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-- Here I said it all !! Detailed reasons why every EDM fan HATES Opera..
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Btw, all these people complaining have to realize, from the money point of view, all the people that spend all their weekly paycheck at a club frequent opera on the weekdays. They are the ones buying the $1k tables at opera for these big shows. Dubfire @ dreams, there were 2 tables on the stage going for $1k, no one bought them. Opera is where the money is at, so you also look at it from that point of view. The only POV I'm seeing people look at it that are complaining is from the 'sweaty rolling balls fan' pov. I'm pretty sure Devin doesn't like to host it at Opera himself, it's more of a love/late relationship, but that's where the money is at! Opera sold every table, vip, and ticket to the show to armin. I'm pretty sure other clubs couldn't do it. I myself don't like Opera as a venue either, but it's either Opera or Dreams for the big shows, and Opera is where the money is at currently.
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| Originally posted by GTS3gEclipse That's why we always got VIP tables at Pacha in NYC for Armin and any other "big name" DJ who came to town. With 4 people it comes to about $80 a person but ur up in the VIP with ur own table and u get a bottle of grey goose. And since events cost $40 or more, u figure ur gunna spend the other $40 on alcohol anyway so u might as well get the added breathing room too. Plus you can go back and forth from the dance floor to the VIP so you can still be with the crowd and then go take a breather. That's why smaller clubs are great, because they can pull in good talent, but they aren't the trendy cool clubs to go to so you don't get that crowd there. Unfortunately, in the US the only cities in the US where those clubs can survive is NYC, Miami, and LA. |
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| Originally posted by iammesol You're pointing out precisely the reason why most people move from trance to house.  When I was fascinated by trance in 03/04, one of my  moments was the Ti�sto In Concert dvd. The amount of people, length of time playing, and music just blitzed me. But then, when I actually started going out and realized what that looked like from the inside, I despised it. That random group of people isn't new. Ask yourself: why have you put up with the stuff for so long? |
whoa... pretty good dialogue on this thread! lots of nice perspective.
in my opinion (humble), the armin show was a complete spectacle. it was packed. it was hot, and sweaty for sure. yes, there were people bumping into me constantly (unless i was in one of those outer areas), and in fact, there were a few occasions where, quite literally, i had people who were moving to another area on the dance floor just body straight through me... i mean straight on through. incredibly rude yes, but not surprising in the least.
you had to figure that armin was going to draw people out of the woodwork. which he did. i wouldn't know what percentage of people at the show would really consider edm as their lifeblood (which i certainly do), but it was a total madhouse. but, I loved it!
Of course, I didn't like the shoving and posturing/posing of many of the folks in attendance, but oh well. They still couldn't keep me from having an absolute mental time. I just tried to put it all into context. I'm not letting anyone (especially the poser fans) detract me from my love of trance. I get it all the time on a daily basis. It's very rare for me to meet people in everyday situations that are really, really into edm. Why would the general crowd at Opera be any different? Admittedly, once I got to Opera and saw the size of the crowd, I immediately headed straight for the bar to get my wits about me. That helped out a lot.
But to wrap this up, I see where people can be incredibly disenchanted by the environment that Opera seems to foster, but what other alternative do you have to seeing a DJ that you really like?
btw, I wanted to mention that i did look for a tall guy that needed a shave (trancension), no chance of id'ing you. i guess lots of folks must have forgot their razors.
and chad, my bad on trying to catch up at the show. I left my phone in my sister's car when she dropped me off.
<----'s gf was too lazy to log into her own account but wanted to say, "i bloody hate opera!"
Lostvision:
Ya, your response to my comments is probably the dumbest thing I've ever read. So I guess we're even. Some of you people read things too literal. You're probably going to read the very first part of this comment and then go quote something that is obviously far more stupid.
I don't know if it's just the culture and way I raised, but exaggeration and sarcasm are heavy aspects of my life and ways of communicating disdain for something.
"Too old for this" isn't literal. I can't believe I have to actually explain myself like I am talking to a 7 year old, but then again, this is the internet; any idiot can log on and let it be known that he is in fact an idiot. "Too old for this" is a cliche comment to represent my disdain for the current EDM scene in Atlanta, specifically of the last couple of years. I've been going to house parties, underground parties and clubs since I was 13 to listen to this music. I've been in an Airplane hangar bay where it was so crowded and so hot, that you were literally stuck to the 8 people surrounding you due to proximity and sweat. And those experiences were still better because at least those 8 people were listening to the music. I don't know. The more I type, the more I guess I do come off as elitist. I don't mean to. Because in the end, I do support people going out and having fun however they can and want.
