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quote:

Originally posted by owien i think we are forgetting the prodigy were the ones that had a huge impact on the hole dance culture paning over many many years and made it what it is now more possible then tiesto and Paul.

dance and techno is not the same, i dont think prodigy had much inpact on what oakie cokey playd. at all. though they did have a big inpact on me from 94-96!

All this stuff is pretty much separate from techno, except to the extent that trance branched off from techno in early 1990s Germany. Watch the trance documentary:

[[ LINK REMOVED ]]


Includes footage of PvD and Laurent Garnier from sixteen years ago (1993).

quote:

Originally posted by palm dance and techno is not the same, i dont think prodigy had much inpact on what oakie cokey playd. at all. though they did have a big inpact on me from 94-96!

but to be fair it wasn't really techno the were making... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bKL1ptf71M


they mixed shit up!

Good lord, please stop posting re-hashed and fairly innacuarte accounts of that "holiday to Ibiza" and the one-sided/highly selective techno documentary.

It's akin to watching the film Amadaus and then thinking you're a world authority on classical music.

(By the way that account of the legendary holiday leaves about 4 other people out of the story who were just as important not to mention that fact I've seen that same story change content in 3 different publications over the years).

The prodigy, although pioneers of rave culture, came long after the likes of Danny Rampling and Paul Oakenfold. (Prodigy surfaced in 1990 by the way guys, clubs like shoom were already a couple of years old).

If you want some decent and accurate history, read:

Last Night A DJ saved My life
Energy Flash
Ecstasy and the Dance music culture
Altered State

Anyway, back OT, the only reason I'd say Paul has a right is that he DID do it all first. Can you even imagine how many times he has played out in a club? Can you think what 20+ years of DJing at the top of your game is like. At some point you;re going to lose some passion, but that's not even the whole story. Paul,as correctly pointed out, was the first true businessman of dance music.

Try to bear in mind before he even became a DJ, he was an A+R man in NY, and gave Will Smith his first break by signing him.

The only reason I think can paul is allowed to carry on however he wants is that without him, dance music would be a completely different place. He did it. He's why you know Dance music in the way you do. Again, I'm not a fanboy, but in being a part of this industry for the last 15 years, I can't think of anyone that contributed more to the scene or dance music.

I simply cannot say the same about Tiesto, becuase his career has just been a copy of others who went before him and is now climaxing in to vulgar characature of everything that is wrong with the "superstar DJ" phenom.

quote:

Originally posted by owien but to be fair it wasn't really techno the were making... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bKL1ptf71M they mixed shit up!

yeah as i said they made dance music. nothing more.
they where on all 90s dance comps. so theyre dance.
then they became rock, big beat and i lost interest.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN ...the one-sided/highly selective techno documentary.

Did you click the link? The documentary is about trance, not techno.

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Did you click the link? The documentary is about trance, not techno.

Yes, about three years ago and I have the same opinion now as I did then.

And the reason I call it the techno documentary is that that's what is was called back then in Germany. The word "trance" came about years later.

...but that's a whole other thread......

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN Yes, about three years ago and I have the same opinion now as I did then. And the reason I call it the techno documentary is that that's what is was called back then in Germany. The word "trance" came about years later.

The producers quoted in the doco, which was made in 1993, call it "trance."

[Edit: not to mention Dance 2 Trance, the German duo who started producing in 1990...]

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles The producers quoted in the doco, which was made in 1993, call it "trance." [Edit: not to mention Dance 2 Trance, the German duo who started producing in 1990...]

Yes, but that was a specific niche movement in germany and not the same thing as we call trance now (and I'm not talking about the normal evolution of the genre). Bbear in mind that it was the UK several years before that was pioneering the uplifting house sound that became Trance that we know now.

Techno sprouted up in the USA but was undoubtedly pioneered by the Germans. IMO, the "trance" they are talking about in that doc was a sub-form of techno and not "trance" as we know. I base this off the research I;ve done, also by growing up in london and having bought records in Germany and Switzerland in the mid-90's and observing the clear difference in terminology relating to same genres.

I told you, I really didn't want to get in to this...

