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-- best jobs to support yourself?
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Yo Yo, jail gives you street cred man. Arms dealer is a good gig if you can get it. You can sleep late mostly, but sometimes those Russian mafia guys want to meet you under a bridge at 5 in the morning to check out those new AR-15's.

The money in dance music production dried up long ago. You used to could make a living from it, in the age of vinyl, but the digital age killed that. If you DJ in addition to producing, then you can make some scratch. Your music makes you no money, but it promotes your live gigs.

Read this post at the time but didnt post as I wasnt sure how it would all pan out. 6 months later and im still working at a great place.

It allows me to produce most the time. I work in I.T. support. Its a small team much like my last place where I could do the same thre also.

Like the original thread maker said, indirectly get paid to produce which is good. Hopefully i'll be here for a bit longer so Im using every second i can lol.

You can be a DJ , suppor your songs and stuff , and its part of music too. Or you can just do some jobs that doesn't involve going out of your home , so you can actually spend time producing too.

Or ,

Audio Engineer.
Soundbanks Creater?(Not sure whats its called , but if you love tweaking knobs and your great at it , why not?)

I think he was thinking more along the lines of a non music job. If you could be a DJ that earnt enough not to have a day job this thread wouldnt of started, same for the audio engineer.

Good idea about working from home.

quote:

Originally posted by music2dance2 I think he was thinking more along the lines of a non music job. If you could be a DJ that earnt enough not to have a day job this thread wouldnt of started, same for the audio engineer. Good idea about working from home.

What about a Record Store owner? One that sells Records? I mean , you can sit at the cashier , and show off your DAW to those customers.

quote:

Originally posted by 9Vibes What about a Record Store owner? One that sells Records? I mean , you can sit at the cashier , and show off your DAW to those customers.

worst thing ever, records doesnt sell anymore.

Until recently I was living exclusively off the royalty shares and gigs. I was really used to it as I had been doing this since 1998.

As I am soon to be a proud parent, as I'm moving houses, I personally think that this living has become way too risky on the longer term. I had to find opportunities and started recently out as a music teacher. I really enjoy doing this, in fact much more than I do making music.

I've always had several companies, so I'm constantly expanding my business. And I learned not to put all of my eggs into the same bag. And after a small calculation I can definitely tell you that living off music right now is not an option for everyone.

I'm getting maybe 10 000 Euro royalty shares in a year. I get less than 10 gigs at 500 Euros average for the same term. 15 000 Euros divided in 12 months, that's 1200 Euros and once you remove taxes, it's approximately 600 a month, definitely not enough.

13 years, and 250 releases behind my back. You can easily tell that it's because of the label... I'd say it is the same with every other label, whether you get more or less %, it's samey after all. Fortunately I get more income off my other activities!! This way I'm not into financial trouble anymore, like I was a few months ago.

Music is now a hobby for me, and it's probably better that way.

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo Until recently I was living exclusively off the royalty shares and gigs. I was really used to it as I had been doing this since 1998. As I am soon to be a proud parent, as I'm moving houses, I personally think that this living has become way too risky on the longer term. I had to find opportunities and started recently out as a music teacher. I really enjoy doing this, in fact much more than I do making music. I've always had several companies, so I'm constantly expanding my business. And I learned not to put all of my eggs into the same bag. And after a small calculation I can definitely tell you that living off music right now is not an option for everyone. I'm getting maybe 10 000 Euro royalty shares in a year. I get less than 10 gigs at 500 Euros average for the same term. 15 000 Euros divided in 12 months, that's 1200 Euros and once you remove taxes, it's approximately 600 a month, definitely not enough. 13 years, and 250 releases behind my back. You can easily tell that it's because of the label... I'd say it is the same with every other label, whether you get more or less %, it's samey after all. Fortunately I get more income off my other activities!! This way I'm not into financial trouble anymore, like I was a few months ago. Music is now a hobby for me, and it's probably better that way.

Good post dude, nice to hear some 1st hand experience. Nowadays I believe if you want to keep afloat then doing regular gigs is key, and of cousre how much you get paid for them.

quote:

Originally posted by music2dance2 Nowadays I believe if you want to keep afloat then doing regular gigs is key, and of cousre how much you get paid for them.

