel Fontana. At that time Lt. Colonel Popovic told me that the thousands of Muslim women and children in Potocari would be transported out of Potocari toward Muslim-held territory near Kladanj and that the able-bodied Muslim men within the crowd of Muslim civilians would be separated from the crowd, detained temporarily in Bratunac, and killed shortly thereafter. I was told that it was my responsibility to help coordinate and organise this operation. Lt. Colonel Kosoric reiterated this information and we discussed the appropriate locations to detain the Muslim men prior to their execution. I identified several specific areas: the Old Elementary School "Vuk Karadzic" (including the gym), the old building of the secondary School "Duro Pucar Stari", and the Hangar (which is 50 meters away from the old secondary School). Lt. Colonel Popovic and Kosoric talked with me about sites of executions of temporaly detained Muslim men in Bratunac and we discussed two locations which were outside Bratunac town. These were: State company "Ciglane" and a mine called "Sase" in Sase. 5 After speaking to Lt. Colonel Popovic and Kosoric, I waited around the Hotel Fontana. At the end of the third meeting Colonel Jankovic came out of the Hotel Fontana and told me to coordinate the transportation of all the women and children and the separation of the able-bodied Muslim men. At that time he did not mention the killing of the Muslim men. Shortly thereafter, two Dutch officers arrived outside the Hotel Fontana where I was standing with Lt. Colonel Kosoric and asked us what the plan was for the transportation of the Muslim population. I told the Dutch officers to go back to Potocari because the buses would be arriving there soon to transport the people towards Kladanj. 6 For most of the day of 12 July, I was in Potocari co-ordinating and working with Dusko Jevic, a commander of the MUP Special Police Force, and the following other military and MUP units: Drina Corps Military Policemen under Major Petrovic; Drina Wolves of the Zvornik Brigade; elements of the 10th Sabotage Detachment; elements of the 65th protection Regiment�s Military Police; Bratunac Brigade�s 2ndt and 3rd Infantry Battalions, Bratunac Brigade Military Police and civilian police with German Shepherd dogs. Working in conjunction with these units I coordinated and supervised the transportation of the women and children to Kladanj and the separation and detention of able-bodied Muslim men. During the day in Potocari, VRS forces and MUP forces intimidated and abused the Muslim population in order to compel them to get on the buses and trucks to Kladanj. The first convoys to leave Potocari included a few men on the buses as part of a propaganda exercise. This was for the benefit of the Dutch troops and the Serb TV cameras, but these men were later separated at checkpoints before reaching Kladanj. During 12 July VRS forces abused and assaulted many Muslim men and women who had assembled around the Dutch base in Potocari. I was personally aware of this conduct and did nothing to stop or prevent the forces under my supervision from carrying out these abuses. I also heard that some Muslim men were taken to isolated areas around Potocari and killed. That evening between 18:00 and 21:00 hrs. I also reported the abuses verbally to my commander, Colonel Vidoje Blagojevic. I discussed the operation to transport the women and children to Kladanj and separate, detain and kill the able bodied Muslim men in Potocari. It was apparent to me that Colonel Blagojevic was fully informed of the transportation and killing operation and expected me to continue to carry out the duties related to those operations that I had begun that morning. We were alone in the office at that time. I also spoke to other Bratunac Brigade staff officers such as Trisic, Micic and Pajic in the Operations Room. We spoke informally about the abuse, separations and evacuations. There was no concern expressed by them. We did not discuss the killing operation at that time. 7 During 11 and 12 July I received intelligence reports that the bulk of the military age men from Srebrenica had assembled near the village of Jaglici and begun to move in a long column toward Muslim territory, following a known route through the mine fields at the front line towards Konjevic Polje. On 12 July and the early morning hours of 13 July I was made aware through intelligence reports and other information that VRS and MUP forces were capturing Muslim men in the area between Ravni Buljim, Nova Kasaba and Konjevic Polje. 8 I was duty officer that same evening (12th) and was exhausted, so at about 03:00 hrs. on the 13th , I phoned Mirko Jankovic to relieve me. I went to my appartment in town and slept for a few hours. I returned to duty at the Bratunac Brigade HQ at about 07:00 hrs. on the 13th July. At about 09:30 hrs. that morning, a meeting took place at the Bratunac Brigade HQ. It was attended by General Mladic, Colonel Vasic, Lt. Colonel Popovic and General Krstic. I do not know what was discussed at this meeting, as I never participated. About 10 to 15 minutes after the meeting, I spoke to my commander, Colonel Blagojevic in his office. I was tasked by Colonel Blagojevic to continue the Potocari operation to transport the Muslim women and children to Kladanj and separate and detain the able bodied Muslim men. 9 My first task of the day (13th July) was to go to Potocari and check on the progress of the transportation and separation of the Muslim men and other tasks. I established that all was going well. I directed the work of the forces present in Potocari. While I was in Potocari, I met Dusko Jevic and told him to pass an order to his units which were on the Bratunac-Konjevic Polje road that all the captured Muslims on this road be transported to Bratunac. I then left Potocari and went back to the Bratunac Brigade HQ. According to my information which I got from the members of the Bratunac Brigade Military Police, on that day, General Mladic intended to use the road Bratunac-Konjevic Polje and my task was to check security and accessability of that road. I drove along the Bratunac-Konjevic Polje road in a Volkswagen Golf motor vehicle with a Military Policeman. On the way I saw MUP forces along the road. I saw MUP at Sandici with heavy weapons. There were approximately 80 to 100 prisoners at Sandici meadow at this time. I arrived in Konjevic Polje at about 12:30 hrs. that day. There was a civilian police checkpoint at the intersection. I sat in a burnt out house and waited for General Mladic to pass. Together with me in this house were five to six Muslim prisoners. While I was in Konjevic Polje I saw approximately ten prisoners in a building used by the 5th Engineering Battalion of the Drina Corps at Konjevic Polje. I also saw police from Bratunac at the checkpoint and soldiers who I did not recognise. I also saw Nenad Deronjic and Mirko Peric there. When I arrived at Konjevic Polje I contacted the MUP commanders and directed them that the Muslim prisoners should be detained and would be moved to Bratunac later that day. I was at Konjevic Polje for approximately 45 minutes before General Mladic arrived. His car arrived from the direction of Bratunac and stopped at the intersection at Konjevic Polje. He got out of his vehicle and we met in the middle of the road. I reported to him that there were no problems. He looked around and saw the prisoners. Some of the prisoners asked him what would happen, to which he responded that they would all be transported away and they should not worry. After General Mladic left, I took a prisoner, Resid Sinanovic, in my car back to Bratunac. Sinanovic was an important prisoner as he was on a war criminal list and he was also the former police chief in Bratunac. On the way back to Bratunac, I saw large columns of captured men, numbering about 500 being marched towards Konjevic Polje. Further along the road I saw another column of prisoners being taken towards Sandici. As I passed on the road near the Kravica Warehouse I noticed a few soldiers but nothing else. I handed Sinanovic over to the Military Police at the Bratunac Brigade HQ, specifically to a legal officer, Zlatan Celanovic. I then went to the building of the Military Police of the Bratunac Brigade and met with Mirko Jankovic, the commander of the Bratunac Military Police Platoon, and Mile Petrovic, a MP member. Jankovic knew how to drive one of the captured Dutch APCs and he, Petrovic and I drove along the Bratunac- Konjevic Polje road. Mile Petrovic sat on top of the APC with a megaphone calling for the Muslims to surrender. It was clear that some were already surrendering at that stage. Just