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN Yes, but that was a specific niche movement in germany and not the same thing as we call trance now (and I'm not talking about the normal evolution of the genre)...IMO, the "trance" they are talking about in that doc was a sub-form of techno and not "trance" as we know.

What, you mean it's not the same as late 1990s Dutch "uplifting" trance? Of course not. But Germany is still connected to the 1990s and early 2000s prog trance scene through producers like Oliver Lieb and Humate, whose tracks were played by UK DJs like Sasha. If you listen to early Platipus (UK) stuff and early MFS and Eye Q (German) records there is a lot of similarity in style and that is not just coincidence. Through the '90s Platipus changed from the harder acid style of early trance to the more uplifting and softer prog style that later became so big and influential.

when people say german trance, they mean poor east side berlin trance (soft melodies in warehouses lol). not frankfurt trance or psychedelic trance which is oliver lieb really.
actualy the frankfurt trance reminds of UK trance but berlin trance is like its own. berlin always do theyr own shit.
UK trance evolved to progressive house wich is what i love most of all.

yeah i know what i talk about rofl

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles What, you mean it's not the same as late 1990s Dutch "uplifting" trance? Of course not. But Germany is still connected to the 1990s and early 2000s prog trance scene through producers like Oliver Lieb and Humate, whose tracks were played by UK DJs like Sasha. If you listen to early Platipus (UK) stuff and early MFS and Eye Q (German) records there is a lot of similarity in style and that is not just coincidence. Through the '90s Platipus changed from the harder acid style of early trance to the more uplifting and softer prog style that later became so big and influential.

No. The term uplifting house was the ONLY term used until late 1997 in the UK for what you would call "trance". Tracks from Chicane, Albion, Matt darey etc were referred to as uplifting house. It what was listed on flyers for nights like clockwork orange, peach, mind over matter, ministry of sound, etc.

The word trance was brought to the UK by mixmag in summer 1998 with the headline "the year of trance".

The dutch sound you mention (this new thing called "trance") was brought to the UK by my local club (I lived approx 34 seconds walk from the Camden Palace), Peach, run by Graham Gold and they were the first club in the UK to book Ferry Corsten for instance and were largely responsible from breaking the sound to the UK and thus it stopped being called uplifting house.

I own a lot of very early Eye q stuff and it's not even close to what is termed as trance - it's waaay deeper, almost psytrance or melodic techno.

there is link between the German and UK tarnce genres but I feel the difference is greater, and the timeframe of them are completely different. The two forms changed over time and kind of merged but were completely different during the 90's.

Honestly going in to a record store in germany, even in 1996, I had to ask for completely differnt record types than I would ask for in the UK or the rest of Europe and conversely if I wanted than music in the UK I had to ask for "German Hard Dnace".

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN No. The term uplifting house was the ONLY term used until late 1997 in the UK for what you would call "trance". Tracks from Chicane, Albion, Matt darey etc were referred to as uplifting house. It what was listed on flyers for nights like clockwork orange, peach, mind over matter, ministry of sound, etc.

Simon Berry from UK was producing under his "Art of Trance" name on Platipus as early as 1993. The term "trance" might not have been popular until late 1990s, but it was certainly around back then. Anyway, I don't care as much about the exact chronology of the terms as how the styles evolved. The trance styles of the UK and the continent of that time are not so different, listen to PvD's X-Mix 1 (MFS) from 1993 and then listen to the Platipus tracks that came out in the same year, they are very similar. If anything, the tracks on X-Mix 1 are more uplifting and softer than the early UK trance releases on Platipus, not less. And you can't say that the Germans didn't influence later developments of the more popular uplifting trance, heck, just listen to Cygnus X with the "Orange Theme" (1994) and "Superstring" (1993) that got remixed dozens of times by UK and Dutch trance artists later on, not to mention Humate - "Love Stimulation." The later uplifting guys clearly acknowledged at least some of the early Germans as predecessors, and with good reason, because the similarities in sound and mood are definitely there.



I do however think you're right that in the UK house was probably a bigger direct influence on trance than techno was, and there were definitely differences in style, but I don't think they're as huge as you're making them out to be.

