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- Canada - Toronto & Southern Ont.
-- Tory Aurora MP Belinda Stronach crosses the floor to the Grits
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^Most people can't be arsed. It's one of faults for giving an avg joe who doesn't give a damn the power.

quote:

Originally posted by Moral Hazard That is a good question, one that will be answered by the next election I suppose.

Yep. Though if I was in Aurora riding, and if my MP does something that seems to go against what the constituents's wishes are, I'd vote him/her out quit.

I vote for an MP to represent my interest first, then interest of Canada later. It's just way humans work.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 yup...how dare anyone disturb a family bbq for a pesky election.

Again, you're over simplifying this. Not everyone objects to having an election now because they are too lazy to vote or don't want their summer to be pre-occupied with election talk. I would suggest that most people don't want an election now because of the cost and/or they do not believe it is necessary. I'm not saying I agree with them, however, I highly doubt that the majority of Canadians don't want an election because they are worried about how it will effect their plans.

Lets remember that her and harper don't see eye to eye on many issues and she is pretty left wing for a conservative. It is not a stretch for her to make the jump to the liberal party. I think this is just the start of things to come. I bet there is a lot of deception in the ranks within the conservative party and you may see further MPs jump ship.

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Originally posted by Moral Hazard Again, you're over simplifying this. Not everyone objects to having an election now because they are too lazy to vote or don't want their summer to be pre-occupied with election talk. I would suggest that most people don't want an election now because of the cost and/or they do not believe it is necessary. I'm not saying I agree with them, however, I highly doubt that the majority of Canadians don't want an election because they are worried about how it will effect their plans.

Agreed.

The biggest concern for me is the cost of another election....it doesn't matter when the election is I will be there to cast my vote. Face it...we are going to have an election either in the summer or late fall no matter what....let's just hope Canadians can make a decision that will put one party in power.

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Originally posted by AwakenedAddict The people do not want an election, and her choice in switching parties reflects that.

How do you know? Do you have the poll numbers?

As I've said in another thread, people in Canada never want an election (ex. 1997 flood in Manitoba), but they rewarded the party that caused the election anyway.

quote:

Originally posted by starsearcher Even if there WAS an election the Liberals would have won anyway...for fuk's sakes stop wasting tax payers money with this bullshit and do some fucking work...like RUN THE COUNTRY!

We can't afford to keep the Lieberals in office! They've spent or promised top spend $23.5 BILLION in the past 3 weeks!!!!

The cost of an election pales in comparison to what they've wasted or swindled in office.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 yup...how dare anyone disturb a family bbq for a pesky election.

I don't think that the timing of an actual election has anything to do with the majority...they can have it on Xmas for all we care...I think most Canadians want the current government to get things DONE including the Gomery inquiry....

I do agree with you Jay that a new way to govern or a new political process or reform is desperatly needed...I wrote a letter last Friday to the Toronto Sun (which they printed btw) and spoke of my disillusionment of this whole political fiasco...Ever since I can remember, no matter WHO was in power, there has been NO vision & true change in Canada and these clowns (Conservatives or Liberals or whoever) that go to Ottawa fall into that stagnant muck we call Canadian Politics.

quote:

Originally posted by RobbyG. I think most Canadians want the current government to get things DONE including the Gomery inquiry....

The commission will finish up in a couple of weeks, having completed its mandate.

Remember, that commission is just looking into AdScam, NOT the other Lieberal scandals (JudgeScam, Shawinigate, Oil-for-Food, Tsunami relief fraud, etc.)

quote:

my disillusionment of this whole political fiasco...

if you vote the Lieberals out, the fiasco would be over..

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Originally posted by ShadoWolf How do you know? Do you have the poll numbers?

well, no, but apparently you do...

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Originally posted by ShadoWolf As I've said in another thread, people in Canada never want an election

Anyway, I think this whole thing really hurts the Liberals in the long-term more than anyone.

They're a party full of unprincipled corrupt politicians, liars, anti-Americans, and social extremists... and now they have traitors in the party. All the scumbags are now in one party. Letting in an unprincipled traitor is not exactly the move you'd want if you're trying to clean up the image of your party.


edit: they should rename it the Scumbag Party so as not to tarnish the image of principled small-l liberals throughout Canada.

quote:

Originally posted by ShadoWolf if you vote the Lieberals out, the fiasco would be over..

You really believe the Conservative Party propoganda don't you. If we were talking about the Reform Party I would agree that voting for them would be making a big change, however, due to the Conservative's need to acheive acceptance both in the west and Ontario they have become as much a brokerage party as the PCs before them and the Liberals. Putting them into power will just lead to different patrinage appointments and scandals. This is the way that parties operate... everyone needs the help of others to get ahead and then when they succeed it is expected that those who helped will be repaid. You don't think Harper owes people... you'd best bet your ass he does!

quote:

Originally posted by ShadoWolf Anyway, I think this whole thing really hurts the Liberals in the long-term more than anyone. They're a party full of unprincipled corrupt politicians, liars, anti-Americans, and social extremists... and now they have traitors in the party. All the scumbags are now in one party.

