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-- Leakers
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quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ and i have huge standards these days

Bulls**t, i heard about you taking home that 40 year old slag the other week.

wait a minute wait a minute. slow down. what are you trying to say? and what is G&D? never heard of it.

quote:

Originally posted by stamper Bulls**t, i heard about you taking home that 40 year old slag the other week.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Tunaboy wait a minute wait a minute. slow down. what are you trying to say? and what is G&D? never heard of it.

Gabriel & Dresden

.........and you've been on this site for how long?

quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ It's a vicious circle. You could say that the standard of tunes has gone down (as I do) which means I buy less simply because I'm not going to buy tunes I have no intention of ever playing, that would be a waste of money, and a lot of my money goes on other forms of EDM or Rock music now instead of trance. Secondly, there are those who never buy after downloading, but that number should be offset against those who have actually used p2p or the internet to actually discover artists, eg yourself. Would any of us know who you were without the net ? no, and that goes for a lot of people.

argument's been covered shitloads of times before, and i don't think he's ever going to see the other side of the picture.

quote:

Originally posted by Demoted Gabriel & Dresden .........and you've been on this site for how long?

not everyone who's been regged here has followed every single fad/aritst emergence or whatnot, there are some who'll have been away for times & missed stuff.

quote:

Originally posted by isoterra argument's been covered shitloads of times before, and i don't think he's ever going to see the other side of the picture.

aye, I think he's gotta take a look in the mirror & ask himself "would anyone (labels & ppl) know who i was without the internet or p2p"

I also wonder what he thinks about ppl who've downloaded his tunes & gone on to buy them ?

quote:

Originally posted by DC- Sales have went down globally, not just trance, but music in general. What could have caused such a big change, perhaps the increase in P2P activity? I know know that it has affected trance considerably becuase I happen to get information on how much lables are selling these days, and the numbers are anything but impressive.

Maybe thats because they release shite music that no one wants to buy? Must be something other than P2P because in the UK at least album sales reached an all time high 2 years ago & have been further increasing since then, as far as i know anyway.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Clarke Maybe thats because they release shite music that no one wants to buy? Must be something other than P2P because in the UK at least album sales reached an all time high 2 years ago & have been further increasing since then, as far as i know anyway.

their argument is that vinyl sales are falling. Maybe people like me aren't buying as many trance ones, but that's because of how piss-poor some of these tracks are, not because I just want to download everything instead, but they seem to fail to see the point, like your mate 'fresh prince' they can never see the error in their ways

quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ their argument is that vinyl sales are falling. Maybe people like me aren't buying as many trance ones, but that's because of how piss-poor some of these tracks are, not because I just want to download everything instead, but they seem to fail to see the point, like your mate 'fresh prince' they can never see the error in their ways

Again that argument is totally false. Bands like razorlight & bloc party etc, however shite i think they may be, are now selling bucketloads of 7" vinyls when in the past that just wouldnt have happened. People just dont want to buy 'shit trance' anymore, and shit trance labels need to grasp that and stop looking to play the blame game.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Clarke Again that argument is totally false. Bands like razorlight & bloc party etc, however shite i think they may be, are now selling bucketloads of 7" vinyls when in the past that just wouldnt have happened. People just dont want to buy 'shit trance' anymore, and shit trance labels need to grasp that and stop looking to play the blame game.

I didn't mean sales on the whole were dropping, just in this kinda genre. I know enough people who're still buying more stuff than ever, just in different styles, so these people who're trying to sell us the music we don't like are moaning cos the new-generation of trance fans (ie. mainly kids or americans) don't buy the plastic how the previous one did. If they concentrated on making quality music, then some of us would buy their stuff again. It's just ignorance on their part that they think the whole music scene is doing badly

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Clarke Maybe thats because they release shite music that no one wants to buy? Must be something other than P2P because in the UK at least album sales reached an all time high 2 years ago & have been further increasing since then, as far as i know anyway.

true, but it is so much more easy to blame it on mp3...

