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-- Tips & Low Prices, or No Tips & Higher Prices
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Originally posted by Cosmic Fur Oh! Well that certainly makes bribery legal now, doesn't it?

bribery is when someone gives you money upfront to perform a task that you wouldnt otherwise do.
What i'm talking about is depending on the tip given the service will be that much perfect, where when you dont tip you still get service and its still good but not the same. It is common sense when you know if you'll be making more money you'll make sure their service is perfect rather than the people that tip you a toonie.

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict Yes, now stop being cheap and "bribe" your server.. you might get some better service. You talk about free markets with respect to server's wages, but you can't understand this concept? Service follows money, tip a little.. and get little service.

Well, it looks like I've finally found my answer: we are strongly encouraged to tip in restaurants because it opens the window to bribery.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go and speed on the highway until the fist cop pulls me over, and then "tip" the fella for doing such a bang-up job on catching speeders. Wish me luck!

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go and speed on the highway until the fist cop pulls me over, and then "tip" the fella for doing such a bang-up job on catching speeders. Wish me luck!

I'm sorry dude, but that is quite an ill-fitted comparison! If you are going to be a smart-ass do it right at least.

There is no comparison by the privately-sought service provided in a restaurant/bar and the PUBLIC service that cops provide.

PS: what do you have against bribery? It's not even illegal in most instances.

last time i checked tipping did not = bribery.

I hate to say it, but I am leaning towards agreeing that servers shuold just be paid a higher wage, and scrap the tipping system... because seriously, people will tip what they want to tip, and it's usually regardless of the service they receive.

Jeff (Floorwhore) does it right, but trust me when I tell you he is in the minority on this.

I personally would rather go to my server job KNOWING I'm going to make 15%, rather than leaving it to chance...

The restaurants will NEVER go for it though. because the government would download it to them to pay out the extra. Probably through a percentage of pay based on sales, like a commission, and restaurants don't care a LICK what a server makes in tips. trust me.

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur Well, it looks like I've finally found my answer: we are strongly encouraged to tip in restaurants because it opens the window to bribery. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go and speed on the highway until the fist cop pulls me over, and then "tip" the fella for doing such a bang-up job on catching speeders. Wish me luck!

Heh heh... THIS is funny. Let me know how that works out for you!

I work as a bartender in a restaurant, where there is no mandatory tip-out from the servers. Its complete crap. Theres 2 of us on a friday/saturday/sunday night, taking care of ALL the servers, alll the drinks for all their tables and at the end of the night, we get what they "think" is reasonable. Some dont at all. So we keep track. We keep track of who tips us good, who tips us shit, and who doesnt tip at all. When theres a LONG ass list of chits waitin to be made, well go glance thru them quickly. High tippers that take care of us get priority...those who dont tip out, well sucks to be them because they have to wait. And the quality of the drinks is not as good either. Its the same principle. Good tips get good service. Some drinks dont come up on our chits, so they have to ask us for them when they come to the window. I will go as far as to BLATANTLY ignore the servers that dont tip out at first, taking care of those who do. I wish I knew what was going thru the servers minds when they dont tip out at the end of their shift. I want to see them work one shift on a busy night and do what we do and see how they make out. Theyd probably have a mental break down half way thru the night.

quote:

Originally posted by geroin last time i checked tipping did not = bribery.

We first, people argued that you tip based on the service you have received and that then harder working servers would get paid more. I refuted saying that if tips weren't mandatory, it would work out to the exactly same thing in terms of the income the server makes.

So now the point of tipping to get better service or special privileges in the future has been brought up, to which I have nothing to say, except for the fact that it is pretty much bribery (you pay extra to get special privileges), except legal bribery because the people getting bribed are not government employees. However, I still consider it an unethical practice.

quote:

Originally posted by tha_broad I work as a bartender in a restaurant, where there is no mandatory tip-out from the servers. Its complete crap. Theres 2 of us on a friday/saturday/sunday night, taking care of ALL the servers, alll the drinks for all their tables and at the end of the night, we get what they "think" is reasonable. Some dont at all. So we keep track. We keep track of who tips us good, who tips us shit, and who doesnt tip at all. When theres a LONG ass list of chits waitin to be made, well go glance thru them quickly. High tippers that take care of us get priority...those who dont tip out, well sucks to be them because they have to wait. And the quality of the drinks is not as good either. Its the same principle. Good tips get good service. Some drinks dont come up on our chits, so they have to ask us for them when they come to the window. I will go as far as to BLATANTLY ignore the servers that dont tip out at first, taking care of those who do. I wish I knew what was going thru the servers minds when they dont tip out at the end of their shift. I want to see them work one shift on a busy night and do what we do and see how they make out. Theyd probably have a mental break down half way thru the night.

that is ridiculous, as the the customer aka your primary reason of employment suffers.Sure the cheaper tippers might make less, but you also might lose customers.Lose enough customers and you just might be out of a job too one day.Its not the patrons fault if the person tipping you out at the end of the night is cheap.