See! I told you we shouldn't get in to this

Yes, there are of course exceptions but platipus records were by far one of the labels on the Euro side things of Dance Music in those days. I can name a 100 labels that pushed their stuff out as dance music or uplifting house (not trance) but now if someone listened to it, they;d call that trance).

I'm not being pedantic about names - the UK in many respects was quite insular in terms of music, mainly focussing on domestic productions, because they were leading it at that time - there really was very little need for outside music.

I'm not making this stuff up - I lived and club through it - I just think that the roots although slightly influential to each other (Germany & UK) were their own, different and separate, things for the best part of a decade.

It just ocurred to me that people forget that fact of how international EDM and DJ's have become. It was a very rare and select few that played outside their home country - now I know (as I'm sure you do) 1000's of DJ's you've never heard of that fly all over the world on for gigs.

In at least the mid 90's (until '98) I can't think of hardly any foreign DJ's that came to the UK to play apart from maybe Sven Vath (but that was techno), Danielle Divoli (house) and Eric Morillo (house). It was all UK talent......which brings us back on topic; as Paul Oakenfold was really the fist to be that Jet-set international DJ.

Really, apart from the Olympics, what did tiesto pioneer? The first DJ to charge $100 per ticket? Lucky us!

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN Really, apart from the Olympics, what did tiesto pioneer? The first DJ to charge $100 per ticket? Lucky us!

I think he was the first to come out with his own line of sneakers:



Or did someone else do that first?

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles I think he was the first to come out with his own line of sneakers: Or did someone else do that first?

LOL, yes strike 1 to Tiesto.

Oh dear god, just found out he's got a shop called Tiestoshop.com

I love this one for it's humility - it's called "poster: cool"

LINK

Is there no limit or digity for this man?

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN I love this one for it's humility - it's called "poster: cool" LINK

His left eye looks jaundiced in that one. Seen a doctor lately, Tijs?

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN LOL, yes strike 1 to Tiesto. Oh dear god, just found out he's got a shop called Tiestoshop.com I love this one for it's humility - it's called "poster: cool" LINK Is there no limit or digity for this man?

I think it's just a combination of him being an idiot, his culture, and just not a very intelligent person overall. He was the right age at the right time with the right passion and got the proper breaks and here he is. Even kids with special needs have passion about things. I'd give my left leg to be able to be born 15 years prior to when I was.

quote:

Originally posted by Magnus Since we are on the topic of Tiesto, I have to share what he did the last time I saw him. Regardless of what he has or has not done for music, he seems to be extremely arrogant and full of himself, something I completely despise. About 3 years ago I saw him at a show. In the middle of his set in front of well over a thousand people, he stoops down behind the decks and begins messing with something. Soon after, he emerges with a rolled up poster in his hand. He's got my attention and curiosity going. What could it be? He unrolls this poster that strecthed as wide as his arms would go and to our delights, it was a giant picture of himself. Disgusted, I thought well maybe at least he'll be throwing it into the crowd for a fan or something. No. He neatly rolls it back up and puts it away. My friends and I left shortly thereafter.

So in other words you weren't there to see if he gave it to someone at the end and you can't be sure he didn't give it to someone later on?

why the fuck is this thread in production studio? it belongs in MD, and you're all fucking morons. eat a dick!

quote:

Originally posted by dj_alfi why the fuck is this thread in production studio? it belongs in MD, and you're all fucking morons. eat a dick!

Why? because you'd suck Tiesto's dick and thank him for it?

its about tiesto production skills, so it fits good in this subforum imo.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN Why? because you'd suck Tiesto's dick and thank him for it?

Fuck Tiesto, and fuck YOU!

quote:

Originally posted by palm its about tiesto production skills, so it fits good in this subforum imo.

No, it's about a track signed to Tiesto's label, dumbass.

quote:

Originally posted by dj_alfi Fuck Tiesto, and fuck YOU!

Then why post defending him?

quote:

Originally posted by dj_alfi No, it's about a track signed to Tiesto's label, dumbass.

No. It's about Tiesto (or should I say his minions) collaborating with someone on a production, hence production studio thread.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by dj_alfi
Fuck Tiesto, and fuck YOU!


ha ha alfi has got some tiesto issues

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