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-- 'Mile-wide UFO' spotted by British airline pilot
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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov

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Originally posted by Renegade Christopher Hitchens put it pretty well: The idea that it is incumbent upon the skeptic to refute claims made by the credulous, no matter how spurious they might be, is patently ridiculous. I'm quite big on the idea that any argument (whether it pertains to UFOs, or religion, or politics, or anything else) should live and die by its own rules. If scant evidence is enough reason to suggest that something is true, then we needn't go to much effort to produce a better argument to suggest that it isn't true. Alien species are not visiting this planet, full-fucking-stop. Until a better contrary case is put forward by the credulous than the fact that strange lights are occasionally seen in the sky, then I can't see how the debate isn't aborted before it begins.

<- That's there just because I saw a post from you in this thread.

Before I say anything, let me make it perfectly clear that I don't believe "Aliens" are visiting this planet (and I myself personally find the idea quite ridiculous, or atleast how seriously some people take it). Now as far as the part in bold goes, for the sake of arguement, that's an assertion supported by no evidence eigther. Did you turn over every rock at the same moment in time all over the planet? Basically, your argument is as devoid of any real substance as there's (well, not quite, but you know what I'm saying). So what it boils down to is this... Do you believe in the validity of the phenomenon or do you? I personaly don't know if aliens exist, atleast ones stupid enough to visit this planet! I just don't believe they do. BTW, I'm bored, but I guess you that figured out .

These are not natural phenomenons. It's all about Chuck Norris.

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Originally posted by d-miurge These are not natural phenomenons. It's all about Chuck Norris.

Well at least we know Chuck Norris exists, with hard evidence to prove it. In the range of possible explanations, Chuck Norris birthing the universe is more plausible than aliens engineering the human race as slave miners

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Originally posted by venomX Well at least we know Chuck Norris exists, with hard evidence to prove it. In the range of possible explanations, Chuck Norris birthing the universe is more plausible than aliens engineering the human race as slave miners

LOL

Why would the aliens, who are far more advanced technologically, physically and spiritually/mentally would impose themselves and their views on us? Universe is enormous. Current studies of Mars, the moon Europa and other bodies will conclude that life and living organisms is not just exclusive to Earth. In my opinion, it is impossible for this universe to be devoid of intelligent life forms beyond our planet. Impossible. These creatures are watching us, trying to help bit by bit but not intervening in our affairs. There's a lot of evidence out there to seriously consider their existence, its just a lot of it is manipulated and controlled by those in power who dont want people to know about it. Specifically organized religion.

Yeah, yeah, I know what many are thinking ... but dont bother posting back silly replies about your scepticism unless you have something productive to say.

There are books like Day After Roswell, written by a high-ranking former Pentagon official (Philip J. Corso) who worked for many years deep in government jurisdictions and secret installations under several presidents, who has credentials and who wrote brilliantly without prejudice about what he saw as reverse engineering of alien technology. The sad thing is that people often wait until government's blessing to believe in something. Just because the government denies the aliens, as they deny many other things among their lies, doesnt mean they're right. They hold all the keys to all the doors, sadly.

^Sorry but all this government secrecy reminds me of the soviet government and how much they lied. I am nearly 110% certain that the government has no alien tecnology and cannot travel at the speed of light or use worm holes.
Sorry to burst your bubble but such advanced technology would be hard to hide. And little green men would also have a hard time hiding.

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Originally posted by ams.rld ^Sorry but all this government secrecy reminds me of the soviet government and how much they lied. I am nearly 110% certain that the government has no alien tecnology and cannot travel at the speed of light or use worm holes. Sorry to burst your bubble but such advanced technology would be hard to hide. And little green men would also have a hard time hiding.

I didnt say that the aliens have passed on all their advanced technology to the inferior primitive humans ... all that we got was their damaged Roswell craft at most, and the likes of other similar crashes. But that was enough for some reverse engineering ...

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Originally posted by Magnetonium I didnt say that the aliens have passed on all their advanced technology to the inferior primitive humans ... all that we got was their damaged Roswell craft at most, and the likes of other similar crashes. But that was enough for some reverse engineering ...

how do you know? There is no possible way of knowing that that crash was of an alien vehicle from outer space. And still than. The reverse engineering would TAKE a very long time to understand. I understand that gov scientists are smart but they are not that smart...

