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-- Money in music
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We love to produce but obviously we don't want to have cracking tracks out there being played by the best dj's in the world while we have enough money to not even buy a crappy old car, rent a house, or have the best clothes but still have the passion for creating music.

Musicians over the years have just abused themselves, they've fallen head ove heels with music and have become suck-ups to get a release by a big name, they get milked dry, see $0 while some fat cat is making all our money....WHY...cos we were too dumb and blinded by our passion.

and one question for steve allen ?

Do u produce every minute, see hardly any money and still live a good life ?

As someone mentioned it, you either have rich parents or I think maybe you inherited a fortune, otherwise i can't see you paying for filling fuel in your car to a trip to your nearest mall (No attack on you is made, just I think theres more to your story )

From limited experience and a lot of conversations....

In short, you'll never make money from just releasing trance tunes. You need to see music as an entire lifestyle choice. That is, you need to turn your hand to DJing, producing multiple styles, random engineering work for bands, live sound, setting up a studio and charging for its use, maybe lease a bar and locate the studio round the back, set up a label, remix everything you release, etc etc. And spend a lot of time generally getting to know people on the scene. Like any self-emplyed person, there's a lot of networking involved.

The really big names (Tiesto, Van Dyk, Sasha etc al) were there at the beginning and there are still no signs of any new "really big names" appearing. The market can't support it. SO forget getting rich You've just got to love it and want to immerse yourself in it! It's what it's all about. It's possible to make a career and live off it, but you've got to be clever. And willing to be a bit poor!

And never stop loving the tunes.

Well, this might be a little bit of topic, but in my point of view as far as producing, i only do it as a really fun hobby. I have a fulltime job that im really saticfied with and im about to start my own company.

Before, i really thought that i wanted to work with music 24-7, but i realised that im happy the way thing are now, to be able to deside when, where and how i want it. Its like terapi after a long day at work, and i think that if i was to work with it every day, i wouldnt enjoy it in the same way like i do today. But i still want my stuff to get signed and heard, and if it generates in some extra "pocket cash" on the side, im happy. That only shows that some people are willing to pay some to hear my music, and that my friends is satisfaction enough for me!

Just how want it to be, and soorry if it was a bit off topic.

Cheers
C

I hear ya substorm. My goal is to make enough money to put back into production, so I can buy hardware and software, ect. So how do you get paid to do remixes? I mean who wants this sort of thing, and how do they find you? Are we talking about winning remix contests? Also, I know it's a basic question, but how do you get signed to a major label? Sending demos out just sounds like a waste of time. From what I understand, from talking to a few DJ/producers, you have to build a name for yourself before any major label will even talk to you.

OK, anyways, for you here who have made more than a few bucks from production, and have had vinyl releases and all, what was your path to success? Your history? How did it all happen?

Hey Steve Allen, I know who you are. I'm working with Enoise too. Your Open Gates EP is great, and you are blowing us all away in sales. I looked at a recent sales report for Enoise. OK, you give us all hope And your strong release gives Enoise more credibilty. I'll soon be releasing an EP through Enoise, if I sell half as many as you, I'll be happy.

quote:

Originally posted by zodiac9 So how do you get paid to do remixes? I mean who wants this sort of thing, and how do they find you? Are we talking about winning remix contests? Also, I know it's a basic question, but how do you get signed to a major label? Sending demos out just sounds like a waste of time. OK, anyways, for you here who have made more than a few bucks from production, and have had vinyl releases and all, what was your path to success? Your history? How did it all happen.

As far as my experience goes, i would say that sending demos isnt a waste of time zodiax9. Yes there are many labels that doesnt answer to your submitions, but i have got some really nice feedbacks from majore labels on some of my tracks, that has helped on what i need to think of and what kinda of tracks that most labels are looking for. So send out demos when you think you have a good track, you have nothing to loose!

However, there are two sides of it, one might be negative and the other positive. If you send a demo to, let say Somatic Sense, and they thing its like really shitty, so the next time you send a dem to them, they might remeber you as a "shitty" producer, but if its the other way around, that its a good production, but its maybe not what they are looking for at the moment, they will probobly tell you so and give you aome feedback, and would like you to send other stuff to them in the future!

Regarding remixing. I dont have that much of experience in remixing, but i did join a remix contest on T.nu(not released yet), which i won, so i hope that it will open some new doors for me! Another thing is that if you get a signed track on a label, it much easyer to get some remix missions, cus then you have at least one foot inside the music world, and you can start making some connections. After my second singed track, i got the question from the label, if i was open for remixing if i got the offer!

So thats my experience. I havnt started getting any money on music yet, cus all my tracks hasnt been released yet, so i havet got anything to offer you in that matter!

