TranceAddict Forums (www.tranceaddict.com/forums)
- Music Discussion
-- What The **** Is mcprog/mctrance
Pages (5): « 1 2 [3] 4 5 »

quote:

Originally posted by Tegu progressive refers to progressive HOUSE, not progressive TRANCE. progressive is an effort to make house less monotonous and one step closer to trance as we know it.

i'm pretty sure that the name "progressive" used on its own refers to prog house, prog trance, prog breaks and all the (very) gray area between these 3 subgenres. these are all subjective labels though, and everyone (every genre freak) has their own detailed perception of what these names mean.

as for mcprog, it's pretty much on the gray area, maybe probably a bit more directed towards trance but it clearly takes house elements

quote:

Originally posted by A.J. It kicks ass.

Oh that I'm not debating at all.

quote:

Originally posted by paranoik0 i'm pretty sure that the name "progressive" used on its own refers to prog house, prog trance, prog breaks and all the (very) gray area between these 3 subgenres. these are all subjective labels though, and everyone (every genre freak) has their own detailed perception of what these names mean. as for mcprog, it's pretty much on the gray area, maybe probably a bit more directed towards trance but it clearly takes house elements

A correct and appropriate analysis.

Progressive has always been an amorphous blob that moved off in a collective direction but never quite settled on a simple definition.

quote:

Originally posted by Cobalt I've made an attempt to advance the alternate label "American Progressive," deeming McProg too colloquial for official use. But you own all rights and reserves to the brilliant McProg label, unconditionally.

Interesting...But isn't "American Progressive" too broad for a subgenre label? I'm worried that the more traditional prog djs from America could be confused into the junk food category.

Would "American Progressive" include the likes of Christopher Lawrence, Sandra Collins, Yoshitoshi artists such as Deep Dish, Saeed and Palash, some Danny T. or maybe even someone like Sean Cusick just because they are "American" and "Progressive" in one way or the other?

And although the vast majority of McProg is most definitely American, it isn't strictly so. Armin himself is one of the principal trendsetters that started off this craze, second only to Markus Schulz.

quote:

Progressive has always been an amorphous blob that moved off in a collective direction but never quite settled on a simple definition.

If this were true, which I believe to be...

quote:

i'm pretty sure that the name "progressive" used on its own refers to prog house, prog trance, prog breaks and all the (very) gray area between these 3 subgenres. these are all subjective labels though, and everyone (every genre freak) has their own detailed perception of what these names mean. as for mcprog, it's pretty much on the gray area, maybe probably a bit more directed towards trance but it clearly takes house elements

Then this is false. Progressive is not a general term, it is an abused word mistakenly fuse trance and bad house together. And this is where the McProg issue comes in. McProg is what is to 'progressive' as McTrance is to, well...trance.
The problem(and yes, it is a problem which I will explain in a second) with McProg is it dilutes the progressive house and progressive trance pool with extremely boring and simple productions that have 'desktop trance' elements thrown all over the place. An example would be Roland Klinkenberg - Monday Groove. Both structure and genre wise, this track is easily labeled progressive because of it's production technicals(very moving track...never stops) and it's fresh sound. The Perry O'Neil remix of this takes all that away, and jams in a recycled synth that we can all characterize Perry O'Neil's productions by, and simplifies the track to make his synth the main part, reducing the track to nothing but a standard trance track with progressive charades and one big build and break. Probspot songs and remixes also have this characteristic, as they color the song vividly with their sound, yet do nothing with the track itself as far as production goes. This is why Sasha is revered and respected everywhere: the quality of his remixes don't stop at the intricacies of his sounds and technicalities, but the composition of his productions and remixes are what each and every Sasha track 'progressive' to the truest sense, both symbolically and technically.
That's not to say that these are not good productions, however. I enjoy listening to the new trance sound that has been pouring out since last year, when Markus Schulz broke through and became popular. Heck, sometimes I throw them into my sets! Perry O Neil, I'll admit, does a good job of creating a different feel and mood with his remixes, which in essence would the core of progressive genres: the mood and atmosphere generated by the sum of all the parts in a great progressive house or trance track(ex. Habersham - Transparent Sound...very simple sounding, yet each part of the track does more than just exist.). But to say that these McProg tracks are considered progressive house or trance can't be justified simply because they don't have a banging lead, huge supersaw break and build, and 138+BPM tempo. They are just as trancey and epic in their own sense as these ASOT Anjuna whatever trance tracks people find entertaining to bash.
Going back to your main point, McProg can be thought of as a quick fix collaboration of progressive house and progressive trance with epic trance elements spilled all over it. So I don't consider it to be part of any progressive genre, if you were to take your definition Progressive as that gray area. Progressive breaks I'd say are true off shoots of the progressive blob that you and Cobalt seem to be right on.