Unfortunately, my friend, the general populace does not believe that the members on any other party are any better then the unprincipled corrupt politicians and liars are only in the Liberal Party. The CPC has a problem in that they need to defeat "the devil you know" comfort that people have with the Liberals. I don't think they can do that so long as a "scary man" from the west is leading the party.... maybe if they get a friendly Quebecer in there...

quote:

Originally posted by Moral Hazard You really believe the Conservative Party propoganda don't you. If we were talking about the Reform Party I would agree that voting for them would be making a big change, however, due to the Conservative's need to acheive acceptance both in the west and Ontario they have become as much a brokerage party as the PCs before them and the Liberals. Putting them into power will just lead to different patrinage appointments and scandals. This is the way that parties operate... everyone needs the help of others to get ahead and then when they succeed it is expected that those who helped will be repaid. You don't think Harper owes people... you'd best bet your ass he does!

Hence the reason(s) for my last comment.

quote:

Originally posted by ShadoWolf if you vote the Lieberals out, the fiasco would be over..

Do you honestly believe what you just wrote here ???

quote:

Originally posted by ShadoWolf if you vote the Lieberals out, the fiasco would be over..

One fiasco over and a new one to start...it is amazing how quickly we forget about how much distaste there was for the previous conservative government.

This is the way of politics....one party will always be a target....no matter what.....it is the job of the other parties to point out the failures of the governing party. I think it would be a cold day in hell when one leader goes to another leader and says "hey you are doing a great job.....I couldn't do any better myself"

quote:

Originally posted by ShadoWolf They've spent or promised to spend $23.5 BILLION in the past 3 weeks.

This should concern every person in Canada.

The reason our economy has been healthy in the last number of years is because of our fiscal responsibility, decreasing taxes, balanced budgets and debt repayments.

Mr. Martin's strategy to get through this difficult time has been completely contrary to how he has managed the country's finances in the past 10 years.

PLEASE realize, if Canada gets into a deficit position - times will become increasing difficult and our economy will suffer (the same economy that provides many of us jobs).

quote:

Originally posted by Crazy Serb i think you people need to do something about this or stfu. arguing over this on a message board won't make any difference... either start your own party, run for the parliament, change the rules/laws/whatever, or carry on with your lives as they are

I agree with you Serb, there's not much you can do arguing this over a forum, if you want your thoughts/opinions heard then write a letter to the Liberal party or better yet address it to Stronach herself.

Jay, for the last couple of months all I've been hearing is your
discontent for the Liberal party yet I don't think you've take any pro-action as of yet, just what your ass feels the Canadian gov't should do about the whole sponsorship scandal and now Stronach switching sides. The way I see it if Stronach is really at odds with Harper than I see really no point in her supporting a party that she does not believe in. No offence, but it's time you either put up or shut up.

quote:

Originally posted by ChemEnhanced One fiasco over and a new one to start...it is amazing how quickly we forget about how much distaste there was for the previous conservative government.

What happened to the PC's after the last election?

2 seats.

Out of 301.

They were subsequently reformed and refounded.


That's what needs to happen to the Lieberals.

good...not that surprising since she didn't exactly follow the Conservative party line on more than one issue. I always thought they'd be better off with her as leader than Harper.

Stephen Harper = *owned*

quote:

Originally posted by rabbitjoker This should concern every person in Canada. The reason our economy has been healthy in the last number of years is because of our fiscal responsibility, decreasing taxes, balanced budgets and debt repayments. Mr. Martin's strategy to get through this difficult time has been completely contrary to how he has managed the country's finances in the past 10 years. PLEASE realize, if Canada gets into a deficit position - times will become increasing difficult and our economy will suffer (the same economy that provides many of us jobs).

That is true. The proposed budget with the NDP demands is bad for our economy. I expect there will be hard times to come. It's too bad though, our economy has been doing pretty good these past years.

You should see what the water cooler-talk is at my office...the Stronachs and Magna are our clients! LOL!!!! (oops...that's off-the-record)...oh well I guess her relationship with Peter MacKay in on the ice...(DAMN! WAY TOO MUCH INFO!!! LOL!!!)<---old news

no doubt she's got ambitions of her own...I've not her biggest fan...but I do prefer her to Harper, no question.

She saw an oppportunity...she saw Harper as incompetent to lead the Conservatives to an election win...she bailed.

tacky? yes. potentially cause for concern for her constituents? yes. Will ALL of them be upset? NO. Many people vote for the indiviudual, not the party. She's wouldn't be the first person to bail on her original party and maintain the support of her constituents.

name escapes me...but who jumped from the Liberals to the NDP not too long ago? Same shit...except the timing of this move could sink the Conservative plans to unseat the gov't.

good.

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 ...

x 20 posts in this thread that all amount to "waaaaaaahhhhh..."

if this were going the other way...with a Liberal jumping ship...you'd be chirping a different tune.

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT except the timing of this move could sink the Conservative plans to unseat the gov't.

I don't think she would have changed parties if she thought that the Conservatives had a chance at winning an election. In fact, the conservative election drive has been losing steam for a while. This move is probably an attempt by Stronach to gain more political clout (ie: joining the largest party in a time of need, where her help would indirectly maintain the liberal majority). Stronach probably sees a greener future in the liberal party.. I wouldn't bet on it though.

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