If I want to get regular gigs nowadays, I have to lower my fee to less than 100 Euro. You know how much trouble gigs by plane can be. And besides that, there are plenty of whores inside this industry playing for less, 50 Euros, or for free. I think that even 600 Euros a gig is ridiculous for someone with my history at times, but I remain humble and am happy to play for even less, or free. Soon I'll have to pay in order to play gigs if things should go on that way. But that's not a priority for me anymore, so I don't take this too seriously. But still, it looks like the red light district of dance music 3.0 won't shut tomorrow. Keeps me worried for the huge talent there is among us.

Sorry, but I have a lot less trouble teaching a few people how to use sequencers, synths, fx, and dj tools, and that's why I've been focusing on that lately. At least some of them treat you with respect.

As long as there's no legal rule for artists (fixed and categorized fees, royalty share, and so on), for promoters (cultural diversity), and radio stations, there's no change in the plans, believe me, the dance music industry will remain the same old sandbox full of kids crap that it is right now.

Now you have my opinion about this, but it's only mine. Many are happy in this industry, too. It's easy spitting bull out on this industry but we are ALL responsible for it.

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo As I am soon to be a proud parent

Congratulations!

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo I'm getting maybe 10 000 Euro royalty shares in a year.

Out of curiosity, do you still get royalties for like the tracks you had on Magik compilations and stuff like that ?

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle Congratulations! Out of curiosity, do you still get royalties for like the tracks you had on Magik compilations and stuff like that ?

thanks

yes I do, and it helps. But I still haven't got anything from my latest cd, thanks to zyx music. They'll get bankrupt in a few, don't sell cd's well and don't send correct statements. Which means I get money quite late, it takes up to 2 years for some releases

get a job that lets you work from home

work nights and spend all day producing

or work part time like 2 days a week then produce all week i used to do this now i have a 9-5 so i just produce at night

or then theres always

http://www.recordingconnection.com/...=googleNEWYORK1

then they could place you. Keep in mind you dont have to be trained professionally and been in the business for years to be noticed it really all boils down to having the right sound at the right time and doing some marketing ,i know we all did not take marketing 101 in high school but now i wish i did!

My country doesn't have jobs

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo If I want to get regular gigs nowadays, I have to lower my fee to less than 100 Euro. You know how much trouble gigs by plane can be. And besides that, there are plenty of whores inside this industry playing for less, 50 Euros, or for free. I think that even 600 Euros a gig is ridiculous for someone with my history at times, but I remain humble and am happy to play for even less, or free. Soon I'll have to pay in order to play gigs if things should go on that way. But that's not a priority for me anymore, so I don't take this too seriously. But still, it looks like the red light district of dance music 3.0 won't shut tomorrow. Keeps me worried for the huge talent there is among us. Sorry, but I have a lot less trouble teaching a few people how to use sequencers, synths, fx, and dj tools, and that's why I've been focusing on that lately. At least some of them treat you with respect. As long as there's no legal rule for artists (fixed and categorized fees, royalty share, and so on), for promoters (cultural diversity), and radio stations, there's no change in the plans, believe me, the dance music industry will remain the same old sandbox full of kids crap that it is right now. Now you have my opinion about this, but it's only mine. Many are happy in this industry, too. It's easy spitting bull out on this industry but we are ALL responsible for it.

Indeed mate, more and more people doing it nowadays very much saturated.

Sell Tupperware...

quote:

Originally posted by Magnus Work for a small technology company that prides itself on employee quality of life. If it wasn't for this, I would not nearly have as much time as I do. I can basically come and go as I please just as long as I get my work done.

I don't think that is something reserved to small tech companies. I work with a lot of large tech company's like Amazon, eBay and Apple and they all seem to be very casual companies just like that...

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo If I want to get regular gigs nowadays, I have to lower my fee to less than 100 Euro. You know how much trouble gigs by plane can be. And besides that, there are plenty of whores inside this industry playing for less, 50 Euros, or for free. I think that even 600 Euros a gig is ridiculous for someone with my history at times, but I remain humble and am happy to play for even less, or free. Soon I'll have to pay in order to play gigs if things should go on that way.