It's annoying when people judge productions as a group (all of one artists work) rather than individually.

Then again, some artists never change their sound {insert your favorite cliche target here}

quote:

Originally posted by A.J. I would class some of the stuff John "00" Fleming plays as closer to the progressive trance that I enjoy, but that's just me. Like i have said before, i do not enjoy the "American Progressive" sound much, apart from a few select tracks, but I think J00F plays some awesome proggy trance. Just my opinion and my taste....

then i think you would do well to check my set on Amateurs Djs forum

quote:

Originally posted by Pio Interesting...But isn't "American Progressive" too broad for a subgenre label? I'm worried that the more traditional prog djs from America could be confused into the junk food category. Would "American Progressive" include the likes of Christopher Lawrence, Sandra Collins, Yoshitoshi artists such as Deep Dish, Saeed and Palash, some Danny T. or maybe even someone like Sean Cusick just because they are "American" and "Progressive" in one way or the other?

This was the main flaw in the name. But I think it's passable because there's nothing particularly regional about progressive producers in America. They more or less share a global progressive sound with similar producers around the world. McProg, however, is highly American in origin.

I also proposed the alternate of "Miami Prog", but I didn't like it as much because American Prog actually started in San Francisco, and isn't limited to Miami either. Which brings me to...

quote:

And although the vast majority of McProg is most definitely American, it isn't strictly so. Armin himself is one of the principal trendsetters that started off this craze, second only to Markus Schulz.

Armin didn't hop on until the movement was well under way. Gabriel & Dresden got the ball rolling with their remix of Mindcircus in 2002, and Schulz took it to new heights in transplanting it to Miami nightclubs (and airwaves). Only during the Gabriel & Dresden remixing blitz of 2003 did Armin begin to incorporate the "GDJB" sound into ASOT.

quote:

Originally posted by dJohn Then this is false. Progressive is not a general term, it is an abused word mistakenly fuse trance and bad house together. ... Progressive breaks I'd say are true off shoots of the progressive blob that you and Cobalt seem to be right on.

Progressive house and progressive trance became hopelessly entangled by the end of 2001 (or, depending on your perspective, progressive trance died). The introduction of breaks made the situation even more unmanageable to classify. I gave up trying to subcategorize progressive over two years ago. It's really rather pointless to call the genre anything but "progressive" after 2002, because no meaningful lines can be drawn after that point. If you really wanted to be particular, or loath an adjective for a genre name, you could probably call it "progressive house" despite the breaks. But any way you cut it, McProg emerged from progressive aka progressive house. Not from progressive trance, which lost its way around the end of 2001, or was dragged to the dark depths by Sasha and Diggers before American Progressive emerged.

I wondn't consider my show McProg, but whatever you say Ian...thanks for the support

-I do realize I play some "McProg" now and then but the tracks I play are the tracks I enjoy so if you dont like it dont listen -

Shawn Mitiska / DJ Mitiska

^^^
Shawn you and Markus are pretty damn different. Like u said you play *some* McProg (and beautiful ones at that) but I love how groovey and housey your progressive tendancies get most of the time. Throwing in some beautiful melodic prog definetly helps keep the eclecticness alive in your sets and are the glimmers of brightness within them.