But let's be realistic for you people acting like complete idiots (or maybe you are just complete idiots and don't actually notice this stuff) but the scene at Opera for these "mega DJs" is fucking horrible. If you even try to argue that, you're just being ignorant and you should stop posting here to stir trouble. Open your eyes and look at the actual crowd. A lot of people are listening to the music. Probably 90%. But that 10% that isn't, they really do rain on my parade. They keep walking back and forth from one spot to the other and back again. And do they politely ask me to move? Nope. They forcefully attempt to walk through me and my friends and the dozens of other people who I can tell are actually in the zone listening to the music.
As for my "mellodramatic" comment. That was intended to be mellodramatic. Once again, my whole point of posting in this thread is to air my grievances against the scene and specifically Opera. Kind of hard to get my point across without exagerrated, sarcastic mellodrama. "My last show" is probably pretty literal in this instance. I don't know how much respect Liquified has for me, don't really care in the end. They don't necessarily need my business, and I sure as hell don't need their respect. Going to Opera is not fun anymore. Do I love the music I hear? Hell yes. Should my love for the music overpower the dozen little annoyances that come up when attending Opera at these events...I wish it did. But in actuality, it's becoming far more clear that just turning up my computer's speakers and hanging out with my friends at my place will be far more enjoyable.
Let me re-iterate, my whole point in this thread is that going to Opera is not fun anymore. I am trying to make a point to Liquified.
I sound like a fucking broken record, but god damn, some of ya'll are acting like idiots. I realize it's not easy to pick up on sarcasm or whatever on the internet, but be realistic for a second. "Too old" at 23? "Name a song" to get entrance?
Liquified:
I don't think spainj had any actual merit or real technique to his theory, once again I think he was just pointing out how he should of expected a large crowd because a lot of page views does correlate to a lot of bought tickets. He probably put about as much thought into his theory as you do in using Opera. Don't take that as an insult. But the fact that you think people support Opera on these surveys is a good sign for Opera is pretty dim. If you found another venue that allowed 18+ and had several bars that was the size of Opera. I'm fairly certain it would be an instant success over that of Opera. Does such a venue exist? It seems less and less likely I guess.
Please read this part: I could very well be wrong and in the minority in my disdain for Opera. But Opera really isn't anything special. Allowing 18+ and the fact that you can squeeze twice as many people as the next venue are what attract these DJs' booking agents. I'll gladly eat my words if there is a noticeable dropoff in attendance if you use a place similar to Opera's capacity with 18+ entrance. In the end though, the EDM scene would be better served if we ditched Opera and those Opera attendees who have no interest in the music and are only there because its Opera.
Either way, I will be at Markus Schulz with fucking bells on, regardless of where he plays.
God damn that was a long post. There's my nerd rage shining through.
I need to go take a few chill pills and forget about this thread. I'm letting some of ya'll get me way overworked on this.
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And I'm sorry I didn't give a better description Big Worm. There were a lot of hairy mofos out at Armin haha. In my defense though, I was the tallest
If you come to Markus in 3 weeks though, we can try to meet up before hand.
OK, I've kept my mouth shut long enough on this issue. I understand and empathize with everyone's frustrations with AvB at Opera but you can't tell me that this whole situation was not entirely predictable. Your expectations for going to see this artist at this venue should have told you (1) it was going to be a sardine can, (2) it was going to be poser city (yes, i said "poser"...I'm bringing it back!), (3) the staff was going to treat you like shit (that's a constant), and (4) there was going to be a high douchebag-to-nice-people ratio. If you knew this and decided to go anyway and had a bad time, well, that's your own damn fault. If you didn't know that, then it makes me sad that you had a bad experience and I'll take you to a good EDM show. 
To be perfectly honest, I rarely go to "big name" shows anymore. It's not for distaste of the music being played (not always anyway). To hear Tiesto play Tiesto tracks, AvB play AvB tracks, or PvD play PvD tracks, I can get equal satisfaction with a CD at home for a fraction of the price. Of course, it is always more fun to hear it on large sound system and be in crowd of folks who share your passion...but you're obviously not going to find that at Opera. Artists with a large fan base / name recognition in any genre are going to attract lemmings. (Hey, it pays the bills. The artists, club, and promoters capitalized on an opportunity. Tell me that you wouldn't do the same thing.)