after we had passed Sandici, we stopped the APC when about six Muslim men surrendered to us. We took them in the APC to Konjevic Polje. When we arrived there I told Mile and Mirko to take the prisoners and leave them with the rest of the approximate 250 prisoners already held there. I went to the house where I had sat before. There were about 30 Muslims being held in this house. I then heard two bursts of gunfire close by. About ten minutes later, Mile Petrovic came to me and said: "Boss, I just took revenge for my brother�I�ve killed them." He was referring to the six prisoners who had surrendered to us a short time before. He said he had executed them down a riverbank behind a yellow building. There is a gas station built on this site now. Mirko had driven off in the APC, in the direction of Zvornik. We stayed in Konjevic Polje for about twenty minutes and when Jankovic returned with the APC we left for Bratunac. I saw that Jankovic had Deutsche Marks with him and I asked him where he got the money. He said that he had received it from some Special Police members along the road. On the way back to Bratunac, I saw many prisoners being marched in both directions. I also saw dead bodies lying on the side of the road near Pervani and Lolici. I saw groups of three or so bodies at a time. At Sandici, I saw about 10 to 15 corpses and a large mass of prisoners in a meadow. On the way back to Bratunac, we drove past the Kravica warehouse and I saw some soldiers there but did not notice any Muslim prisoners. The next day I heard that an incident had occurred where a member of the MUP had been killed by a prisoner there. I looked into the incident and determined that after the killing of a MUP individual, the MUP forces became very angry resulting in the military and MUP forces present executing the prisoners held there. I established that among those participating in the execution were: Nikola Popovic from Kravica, who was attached to the Bratunac Brigade Military Police; Milovan Matic who was attached to the 1st Infantry Battalion of the Bratunac Brigade; Ilia Nikolic who was attached to the 1st Infantry Battalion of the Bratunac Brigade; Raso Milanovic who the commander of the Police Unit in Kravica. I also found out that the director of the warehouse, Jovan Nikolic witnessed the execution. Further, I learned that shortly after the executions on 13 July machines were brought from Zvornik and Bratunac to bury the bodies. I reported about what I have learnd to Colonel Vidoje Blagojevic about one of two days after the event. While the Muslim were detained in Potocari and around Bratunac, they were not given any food or medical aid and only given enough water to sustain them until the time they were transported to Zvornik. 10 In the evening of 13th July I was having dinner at the Bratunac Brigade HQ when I received a call from the communication room to report directly to Colonel Beara in the centre of Bratunac. I travelled to the centre and met with Colonel Beara at about 20:30 hrs. Colonel Beara ordered me to travel to the Zvornik Brigade and inform Drago Nikolic, the Zvornik Brigade Security Officer, that thousands of Muslim prisoners were being held in Bratunac and would be sent to Zvornik that evening. Colonel Beara also told me that the Muslim prisoners should be detained in the Zvornik area and executed. I drove alone to Zvornik from Bratunac via Konjevic Polje and and arrived at the Zvornik Brigade Headquarters at around 21:45 hrs. I went to the Duty Officer�s desk and requested to see Drago Nikolic. A person whom I believe was from the Brigade Intelligence branch met me in the Duty Officer�s room and I explained to him that I needed to see Drago Nikolic. He told me that Drago Nikolic was at the Forward Command Post (FCP) and provided me with a Military Police (MP) escort to go to the FCP. I then left the Zvornik Brigade HQ and travelled with the MP to the FCP. The trip from the Zvornik Brigade HQ to the FCP took almost 45 minutes along a very rough road. I met with Drago Nikolic and explained to him what Colonel Beara had told me. Drago Nikolic told me he would inform his command. I spent around 10 minutes at the FCP and then drove back to the Zvornik Brigade HQ where I dropped the Military Policeman at the gates. I drove back to Bratunac via Konjevic Polje. On the way back to Bratunac I passed some of the busses containing prisoners, at Kuslat, who were traveling towards Zvornik. I later established that another convoy had left for Zvornik along the Drina river road to Zvornik. I returned to Bratunac, around midnight, and reported to Colonel Beara at the Hotel Fontana. I told him that I met with Drago Nikolic and had passed on his (Beara�s) orders. At that time the Bratunac town was overcrowded with Muslim prisoners that had been brought from the area of the Milici-Bratunac road. It was late at night and there was insufficient transportation to move these prisoners to Zvornik. This created an unstable situation around Bratunac town. To deal with this situation, Colonel Beara, M. Deronjic (the civilian commissioner appointed by Karadzic to deal with the Muslim civilians), Dragomir Vasic and myself met in the SDS office in Bratunac. Deronjic was concerned that the prisoners in the town created a security risk and did not want the killing of these prisoners to be carried out in and around Bratunac. The killing operation was openly discussed at the meeting and all participants indicated that they had been reporting to their various chains of command. Logistic, transportation and security support was also discussed. It was decided at the meeting that the Muslim men in and around Bratunac should be continued to be guarded by elements of the Bratunac Brigade Military Police, various civilian MUP forces and armed volunteers from Bratunac town. The meeting ended at 00:30 hrs. on 14 July and I returned to the Bratunac Brigade Headquarters where I informed my commander, Colonel Blagojevic, of my trip to Zvornik and the instructions I had received from Colonel Beara and that all the prisoners would be moved to Zvornik where they would be detained and killed. He accepted what I said and never queried me. I also informed him of the meeting at the SDS office that night. 11 The vast majority of the Muslim men in Bratunac were transported to Zvornik the morning of 14 July in a column of buses and trucks well over 1 � kilometers in length led by Mirko Jankovic in a stolen Dutch APC. Later that day Mirko Jankovic reported to me that, that day, many Muslim prisoners were detained in schools and gyms in the Zvornik area. I was also aware that a patrol consisting of two Bratunac Military Policemen were also left overnight from 16 to 17 July in Pilica to assist in securing prisoners detained there. It was reported to me that approximately 80 to 100 Muslims were murdered in the hangar near the Vuk Karadzic school in Bratunac on the evening of the 13 July. Their bodies were deposited over a hillside and covered with dirt. 12 From 14 July through October 1995, Bratunac Brigade forces, working with the MUP and other VRS forces continued to capture and execute Muslim prisoners attempting to escape from the Srebrenica and Zepa areas. 13 From September through October 1995 the Bratunac Brigade, working with the civilian authorities, exhumed the mass grave at Glogova and other mass graves of Muslim victims of the murder operation, and reburied them in individual mass graves throughout the greater Srebrenica area. In September 1995 I was contacted by Colonel Popovic, the Drina Corps Chief of Security, and told to conduct a reburial of the Muslim bodies at Glogova. I coordinated the effort to exhume and re-bury Muslim bodies from mid-September to October 1995. This was done in coordination with the Bratunac Brigade Military Police, civilian police, and elements of the 5th Engineering Battalion of the Drina Corps. I reported on a Bratunac Brigade Commandmeeting in October 1995 to the assembled Command including Colonel Blagojevic that we were tasked with conducting the reburial operation of the Muslim bodies for the VRS Main staff. 14 In May 1996 when I was already demobilised from the VRS and worked in the Ministry of Refugees and Exiled Persons in Bratunac, the safe (containing intelligence and security documents, including decisions and orders, and valuables such as money) which was the property of the Security and Intelligence Organ of the Bratunac Brigade was handed over from me to my successor Captain Lazar Ostojic. In the presence of a commission comprised of the Chief of Security of the Drina Corps, Rade Pajic, two more officers from the Drina Corps whose names I don�t recall and Lazar Ostojic the documents which could have compromised myself and the Bratunac Brigade were destroyed. These documents related to the events in Srebrencia in 1995. I have not informed Colonel Blagojevic nor anybody else about this and I don�t know whether Captain Ostojic has informed Colonel Blagojevic. 