Cheers
C

Trance is not dead but the trance scene is. A few people here have posted saying trance is more and more moving into house. Absolutely. You will find most of the past big shot producers have evolved with the current scene. Paul Oakenfold, Paul Van dyke, Pete Tong, all at a time played nothing but trance when it was the dance music of choice. Now what do they produce or remix? Mainly House.

Making a career in music is like being the tea boy in an office. You start at the bottom, nobody knows or likely respects you but you gradually work your way up bit by bit, gaining recognition for your abilities and learning new skills untill one day your the director of the firm. Or.. In the case of a music career an established trance DJ. How much you get paid works exactly the same way.

I love trance music and its a shame it died out commercially the way it did to be pushed out of the way by house music in clubs.

I engineered a progressive house track once as a challenge and i swear it sounded immense, in places better than my trance but it was never finished as my heart isnt in house.

If your in it 'for the money' and want to build a reputation fast (if your good!) I would suggest working with music that is currently on the scene i.e Funky/Dirty Electro/progressive house

quote:

Originally posted by -MCLAIN- Trance is not dead but the trance scene is. A few people here have posted saying trance is more and more moving into house. Absolutely. You will find most of the past big shot producers have evolved with the current scene. Paul Oakenfold, Paul Van dyke, Pete Tong, all at a time played nothing but trance when it was the dance music of choice. Now what do they produce or remix? Mainly House. Making a career in music is like being the tea boy in an office. You start at the bottom, nobody knows or likely respects you but you gradually work your way up bit by bit, gaining recognition for your abilities and learning new skills untill one day your the director of the firm. Or.. In the case of a music career an established trance DJ. How much you get paid works exactly the same way. I love trance music and its a shame it died out commercially the way it did to be pushed out of the way by house music in clubs. I engineered a progressive house track once as a challenge and i swear it sounded immense, in places better than my trance but it was never finished as my heart isnt in house. If your in it 'for the money' and want to build a reputation fast (if your good!) I would suggest working with music that is currently on the scene i.e Funky/Dirty Electro/progressive house

ugh... let's go back to 1999!

perhaps the year will be 2009, a resurgance

quote:

Originally posted by -MCLAIN- Trance is not dead but the trance scene is. A few people here have posted saying trance is more and more moving into house. Absolutely. You will find most of the past big shot producers have evolved with the current scene. Paul Oakenfold, Paul Van dyke, Pete Tong, all at a time played nothing but trance when it was the dance music of choice. Now what do they produce or remix? Mainly House. Making a career in music is like being the tea boy in an office. You start at the bottom, nobody knows or likely respects you but you gradually work your way up bit by bit, gaining recognition for your abilities and learning new skills untill one day your the director of the firm. Or.. In the case of a music career an established trance DJ. How much you get paid works exactly the same way. I love trance music and its a shame it died out commercially the way it did to be pushed out of the way by house music in clubs. I engineered a progressive house track once as a challenge and i swear it sounded immense, in places better than my trance but it was never finished as my heart isnt in house. If your in it 'for the money' and want to build a reputation fast (if your good!) I would suggest working with music that is currently on the scene i.e Funky/Dirty Electro/progressive house

its dyk! jesus he's not a lesbian.

jsut because its not commercial doesnt mean its shit or dying out its better the way it is as there is less and less cheese everyday.
oakenfold and tong yes have geared towards house but pvd is still very tech/trance as he has always been. if he does a warm up set he would play prog but what dj doesnt play that for a warm up.

quote:

Originally posted by djillicit ugh... let's go back to 1999!

Is that meant to mean something?

I did say the scene was dead didnt I? And I did say House music is current didnt I? If you are referring to the strong trance music industry in general, thinking there isnt one then I think we might have a mental problem.

quote:

Originally posted by dj_kane its dyk! jesus he's not a lesbian.

Lol dj_kane, I have seen it misspelled so many times now (even on online record stores) and its pickled my head. Like Scott (Scot) Project. My bad.

Substorm, thanks for detailing your experiences. I suppose I should start at least thinking about sending some demos out. I think I want a little more producing experience under my belt first. I'm on a digital label right now, it's a start. Every once in a while they submit tracks to Armin and he listens to them, so there's at least one avenue open to me.

I'm starting to wonder if I should switch styles, my next project is going to be leaning heavily toward progressive trance. That's still Trance though, of course. I like some of the progressive house and deep house, and I'm sure I could produce those styles, but my heart just wouldn't be into it. Plus, I don't listen to enough of it to really understand those styles. I get bored of it all pretty quickly. I don't like Techno at all, so that's out of the question.