I just think that if I am going to pay a high price for tickets for an event, I want to see something different and innovative. I don't want to see a producer just play me something they produced (speaking of which, someone needs to send Deadmau5 some f*ing promos...but i'll save that for another time). Rabbit in the Moon and Underworld provide a unique show well worth the price of admission. You could argue that this is an EDM performance rather than a DJ show. Fine. James Holden or 1+1 offer a true DJ performance. Even the upcoming Crystal Method / Benassi offers something unique in having an EDM show at a large venue with two headliners and multiple side rooms featuring a variety of local talent.
The point is, if you went to AvB to see a world-class DJ performance, you are just as misguided as the people who have no idea why they are there. If the night did not meet your expectations, I am sorry you had a bad time. Nothing sucks more than spending a lot of money for something that you would not have enjoyed if it was free. That being said, you don't have to be Miss Cleo to have predicted what AvB @ Opera was going to be like.
*ding ding ding*
time for me to chime in on my 2 cents.
If you let wasted youngins get in the way of seeing good music then you really didnt want to see them that bad in the first place.
supply and demand pimpin.
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| Originally posted by trancension God damn that was a long post. There's my nerd rage shining through. I need to go take a few chill pills and forget about this thread. I'm letting some of ya'll get me way overworked on this. ----------- And I'm sorry I didn't give a better description Big Worm. There were a lot of hairy mofos out at Armin haha. In my defense though, I was the tallest If you come to Markus in 3 weeks though, we can try to meet up before hand. |
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| Originally posted by ZeeRobot1 If you let wasted youngins get in the way of seeing good music then you really didnt want to see them that bad in the first place. |
what is the capacity for tabernacle? i know it was very hot, but i had a good time there watching tiesto 3??? years ago. i also think there is something about seeing a tiesto/amin at a large venue
also, i do think some of you are right about the kind of crowds opera draws. at A&B i saw some people i know in vip and in the crowd that i was like "wtf are they doing at this show". i ran into the people a few weeks later and they were like "who was that performing, that was a great night". is this a bad thing or good thing? i dont know becase it sure as hell looks like it is helping the scene in atlanta since we are getting a lot more events in atlanta than just 2 years ago.
to further the point that opera draws a crowd because of the venue, wasnt it just 2 years ago i watched armin play at wetbar with a less than capacity crowd? and i believe half of the crowd that night was wetbar's "normal crowd". granted, armin is now the "#1 dj in the world", which makes a difference.
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| Originally posted by ZeeRobot1 *ding ding ding* time for me to chime in on my 2 cents. If you let wasted youngins get in the way of seeing good music then you really didnt want to see them that bad in the first place. supply and demand pimpin. |
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| Originally posted by trancension Lostvision: Ya, your response to my comments is probably the dumbest thing I've ever read. So I guess we're even. Some of you people read things too literal. You're probably going to read the very first part of this comment and then go quote something that is obviously far more stupid. I don't know if it's just the culture and way I raised, but exaggeration and sarcasm are heavy aspects of my life and ways of communicating disdain for something. "Too old for this" isn't literal. I can't believe I have to actually explain myself like I am talking to a 7 year old, but then again, this is the internet; any idiot can log on and let it be known that he is in fact an idiot. "Too old for this" is a cliche comment to represent my disdain for the current EDM scene in Atlanta, specifically of the last couple of years. I've been going to house parties, underground parties and clubs since I was 13 to listen to this music. I've been in an Airplane hangar bay where it was so crowded and so hot, that you were literally stuck to the 8 people surrounding you due to proximity and sweat. And those experiences were still better because at least those 8 people were listening to the music. I don't know. The more I type, the more I guess I do come off as elitist. I don't mean to. Because in the end, I do support people going out and having fun however they can and want. But let's be realistic for you people acting like complete idiots (or maybe you are just complete idiots and don't actually notice this stuff) but the scene at Opera for these "mega DJs" is fucking horrible. If you even try to argue that, you're just being ignorant and you should stop posting here to stir trouble. Open your eyes and look at the actual crowd. A lot of