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Why would the aliens, who are far more advanced technologically, physically and spiritually/mentally would impose themselves and their views on us? Universe is enormous. Current studies of Mars, the moon Europa and other bodies will conclude that life and living organisms is not just exclusive to Earth. In my opinion, it is impossible for this universe to be devoid of intelligent life forms beyond our planet. Impossible. These creatures are watching us, trying to help bit by bit but not intervening in our affairs. There's a lot of evidence out there to seriously consider their existence, its just a lot of it is manipulated and controlled by those in power who dont want people to know about it. Specifically organized religion. Yeah, yeah, I know what many are thinking ... but dont bother posting back silly replies about your scepticism unless you have something productive to say.

dude what are you smoking ? Yeah it's a silly reply i know. But your post is just too silly to pass up without making any silly comments in return.

If you think about it, not all aliens may be "spiritually superior" than us. Just as there are good and bad people on this planet, it would make sense to believe that some alien species are good and want to "help us" whereas some aliens seek dominance and control of this planet for their own use. People have battled each other since antiquity and still do, for territorial control. Why would you not expect these ambitions to spill out into the galactic domain, if you have the technology to do it ? I think this universe is teeming with life. If just a single small insignificant planet exhibits such infinite diversity of species, what can you expect from this Universe ?

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Originally posted by Omega_M dude what are you smoking ? Yeah it's a silly reply i know. But your post is just too silly to pass up without making any silly comments in return. If you think about it, not all aliens may be "spiritually superior" to us. Just as there are good and bad people on this planet, it would make sense to believe that some alien species are good and want to "help us" whereas some aliens seek dominance and control of this planet for their own use. People have battled each other since antiquity and still do, for territorial control. Why would you not expect these ambitions to spill out into the galactic domain, if you have the technology to do it ? I think this universe is teeming with life. If just a single small insignificant planet exhibits such infinite diversity of species, what can you expect from this Universe ?

I think some people watch too much Stargate SG-1.

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Originally posted by Omega_M dude what are you smoking ? Yeah it's a silly reply i know. But your post is just too silly to pass up without making any silly comments in return. If you think about it, not all aliens may be "spiritually superior" than us. Just as there are good and bad people on this planet, it would make sense to believe that some alien species are good and want to "help us" whereas some aliens seek dominance and control of this planet for their own use. People have battled each other since antiquity and still do, for territorial control. Why would you not expect these ambitions to spill out into the galactic domain, if you have the technology to do it ? I think this universe is teeming with life. If just a single small insignificant planet exhibits such infinite diversity of species, what can you expect from this Universe ?

Advanced civilizations would have had to become very advanced not just technologically, but mentally to traverse such great distances. It would take a long time for such possible technology to develop so that they could travel this far - and along with technology their species would have to had develop in mental, social, philosophical ways to be able to properly comprehend and utilize that technology. Does that make some sense? Just imagine this great parallel - lets say we develop technologically very superior, but mentally not, we would technically be like children using very dangerous technology (i.e. children playing with matches). So these aliens would be very advanced in mind. And you think they would travel this far for dominance and control? There are hardly any resources left on this planet - its all in decline.

Primitive aliens concept is not feasible as a result. There could be "agressive" aliens, like reptilian in nature, but not primitive. I am talking about the ones that have the technology and ability to travel to our planet. I am sure there are plenty of species out there in other world that are far more primitive than ours, and far more advanced as well.

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Originally posted by ams.rld I think some people watch too much Stargate SG-1.

Never seen a single episode. I swear. I hate Star Wars and similar crap too.

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Originally posted by Omega_M What do you think is happening there ? Do you believe they have captured aliens/alien spaceships ? Or that DARPA is developing secret technology far beyond current industrial capabilities ? Come to think of it, the Blackbird SR-71 was far too developed for its time. Do you think Lockheed Martin Skunk Works had some sort of access to secret alien spaceship designs ? How could they conceive such futuristic engineering designs?

i wouldn't use the SR-71 as a premise for secret American/alien designs. the SR-71 design was born out of necessity. it's design and designers are very well documented. there's nothing in the design of that plane we didn't have a handle on at that time. it was a revolutionary concept in design but nothing extra-revolutionary.

we were playing with experimental high speed wind tunnel testing from all the x-series airframes at that time.

you'd think we would be able to keep all the fuel from leaking out of the damn thing while it sat on the tarmac waiting to take off if we had used "alien" technology.

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Originally posted by Q5echo i wouldn't use the SR-71 as a premise for secret American/alien designs. the SR-71 design was born out of necessity. it's design and designers are very well documented. there's nothing in the design of that plane we didn't have a handle on at that time. it was a revolutionary concept in design but nothing extra-revolutionary. we were playing with experimental high speed wind tunnel testing from from all the x-series airframes at that time. you'd think we would be able to keep all the fuel from leaking out of the damn thing while it sat on the tarmac waiting to take off if we had used "alien" technology.