As far as tipping goes, it makes it easier to create employment by lessening the salary burden of the owners.So what if they only opened a bottle or hung up a coat.The fact is someone has to do the job,and if they do it right why not reward for it.I wont tip for shit service,hell if its really bad ill refuse my bill/meal or drinks and walk out.Do your job and i usually tend to tip just a bit more than the tax on the bill(in quebec it comes out to 15%)Go beyond that and it can go more.When i worked as i bartender, i would hustle,listen to problems i couldnt give 2 shits about all night, babysit drunks,make sure people got home ok all with a smile.If you are good about these things i found that the customers generally treated me well, and when they became regulars of mine even better.When i fucked up, i paid the price myself.Its how it should be.
Some people are just cheap, and that will never change.I personally would rather control my own generosity instead of having it forced on me.I also guarantee that without the tipping system more people would get fired, because if not being able to not tip for shit service more people will complain.When you get no tip you may learn from mistakes and work to rectify them.
Cosmic....this aint communist russia

the only reason anyone would think tipping makes sense is if they recieve tips on a regular basis, or have in the past. tipping for excellent service makes sense, but not as a rule, and certainly not a reason to lower their wages.


and the example of strippers doesnt apply to the argument of tipping, because people are essential paying their wage, not tipping them. strippers pay for the ability to use the venue ( strip club) in order to try and make money ( by whatever services they want to provide, lap dance, table dance, just talking etc....)

i work as a cashier at a super market where people can have orders costing over 400 dollers, its my job to be friednly, greet, make chit chat, ring up all the items at a good pace, pack the bags in a way the customer thinks best and so the bags wont rip, lift up heavy items etc.... then if no one is around and the customer requests a carry-out i may have to close my cash register (if its not busy) and help the customer out to the car to put all the items in the trunk.


so tell me do i deserve a tip? guess what my job states im not allowed to accept one......i can easily do an amazing job, or a shitty job etc. i see no difference between this and a waiter or a coat check etc. so which one of u pro tippers would like to tell me why im NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO ACCEPT A TIP when others are expected to recieve tips in order to make up for a lower wage

quote:

Originally posted by Flec the only reason anyone would think tipping makes sense is if they recieve tips on a regular basis, or have in the past. tipping for excellent service makes sense, but not as a rule, and certainly not a reason to lower their wages. and the example of strippers doesnt apply to the argument of tipping, because people are essential paying their wage, not tipping them. strippers pay for the ability to use the venue ( strip club) in order to try and make money ( by whatever services they want to provide, lap dance, table dance, just talking etc....) i work as a cashier at a super market where people can have orders costing over 400 dollers, its my job to be friednly, greet, make chit chat, ring up all the items at a good pace, pack the bags in a way the customer thinks best and so the bags wont rip, lift up heavy items etc.... then if no one is around and the customer requests a carry-out i may have to close my cash register (if its not busy) and help the customer out to the car to put all the items in the trunk. so tell me do i deserve a tip? guess what my job states im not allowed to accept one......i can easily do an amazing job, or a shitty job etc. i see no difference between this and a waiter or a coat check etc. so which one of u pro tippers would like to tell me why im NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO ACCEPT A TIP when others are expected to recieve tips in order to make up for a lower wage

thats funny, because i actually tip the bag boy when i do a huge grocery order and he packs it and helps.

quote:

Originally posted by Flec i work as a cashier at a super market where people can have orders costing over 400 dollers, its my job to be friednly, greet, make chit chat, ring up all the items at a good pace, pack the bags in a way the customer thinks best and so the bags wont rip, lift up heavy items etc.... then if no one is around and the customer requests a carry-out i may have to close my cash register (if its not busy) and help the customer out to the car to put all the items in the trunk. so tell me do i deserve a tip? guess what my job states im not allowed to accept one......i can easily do an amazing job, or a shitty job etc. i see no difference between this and a waiter or a coat check etc. so which one of u pro tippers would like to tell me why im NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO ACCEPT A TIP when others are expected to recieve tips in order to make up for a lower wage

I worked at safeway (grocery store out west and in the states) for 2 years as a bag boy. We weren't allowed to accept tips either, bollocks!

