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Originally posted by Member of X I posted this in the sports discussion but I'd thought to do it here since Shamus is my buddy. National League Cy Young Race. My opinion: 1. Cris Carpenter 2. Roger Clemens 3. Pedro Martinez Here's the stats to backup my thinking: ----- IP - ERA - WHIP - WINS - HR Alw - Opponent OPS: C Car 220 - 2.21 - 0.97 - 21 - 15 - .578 Roger 189 - 1.57 - 0.92 - 11 - 8 - .504 Pedro 195 - 2.95 - 0.92 - 13 - 19 - .578 ----- Run Supp - CG - Quality Starts C Car 5.2 - 7 - 27 Roger 3.6 - 1 - 24 Pedro 5.0 - 3 - 21 Pedro's weakness is clearly the long ball. Roger has quite a bit lower OPS surely attributable to only allowing 8 homers. That's why his ERA is so astronomical, he doesn't give up the big ones. Compare that to Randy Johnson who has given up a whopping 29 HR's. In comparison to history, Roger's ERA is clearly mind boggling! Pedro's run support is actually almost the same as Carpenter but Roger's is clearly worse than all. However, I give the slight nudge to Carpenter over Roger just because he has 7 complete games which is saying to me he doesn't tire his bullpen as much. Plus, he's giving his team longer production of great pitching giving his team more assured wins because it's not left up to the bullpen to decide the game. Lastly, I think Carpenter has been the most consistent start to start as seen with his quality starts. He has one more start than Roger and Pedro but has nearly 3 more games of innings. Again, he eats more innings. Carpenter is also in first, Houston looks like a strong wild card, and the Mets are in last but that really isn't Pedro's fault but still, a point in talking about valuable to ? Just my thoughts...

Pedro's start against Philly really killed some of his stats. Take that game away, and it's only 15 HRs. His WHIP is still really damn good. I think he needs a start skipped. But there's no way the retarded Mets Front Office and/or Willie (who insists on batting Beltran 3rd, Wright 5th, and, up until a few days ago, Cairo 2nd) will do that.

With that being said, the Cy Young should go to the best pitcher in the league. Last year, Randy Johnson should've won it. Hands down. And this year, as much as I hate to say it, Roger Clemens has been the leagues best pitcher. I truly thought he would fade in the end. I thought there was no way he could keep the ERA below 2. I was wrong. He is clearly the best pitcher in the NL this year. The best pitcher in the majors, actually. And it sucks that he's going to be penalized because of his teams poor offense.

Just going through his stats, I see that Pedro and Clemens have the same WHIP. The HR is really what has hurt Pedro the most. Also TranceHater, Pedro won on August 25th. That is... 2 weeks ago. Not 6 weeks ago.

Another thing, Clemens has had 25 QS's, not 24. Plus, quality starts are usually a very overrated stat. If a player starts 32 games and goes 6 innings while giving up 3 runs everytime, that is 32 QSs and a mediocre 4.50 ERA. If that same player starts 32 games and goes 9 innings while giving up 4 runs everytime, that is 0 QSs and a much better 4.00 ERA. I tend to avoid stats like that.

Plus, you already know how I feel about 'wins' as a way of judging a pitchers success. I don't care if a pitcher is 0-32, if he has a 1.30 ERA, he should get the Cy Young...

excellent pitching duel between Johnson and Wakefield
1-0, just 3 hits by each side, and the game-winning hit (and run) came in the 1st inning

King Felix has the first bad game of his career. 6 ERs in 7 innings.

Jaret Wright is the most injury prone pitcher well since Kevein Brown, this guy has no luck.

Id like to see willie get fired for Pinella in the offseason..
Cant let a team with that high of payroll who was 68-60 colapse that bad unexceptable

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Originally posted by TranceHater Jaret Wright is the most injury prone pitcher well since Kevein Brown, this guy has no luck. Id like to see willie get fired for Pinella in the offseason.. Cant let a team with that high of payroll who was 68-60 colapse that bad unexceptable

You're crazy... and I hate Willie.