15 I was summonsed to an interview by the ICTY in December 1999. Just prior to attending this interview, I was called to a meeting at the Zvornik Brigade Headquarters. I met General Andric, Dragan Jokic, Lazar Ostojic, Dragan Jevtic and General Miletic there. There were also some civilian lawyers from Belgrade present. The lawyers instructed us on our legal rights, General Miletic appealed to our patriotism and asked us not to divulge information which would damage the state and General Andric said we should say as little as possible. After my meeting with the ICTY, I met again with General Andric. The topic of the conversation was the same and he wanted to know if I had spoken about the killings to the ICTY. I was also visited by State Security just prior to my meeting with the ICTY, and was threatened that I should not speak of their involvement. Several months after the first meeting I attended again a similar meeting that was held again in the Zvornik Brigade headquarters, with the same individuals including, I think, Dragan Obrenovic who had been recently summonsed by the ICTY. General Miletic and Andric again told us not to provide any information related to the Srebrencia events to the ICTY. http://www.un.org/icty/mnikolic/trialc/facts030506.htm |
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Statement of Facts as set out by Dragan Obrenovic (Tab A to "Annex A" to the "Joint Motion for Consideration of Plea Agreement Between Dragan Obrenovic and the Office of the Prosecutor") I first became aware of the Muslim prisoners coming up to the Zvornik area in the evening of the 13th July 1995. I cannot recall the exact time but it was at about 19:00 hrs. that evening, when I received a telephone call from Lieutenant Drago Nikolic. He called me from the Brigade�s Forward Command Post and told me that he had just been telephoned by Lieutenant-Colonel Popovic. Drago Nikolic relayed to me that Popovic told him that a huge number of Muslim prisoners were to arrive in Zvornik from Bratunac and that Drago Nikolic should make preparations for their arrival. I understood "huge number of Muslim prisoners" to mean thousands of Muslim prisoners as I had already known from intelligence and other information received earlier in the day that thousands had been captured down in the Konjevic Polje area. Drago Nikolic said that he had to be relieved from the Forward Command Post to carry out this task. He also told me that Popovic was going to send someone to brief him in person and give him additional information. I asked why the prisoners were not being transported further north to the prisoner of war camp at Batkovici. Drago Nikolic told me that they were not going to send the prisoners to Batkovici because the Red Cross knew about Batkovici. He said that the orders were that these prisoners were to be brought to Zvornik to be shot. I said to Drago Nikolic that we could not accept the responsibility of the task he had just informed me about without informing our Command. Drago Nikolic told me that the Command already knew, and that this order came from Mladic and that everyone, including Pandurevic, was aware of this order. For this reason I never took steps to inform my Commander, Pandurevic, of this development, as I trusted Drago Nikolic�s word that Pandurevic already knew. I acknowledge that I was in Command of the Zvornik Brigade during the absence of my Commander, Vinko Pandurevic, until his return at about midday on 15th July. On hearing of this plan to kill the prisoners I, as acting Commander, took responsibility for the plan and supported the implementation of this plan. Drago Nikolic also asked me to release the Military Police Company from the line to assist him. I said that I had no other units available for the line. I then decided to send the Commander of the Military Police Company, Lieutenant Miomir Jasikovac, and five military policemen to assist him. About an hour later, at about 20:00 hrs., I ordered Lieutenant Jasikovac back to the Brigade and he arrived about forty minutes later. I telephoned General Zivanovic at about 20:30 hrs. and informed him of the situation regarding the Muslim column. I did not say anything to him about the plan to execute the prisoners. At the time I thought General Zivanovic was still the Drina Corps Commander. I ordered Jasikovac to remain with five to six men. The remainder of his men were to report to a Military Police Platoon Commander, Tanasko Mekic. I then briefed Jasikovac about the prisoners coming from Bratunac and that Drago Nikolic would call him and tell him what to do regarding these prisoners. Jasikovac remained at the Zvornik Brigade Headquarters with five Military Policemen and I went with Mekic to Snagovo. I arrived at Snagovo as it was getting dark, and met up with Captain Milan Maric and the Commander of the Engineering Company, Dragan Jevtic. During the course of the day on the 14th July 1995, we engaged the 28th Division in three battles. At abount 14:00 hrs. Major Zoran Jovanovic arrived at the Snagovo area with reinforcements from Zvornik. He told me that Beara had brought a large number of prisoners in buses, to the Zvornik area. At about 14:00 hrs., just after the reinforcements arrived, my signalman told me of a radio report from the Zvornik Brigade via the communication centre, with a message to release two machine operators. I was at an intersection at Snagovo at the time. The message was actually for Milan Maric, but my signalman received the transmission and informed me. The report was specific and referred to the machine operators by name, and said their duties were to build a road. I knew the road building story was not plausible. I suspected that they were either going to be used to bury prisoners or were being pulled off the line as a personal favour to the machine operators so I queried the message. Five minutes later I received a message from the radio centre that the request was related to the work of Popovic and Drago Nikolic. I knew then that the task for which the machine operators were requested was the burial of prisoners as part of the plan told to me by Drago Nikolic the night before. I have read the tactical intercepts provided by the Prosecution. As to my own conversations reflected in those intercepts, they are a generally accurate reflection of what was said, but the entire conversation is not recorded. As I was using a RUP 12 radio which was not secure, it was common practice for us to talk in code and switch to predetermined channels during the conversation and then proceed with the rest of the message, thus explaining why the intercepts are not complete. I then walked up to where Dragan Jevtic was. He was already speaking to the machine operators in question and it appeared as though they were arguing. It appeared as though the message had already reached them. Dragan Jevtic did not want to release the men, but I said that they had to go as ordered and approved their removal from the line. Later that afternoon, I�m not sure of the time but it was before we attacked Liplje, I heard on the radio that there were problems at Orahovac. I found this out when I was on my way to check on my 4th and 7th Battalions, and came into an area where I could get radio communication with the 4th Battalion (whom I previously could not contact by radio). I contacted Lazar Ristic, the Commander of the 4th Battalion, and he informed me on the radio that there were problems with the people who had been brought there. He was speaking in code and referred to the location of the problem as the place where the joint Command of the 2nd Battalion and the Brigade had been in 1992, which I knew to be Orahovac. He referred those who had been brought there as having been brought from the place where the "Zoljani People" are, which I understood to be a code reference to mean the prisoners from Srebrenica. Lazar Ristic informed me that he sent reinforcements to Orahovac to sort out the problem. I remained in the field and continued to request reinforcements to deal with the column, but none were forthcoming. That same evening (14th), between 23:00 hrs. and 00:00 hrs., I wrote a request to the Drina Corps Command for reinforcements on a piece of paper and gave it to my signalman. He in turn sent the message to the radioman, it was transmitted to the communication centre, and then relayed to