I've started a little side project, composing and producing music for media productions, mainly Indie films. It's something I've always wanted to do, and I think there's more money in that than Trance.

quote:

Originally posted by zodiac9 I'm starting to wonder if I should switch styles, my next project is going to be leaning heavily toward progressive trance. That's still Trance though, of course. I like some of the progressive house and deep house, and I'm sure I could produce those styles, but my heart just wouldn't be into it. Plus, I don't listen to enough of it to really understand those styles. I get bored of it all pretty quickly. I don't like Techno at all, so that's out of the question.

i was the same i started making a prog house track and even though it was going well half way through it i said to myself i dont want to do this. i only feel satisfaction when i produce uplifting trance. techno like you i hate. if theres no money to be made in uplifting trance then so be it at least ill have the satisifaction in myself that i produced for me and not the money.

quote:

Originally posted by zodiac9 I'm starting to wonder if I should switch styles, my next project is going to be leaning heavily toward progressive trance. That's still Trance though, of course. I like some of the progressive house and deep house, and I'm sure I could produce those styles, but my heart just wouldn't be into it. Plus, I don't listen to enough of it to really understand those styles. I get bored of it all pretty quickly. I don't like Techno at all, so that's out of the question.

Im on exactly the same boat as you. I want to be able to enjoy house, saying as its so popular and especially would like to be able to produce house on an on-going basis but I dont really know the style all that well and whats expected as I just dont listen to it really.

Im scared that in order to produce house and make it sound professional I will have to go back to basics nearly, forgetting all the traditional styles of engineering trance to sound good and go on a whole new learning curve of listening to and understanding how good house sounds and being able to make a creation of my own.

No doubt would I have to start listening to tonnes of current house tracks and start appreciating them and listening to the 'style' before I could really get into the producing side of it.

DJ_Kane, I also find no real satisfaction in producing trance unless at least I find its Uplifting/Epic on the end result with incredible buildups/breakdowns, sweeping pads and killer leads etc.

Would it be possible to listen to any of your work?

Cheers

in my footer theres a link to my new track and my myspace page where you can listen to other tracks.

quote:

Originally posted by dj_kane i was the same i started making a prog house track and even though it was going well half way through it i said to myself i dont want to do this...

yeah, i did that once too... then i got bored. "fuckin a, this is too slow!" sometimes i do slip into a prog house mood though...

So what are your weapons of mass distraction then? (Tools in this case ) I know VEC is one because i know that distorted vocal sample you used in Mystify a mile away, used it myself in a project. That and a couple other samples

What sampler you running? Any Hardware?

Your musics good by the way

quote:

Originally posted by djillicit yeah, i did that once too... then i got bored. "fuckin a, this is too slow!" sometimes i do slip into a prog house mood though...

if it isnt something that im going to dance to while im mixing and i no i wont get a crowd reaction to it then i cant make it. i find prog much easier to produce but to hear a powerful uplifting track and seeing people dance to it is much more enjoyable to me.

Kane, Volo Dimitto sounds powerful but sounds extremely distorted is that just the MySpace player? I could definately appreciate this track like if it wasnt for the myspace distortion.

quote:

Originally posted by -MCLAIN- So what are your weapons of mass distraction then? (Tools in this case ) I know VEC is one because i know that distorted vocal sample you used in Mystify a mile away, used it myself in a project. That and a couple other samples What sampler you running? Any Hardware? Your musics good by the way

cubase sx, reason 3.0, jp8000 synth, vsts - albino, v station, z3ta, vanguard, synth1, fm7 and a few others. for fx i use the vec samples plus i make my own with the jp8000.

quote:

Originally posted by -MCLAIN- Kane, Volo Dimitto sounds powerful but sounds extremely distorted is that just the MySpace player? I could definately appreciate this track like if it wasnt for the myspace distortion.

the myspace player makes everything sound like shit because i upload 128 kbps versions then myspace compress them again. theres a couple of djs playing volo dimitto (no one big though) and it was on a dublin trance radio. might try and fix it up and send it to labels.

quote:

Originally posted by dj_kane cubase sx, reason 3.0, jp8000 synth, vsts - albino, v station, z3ta, vanguard, synth1, fm7 and a few others. for fx i use the vec samples plus i make my own with the jp8000.

Sony Acid Pro 6.0, the same VST's you use apart from z3ta, TBL Bass synth, Atmosphere Dream Synth, Access Virus B and a Korg Electribe ESX-1. Roland E-20 Synthesizer. I use VEC FX CD also for effects, very good cd n all.

you any tracks?

I am just finalising a project at the minute which i will make available online in lofi format soon for criticism. I will post back here soon with it. I dont post anything that I think isnt worthy of getting feedback from a label. Anything i will be posting on here will be of the best of my ability. I dont want any bad reflections on me if you know what i mean by posting unfinished demos that i know wont cut it.

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