But that's what this Mets team is. They are a .500 team. They need higher OBP at the top of the lineup. The Mets have use basically 1 lead-off hitter and have had quite a few 2 hitters this year. Lead-off hitters on the Mets have a .297 OBP. The number 2 hitters have a .297 as well. That's why they can't score any runs. So, a decent OBP second baseman, and a basher at 1st or in the OF should do it. The pitching has been superb.

Basically what I'm saying is: Willie sucks. But his suckiness has nothing to do with this team not scoring runs.

Also... by your reasoning, shouldn't the 200$M Yankees fire Joe Torre?

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Originally posted by TranceHater Jaret Wright is the most injury prone pitcher well since Kevein Brown, this guy has no luck. Id like to see willie get fired for Pinella in the offseason.. Cant let a team with that high of payroll who was 68-60 colapse that bad unexceptable

You lost me at unexceptable...

That's unacceptable my friend!

Yankees win 5 out of 6 games on the road trip and lose ground to Cleveland. That says something about how good the Indians have been lately. They have a plethora, a slew, and a bevy of young hitters. Plus some decent starters like Sabathia, Westbrook, and Millwood (who is a free agent by the way). I like the Yanks chances against Boston a smidgen more but I foresee the Yanks sitting home this playoffs. Just a hunch but I hope I'm wrong.

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Originally posted by Shamez214 You're crazy... and I hate Willie. But that's what this Mets team is. They are a .500 team. They need higher OBP at the top of the lineup. The Mets have use basically 1 lead-off hitter and have had quite a few 2 hitters this year. Lead-off hitters on the Mets have a .297 OBP. The number 2 hitters have a .297 as well. That's why they can't score any runs. So, a decent OBP second baseman, and a basher at 1st or in the OF should do it. The pitching has been superb. Basically what I'm saying is: Willie sucks. But his suckiness has nothing to do with this team not scoring runs. Also... by your reasoning, shouldn't the 200$M Yankees fire Joe Torre?

as for willie frank robinson has more wins with less of a team and alot less payroll. the braves had 6 rookies starting alot of year still managed another title. He makes terrible decisions, some torre like I might add.
No theyve had numerous injuries to the entire opening day starting staff, Pavanno, wright , brown, Mussina, then to wong. hes done a great job with crap pitching. its not his fault they have a flawed team 2 good releivers and great hitting. only 1.5 out with all that so hes ok and dont forget the rings and never missing playoffs as a yankee skipper. hes got slack.

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Originally posted by Member of X You lost me at unexceptable... That's unacceptable my friend! Yankees win 5 out of 6 games on the road trip and lose ground to Cleveland. That says something about how good the Indians have been lately. They have a plethora, a slew, and a bevy of young hitters. Plus some decent starters like Sabathia, Westbrook, and Millwood (who is a free agent by the way). I like the Yanks chances against Boston a smidgen more but I foresee the Yanks sitting home this playoffs. Just a hunch but I hope I'm wrong.

He has led the team to ANOTHER sept. collapse same as the past 4 years ala howe bobby v after 00, thats all he was brought in for meaningful september baseball, thats what wilpon wanted now he has an empty ballpark and another last place team with alot higher payroll.

Actually, the Mets payroll is the same or less than it has been recently.

Plus, I am just going to say the same thing, without an offense, a team can't win. And the Mets have no offense. A decent thumper for OF or 1B, a slightly better 2B, a normal year from Beltran, and a closer... that's all the Mets need. Not much at all.

Gotta love Bubba..

I think Boston might actually have a worse bullpen than the Yankees if at all possible. Where has Manny been the past month ????

Guy 1> You know, he didnt turn out that bad
Guy 2> I know, people say hes a bust but hes come through lately
Guy 1> What is that, 2 complete games now in this short while?
Guy 2> I think so...
Guy 1> So you know, I heard some major news...
Guy 2> Whats that?
Guy 1> Red Sox lost tonight...
Guy 2> Sweet, what about the Yankees?
Guy 1> FIRST PLACE MOTHA FUCKA!!!