people are listening to the music. Probably 90%. But that 10% that isn't, they really do rain on my parade. They keep walking back and forth from one spot to the other and back again. And do they politely ask me to move? Nope. They forcefully attempt to walk through me and my friends and the dozens of other people who I can tell are actually in the zone listening to the music. As for my "mellodramatic" comment. That was intended to be mellodramatic. Once again, my whole point of posting in this thread is to air my grievances against the scene and specifically Opera. Kind of hard to get my point across without exagerrated, sarcastic mellodrama. "My last show" is probably pretty literal in this instance. I don't know how much respect Liquified has for me, don't really care in the end. They don't necessarily need my business, and I sure as hell don't need their respect. Going to Opera is not fun anymore. Do I love the music I hear? Hell yes. Should my love for the music overpower the dozen little annoyances that come up when attending Opera at these events...I wish it did. But in actuality, it's becoming far more clear that just turning up my computer's speakers and hanging out with my friends at my place will be far more enjoyable. Let me re-iterate, my whole point in this thread is that going to Opera is not fun anymore. I am trying to make a point to Liquified. I sound like a fucking broken record, but god damn, some of ya'll are acting like idiots. I realize it's not easy to pick up on sarcasm or whatever on the internet, but be realistic for a second. "Too old" at 23? "Name a song" to get entrance? Liquified: I don't think spainj had any actual merit or real technique to his theory, once again I think he was just pointing out how he should of expected a large crowd because a lot of page views does correlate to a lot of bought tickets. He probably put about as much thought into his theory as you do in using Opera. Don't take that as an insult. But the fact that you think people support Opera on these surveys is a good sign for Opera is pretty dim. If you found another venue that allowed 18+ and had several bars that was the size of Opera. I'm fairly certain it would be an instant success over that of Opera. Does such a venue exist? It seems less and less likely I guess. Please read this part: I could very well be wrong and in the minority in my disdain for Opera. But Opera really isn't anything special. Allowing 18+ and the fact that you can squeeze twice as many people as the next venue are what attract these DJs' booking agents. I'll gladly eat my words if there is a noticeable dropoff in attendance if you use a place similar to Opera's capacity with 18+ entrance. In the end though, the EDM scene would be better served if we ditched Opera and those Opera attendees who have no interest in the music and are only there because its Opera. Either way, I will be at Markus Schulz with fucking bells on, regardless of where he plays. |
I agree with Stew that it was predictable. Part of the reason I decided not to go and spend 50 bucks. I guess some of us just really like djs like Armin. I have never got into Rabbit in the Moon or Crystal Method, so to me, and probably others, it's harder to get into those types of shows. The same goes for many other djs who may not attract a crowd, but if I can't get into the music, it's not worth my time getting out to Atlanta. Some of you guys can walk to the local club which would make it much more likely that I would be at some of these shows. Another reason me and a lot of the trance lovers want some lesser knowns to come is it's more likely a lot of posers won't come.
I don't think it is elitist to wish that only people that know and love the music should go. My opinion is always that concerts and djs should not have random people who just decide to go out. They should know that a majority of the people there want to enjoy the music and not go and just stand around and cause problems for the others. I went to a show once where these kids were literally standing by me and chit chatting while the band was playing. Needless to say I told them to go someplace else if they were going to talk. I was seeing a dj at Opera one time and this guy tried to walk through me, but I looked at him and told him to go around. Sometimes you just need to be tough. I don't think many of the Opera people will actually fight you, but I could be wrong. Yeah, it would be ideal if everyone was nice and gave you room, but it's not realistic.
The bottom line is we know how these shows will turn out and some of us realize that more and more. We want to put up with it because we love the music. Yeah, maybe he was being sarcastic when he said it was his last show, but maybe for the bigger djs it is. Now if they got Tiesto and PVD at a more suitable venue, I might go. I can't speak for anyone, but if a smaller dj came I'm sure we'd be more likely to get out. I guess you guys hit the nail on the head, if you like the dj enough, you will soldier through the bad things. That is true. Thankfully Armin, Tiesto, etc. are not my favorites. Now if Markus ever got that big, I'd probably still go and just put up with it.