By the way...I have never heard of McTrance, McProg sure but not the other. And may I ask, why is McProg bad? I missed that little fact.

quote:

Originally posted by Dan1584 ^^^ Shawn you and Markus are pretty damn different. Like u said you play *some* McProg (and beautiful ones at that) but I love how groovey and housey your progressive tendancies get most of the time. Throwing in some beautiful melodic prog definetly helps keep the eclecticness alive in your sets and are the glimmers of brightness within them.

Love this is what dance music should be about, congradulating talents and showing love for the music you enjoy, not over analisizing (SP) everything

quote:

Originally posted by dJohn Then this is false. Progressive is not a general term, it is an abused word mistakenly fuse trance and bad house together. And this is where the McProg issue comes in. McProg is what is to 'progressive' as McTrance is to, well...trance.

i'm not understanding your argument there. yes progressive is an abused word.. but so is trance, so is house, etc

quote:

The problem(and yes, it is a problem which I will explain in a second) with McProg is it dilutes the progressive house and progressive trance pool with extremely boring and simple productions that have 'desktop trance' elements thrown all over the place. An example would be Roland Klinkenberg - Monday Groove. Both structure and genre wise, this track is easily labeled progressive because of it's production technicals(very moving track...never stops) and it's fresh sound. The Perry O'Neil remix of this takes all that away, and jams in a recycled synth that we can all characterize Perry O'Neil's productions by, and simplifies the track to make his synth the main part, reducing the track to nothing but a standard trance track with progressive charades and one big build and break. Probspot songs and remixes also have this characteristic, as they color the song vividly with their sound, yet do nothing with the track itself as far as production goes. This is why Sasha is revered and respected everywhere: the quality of his remixes don't stop at the intricacies of his sounds and technicalities, but the composition of his productions and remixes are what each and every Sasha track 'progressive' to the truest sense, both symbolically and technically.

ehh.. ummm.. i'm aware of this though i'm of the opinion that sasha and company aren't necessarily on a superior level, they just follow a different formula and i happen to prefer that formula. but he's indeed a bit more versatile than schulz

quote:

But to say that these McProg tracks are considered progressive house or trance can't be justified simply because they don't have a banging lead, huge supersaw break and build, and 138+BPM tempo. They are just as trancey and epic in their own sense as these ASOT Anjuna whatever trance tracks people find entertaining to bash.

again i don't understand what you're saying there. mcprog isn't progressive house, neither epic trance. mcprog is mcprog. we know that. it picks elements from both house and trance (and yes it's influenced by both prog trance and epic trance), hence the "grey area" comment, it's somewhere between the two of them

quote:

Going back to your main point, McProg can be thought of as a quick fix collaboration of progressive house and progressive trance with epic trance elements spilled all over it. So I don't consider it to be part of any progressive genre, if you were to take your definition Progressive as that gray area.

mcprog = prog trance + prog house + epic trance. that makes it 2/3 progressive

quote:

Progressive breaks I'd say are true off shoots of the progressive blob that you and Cobalt seem to be right on.

and i must be really slow today, cause yet again i didn't understand what you were trying to say there. or maybe i just need some english classes. what the hell are "true off shoots"

Re: Re: What The **** Is mcprog/mctrance

quote:

Originally posted by speedracer_mec Hopefully Markus Schulz will be exiled from Florida to Madagascar.