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Originally posted by Vlad Guy 1> You know, he didnt turn out that bad Guy 2> I know, people say hes a bust but hes come through lately Guy 1> What is that, 2 complete games now in this short while? Guy 2> I think so... Guy 1> So you know, I heard some major news... Guy 2> Whats that? Guy 1> Red Sox lost tonight... Guy 2> Sweet, what about the Yankees? Guy 1> FIRST PLACE MOTHA FUCKA!!!

where were you when t hey weren't in first place?

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Originally posted by trunks1022 where were you when t hey weren't in first place?

Same place everyone else has been,

Watching them climb the charts...

As well as checking out the Mets team, cant lie, they got some stars on there.



But you guys know Im not a baseball person, football is my sport (college and pro's). Although its hard to keep up with college, you can only really keep up with what gets televised.

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Originally posted by Vlad Same place everyone else has been, Watching them climb the charts... As well as checking out the Mets team, cant lie, they got some stars on there. But you guys know Im not a baseball person, football is my sport (college and pro's). Although its hard to keep up with college, you can only really keep up with what gets televised.

time for football packages!!! too bad nfl is directv only...

WOOT WOOT!!!!!!!

Number 1 bitches!!!!!

The evil empire is back!!!!

Im not gonna go all crazy until theyve distanced themselves a bit.

I really hate when no one says shit all year and then here they all come. It stuff like this that makes me all giddy inside thinking of the Yankee fans and how they'll react when they suck again.

In anycase, if the Mets can win roughly every game, or maybe they can lose 1, they just may make the play-offs... as long as all the other teams lose.

Eff the White Sox. I really hope they don't make it. Same goes for the Angels and Astros. I don't know why I hate those teams... but I do.

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Originally posted by Shamez214 I really hate when no one says shit all year and then here they all come. It stuff like this that makes me all giddy inside thinking of the Yankee fans and how they'll react when they suck again. In anycase, if the Mets can win roughly every game, or maybe they can lose 1, they just may make the play-offs... as long as all the other teams lose. Eff the White Sox. I really hope they don't make it. Same goes for the Angels and Astros. I don't know why I hate those teams... but I do.

I became a Yankee fan during their low points, I was a kid, watched games and Don Mattingly became my favorite baseball player, and he retired the season before they begun their non-stop winning.

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Originally posted by Shamez214 In anycase, if the Mets can win roughly every game, or maybe they can lose 1, they just may make the play-offs... as long as all the other teams lose.

Interestingly enough I'm saying the same thing about the Nationals.

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Originally posted by Vlad I became a Yankee fan during their low points, I was a kid, watched games and Don Mattingly became my favorite baseball player, and he retired the season before they begun their non-stop winning.

Okay... then why only say something when the Yankees take 1st place? Because you're not a baseball fan?

stop all this bickering, baseball is baseball. some follow the sport others follow their teams and others jump the bandwagon there isn't much you can do about it. it's a game, if people feel the need to watch it we should be inviting since we are advocates of the sport, not disuading people from showing interest.

point being - superbowl? how many offices have pools going and of those pools, how many actuall follow the sport? not many, but the interest of winning money and participating in following the game is what pools are based on. it's to draw people into the sport, make the office place buzz about the games last night, not put up signs on peoples cubes saying BANDWAGON JUMPER YOU NEVER FOLLOWED FOOTBALL IN YOUR LIFE. I dunno I think its a bit immature.

and FYI, I'll be at the yankee game tonight in the RF Bleachers screamin on Vernon Wells.

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Originally posted by phuzzyfish12 WOOT WOOT!!!!!!! Number 1 bitches!!!!! The evil empire is back!!!!

I was thinking the same thing

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Originally posted by kid nyce and FYI, I'll be at the yankee game tonight in the RF Bleachers screamin on Vernon Wells.

you're heckling my namsake?

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Originally posted by Shamez214 Okay... then why only say something when the Yankees take 1st place? Because you're not a baseball fan?

Hmm... ????

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Originally posted by Shamez214 Okay... then why only say something when the Yankees take 1st place? Because you're not a baseball fan?

Uhh, duh... Im not really a baseball fan, I know alittle about whats going on, but I hardly follow it, I just watch the Yankee games whenever they are on.

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