Alien aircraft is not propelled by liquid fuel, silly - thats the primitive method (currently with the best fuel technology and craft, we'd be able to reach the nearest star in about 32,000 years). Thats not the technology that they employ to travel many millions of light years through space, bud.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Advanced civilizations would have had to become very advanced not just technologically, but mentally to traverse such great distances. It would take a long time for such possible technology to develop so that they could travel this far - and along with technology their species would have to had develop in mental, social, philosophical ways to be able to properly comprehend and utilize that technology. Does that make some sense? Just imagine this great parallel - lets say we develop technologically very superior, but mentally not, we would technically be like children using very dangerous technology (i.e. children playing with matches). So these aliens would be very advanced in mind. And you think they would travel this far for dominance and control? There are hardly any resources left on this planet - its all in decline. Primitive aliens concept is not feasible as a result. There could be "agressive" aliens, like reptilian in nature, but not primitive. I am talking about the ones that have the technology and ability to travel to our planet. I am sure there are plenty of species out there in other world that are far more primitive than ours, and far more advanced as well.

I don't see why intellectual growth, as demonstrated through the development of advanced technology, should also imply a corresponding growth in spirituality. Do you think that we are coming to age spiritually, with the rapid improvement in our technology ? The general observations would tend to point to the contrary. We are getting more and more materialistic as we develop products that improve our quality of life. Spirituality has nothing to do with intelligence. Spirituality may or may not be a driving factor for technology. A race may be purely motivated by wrong reasons to develop technology. It does not require a pure conscience to work out the physics of hyper planes that travel through the universe. If we grow spiritually, we may actually drop the technological developments all together. Spiritualism is all about internalizing personal resources.

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Originally posted by Q5echo what? did you even read my post? or are you confusing me with someone else?

Sorry, didnt mean to do a direct stab at you, I was merely saying that any fuel-based aircraft technology is not alien in nature ... which is your point, I guess.

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Originally posted by Omega_M I don't see why intellectual growth, as demonstrated through the development of advanced technology, should also imply a corresponding growth in spirituality. Do you think that we are coming to age spiritually, with the rapid improvement in our technology ? The general observations would tend to point to the contrary. We are getting more and more materialistic as we develop products that improve our quality of life. Spirituality has nothing to do with intelligence. Spirituality may or may not be a driving factor for technology. A race may be purely motivated by wrong reasons to develop technology. It does not require a pure conscience to work out the physics of hyper planes that travel through the universe. If we grow spiritually, we may actually drop the technological developments all together. Spiritualism is all about internalizing personal resources.

Spiritualism might not be the right word ... but do you get my example with regards to children playing with matches? We humans are creating very dangerous technology, and with little comprehension of it. One day, like children, we could, you know, set the house on fire if you know what I mean. I am not being very technical today. We have threatened our own existence. We are continually deploying technology and destructive methods on this planet that can easily cause problems and decline for humans in the near future.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Advanced civilizations would have had to become very advanced not just technologically, but mentally to traverse such great distances. It would take a long time for such possible technology to develop so that they could travel this far - and along with technology their species would have to had develop in mental, social, philosophical ways to be able to properly comprehend and utilize that technology. Does that make some sense? Just imagine this great parallel - lets say we develop technologically very superior, but mentally not, we would technically be like children using very dangerous technology (i.e. children playing with matches). So these aliens would be very advanced in mind. And you think they would travel this far for dominance and control? There are hardly any resources left on this planet - its all in decline. Primitive aliens concept is not feasible as a result. There could be "agressive" aliens, like reptilian in nature, but not primitive. I am talking about the ones that have the technology and ability to travel to our planet. I am sure there are plenty of species out there in other world that are far more primitive than ours, and far more advanced as well. .

Sorry, but not all humans are materilistic or selfish. There would be a group of people capable of travelling long distances. There are many that do that now. And guess what? They are not spirtuality enlightened.

Our galaxy is not that old and we can only assume that the majority of life in our galaxy is also not that old. So the advanced species wouldn't be "advanced in mind" as you implied.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Spiritualism might not be the right word ... but do you get my example with regards to children playing with matches? We humans are creating very dangerous technology, and with little comprehension of it. One day, like children, we could, you know, set the house on fire if you know what I mean. I am not being very technical today. We have threatened our own existence. We are continually deploying technology and destructive methods on this planet that can easily cause problems and decline for humans in the foreseable future.