"american mcprog"
u kidz 'r funnaay!!!
doesthis mean mc.. "prog" genre is going down?

quote:

Originally posted by Trancened I wondn't consider my show McProg, but whatever you say Ian...thanks for the support -I do realize I play some "McProg" now and then but the tracks I play are the tracks I enjoy so if you dont like it dont listen - Shawn Mitiska / DJ Mitiska

that's ok, it's never on at a time that I can listen anyway

Seriously tho, it might sound like we're being totally derogative, but progressive can be great, cass & slide etc but I do find a lot of it unimaginative, slow, boring and lacking energy, which imo is what music is about.

quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ REGRESSIVE TRANCE backwardly evolving music appealing mainly to americans and many people who haven't seen the 1990s. Involves lots of coldharbours, mike foyles, 'mile high nights' Gabriel & Dresden perry o'neil and awfully produced drivel. Rivals the stuff from labels like somatic sense, anjunabeats & armada who are the same plague on trance

ok for fucks sake, ive had enough of you. here are a list of samples of my tracks. there is maybe 1 that you could call "mc prog" and i made it god knows how long ago. listen to them so you actually have the faintest fucking clue as to what i produce, and then ill take your opinion on me and my music into account.

Santiago Nino - Wake Me From The Inside (Mike Foyle Remix)

Mike Foyle - Jigsaw

Mike Foyle - Space Guitar (Club Mix)

Mike Foyle vs Signalrunners - Love Theme Dusk (Mike's Gladiator Mix)

Mike Foyle presents Andromeda - Northern Lights (Original Mix)

Filo & Peri - Closer Now (Mike Foyle Remix)

GRRRRRRR

Now im sorry if this isnt boring repetative clicky progressive SHITE, but its what i like, its what alot of others like, its varied, alot of it is experimental, and takes me fucking ages to do. im sorry but i have a massive problem with you, your big "know it all" head, and your judgement of other people because of what they listen to.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike_Foyle ok for fucks sake, ive had enough of you. here are a list of samples of my tracks. there is maybe 1 that you could call "mc prog" and i made it god knows how long ago. listen to them so you actually have the faintest fucking clue as to what i produce, and then ill take your opinion on me and my music into account. GRRRRRRR Now im sorry if this isnt boring repetative clicky progressive SHITE, but its what i like, its what alot of others like, its varied, alot of it is experimental, and takes me fucking ages to do. im sorry but i have a massive problem with you, your big "know it all" head, and your judgement of other people because of what they listen to.

Honest opinion ?

I like how you flipped at me, keep on practising cos you have more chance of flipping burgers than making it in the music business. I'm sorry to bring your world crashing down on you but while your music is good for an amateur, that's all it is, there's hundreds of other people who can produce to that standard and that's why I don't believe you're very good, especially compared to some of the people who use/used Am Prod forum in the past like Haak, MK-S, Luke Terry, Santiago Nino, Mike Upton, George Hales, Wim & Many many others.

I've been into music since 1990 at least and It's a great passion of mine, and when I hear something I don't like, why should I give it praise when there are thousands more skilled producers or dj's out there who can do better. If being honest about your productions leads you to hate me, then you take it too seriously, if having a personal vendetta against me simply because I don't follow the crowd & give honest opinions is so bad, then excuse me, and if You dont like my posts, don't read them, I just find it funny how people like you complain when people abuse something they believe in, but their retorts are basically just as bad as the troll who's posting the tracks opinon is.

oh and if you actually knew me you'd know that i hate 'clicky' progressive nearly as much as your stuff I do have a huge range of tastes that satisfy me, and to be totally frank a lot of your stuff isn't fit to clean their shoes If you concentrated more on forging a sound that wasn't so cheap sounding, you'd be much better off. Don't hate people with opinions, else you'll hate 99% of Tranceaddict

quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ Honest opinion ? I like how you flipped at me, keep on practising cos you have more chance of flipping burgers than making it in the music business. I'm sorry to bring your world crashing down on you but while your music is good for an amateur, that's all it is, there's hundreds of other people who can produce to that standard and that's why I don't believe you're very good, especially compared to some of the people who use/used Am Prod forum in the past like Haak, MK-S, Luke Terry, Santiago Nino, Mike Upton, George Hales, Wim & Many many others. I've been into music since 1990 at least and It's a great passion of mine, and when I hear something I don't like, why should I give it praise when there are thousands more skilled producers or dj's out there who can do better. If being honest about your productions leads you to hate me, then you take it too seriously, if having a personal vendetta against me simply because I don't follow the crowd & give honest opinions is so bad, then excuse me, and if You dont like my posts, don't read them, I just find it funny how people like you complain when people abuse something they believe in, but their retorts are basically just as bad as the troll who's posting the tracks opinon is. oh and if you actually knew me you'd know that i hate 'clicky' progressive nearly as much as your stuff I do have a huge range of tastes that satisfy me, and to be totally frank a lot of your stuff isn't fit to clean their shoes If you concentrated more on forging a sound that wasn't so cheap sounding, you'd be much better off. Don't hate people with opinions, else you'll hate 99% of Tranceaddict

see mate this is the thing, i dont give 2 flying fucks if u like my music or not. but u fire it so personally. you dont like people who make music that you dont like. why though?! i appriciate your taste in music, but no matter what you like and dont like, the fact is, my music isnt all the same, isnt based on particular formulas, isnt unimaginative, and alot of work, time, and thought goes into them. the end result is what i want it to sound like, its what i like, what i enjoy, what does it for me, which is why its all so different, because im not so narrow minded that i only aprriciate 1 genre of music. ok so technically im not the best producer in the world, did i ever claim to be? all i wanted to prove was that my music isnt all the same formulaic dick juice like you seem to think. you just have a completely retarded attitude and it pisses me off

Had a listen to some of those tracks Mike, and they sound pretty varied to me. Nice tracks - Space guitar is pretty different sounding in my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by RickyM Had a listen to some of those tracks Mike, and they sound pretty varied to me. Nice tracks - Space guitar is pretty different sounding in my opinion.

thanks dude, space guitar is the one that everyone thinks is mc prog :/ the original mix is to a certain extent i suppose. the remix of wake me from the inside is the one thats most unique i think.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike_Foyle ok for fucks sake, ive had enough of you. here are a list of samples of my tracks. there is maybe 1 that you could call "mc prog" and i made it god knows how long ago. listen to them so you actually have the faintest fucking clue as to what i produce, and then ill take your opinion on me and my music into account. Santiago Nino - Wake Me From The Inside (Mike Foyle Remix) Mike Foyle - Jigsaw Mike Foyle - Space Guitar (Club Mix) Mike Foyle vs Signalrunners - Love Theme Dusk (Mike's Gladiator Mix) Mike Foyle presents Andromeda - Northern Lights (Original Mix) Filo & Peri - Closer Now (Mike Foyle Remix) GRRRRRRR Now im sorry if this isnt boring repetative clicky progressive SHITE, but its what i like, its what alot of others like, its varied, alot of it is experimental, and takes me fucking ages to do. im sorry but i have a massive problem with you, your big "know it all" head, and your judgement of other people because of what they listen to.

Unrelated it may be but thought I may as well chip in seeing as I haven't heard any of your stuff before. I think the production on those tracks (barring maybe Jigsaw) sounds very good... above average at least. However they all seemed too middle of the road to me musically, without any really grabbing factors to them... as if they were designed as set fillers. I actually thought Jigsaw sounded the most unique out of them.. just it had a kinda amateur feel about it which I can't put my finger on. The one that annoys me the most is the Love Theme Dusk track... it's in the uplifting trance style but imho sounds pretty dry & emotionless, without a decent hook or a driving powerful bassline.. relying too much on wishy washy ambient effects and twinkly bits instead. Reminds me alot of the music which has put me off uplifting trance a bit over the past year or two.