the Duty Officer, Dragan Jokic. This was after the battles and the capture of police captain Zoran Jankovic. I did not return to the Zvornik Brigade Headquarters on the 14th July. On the morning of the 15th July 1995, I returned to the Zvornik Brigade Headquarters. As I approached the Headquarters at about 11:00 hrs., I noticed some of our army trucks and some troops returning to the Brigade. As I entered the compound, I saw Colonel Vasic from the MUP arrive. I waited for him and we walked together. Colonel Vasic was concerned about the capture of MUP police captain Zoran Jankovic. Before I reached my office, Dragan Jokic stopped me in the corridor. Vasic continued on toward my office while I spoke to Jokic. Jokic told me that he had a huge problem with the burials of those executed and the guarding of prisoners still to be executed. I asked who he had informed about this problem. He said that Beara, Popovic and Drago Nikolic were taking people wherever they wanted to take them. He said that Popovic had instructed him not to make a record of the activities involving the killing operation or speak on the radio about it. I was aware that the killing operation was occurring. I went to my office and spoke to Vasic. We spoke about the column and the Muslim prisoners. Vasic suggested that a corridor be opened in the lines to let the column through to avoid casualties and relieve the threat the column posed on the security of Zvornik as well as the rear of our front lines. Special Police Commander Ljubomir Borovcanin and Special Police officer Milos Stupar arrived and joined the meeting. We continued discussions with regard to the column. I felt I needed higher authority to open such a corridor and attempted to reach the Commander of the Drina Corps. I telephoned the Drina Corps and was put through to the Duty Officer there. I asked for the Commander and was told that Pandurevic had already left for Zvornik. There were no other officers at the Corps who could help me so I ended the call. Unable to speak to a Commander at Drina Corps, I then telephoned the Main Staff and spoke to General Miletic. At that stage I thought he was the operations officer, but I now know that he was standing in for the Chief of Staff of the Main Staff. I told Miletic of the column�s size and location and suggested that the lines be opened up to let it pass through. Miletic did not approve of this and said that I should use all military hardware possible to stop and destroy the column as I had been ordered to do. General Miletic told me that the column should be destroyed. He further complained to me about using an insecure line and hung up. I therefore did not have an opportunity to discuss the matter properly with him. From my knowledge of the column and the situation on the ground, I knew it was impossible to destroy the column as Miletic had suggested. Vasic then said jokingly that the army was stupid and that he was going to call the Ministry of Interior. Vasic then placed a telephone call to Pale on the speakerphone. He spoke to an advisor to the Minister of Interior. He explained the situation to this advisor and asked permission to allow the column to pass. The advisor said that he should find the army and alert the airforce and kill them all. We did not have the capability to use air power and it was clear to all of us that our superiors did not comprehend fully what was going on the ground with regard to the column. Thinking aloud, I then asked myself where General Zivanovic could be. Borovcanin responded that Zivanovic was no longer the Corps Commander, and that General Krstic was now the Drina Corps Commander. I then tried to get hold of General Krstic. I was able to get hold of the communications officer Major Milenko Jevdevic, who in turn connected me to General Krstic. I informed General Krstic of the situation and told him that Zvornik was about to fall and that something had to be done. General Krstic told me not to worry and said that Pandurevic, "Legenda" and his men were on their way to Zvornik. I knew "Legenda" was Captain Jolovic of the Drina Wolves of the Zvornik Brigade. After I hung up with General Krstic, Vasic talked about the situation in Bratunac with regard to the Muslim prisoners. He said that a dangerous situation had been created in Bratunac because of the large number of prisoners brought there. He said that, because of a lack of space, groups of prisoners could not be housed over night and had spent the night in parked busses. The prisoners had become agitated and had begun to rock the busses. He spoke of the problem in guarding all the prisoners. Borovcanin indicated that he was not happy that civilian police were being used to provide security on the buses and that he did not want the police to provide security for the prisoners when they reached their destination in Zvornik. Borovcanin further said that they had had battles with the column, and that he had not expected so many to have passed through the lines in the Konjevic Polje area. He also told me that they had captured large numbers of prisoners who were trying to cross the lines on the Konjevic Polje road. Milos Stupar then told me about an incident at a warehouse in Kravica where a Muslim prisoner had killed one of his officers. He said that a large number of prisoners had been detained at the warehouse and that one of the prisoners disarmed one of his men and shot him. He said that his men had opened fire on the remaining prisoners in the warehouse and that they had killed the prisoners. Based on our conversation I supposed that everyone present knew of the plan to kill the prisoners who had been brought to Zvornik. I also reasoned that, if I had known of the plan whilst in the hills, these officers who were dealing with the prisoners in Bratunac would have known about the plan. During this time, I left the room briefly and saw three soldiers from Bratunac. I addressed the Commander and told them that a soldier would take them to Bajlkovica and then they left with their troops. I later saw them in Bajlkovica. About twenty minutes after I had spoken to General Krstic, I was notified that my Commander, Vinko Pandurevic, had arrived at the Zvornik Brigade. I left my office to meet him and spoke to him in private. I first briefed Pandurevic about the Muslim prisoners and the murder operation, in which Beara and Popovic were active. I informed Pandurevic of the problems reported to me by Jokic regarding the burial of all the executed prisoners and the guarding of the men who had not yet been executed. Pandurevic asked me why the civilian protection people were not doing the burial as ordered. I just shrugged, as I did not know the civilian protection was supposed to be involved. Based on this comment by Pandurevic and what Drago Nikolic had told me on the 13th July, I realised that Pandurevic had knowledge of the murder operation. We then spoke about the column and I told him where the column was and how large it was. He asked why we had not stopped the column using the military hardware as ordered. When the suggestion that the lines be opened for the column to pass through was discussed, he asked who had the right to trade with Serb land. We spoke for approximately twenty minutes about military activities in the area of responsibility of the Zvornik Brigade. At approximately 13:00 hrs., I left the Zvornik Brigade. In my vehicle with me was my driver, Ljubisa Danojlovic and a signalman. The signalman was equipped with a RUP 12 radio. We travelled on the main road towards Tuzla via Kitovnica and Cer to Bajlkovica. We did not take the route past Orahovac as the road through there had been cut off by the Muslim column. We went directly to the command of the 4th Battalion at Bajlkovica and arrived there at about 14:00 hrs. I saw Ristic and his Command staff at the Forward Command Post, including his Communication staff and Rear Services. I also saw a Praga parked there. I changed the position of a group of about sixty men I had previously sent to the 4th Battalion to a position on a hill overlooking the Forward Command Post. I discussed military matters with Ristic and about an hour to an hour and half later, I reminded him of the conversation we had on the 14th July about the prisoners from Srebrenica. Earlier, I had requested a platoon from him for re-enforcement of the line and he said he did not have men to spare, yet provided men to Orahovac. Ristic told me that Milorad Trbic had called him from Orahovac school where the prisoners were being kept and asked for help. Ristic then sent about eight men to Orahovac as re-enforcements to assist Trbic in guarding the prisoners. Ristic said he didn�t