So so easy to blame mp3s...

Re: Leakers

quote:

Originally posted by Tayfoon How can you fucks do it ? does it make u feel all fuzzy inside knowing that youre the one who leaked the new G&D production, or some new Schulz remix ? What gain do you get from this ? Money ? Sluts ? what is it ? What can drive you to do shit like this ? I want to hear from leakers on this subject, as I know there are quite a few on this board Discuss

Since no one wrote it...
I like to think I know a fair deal on the subject, not that I implicate me in any way I just happen to know what's going on. Ever heard of "the scene"?
It's a wonderful little underground world where people/groups exchange pirated goods via ftp servers, there's a hierarchy of positions and lots to do around there in order to leak something.
I won't bother you with gritty details, suffice to say is that for as how much you give you receive back trifold or more.
There's other things than just music exchange going on, think movies, games, programs, anything that can be copied.
It's really just well structured exchange unlike anarchistic p2p for example. To think there's something personal behind these peoples' actions would be idealistic. The only "personal" bit comes between rivalry and competition these people go through to deliver the "release" first.

Things to know though, most if not all involved don't condone p2p, and "release" things with intent to keep it in the "community".
Most if not all urge people to buy artists works if they like them.
And most if not all don't do it for money. I'd say they're actually helping artists get exposed and thus improve their sales.

i was going to post something about my thoughts on the subject but then i remembered that "arguing on the internet is retarded"-gif. but i did find some numbers on riaa's website. i'm not going to talk about the decline in sales but i was just suprised to see that "Cassette Singles" were still being sold in 2002 ??

RIAA 2004 year end stats

I've never even seen a cassette single but what stupid label decided to release something on a cassette in 2002? and a single!?

good luck with your argument..

i havent bought a single brand new trance track since i bought my vinyl decks year and a half ago says it all really i used to be really into trance aswell u cant blame p2p software for that trance is just a load of shit i moved on to other genres now.

Touche! I have to agree with everything that Ian^ said, cause that's what I think too!

Look at me - I used to download a lot of music and still do - but I a also buy what I like - I've got close to 700 CDs now, mostly EDM. And that number goes up every week

quote:

Originally posted by Ian^ aye, I think he's gotta take a look in the mirror & ask himself "would anyone (labels & ppl) know who i was without the internet or p2p" I also wonder what he thinks about ppl who've downloaded his tunes & gone on to buy them ?

I'll be the first person to admit that trance is where it is today becuase of the internet, that is indeed how I found out about it myself, BUT, it has gone completely the other way around now. It is doing nothing but hurting it.

What do I think about people who download then buy? I respect people like that, but unfortunately they are a minority. The reason why I am even making this thing an issue is because people have this notion that they do not hurt the artists, trance artists in particular, but when you are talking about quantities of 100's and occasionally 1000s of sales, you indeed are hurting it, especially lame sites that illegally sell mp3s. I do not understand the mentality of people who buy tracks off sites like those...

The issue has been beaten to death and back and some people just won't change their views.

quote:

Originally posted by DC- It is doing nothing but hurting it.

Prove it.

quote:

What do I think about people who download then buy? I respect people like that, but unfortunately they are a minority.

Prove it.

quote:

when you are talking about quantities of 100's and occasionally 1000s of sales, you indeed are hurting it,

Prove it.





Well, my work is done.

Before i'm willing to buy a track I want to listen to it. Just like before I buy an album i want to listen to it. I don't want to listen to shit quality short clip either i want the full song and if i like it i'll track it down and buy it. Most people i know do the exact same thing. I wouldn't know about half the artists and or labels if I didn't have tracklists from live mixes, listen to artists other stuff etc.