Probably doesn't matter that much to you but just on the off chance you were interested in people's opinions.

quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ Honest opinion ? I like how you flipped at me, keep on practising cos you have more chance of flipping burgers than making it in the music business. I'm sorry to bring your world crashing down on you but while your music is good for an amateur, that's all it is, there's hundreds of other people who can produce to that standard and that's why I don't believe you're very good, especially compared to some of the people who use/used Am Prod forum in the past like Haak, MK-S, Luke Terry, Santiago Nino, Mike Upton, George Hales, Wim & Many many others. I've been into music since 1990 at least and It's a great passion of mine, and when I hear something I don't like, why should I give it praise when there are thousands more skilled producers or dj's out there who can do better. If being honest about your productions leads you to hate me, then you take it too seriously, if having a personal vendetta against me simply because I don't follow the crowd & give honest opinions is so bad, then excuse me, and if You dont like my posts, don't read them, I just find it funny how people like you complain when people abuse something they believe in, but their retorts are basically just as bad as the troll who's posting the tracks opinon is. oh and if you actually knew me you'd know that i hate 'clicky' progressive nearly as much as your stuff I do have a huge range of tastes that satisfy me, and to be totally frank a lot of your stuff isn't fit to clean their shoes If you concentrated more on forging a sound that wasn't so cheap sounding, you'd be much better off. Don't hate people with opinions, else you'll hate 99% of Tranceaddict

Mike, want a suggestion? copy this post, and post it right by your computor. Let this motivate you. Everytime you are working on a track, read it!! Show these people and when you make ithave a good laugh at them because they will still be sititing in front of their computors posting shit.

quote:

Originally posted by isoterra Unrelated it may be but thought I may as well chip in seeing as I haven't heard any of your stuff before. I think the production on those tracks (barring maybe Jigsaw) sounds very good... above average at least. However they all seemed too middle of the road to me musically, without any really grabbing factors to them... as if they were designed as set fillers. I actually thought Jigsaw sounded the most unique out of them.. just it had a kinda amateur feel about it which I can't put my finger on. The one that annoys me the most is the Love Theme Dusk track... it's in the uplifting trance style but imho sounds pretty dry & emotionless, without a decent hook or a driving powerful bassline.. relying too much on wishy washy ambient effects and twinkly bits instead. Reminds me alot of the music which has put me off uplifting trance a bit over the past year or two. Probably doesn't matter that much to you but just on the off chance you were interested in people's opinions.

thanks for your opinions. im quite a fan of love theme dusk hehe. but yeah.. very twinkley indeed. jigsaw i agree quality wise is pretty pants, but i like the drive and energy in it, i made that track in a day

mike

quote:

Originally posted by Mike_Foyle thanks dude, space guitar is the one that everyone thinks is mc prog :/ the original mix is to a certain extent i suppose. the remix of wake me from the inside is the one thats most unique i think.

Don't worry about the hate... your name is mentioned because you are the only person they can think of who will directly respond to the attacks. No more, no less.

We all see the truth. Trance's sound has moved to a place that a vocal minority doesn't like.

Anjunabeats? Geeze I love that label. You can't convince me it's not supporting a great sound.
Kallocain, I kill for you, The Promise, Time to Die, Believe, Alt-f4, Rush, Voller Sterne, Remember, Gravity etc.

That's what it all boils down to. They want to DISMISS the fact that people enjoy all those tracks. They want to badger us day in day out, and make it unpleasant for us to admit to liking those tracks (doesn't mean you personally have to like them).

How could I possibly feel bad about liking any of those tracks? How could anyone possibly want me to feel bad about liking a label whose output is the above?

We hear the tracks... we reap the rewards.

quote:

Originally posted by Durrrtysouth Mike, want a suggestion? copy this post, and post it right by your computor. Let this motivate you. Everytime you are working on a track, read it!! Show these people and when you make ithave a good laugh at them because they will still be sititing in front of their computors posting shit.

haha thanks, made me laugh =)

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright © 2000-2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.