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| Originally posted by PVDfan07 I agree with Stew that it was predictable. Part of the reason I decided not to go and spend 50 bucks. I guess some of us just really like djs like Armin. I have never got into Rabbit in the Moon or Crystal Method, so to me, and probably others, it's harder to get into those types of shows. The same goes for many other djs who may not attract a crowd, but if I can't get into the music, it's not worth my time getting out to Atlanta. Some of you guys can walk to the local club which would make it much more likely that I would be at some of these shows. Another reason me and a lot of the trance lovers want some lesser knowns to come is it's more likely a lot of posers won't come. I don't think it is elitist to wish that only people that know and love the music should go. My opinion is always that concerts and djs should not have random people who just decide to go out. They should know that a majority of the people there want to enjoy the music and not go and just stand around and cause problems for the others. I went to a show once where these kids were literally standing by me and chit chatting while the band was playing. Needless to say I told them to go someplace else if they were going to talk. I was seeing a dj at Opera one time and this guy tried to walk through me, but I looked at him and told him to go around. Sometimes you just need to be tough. I don't think many of the Opera people will actually fight you, but I could be wrong. Yeah, it would be ideal if everyone was nice and gave you room, but it's not realistic. The bottom line is we know how these shows will turn out and some of us realize that more and more. We want to put up with it because we love the music. Yeah, maybe he was being sarcastic when he said it was his last show, but maybe for the bigger djs it is. Now if they got Tiesto and PVD at a more suitable venue, I might go. I can't speak for anyone, but if a smaller dj came I'm sure we'd be more likely to get out. I guess you guys hit the nail on the head, if you like the dj enough, you will soldier through the bad things. That is true. Thankfully Armin, Tiesto, etc. are not my favorites. Now if Markus ever got that big, I'd probably still go and just put up with it. |
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| Originally posted by Lostvission Speaking on you though man...your whole focus wasnt against opera, so i commented. |
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| Originally posted by trancension No, my whole focus is against Opera and the crowd it attracts for some of these DJs. If you got any other impression, then you misread it. My thread about Opera/Atlanta not being as bad as say New York was solely in regards to the staff at Opera. I still haven't had a bad experience with the staff at Opera. New York and Miami -- some atrocious stories that could probably let me call the better business bureau. The crowd at Opera is deplorable though. I can't stand it anymore. And any of you who are going to accuse me of not loving the music enough, that's laughable. The fact that I have kept putting up with these crowds the last two or so years should be evident enough of how much I do love the music. But it really has gotten that bad in my opinion. Maybe when I graduate and get a job and can move up to VIP and actually be elitist instead of bitter, maybe then I'll return to Opera. Until then, I don't think I'll be returning to Opera, probably not even for the smaller DJs. Markus is the one exception though. |
This thread bores me....
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| Originally posted by trancension No, my whole focus is against Opera and the crowd it attracts for some of these DJs. If you got any other impression, then you misread it. My thread about Opera/Atlanta not being as bad as say New York was solely in regards to the staff at Opera. I still haven't had a bad experience with the staff at Opera. New York and Miami -- some atrocious stories that could probably let me call the better business bureau. The crowd at Opera is deplorable though. I can't stand it anymore. And any of you who are going to accuse me of not loving the music enough, that's laughable. The fact that I have kept putting up with these crowds the last two or so years should be evident enough of how much I do love the music. But it really has gotten that bad in my opinion. Maybe when I graduate and get a job and can move up to VIP and actually be elitist instead of bitter, maybe then I'll return to Opera. Until then, I don't think I'll be returning to Opera, probably not even for the smaller DJs. Markus is the one exception though. |
I really don't care why people come to events, as long as they aren't physically disturbing me I could care less what their reasons for being there are. Its Opera...I don't like it either, but all of you should know what to expect by now. Bitching about Opera sucking/Armin being crowded is pointless imo.
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| Originally posted by Lostvission Same reason why people move from trance to house ?? In europe house shows are as packed as trance shows here. Not quite sure if if its a matter of genre or some of you just like small crowds regardless of genre or location. A good summers visit to ibiza and digweed, sanchez, van helden, all of em are rocking mega long sets with crowds where you cant move. Would that be a cue to switch to trip hop at that point cause house shows have too many fans now ? I understand what you guys mean..it just doesnt really seem logic to me in sense. No disrespect sam. - chris |
Well I did reference the "scene" a lot, but that's because in terms of trance DJs -- Opera is the "scene" due to Liquified utilizing it about every time. In reality, this is specifically in regards to Opera though and the "mega DJs" that come through.
And I agree Seppeku. I know what to expect, but I'm one of those people who likes to speak up and get my voice heard. Rarely do I get changes implemented, but sometimes I have.
Sorry for basically annoying a lot of you with some of this pointless drivel, but this is my only outlet really to talk to Liquified. This or in private message. But this does allow for other people to chime in and also comment on how Opera isn't a good venue.
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| Originally posted by trancension Well I did reference the "scene" a lot, but that's because in terms of trance DJs -- Opera is the "scene" due to Liquified utilizing it about every time. In reality, this is specifically in regards to Opera though and the "mega DJs" that come through. And I agree Seppeku. I know what to expect, but I'm one of those people who likes to speak up and get my voice heard. Rarely do I get changes implemented, but sometimes I have. Sorry for basically annoying a lot of you with some of this pointless drivel, but this is my only outlet really to talk to Liquified. This or in private message. But this does allow for other people to chime in and also comment on how Opera isn't a good venue. |
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