know at that stage about the killing of prisoners at Orahovac, but learnt about it when he visited the site early in the evening of the 14th July. He said that he found his men guarding prisoners in the gymnasium of the school at Orahovac and that the execution of prisoners had already commenced in a nearby location. He lined up his men and was about to take them away, when Drago Nikolic stopped him. Drago Nikolic said that if the men stayed, they would all be issued with new uniforms by Captain Milosevic from rear services. Lazar Ristic spoke of other soldiers there in camouflage uniform from another location and he was not clear where they were from. I learned later from Ristic that a certain Gojko Simic from the 4th Battalion had been on leave at that time, but because he was from Orahovac, he went there voluntarily and joined the guards at the gymnasium before the arrival of the 4th Battalion re-enforcements. Ristic said that Drago Nikolic had been asking for volunteers and Gojko had volunteered to take part in the executions of prisoners. I also heard that there was a group at Orahovac from the Drina Corps Military Police. An elderly man attached to the Rear Services of 4th Battalion approached me and stated that he had heard that Drago Nikolic had personally taken part in the execution and that he could not believe what had happened. On the 15th July at about 18:00 hrs. that evening, the enemy blocked off our escape route. The RUP 12 radio at the 4th Battalion Command Post was also lost, but we still had my radio. The telephone lines to the 4th Battalion Command Post, both civilian and military had been cut. Prior to this happening, I had communicated with the Zvornik Brigade from the 4th Battalion Command Post on the civilian line when they reported shelling near Zvornik. I asked for Pandurevic, but the assistant Duty Officer informed me that he was not there. From the time we were cut off on the 15th July until we were pulled out on the 16th July, we endured fierce fighting. We eventually withdrew from the area between 13:00 hrs. and 14:00 hrs. on the 16th July 1995. During the fighting our Serb forces suffered 30 to 40 dead and many more wounded. In the afternoon or evening of the 16th July I called Pandurevic on the radio, who sent me the 6th Battalion Commander, Ostoja Stanisic. I met Stanisic in the field and briefly spoke to him. He told me that his deputy had been wounded and that Beara had brought prisoners to the school nearby. He was angry as the last group of prisoners were not taken to the dam to be executed, but were executed right there at the school and that his men (the 6th Battalion Rear Services) had to clean up the mess at the school, including the removal of the bodies to the dam. With regard to the execution of prisoners at the Petkovci Dam, I found out later that men from the 10th Sabotage unit from Vlasenica took part in the execution. I also know that the Zvornik Brigade�s 6th Battalion trucks and personnel were utilised to transport the corpses from the school of Petkovci, which were buried in a mass grave at the dam. With regard to the execution of prisoners at the Branjevo Military Farm, I found out later that members of the 10th Sabotage Detachment Platoon from Bijeljina took part in the execution, together with selected soldiers from Bratunac. I spent the evening of the 16th July at the Brigade�s Forward Command Post. On the morning of the 17th July 1995, I was travelling in a jeep with my Commander, Vinko Pandurevic. Together with us in the vehicle was the driver and two escorts. We drove through Kitovnica to Orahovac. Next to a water point in a meadow we saw the corpses of about twenty men, lying next to the road. I told Pandurevic that I had information that Drago Nikolic personally took part in the executions at that place. Pandurevic never said anything, but one of the escorts said that this sight of the corpses was nothing compared to the scene on the Konjevic Polje road and further on. One of the men in the car also said that he had been in a vehicle on the same road that we were on at that stage in Orahovac when a man jumped in front of the car and they collided with him, killing him. On the 17th I was the senior officer at the Forward Command Post. Our troops were conducting sweeping operations in an attempt to push the stragglers of the column towards the corridor which had been opened on the 16th, at around 14:00 hrs., to allow the Muslim column to pass into Muslim territory. The corridor was then closed between 17:00 hrs. and 18:00 hrs. that same day. On the morning of the 18th July 1995, I went to the area of the 4th Battalion and spent most of the day thereto moving the Battalion Command to a new location and reorganising it. By the 18th, news of the execution of the prisoners was widespread and everyone was talking about it. I spoke to the Drina Corps that day, but not about the killing operation. I spoke to them about the sweeping operation. At about noon on the 18th July, Vinko Pandurevic called me on the radio and asked me to brief three senior officers from main staff on the opening of the corridor for the column. I met these officers on a road overlooking a valley where the fiercest fighting took place and where we lost 38 or 39 men. Present were Colonel Sladojevic; Colonel Trkulja, who was in charge of the armoured units at Main Staff; Colonel Stankovic, who had something to do with security or police. I gained the impression that the Commander of the Brigade had come under scrutiny for opening up the corridor to allow the column through, by the group�s questions. They asked me if we could have held the line if 2nd Corps attacked and if the Muslims were shelling us at the time. I gained the impression that they thought we never put up resistance to the 28th Division and just let them through. They were surprised to hear of our losses but never drew any conclusions while I was there. I had arrived after their meeting had begun and left before it ended. Vinko Pandurevic issued an order on 18th July. This order followed the death of one of our soldiers. On the 18th of July one of our soldiers was killed while he was taking some prisoners into custody during sweep operations. My Commander, Pandurevic, then gave an order that persons should be shot and not to take risks capturing them. Some Brigade units did not take prisoners after this order. Pandurevic changed this order a few days later, around the 21st July. The order was over the radio and it stated that all prisoners should be brought down and processed according to normal procedures. From around that date, we began to take prisoners again. I went back to the Zvornik Brigade Command in the evening of the 18th July. Sometime after the 20th July 1995, I received an order from my Commander, Vinko Pandurevic. He ordered me to visit the clinic at "Standard" and the prisoners being treated there. I was aware that we had prisoners there who had arrived under written instructions from a colonel in the Medical Corps. My instructions were to brief the clinic staff and ensure there are no problems related to the prisoners. There was a fear that there would be problems because our wounded were being kept in the next room. I briefed the nurses and doctor present not to allow anyone in the room. I told them that as the prisoners recover individually, they would be transported to Bijeljina. I looked around and then left. Pandurevic referred repeatedly to these prisoners at briefings and told the Drina Corps that they had to be taken away. On around the 23rd July at about 08:00 hrs., Pandurevic called the Drina Corps to resolve the issue of these prisoners. Later we received word from the Drina Corps that Colonel Popovic would be coming to deal with the prisoners. I knew then that the prisoners would probably not be taken to Bijeljina as previously stated. Military Policemen took the prisoners away early one morning, but I�m not sure if they were Zvornik Brigade Military Police or Military Police from the Drina Corps and shot the prisoners dead. I asked my Commander about these prisoners at the morning briefing the day they disappeared. He told me that Popovic had passed an order from Mladic to Drago Nikolic that these patients had to be executed and that Popovic had acted as a courier. Sometime in August 1995, General Krstic came to Zvornik and requested me to take him to the soldiers in the field who had been involved in the most fierce fighting. I decided to take him to the right flank of the 7th battalion where the men were manning the trenches. I stood with General Krstic next to a trench where one of the soldiers was listening to a transistor radio. A