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur We first, people argued that you tip based on the service you have received and that then harder working servers would get paid more. I refuted saying that if tips weren't mandatory, it would work out to the exactly same thing in terms of the income the server makes. So now the point of tipping to get better service or special privileges in the future has been brought up, to which I have nothing to say, except for the fact that it is pretty much bribery (you pay extra to get special privileges), except legal bribery because the people getting bribed are not government employees. However, I still consider it an unethical practice.

legal bribery does not exist, bribery is illegal and i would not accept a bribe. I work for my money, people that take bribes usually don't work their money. Example would be: a bouncer at a club so you get in with no line (he is not a government worker). What you keep mentioning is that a tip to get a better service is a bribe and that is wrong. Again its common sense, when you make more money off one table rather than another you will work harder for it and give them a topnotch service rather than a person that treats you like shit and tips you a toonie.

Second Cup cup sizes

Second cup has increased there cup sizes, before it was a large now that comes in an extra large cup and it cost 35cent more!

GOD DAMN coffee consumers! it's no logner a cheap *drug*!

This has been a very interesting read. Personally, I feel that no matter if I'm at a bar or resturant if I get good service, then tipping good is mandatory. I have absolutely no problem what so ever tipping 20-25% for good service, I have even tipped upwards of 40% when shown great service.

Honestly, if you've been serving us for a couple hours and doing a really good job at it allowing us to have the good time that we came there for, we really appreciate it and I'd like to thank you for it.

My rule of thumb is:
1) 5% if we get seated and served in a decent amount of time.
2) 10% if your polite and courtous. (to me nothing is worse then a rude server)
3) 5% if you regulary check in on us.
4) 5% if our order is as it was ordered.
5) 10-15% bonus just for allowing us to have a great time.

If you can't tell I tip very good and there is a reason that I do. When we go to the same place and have tipped generously we get accomodated. Be it faster seating, free drinks, preferred tables, what ever it is it doesn't matter. They show that they appreciate us as their guests and we in turn show that we appreciate their service.

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Originally posted by all-nite-freak that is ridiculous, as the the customer aka your primary reason of employment suffers.Sure the cheaper tippers might make less, but you also might lose customers.Lose enough customers and you just might be out of a job too one day.Its not the patrons fault if the person tipping you out at the end of the night is cheap. As far as tipping goes, it makes it easier to create employment by lessening the salary burden of the owners.So what if they only opened a bottle or hung up a coat.The fact is someone has to do the job,and if they do it right why not reward for it.I wont tip for shit service,hell if its really bad ill refuse my bill/meal or drinks and walk out.Do your job and i usually tend to tip just a bit more than the tax on the bill(in quebec it comes out to 15%)Go beyond that and it can go more.When i worked as i bartender, i would hustle,listen to problems i couldnt give 2 shits about all night, babysit drunks,make sure people got home ok all with a smile.If you are good about these things i found that the customers generally treated me well, and when they became regulars of mine even better.When i fucked up, i paid the price myself.Its how it should be. Some people are just cheap, and that will never change.I personally would rather control my own generosity instead of having it forced on me.I also guarantee that without the tipping system more people would get fired, because if not being able to not tip for shit service more people will complain.When you get no tip you may learn from mistakes and work to rectify them. Cosmic....this aint communist russia

It doesnt matter to me this way.....if the server that doesnt tip me out takes forever in delivering the drink, they end up getting a bad tip...in the end it doesnt matter to me because bad or not, I dont get any of it whatsoever anyways. Its a Matter of respect. These servers get tips from their customers for the drinks that I make and I garnish, and they dont give me my cut??? forget that. Why am I going to give EXTRA good service for something THEY get rewarded for in the end when its something I DID...and they dont tip ME out??? meh! I take care of my customers first and foremost, then the servers that tip me out, THEN those who dont. What I do for them as a bartender is exactly that. They expect to be tipped out for the service they provide, then they should expect to be tipping out for the service provided for them....If they get good service, They should expect to have to tip out...If we were shitty bartenders, Id understand but we arent. We work our asses off for them.

The general rule of thumb "Take care of those who take care of you" If you dont, I dont either.

i always tip, even with bad service. But I let them know my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by malek i always tip, even with bad service. But I let them know my opinion.

That right there my friends is awesomeness. If you can tip and at the same time give an opinion in a constructive criticism sort of way, thats awesome. That not only makes the server feel good, but it gives her/him tips on what he did wrong, where to improve. Malek, Kudos, my friend!

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Originally posted by tha_broad The general rule of thumb "Take care of those who take care of you" If you dont, I dont either.

I couldn't have put it any better.

LOL

this would be so funny if it wasnt so fucking sad.

you dont think nobody deserves tips?

good for you, stop explaining yourself cause whatever you say now it aint gonna make you look any better.

we talk here about 4-5-6 $ tip for somebody who's making 6 $ an hour.