Don't worry I wouldn't want you to be very technical anyday.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Alien aircraft is not propelled by liquid fuel, silly - thats the primitive method (currently with the best fuel technology and craft, we'd be able to reach the nearest star in about 32,000 years). Thats not the technology that they employ to travel many millions of light years through space, bud.

Dude, you talk as if you are the resident expert on alien inter galactic propulsion technology. Solid, liquid, radioactive, solar energy, dark matter, anti matter or whatever fuel they may use basically will be determined by the engineering requirements. Using liquid fuel by no means is a "primitive method". Whatever is needed and works, works.

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Originally posted by ams.rld Sorry, but not all humans are materilistic or selfish. There would be a group of people capable of travelling long distances. There are many that do that now. And guess what? They are not spirtuality enlightened. Our galaxy is not that old and we can only assume that the majority of life in our galaxy is also not that old. So the advanced species wouldn't be "advanced in mind" as you implied.

A lot of humans are very materialistic. Look at you and me - computers, digital equipment, TV, toys, ipods, wireless, etc. - we're deep in it. We've lost the touch with reality and who we really are. We are becoming closer to machines, and next step is getting micro-chipped and id-tagged, but thats another topic. Most people, especially in developed world, have lost touch with humanity, their past and their feelings. There's so much jealousy, hatred, selfishness, IGNORANCE, unfairness, greed, etc. that is holding our society by a thread. Our society is based on their immoral standards like getting more money than others. Once the climate changes and/or environment will decrease its food production capability, this material world will come crashing down, because there's no solid base underneath. Just like countless civilizations before us, whose ruins have been found all over around the world, the fate of our overpopulated world is bleak.

Travelling from Canada to Africa is not the same as travelling from Earth to Andromeda Galaxy. Thats a long step far far away. We've managed to explode our scientific research and development over the last hundred years, but we've dug ourselves a huge hole of problems to deal with later. Even our space program is pretty dam weak. Its been 40 years since first man landed on the moon and we havent been back since and we havent improved.

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Originally posted by Q5echo i wouldn't use the SR-71 as a premise for secret American/alien designs. the SR-71 design was born out of necessity. it's design and designers are very well documented. there's nothing in the design of that plane we didn't have a handle on at that time. it was a revolutionary concept in design but nothing extra-revolutionary. we were playing with experimental high speed wind tunnel testing from all the x-series airframes at that time. you'd think we would be able to keep all the fuel from leaking out of the damn thing while it sat on the tarmac waiting to take off if we had used "alien" technology.

I read somewhere that the designers of SR-71 were hoping that the blackbird would be the platform over which all future air craft designs would be based. Unfortunately that never happened. People then went into a CT mode and said, well maybe his design was influenced by alien technology cause the plane was far too radical for its time, and even now we don't see anything like it. Ofcourse, what people fail to realize is that engineers found other mechanism to make things work, without having to resort to the Black bird's platform. I didn't want to imply that I believe in this stuff. I just wanted to read Trancer's reply cause he seems to believe in a lot of government CTs.

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Originally posted by Omega_M Dude, you talk as if you are the resident expert on alien inter galactic propulsion technology. Solid, liquid, radioactive, solar energy, dark matter, anti matter or whatever fuel they may use basically will be determined by the engineering requirements. Using liquid fuel by no means is a "primitive method". Whatever is needed and works, works.

I never said I was an expert, I am just discussing.
Of course they all do work, but would you rather use the bicycle to travel to Africa or a jetliner? Same for traversing great distances ... you'd need one hell of line of resupply stations to travel great distances using non-renewable fuel and energy sources.

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Originally posted by Omega_M I read somewhere that the designers of SR-71 were hoping that the blackbird would be the platform over which all future air craft designs would be based. Unfortunately that never happened. People then went into a CT mode and said, well maybe his design was influenced by alien technology cause the plane was far too radical for its time, and even now we don't see anything like it. Ofcourse, what people fail to realize is that engineers found other mechanism to make things work, without having to resort to the Black bird's platform. I didn't want to imply that I believe in this stuff. I just wanted to read Trancer's reply cause he seems to believe in a lot of government CTs.

The future main component for aircraft is pretty simple - the use of anti-gravity (magnetic) forces to creat repelling forces to lift the craft off the ground and manipulate these forces for desired effect. You wouldn't even need a droplet of fuel for that.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium The future main component for aircraft is pretty simple - the use of anti-gravity (magnetic) forces to creat repelling forces to lift the craft off the ground and manipulate these forces for desired effect. You wouldn't even need a droplet of fuel for that.

Dude, the US government already has that. They are just keeping it classified.

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