survivor from one of the executions was giving an account of what happened to him over the radio broadcast from Tuzla. We stood there for about two minutes listening to the survivor and then General Krstic ordered that the radio be switched off and said we should not listen to enemy radio. He asked me if I had issued orders that enemy radio should not be listened to and I said that I had not. On the way back I thought about the survivor�s story on the radio and this lead me to ask General Krstic why the killings took place. I had said that we knew the people killed were all simple people and asked for the reason why they had to be killed. I said that even if they were all chickens that were killed, there still had to be a reason. General Krstic asked me where I had been. I said that I went to the field at Snagovo as ordered. Krstic cut me short and said that we would speak no more about this. On the 14th September 1995, I returned to the Zvornik Brigade from the field. The Duty Officer informed me that the Duty Officer at the Drina Corps had called and said that five tons of fuel was to be given to Trbic for a task. I telephoned the Drina Corps and spoke to the Duty Officer, but he did not know about the fuel. About 5 to 10 minutes later I was telephoned by Popovic who asked me how I knew about the fuel. I told him from the Duty Officer. Popovic told me that the Duty Officers were incompetent and had made a mistake. Pandurevic arrived the next day on the 15th September and I told him about the fuel story. He was going to the Drina Corps and said he would look into it. When he returned from the Drina Corps, Pandurevic told me that Popovic and his men would be in charge of the re-burying of the Muslim prisoners buried after the initial execution. On the 26th September 1995, I was about to leave the Brigade to perform duties in Krajina. At about 09:00 hrs. that morning, I saw Popovic at the entrance of the Zvornik Brigade Command building. He had a map rolled up under his arm. He went upstairs. Later, when I returned from Krajina on the 20th October, I heard that several members of the Brigade�s Engineering unit, some Military Police and Drago Nikolic participated in the re-burial of those prisoners executed in July 1995. The remainder of those who participated were brought in by Popovic, including some Drina Corps Military Police, who secured the area and traffic where the re-burials were taking place. I heard that Popovic wore civilian clothes for this operation. I heard that some of the Zvornik Brigade earth moving equipment and personnel were used in the initial burial phase and exhumation but have no information if they were used to construct the secondary grave. I also heard that Popovic and Drago Nikolic changed truck drivers at regular intervals, and that some Zvornik Brigade engineers were involved in the loading of bodies from the primary graves. I also heard that both Popovic and Beara visited the work during the re-burial operation, but were wearing civilian clothes. Sometime during 1998, I had a conversation with Drago Nikolic when he told me about the locations of two secondary mass graves where the remains of those executed in July 1995 had been moved. I am aware of meetings, which took place in Zvornik after people were issued with summonses to attend ICTY interviews about Srebrenica and the events, which followed. I did not attend these meetings as I was attending a class in Belgrade. I was upset at not being able to attend. http://www.un.org/icty/obrenovic/tr...acts_030520.htm |
why copy and paste all that? I think my head and fingers hurt from scrolling.
It's true that Serbs created their own commission and I already posted it if you bothered to read to dispel jewish media lies and it's report is here http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/d.../srebrenica.pdf
It's 141 pages long and it's very detailed and it exposes everyone involved .
Read that and not some controlled rag tag that tries to brainwash and tries to fit its own agenda.
Jews in US and Israel are not above using muslims for their plans. From Balkans to Checnya to Kurdistan , denying Armenian genocide to their old cooperation with Saddam and Bin Laden there is plenty of evidence of how Jews brainwashed muslims for their temporary plans . They know very well how savage they can be
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| Originally posted by erdega why copy and paste all that? I think my head and fingers hurt from scrolling. It's true that Serbs created their own commission and I already posted it if you bothered to read to dispel jewish media lies and it's report is here http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/d.../srebrenica.pdf It's 141 pages long and it's very detailed and it exposes everyone involved . Read that and not some controlled rag tag that tries to brainwash and tries to fit its own agenda. Jews in US and Israel are not above using muslims for their plans. From Balkans to Checnya to Kurdistan , denying Armenian genocide to their old cooperation with Saddam and Bin Laden there is plenty of evidence of how Jews brainwashed muslims for their temporary plans . They know very well how savage they can be |
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It is said that the dreadful massacre of Muslims occurred at the fall of Srebrenica. Particularly, Muslim soldiers who decided to flee through woods instead of surrendering are said to be executed by Bosnian Serb forces as if they had been hunting rabbits. However, two important facts were ignored in this understanding: those soldiers were carrying weapons in spite of Mladic�s repeated warning, and there were ferocious fighting between those Muslim soldiers and Bosnian Serb soldiers. . . . As Bosnian Serb forces were carrying anti-aircraft weapons, what they had to do was just to wait and shoot at massive Muslim soldiers coming out of the woods if they do not obey the warning of surrender. Yet, Bosnian Serb forces lost the fight at several places � because Bosnian Serb soldiers, being inferior in number, could not fight with hundreds or thousands of Muslim soldiers that crossed roads at a time even by heavy artillery. Among the loss of Bosnian Serb forces, there were quite a few elite soldiers, and local newspapers of Serbia often carried sad stories of those soldiers together with their photos in those days. Taking into consideration the huge loss of Bosnian Serb forces under the favorable conditions for them, it can be estimated that Muslim forces must have suffered the loss of nearly 2,000 soldiers from military perspectives. However, it must be noted that this combat might look mass killing to the eye of frightened Muslim soldiers although they carried weapons and shot at Bosnian Serb soldiers randomly. . . . In addition to death tolls in the combat, there were a number of Muslim soldiers who lost physical power to continue to flee. Dr. Ilijas Pilav, who succeeded this journey, said that he noticed many drowned men when he crossed the Jadar River. He added that there were mutual shootings because of illusions resulted from exhaustion. Another person said that there must have been lots of people who lost lives after losing sense of directions and going into a circle walk. After the combats, a huge number of dead bodies were scattered around. To walk for almost 20 days in the area which might be full of mines without any food and water under the fear of being shot from any directions was such a trauma that Muslim soldiers sometimes mixed reality with illusions. Having looked at dead bodies under the psychological disturbance, some Muslim soldiers could believe what they imagined. |
^^^^
You're forgetting that it was the Muslims that invaded that country in the first place, killing who knows how many thousands of Serbs.
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| Originally posted by ShadoWolf ^^^^ You're forgetting that it was the Muslims that invaded that country in the first place, killing who knows how many thousands of Serbs. |
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| Originally posted by occrider All the quotes are admissions from Serb commanders of their actions. Furthermore why don't you read the final report issued by the Serb commission. It fully admits to Serb atrocities. I started to read the report you sourced and its "detail" is quite humorous. |
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| Originally posted by ShadoWolf ^^^^ You're forgetting that it was the Muslims that invaded that country in the first place, killing who knows how many thousands of Serbs. |
Serbs moved into turkish occupied land?
That's a news to me.