4-5-6 $ is one fucking battle of water !

with all due respect to all of youse, of course. when i go out i wanna have fun. do i think about about 4-5-6 $ ??? its a fucking change in your pocket, at the end of the nigh it aint gonna make any difference to me, every person working in the entertainment industry deserves that tip cause they are making SHIT.

quote:

The general rule of thumb "Take care of those who take care of you" If you dont, I dont either.

hehe, its so simple but....

p.s. this post goes to all of you with all due respect. i dont wanna flame anybody but do you know how do you sound asking all these questions????






"smallest fucking violine...."

quote:

Originally posted by Hantu If you can't tell I tip very good and there is a reason that I do. When we go to the same place and have tipped generously we get accomodated. Be it faster seating, free drinks, preferred tables, what ever it is it doesn't matter. They show that they appreciate us as their guests and we in turn show that we appreciate their service.

Amen.
this is the answer to all your questions

quote:

Originally posted by Enraptured Actually... you would think so... but the longer I do this, the more I realize that people will tip EXACTLY what they were going to tip, more or less regardless of the service they receive. I've had nights where I KICK ASS with a table, and they LOVE me, fill out a GREAT comment card, and even talk to my MANAGER about what a GREAT NIGHT they had, and then tip 10%. Alternately, there are people who complain incessantly, send things back, and are generally bitchy about everything, and then tip 20%. It happens too often to be a coincedence.

I am a server as well. You hit the nail on the head! It always amazes me when a table you think isnt impressed with the service tips well.

At the restaurant I work at I have to pay 3% of my total sales as tipout, this money goes to the kitchen and bar tenders. If a table tips 10%, that only leaves me with 7%.

quote:

Originally posted by tha_broad I work as a bartender in a restaurant, where there is no mandatory tip-out from the servers. Its complete crap. Theres 2 of us on a friday/saturday/sunday night, taking care of ALL the servers, alll the drinks for all their tables and at the end of the night, we get what they "think" is reasonable. Some dont at all. So we keep track. We keep track of who tips us good, who tips us shit, and who doesnt tip at all. When theres a LONG ass list of chits waitin to be made, well go glance thru them quickly. High tippers that take care of us get priority...those who dont tip out, well sucks to be them because they have to wait. And the quality of the drinks is not as good either. Its the same principle. Good tips get good service. Some drinks dont come up on our chits, so they have to ask us for them when they come to the window. I will go as far as to BLATANTLY ignore the servers that dont tip out at first, taking care of those who do. I wish I knew what was going thru the servers minds when they dont tip out at the end of their shift. I want to see them work one shift on a busy night and do what we do and see how they make out. Theyd probably have a mental break down half way thru the night.

The bar tenders definitly deserve tipout, we couldnt do it without them.

quote:

Originally posted by simms327 ^^ its crap though, cause you in the coat check do exactly what cosmic_fur says you do. take a coat, and hang it up. whoop de fuckign do i worked in a kitchen in a busy restaurant, and the kitchen got 10% of the total monthly tips (and thats even if the waiters reported it). we worked WAY harder than the prissy short skirt-ed boobs hanging out smiling waitresses and got paid the same. A junior line cook makes the same as waiting staff (At least in BC) next time you are in a restaruant and get good service, think about the people making the food - thats a MUCH tougher job than the waitress. the waitress/waiter just smiles and brings it to you.

+1 to that.

quote:

Originally posted by tha_broad It doesnt matter to me this way.....if the server that doesnt tip me out takes forever in delivering the drink, they end up getting a bad tip...in the end it doesnt matter to me because bad or not, I dont get any of it whatsoever anyways. Its a Matter of respect. These servers get tips from their customers for the drinks that I make and I garnish, and they dont give me my cut??? forget that. Why am I going to give EXTRA good service for something THEY get rewarded for in the end when its something I DID...and they dont tip ME out??? meh! I take care of my customers first and foremost, then the servers that tip me out, THEN those who dont. What I do for them as a bartender is exactly that. They expect to be tipped out for the service they provide, then they should expect to be tipping out for the service provided for them....If they get good service, They should expect to have to tip out...If we were shitty bartenders, Id understand but we arent. We work our asses off for them. The general rule of thumb "Take care of those who take care of you" If you dont, I dont either.

And without tips, there wouldn't be any of these problems either.

On another note, since we've pretty much decided that you tip to get better service next time; that means if I don't go to restaurants often enough for them to remember me, I don't have to tip at all. If I spread my eating out over enough restaurants, they won't remember me at any particular one, and I won't ever have to tip. Or, if I'm on vacation and I know I won't ever go to this restaurant again, same deal; no point in tipping - there won't be any next time for me, so why tip? See how well tipping works out for the servers?

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