This has gone a different way then i expected

Im not talking about sharing released tracks as we all know that is going to happen anyway

Im talking about tunes, that arent signed to labels, or arent even out on promo

If you want to listen to a track before you buy it, good, download it when its out and then decide , but we all know that leaking a track months before its release date HURTS THE RELEASE SIGNIFICANTLY

quote:

Originally posted by Aiwendil Prove it. Prove it. Prove it. Well, my work is done.

haha

first time i've agreed with one of your posts in eons

quote:

Originally posted by Tayfoon This has gone a different way then i expected

and a better one. Keep it up

when you get sent shit you gotta keep it for yourself. There is no excuse for sending stuff to your friends.

BTW, isnt it 100 times cooler to play/spin a tune, that no-one else has?

There are a fair few issues here.

1) MP3's have helped over many years the popularity of artists, distribution to foreign countries like America, South America and outer Europe has been very poor in the last few years, though has now improved, so how were Trance DJ's meant to be able to spin decent new material if it wasnt being distributed to them because the Record Shops in those countries didnt know any better than to stock a load of sh-t? Since the introduction of Online MP3 stores this situation has greatly improved for those who had not been previously able to get the tracks without having to resort to downloading via free mp3 websites that no longer exist (such as shadow-zone etc) or through p2p, though the choice of online mp3 material could be improved quite considerably, that is down to all the record labels.

2) One central site should be created that links to Audiojelly and others, Im sure Im not the first to wonder what site a certain track is on, wouldnt it be great if anyone could go "hey, I'd like Jonas Steur - Castamara" and a tool would look up all of the 'legal' mp3 sites and come back with a price for each site that has it, this is something I feel is missing, we need tool similar to Kelkoo but for legal online mp3 shops!!

3) Record labels and the artists need to take more care to ensure that the material gets in the right hands and there is a certain level of trust with those people. I know someone that gets a lot of a certain artists new material months before its sees the light of day on vinyl or 'legal' mp3, and this individual is involved in 'the scene'....

4) Perhaps a solution for 3) would be the approach that Monster Tunes currently take, I know some of you will slag me off for mentioning Monster Tunes, seeing as I have been a little helper with them here and there, but they are an example of what all record labels should be doing!

Monster Tunes send out samplers of all their new material to DJ's all over the world with 6-8 tracks per CD every couple of months. The tracks on the CDs fade in and out, which is a bloody good move if you ask me. Think of it this way, you receive a CD Sampler in the post and think 'great, I'm gonna release this to the scene, OMFG!!! leech...' then you play the CD and see that the tracks fade in and out, therefore rendering them useless for the scene, because nobody really wants a track for illegal purposes if its not in its entirety, there are also certain scene rules that have strict instruction not to allow faded mp3s to be released and instead they get 'nuked'.
That's some clever stuff if you ask me, the Samplers wont be useless however as DJ's can still use them to spin on Online Radio or in clubs etc. This is what every record label who distributes their material should be doing!!! A similar approach is needed for 'Promo vinyls' - fade them in and out, but only copies that get distributed to artists and dj's, not to record shops for people to buy.

There are so many things that are wrong with how the industry & mp3 scene (whether it be legal or illegal) act at the moment:

a) Promo vinyls should be distributed only to artists and dj's but in a cut format, fade in and fade out and not sold at a price.

b) Record shops are only sent full releases of new tunes, which record labels should release sooner than they currently do.

c) Record labels should professionally rip most of their back catalogue and make it available to online mp3 stores such as Audiojelly.

It's so easy for labels and others to blame the illegal sharing of mp3s on everything, but that is utter bullshit. Maybe the scene has changed over the years which I am not fully aware of but the way things used to be is there was very poor distribution, no online legal mp3 stores, or there were but VERY little selection, do you guys feel the same way as I do that the record labels and artists are partially to blame, they are a few years too late on the online mp3 thing, that should have been done a long time ago, maybe some labels would still be around? how it took until late '03 / early '04 for these sites such as audiojelly to start is beyond me.

I hope I havent gone round in circles on this issue.

Cheers,

Simon

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