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| Originally posted by erdega Serbs moved into turkish occupied land? That's a news to me. |
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| Originally posted by erdega Do you think I am supposed to take interviews of jailed soldiers and generals seriously in a controlled propaganda piece something which they can't prove physically or even theoratically? But still no mention of hundreds of civilians butchered around Srebrenica. You may find this all of this humorous and ego boosting but I find it personal and very serious. |
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| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 Well, when did the Serbs move to Bosnia then? |
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| Originally posted by occrider Fine, if you don't like admissions of guilt from those responsible than read the Bosnian Serb government's official report. I'll post it again for the sake of posterity: http://www.domovina.net/srebrenica/...nica_report.doc [urlhttp://www.domovina.net/srebrenica/page_006/rs_final_srebrenica_report_add.pdf]/url] In the report the Serbs state:
Hell they're still finding mass graves in 2004 as the Serb gov't is finally coming clean and reporting them: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3674693.stm |
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| Originally posted by erdega What's your point ? Your so called document is very shortened version of the original document I gave a full link to and I am not sure it's even real, certainly manipulated. Of course when it appears on a muslim website funded by jew George Soros , it's even more suspicious. |
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Report on Srebrenica massacre published BANJA LUKA, Bosnia-Herzegovina (AP) - Bosnian Serb forces killed more than 7,000 Muslim men and boys at Srebrenica, a Bosnian Serb commission conceded Thursday in its final report on the 1995 massacre. Bosnian Muslim officials claim that up to 8,000 men and boys were killed at Srebrenica in July 1995, when Serb troops overran the UN-declared safe zone in Europe's worst massacre of civilians since the Second World War. Although the report gave a lower estimate of the number of victims, the panel's vice-president, Smail Cekic, told The Associated Press the figure was not final. "That is hard to achieve because differences in sources," Cekic said. "That is still an open question." The Bosnian Serb government formed the commission of judges and lawyers last year to investigate who was responsible. Its final report includes information on the location of 34 mass grave where some of the victims are presumed to have been buried, Cekic said. So far, the remains of about 18,000 victims from different ethnic groups who died in the 1992-95 war have been exhumed from more than 300 mass graves across the country. UN and Muslim experts have found the remains of about 5,000 victims from mass graves in eastern Bosnia and discover new remains every month. The fate of the others is still unknown. Nearly 1,200 Srebrenica victims have been identified through DNA analysis. Although Bosnian Serbs long have been blamed for the massacre, it was not until this past June - following the Srebrenica commission's preliminary report - that Serb officials acknowledged for the first time that their security forces carried out the slaughter. Bosnian Serb wartime leader Radovan Karadzic and Ratko Mladic, his top general, are wanted for genocide and crimes against humanity for the Srebrenica killings and other atrocities. Karadzic is believed to be hiding in the half of Bosnia controlled by the Serbs, while Mladic is thought to be hiding in Serbia. Both were indicted in 1995 by the UN war crimes tribunal in The Hague, Netherlands, for their alleged roles in the Srebrenica massacre and for the Serbs' three-year siege of Sarajevo during the war. Cekic said the final report was sent to the government of the Bosnian Serb half of the country for evaluation and approval. The peace agreement that ended the war in Bosnia left the country divided into a Bosnian Serb mini-state and a Muslim-Croat federation. Both have separate governments, police and army and are linked only by joint state institutions. The Bosnian war - which pitted Serbs opposed to Bosnia's independence from the former Yugoslavia against Muslims and Croats backing it - claimed about 260,000 lives and left around 20,000 missing and presumed dead. http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2.../pf-669282.html |
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Of course they separated men from women , cause these men butchered hundreds of civilians around srebrenica and then recorded some of it. But most of them resisted, weomen and children were sent to Tuzla. |
So preliminary report is more than 100 pages longer and goes into every detail based on facts.
Your doc is way short, way subjective, peppered with emotional language, short on facts
that can't be proven anyway and authored in a very recognizable jewish zionist media trademarks of lies and manipulations. Once again, if the truth is so clear to you, why lie and mahipulate?
Really who are you to talk about Bosnia , really?
A destruction of any religious establishments is a sickening primitive act. The utter disregard and lack of respect and tolerance for other�s culture is an utter failure of humanity. The culprits of such lowly actions should be punished in the severest manner. I�m saddened to see a part of Serbian heritage disrespected in such callous manner but please do bring to light the true face of the real butchers of the Balkans.
Tearing Down the Past
The rejection of guilt a grave complex that plagues a slew of Serbs in the modern day; half a century later you�ll still be sure to find individuals in Germany who�d refute the holocaust. Some face reality sooner or later, some succumb to the not so quite rudimentary propaganda designed for demented minds. It�s an interesting technique to churn out chic balderdash from the Serbian corners of the world wide web in order to pool the wool over someone�s eyes, but mostly perhaps not to prick at one�s own grimy conscience.
Reasoning with individuals who suffer from a major lack of a rational perspective is not my intent. I would just like to state to those who attempt to reason with Serbian radicalism that it�s crucial not to place all eggs in the same basket. Quarter of a million Bosnians were victims of the Serbian barbarism in the Balkans, but never forget that about 30% of Sarajevo�s resistance fighters were Serbs who put their lives on the line for a multicultural Bosnia & Herzegovina. Sarajevo�s resistance was lead by Jovan Divljak the Serbian General of the BiH army. The sole reason why Serbian fundamentalists will never be able to enjoy a day in an ethnically cleansed Sarajevo is predominantly thanks to the special police force unit of Dragan Vikic. I doubt there would be any articles on the Serbian network on a man who stood up against Milosevic�s tyranny with a unit that consisted of a majority of Serbs at the beginning of the aggressions on Bosnia and Herzegovina.
It�s not a question of ethnicity, the chief paradigm here is humanism. A concept a few know more about than Bernard-Henri Levy, one of the most respected political philosophers of the modern day, a staunch advocate of ethics and justice, a man who really needs no introduction in intellectual circles. Here�s just a brief interiview with the Frenchman during the war:
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| ------What should be done, then, to save Sarajevo? BHL: What should be done is what Bosnian President Alija Izetbegovic asks. He does not ask for U.S. Marines or UN troops. Bosnia has enough soldiers to defend Sarajevo. He wants bombing of the artillery batteries that surround Sarajevo. Absent that, he wants the kind of weapons necessary to defend the city from artillery and tank barrages. He wants the world to recognize that the arms embargo on the Bosnian government is tragically unfair because it penalizes the people of Sarajevo. --- But isn't this a war among competing nationalisms, with each group trying to set up its exclusive nation-state? Isn't the conflict in the former Yugoslavia, as you have said, a war between weak and strong nationalisms? BHL: I think this is true between the Croats, the weaker nationalism, and the Serbs, the stronger. The situation in Sarajevo is different. Izetbegovic is not a nationalist. Sarajevo is a cosmopolitan city where different nations have lived together for five centuries. ----- The Bosnian Serbs claim that Izetbegovic is trying to create a Muslim-dominated state in Bosnia. BHL: No. There was one document from 1970, which the Serbs often cite, called "The Islamic Declaration." Izetbegovic has stated his disagreement with the document many times, and since he became president his policy has been demonstrably against the establishment of an Islamic state. The government of Sarajevo is mixed, with a strict parity of the Muslim, Croat and Serb ministers. There are six of each . The second in command of the Bosnian governments army is a Serb. Thirty percent of the population fighting to defend Sarajevo are Serbs. And they have confidence in Izetbegovic. The reality today in Sarajevo speaks for itself .An ethnically mixed population is fighting against Serbian nationalism in Sarajevo, and in the western part of Bosnia-Herzegovina, against Croatian nationalism. In Sarajevo cosmopolitan and tolerant Europe is fighting the specter of the nationalist, populist, chauvinist idea of Europe. |
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| Originally posted by erdega So preliminary report is more than 100 pages longer and goes into every detail based on facts. |
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Your doc is way short, way subjective, peppered with emotional language, short on facts that can't be proven anyway and authored in a very recognizable jewish zionist media trademarks of lies and manipulations. Once again, if the truth is so clear to you, why lie and mahipulate? |
