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-- does homeopathy work?
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Originally posted by GoSpeedGo! Either you say that homeopathy is completely inert, or that it has strong effects on human health. You can't claim both, that's just lazy faux-skepticism.

Oh, im sorry. I didn�t realise you were a simpleton. Quite clearly either the water in question was poisoned/dirty (or similar) OR the solution wasn�t diluted to the point of nothingness.

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Originally posted by GoSpeedGo! This is what bothers me about all this. People are so obsessed with the idea that homeopathy = bullshit, that they don't even notice they contradict themselves.

What bothers me is people quite obviously unable to make reasonable inferences from information presented, and make horrible leaps of logic that are completely retarded.

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Originally posted by GoSpeedGo! Either you say that homeopathy is completely inert, or that it has strong effects on human health. You can't claim both, that's just lazy faux-skepticism. This is what bothers me about all this. People are so obsessed with the idea that homeopathy = bullshit, that they don't even notice they contradict themselves.

Oh come on. You're just being stupid now. He's not claiming both in the slightest. Correlation does not equal causality. It's impossible to be sympathetic towards your "I'm no hippy, but..." position when you act like this.

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Originally posted by GoSpeedGo! I guess my point is that even objective scientific research isn't enough when we're talking about health of a given individual. It obviously doesn't validate homeopathic practices - what I'm saying is that we should examine what homeopathy and other alternative therapies do right, and try to include that in common practice. It may be such a simple thing such as communication between doctor and patient.

Of course it's not absolute, we don't have all the answers but we strive to answer as much as we can. A doctors job is to practice evidence based medicine and do so on a case by case basis, utilising their experience and available evidence to determine the most appropriate treatment available at the time.

What you preach is basic common sense in preventative medicine when it comes to looking after yourself by exercising and eating correctly. It all falls apart when you try and go any deeper than that and try and push treatments onto people that are basically placebo effects at their core. That's not medicine, that's hope.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN Quite clearly either the water in question was poisoned/dirty (or similar) OR the solution wasn�t diluted to the point of nothingness.

Well, we don't really know that. I thought we were operating under the assumption that it actually was a properly prepared homeopathic remedy.

If you read the whole story you find out that:

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In this case the combination of liquor and the tonic probably proved dangerous, as per the doctors.

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Originally posted by Fledz What you preach is basic common sense in preventative medicine when it comes to looking after yourself by exercising and eating correctly.

Well yes, but there's more to that. I think that we can all agree on that it is important for people to realize they are responsible for their own health. However, what conventional medicine seems to be doing is providing quick and simple solutions to people so that they could continue living the (unhealthy) life they want. It's like someone popping painkillers so they could go drink themselves to death two nights in a row. Again, you're treating the symptom and not dealing with the cause. And this is what allopathic western medicine is essentially all about - it doesn't make its patients more responsible, but rather more dependent on its services, and on often unnecessary and potentially harmful medicine. Yet you don't see this kind of criticism much, even though it is completely valid and maybe more important than flaws of homeopathy.

On the other hand, this is where alternative therapies are beneficial; they, at least from my experience, encourage people to assume responsibility for their own well-being. The medicine itself may be inert/fake, but the philosophy of health is good and beneficial. That's why I was saying that we should not dismiss homeopathy as a whole because there are some things worth learning.

Ideally, a balance between the two should be achieved, but we're not going to get there if we resort to cursing and unproductive criticism.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
well, let's think about that for a second. on the one hand, we have a well-developed (if imperfect) understanding of the world as far as physics goes, and that understanding is tested regularly and bears results everyday. experiments are reproduced etc. on the other hand we have the concept that water has a "memory" of what's been dipped in it, even after diluted to the point where its just water. this type of treatment has born exactly zero results or medical utilisation. for anything. ever.

so, the homeopathic remedy produces no results and contradicts a bunch of science that has, for all intents and purposes, been proven. do the fucking math, dickhead.

Ok, i don't actually care i just wanted to see what your response would be.

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Originally posted by GoSpeedGo! Well, we don't really know that. I thought we were operating under the assumption that it actually was a properly prepared homeopathic remedy.

Of course not. If it was a properly prepared homeopathic remedy it would�ve had exactly no impact whatsoever (assuming nobody was allergic to water).

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Originally posted by GoSpeedGo! Again, you're treating the symptom and not dealing with the cause.

Because homeopathic �medicine� deals with the cause, right?

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Originally posted by GoSpeedGo! but the philosophy of health is good and beneficial.

Except for all these people, yeah?

http://whatstheharm.net/homeopathy.html

I for one fully support people using homeopathy as an alternative to western medicine. Stupidity will cease to exist due to all the smeg heads dropping like flies.

The world will be a better place once the homeopaths just die from completely treatable conditions...

In fact, homeopathy should be used as a test to see who has passed grade 9 chemistry............ if you are dumb enough to think homeopathy is a real treatment option, your GED is automatically revoked and you go back to grade 8.....

Always a pleasure, colonel!

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN Except for all these people, yeah? http://whatstheharm.net/homeopathy.html

To be fair, although most of them could probably be treated, citing old cancer patients doesn't seem to be fair - they'd probably have died anyway!

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