I thought this was an interesting comment. It really does just go to show that producers don't really get enough credit. The tiesto's and armin's of the community have absolutely no trouble getting gigs and getting paid well for them, yet even though producers like you make so much of the music those guys play, you aren't well known enough yourself to draw the crowds. I don't think it's a surprise, just bitter sweet...

More emphasis on bitter, Floorfiller =)

i work in a big finance company selling investments.. didnt have to goto uni or anything.. that gives me quite a good wage..

but that mixed with general mid week things leaves zero time
during the week but i try and rape my weekends with music production usually.
but if u go have a big night that messes up the next day...

i do dj too.. maybe once or twice a month .. pays alright depending where i play..

but all in all i love the money of my job been there 9 months
but when i was working casual for a few years just after i finished school.. i could mess around with djing and music production as much as i wanted...

but u take the good with the bad i guess..

quote:

Originally posted by johncannons1 i work in a big finance company selling investments.. didnt have to goto uni or anything.. that gives me quite a good wage.. but that mixed with general mid week things leaves zero time during the week but i try and rape my weekends with music production usually. but if u go have a big night that messes up the next day... i do dj too.. maybe once or twice a month .. pays alright depending where i play.. but all in all i love the money of my job been there 9 months but when i was working casual for a few years just after i finished school.. i could mess around with djing and music production as much as i wanted... but u take the good with the bad i guess..

Indeed, just go with whats working for you, if have a good job or studying then keep at it. eventually if you keep on producing when you can it will all pay off. Just have to wait.

Totally understand the going out thing, may as well right off the next day completely.

quote:

Originally posted by Floorfiller I thought this was an interesting comment. It really does just go to show that producers don't really get enough credit. The tiesto's and armin's of the community have absolutely no trouble getting gigs and getting paid well for them, yet even though producers like you make so much of the music those guys play, you aren't well known enough yourself to draw the crowds. I don't think it's a surprise, just bitter sweet...

unsurprisingly, indeed. But I came to a point I don't want to make any compromise in life anymore. That's a risky way business-wise, but I'm sure it will pay off some day. If people want to keep supporting dj's or musicians who actually can't play just a little bit keys, it's none of my business. I'm a bad performer myself, but at least I'm sweating and take a lot of risks when playing out. Don't you think that it'll pay off much more in the end? One thing is sure, when some will disappear I'll still be there. Musicians remain, douchebags don't.

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo unsurprisingly, indeed. But I came to a point I don't want to make any compromise in life anymore. That's a risky way business-wise, but I'm sure it will pay off some day. If people want to keep supporting dj's or musicians who actually can't play just a little bit keys, it's none of my business. I'm a bad performer myself, but at least I'm sweating and take a lot of risks when playing out. Don't you think that it'll pay off much more in the end? One thing is sure, when some will disappear I'll still be there. Musicians remain, douchebags don't.

really great posts on this page, and your most recent post on your site as well mate, really good to see some real, honest perspectives on the scene from someone who actually KNOWS (and isn't just a dj)...

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo I'm a bad performer myself, but at least I'm sweating and take a lot of risks when playing out.

If it makes you feel any better, I don't think you are. Saw you doin a live gig with ableton on a Intuition party at bloemendaal 2 years ago, it was really awesome!

But I get your point, nowadays it's fairly easy for everyone to make music, but it's hard to stand out. I consider music as a hobby, I hope that will ever change, but I won't bet my money on it!

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo If I want to get regular gigs nowadays, I have to lower my fee to less than 100 Euro. You know how much trouble gigs by plane can be. And besides that, there are plenty of whores inside this industry playing for less, 50 Euros, or for free. I think that even 600 Euros a gig is ridiculous for someone with my history at times, but I remain humble and am happy to play for even less, or free. Soon I'll have to pay in order to play gigs if things should go on that way.

That's indeed plain sad, considering your history.
What bothers me is that people who contribute to the music community that much, made that much great records (and did start to produce trancehouse crap for $$$) earn a fraction of the dutch "elite". I don't think you can ask armin or tiesto for a fee less than 4 digits. It can't be all marketing can it? I don't understand today's music industry.

i studying to become a computer engineer. Gonna DJ, mix concerts and produce on the side.

I see a trend in the work field here. way to go guys.

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