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Really who are you to talk about Bosnia , really? |
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| Originally posted by erdega Is that the fine revisionist history they are teaching you in croatia? My father's family is from bosnia and they lived there since ever they can trace their genes. Still I don't want this thread to turn into a history debate either. |
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| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 Look, I've just mentioned that because Shadowwolf implicitely said that Bosnia was populated by serbs prior to Turkish invasions, which is simply not the case. |
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| Originally posted by occrider LOL I actually read the preliminary report. Unfortunately I lack the capability to delve into its sources due to language constraints but its explanations are quite ludicrous. Muslims went into "circle walks" which explains the bodies everywhere? They were so traumatized by Serb superirority that they didn't realise that they themselves were shooting back? They hallucinated everything? Not only are they ludcrous explanations, but that still doesn't explain the fact that 5,000 bodies were dug up of which 1,200 have been identified by DNA and many of the identified were civilians. |
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| Haha it's not my document. It's the final report issued by the Bosnian Serb Government. |
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| I'm God actually. As such I'm fully qualified to talk about whatever I wish since I'm quite omniscient. I'm guessing that you desired a rediculous response to your non-sequitor that hinted at a false appeal to authority. |
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| Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 Look, I've just mentioned that because Shadowwolf implicitely said that Bosnia was populated by serbs prior to Turkish invasions, which is simply not the case. |
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Originally posted by Kzwei  |
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| Originally posted by erdega you can't grasp anything cause you are jewish media lackey with preconceived notions and no direct knowledge of situation. |
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How do you justify to your self to promote a report that is barely 30 pages long and peppered with unverifiable statements and very much one sided over a report that is 100 pages longer and goes into excrutiating physical detail? |
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Authorities in the Federation Entity of Bosnia and Herzegovina and the international community have severely condemned a report released by authorities in the Republika Srpska claiming the July 1995 massacre of Bosnian Muslims at Srebrenica never happened. Though it is widely accepted that between 7,000 and 8,000 Bosniak men and boys were massacred by Bosnian Serb forces when they took control of Srebrenica in eastern Bosnia between 11 and 15 July 1995, the report offers a completely different story, blaming deaths on "exhaustion," among other things. The report � conducted in early September by the Republika Srpska's Government Bureau for Relations with the International Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia (ICTY) � claims that no more than 2,000 were killed, and that all were armed soldiers of the Bosnian Army and not civilians. Of those 2,000, the new study says that 1,600 were killed in battle or while attempting escape, and 100 died simply because they were "exhausted." The study also claims that it is possible that fewer than 200 members of the Bosnian Army were killed by members of the Bosnian Serb Army in acts of revenge or because they were not aware of the particulars of the Geneva Convention on prisoners of war. "To walk for almost 20 days in an area that might be full of landmines, without any food and water, under the fear of being shot from any direction was such a trauma that soldiers sometimes mixed reality with illusions," the report concluded, referring to a member of the Bosnian Serb army who confessed to having taken part in the mass killings as "mentally disturbed." The controversial study is to be presented to officials at the ICTY and to a handful of local and international nongovernmental organizations to be used in the defense of Bosnian Serb soldiers and politicians accused of war crimes between 1992 and 1995. The study is partially a compilation from other, earlier studies conducted by various institutions, including the United Nations and the International Crisis Group (ICG). But those institutions have accused the Bosnian Serb authorities of manipulating the earlier reports and using only parts of statements to change context. Across the board, the international community has harshly criticized the report as an attempt to cover up the heinous crimes committed at that time. The International Commission on Missing Persons (ICMP) released a statement on 6 September, calling the report a gross distortion of the facts. "Manipulation of the issue of the missing for political purposes, including the manipulation of numbers of missing, has been an ongoing practice within Bosnia and Herzegovina that only serves to cause further pain and suffering in a society that has already suffered so much. The study regarding the numbers of missing from the 1995 fall of Srebrenica made by the Republika Srpska's Government Bureau for Relations with the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY) contains what ICMP believes to be serious inaccuracies," ICMP's statement read. According to information from ICMP, "there are approximately 7,500 bags of human remains currently in storage, which have been exhumed from various gravesites in northeast BiH. These remains are stored in three locations in Tuzla and one location in Visoko. Almost 2,000 of these bags contain complete bodies, another 2,000 bags contain partial bodies of one individual, and the remaining 3,500 bags contain 'commingled remains.'" However, the government of Republika Srpska, of which the bureau that conducted the report is a part, is dragging its feet over a public rejection. The entity's media has largely come out in favor of the report, while Republika Srpska President Mirko Sarovic has said only that the report should not be dismissed entirely, but does warrant further investigation. When Srebrenica fell under Bosnian Serb control, the report says, between 25,000 and 40,000 local residents decided to surrender themselves at the UN base. According to the study, most of those who surrendered were women, children, and the elderly, with approximately 2 to 3 percent soldiers. Bosnian Serb officials claim that they transferred those civilians to safe territory under Bosnian government control, and took the soldiers to a prison camp in the town of Bratunac. The bureau's director, Dejan Miletic, told the Banja Luka daily Nezavisne novine that of 750 Bosnian Army soldiers arrested, 500 were immediately released and the rest were sent to prison camps in Batkovici. "Later, those 250 prisoners were exchanged for Bosnian Serb prisoners of war. Also, between 10,000 and 15,000 Bosniak civilians and armed soldiers tried to escape from Srebrenica through the forest, but there is no evidence of war crimes committed against them," he said. "So far, more than 30 mass graves have been discovered along those escape routes," Amor Masovic, president of the Bosnian Commission for Missing Persons, told TOL*. Masovic said that no one from the Republika Srpska bureau has ever been present at mass grave exhumations in that region. And if any of them did show up at those graves, Masovic says he would gladly give them evidence of heinous crimes. Sinisa Djordjevic, adviser to Republika Srpska's prime minister for relations with The Hague, told the ONASA news agency that there can be more than one truth about Srebrenica during the war because over 1,000 Bosnian Serb civilians were also killed. "We want to find out the truth about Srebrenica. We want to bury the hatchet, but we want the facts to be known to the public in order to secure peace in Bosnia," Djordjevic was quoted as saying. Djordjevic is a member of the prime minister's Party of Democratic Progress (PDP). Analysts link the emergence of the report with the October general elections in Bosnia, when the PDP will compete with the ultra-nationalist Serbian Democratic Party (SDS) for the votes of a still rather nationalist electorate. Djordjevic said that he doesn't believe that more than 7,000 Bosniaks were killed when Bosnian Serbs took control of Srebrenica. "The study shows that the crimes committed in Srebrenica according to Bosniak politicians are not backed up by complete information about victims' names, and the lists that exist of those killed are very suspicious. In addition, the details of those who committed the so-called crimes and when they were committed are unknown," he said. Djordjevic claims that Bosniak politicians manipulated the number of victims in order to turn the international community against Bosnian Serbs. All major politicians and media outlets in the federation condemned the report. But Prime Minister Ivanic claimed last week that "the federation media made fuss over the report for their own purposes." http://www.time.com/time/europe/eu/...,349957,00.html |
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That's jewish authored or rather edited document from cnn and other controlled media. I already showed you the real document, however you push this propaganda trick. I am more experienced than that, you won't persuade me or overpower me no matter how much you repeat yourself. You are just confused as far as this particular subject is concerned and better to admit to it to yourself and find a subject you are familiar with. |
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